CoH CCG....Anyone played yet? Comments?
By
Aaron123,
Posted on: 2006-01-26 16:51 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Whoooo, I found someone to play with. I'll get around to picking up a pack or seven eventually 
What do I have to buy to get all the "how to play" stuff? I know it's not boosters..
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Whoooo, I found someone to play with. I'll get around to picking up a pack or seven eventually What do I have to buy to get all the "how to play" stuff? I know it's not boosters..
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Battlepacks (the $4.99 ones) each have a rules sheet in them, and you could download them from the CoHCCG website as well... but you're going to need at least ONE battle pack to get a hero and a dcent set of powers to start with..
Yeah, this is the first CCG I've played where I've wanted to buy more Battle Packs than boosters. I hope my local store hasn't sold out of them...
(leers at Nekomusumi) 
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Two words. Awe. Some.
I'm playing it alongside VS and Dark Millennium.
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Statesman plays three (3) different CCGs at once?! Wow!
I've seen it!!
Three tables and a lone chair are all that can be seen, lit by a solitary shaft of light that may as well come down from heaven itself. You blink, then he is there, framed in shadow: Statesman. His helmet gleams in that sacred light, his cape flapping slightly from a mysterious breeze.
He takes his seat, and in a single blur of movement, he conjures his decks from the ether, shuffles them, and places them neatly. This is all far too fast for the naked eye, but noone challenges the legality of it, for he is Statesman!
You then note it odd; no chairs are present for his would-be opponants. The reason soon becomes all too clear, as they are beaten long before their posteriours would ever hit cushon (if the cads who oppose him even deserve the nicities of a cushon).
Foe after foe steps up, and is promptly whisked away until they have had enough, then with a flash of Zeus's lightning, the incomperable Statesman takes to the sky... leaving you alone in the near darkness with only the smell of ozone and smoke to keep you company.
Ok... maybe I didn't see this.
Maybe I'm just crying out for attention...
But I'd bet that's exactly how he does it...
(looks longingly to the heavens)
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Three tables and a lone chair are all that can be seen, lit by a solitary shaft of light that may as well come down from heaven itself. You blink, then he is there, framed in shadow: Statesman. His helmet gleams in that sacred light, his cape flapping slightly from a mysterious breeze.
He takes his seat, and in a single blur of movement, he conjures his decks from the ether, shuffles them, and places them neatly. This is all far too fast for the naked eye, but noone challenges the legality of it, for he is Statesman!
You then note it odd; no chairs are present for his would-be opponants. The reason soon becomes all too clear, as they are beaten long before their posteriours would ever hit cushon (if the cads who oppose him even deserve the nicities of a cushon).
Foe after foe steps up, and is promptly whisked away until they have had enough, then with a flash of Zeus's lightning, the incomperable Statesman takes to the sky... leaving you alone in the near darkness with only the smell of ozone and smoke to keep you company.
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Truly beautiful.
/em sheds a tear
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This is one of the major points I see in the game's favor. Highlander is the only other CCG I can think of (hey, there's a tie-in game that's really old, and I think it's even still being produced!)
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Unless there is a new one out there somewhere (doubtful) the Highlander CCG is long gone as Thunder Castle Games went under many years ago. Their former owner is now a Senator, somewhere. I found him on the net because the company owed me some money from work done on the CCG and the never released RPG. I'll never see that money, mind you, but the Senator still got a letter from my attorneys.
I haven't played the CoH CCG. Nothing against the concept, I just spent enough money on the CCG craze in my youth that I am burned-out on the concept.
I just hope that it fairs better than the other Super-Hero CCGs that have come along over the past decade.
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I just hope that it fairs better than the other Super-Hero CCGs that have come along over the past decade.
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I do too, but honestly, I see the fact that it is based on a computer game to be a big obsticle in the way of its success. I think that the best thing to do would be to offer to demo it at stores and the like so that people see that yes, indeed, it's a GOOD game!
I'd hate to see it die like others I've played in the past that were amazing... (sniffNETRUNNERsniff)
The card game's chief difficulties is that it moves too slowly.
There's a lot of turns where nothing happens.
In addition, the mechanics (not the rules) are a bit overly complex.
Look at magic:
The chief mechanic is:
Tap to Use or Always in play.
Lands: tap to use
Creatures: tap to use
Artifacts: tap to use
Enchantments: the exception, either always active, or you tap other things to use...notice, however, the mechanic is still: tap to use
Now, CoH:
Toggles: Tap all the way around and leave it tapped until it is turned off. And you can only have two active at a time.
Clicks: Tap 45 degrees for 1 click, 90 degrees for 2 clicks, 135 degrees for 3 clicks.
Constants: Always active
Back to the slow moving, with the frequent discards than are long stretches of game where both players are doing nothing but resting. My brothers and I are considering a house rule that every round requires you to draw one card, rest would turn that to 3 cards.
In addition, the edges are confusing. Can they be used at any time, or do they count as an action?
Finally, it seems as if it would be a lot more fun with large numbers of people. The slow pace of the game makes it less interesting as a pick up and do it with one friend deal.
That said, I did enjoy the game and will continue playing, but I do feel that some comments on the weaknesses do need to be made.
Thrythlind's Deviant Art Page
"Notice at the end, there: Arcanaville did the math and KICKED IT INTO EXISTENCE." - Ironik on the power of Arcanaville's math
My general opinion of the game is: Meh.
AEG has made some awesome games in the past, but this one is simply a 'meh.'
There are two cards (one power: Air Superiority and one Edge: Knock out of the Sky) that remove the Flight ability, and only one card (Edge: Out of the Sun) that makes positive use of flight. Flight is completely useless for anyone other than a melee archtype (the edge card increases Melee damage).
Mez effects are 100% (unless you have mez protection, which is also 100%). Heartbreaker's deck is so one-sided it's not terribly useful to play.
It's been my experience that whoever gets the first turn wins the game (unless I'm playing HB, then she wins).
Also, with ties going to the attacker, it makes defending dang near impossible, since there are nearly 5x as many cards that increase accuracy as there are that provide any defense (including Luck insp discards).
With constructed decks you can only have 3 of any card. So, for a non-FF controller/Defender you can only have a pitiful number of defense-increasing cards (3x Bob & Weave and 3x of either the Jump Dodge or Defensive Teleport for 6 cards if your using the relevant movement type). Only the FF powerset has "Luck" inspirations meaning that you aren't going to have many of them.
The reply from AEG was that they didn't want the game to bog down into a defensive morass. They had no idea. I spend most games completely stunned (much like the real COH) because of the vast number of status effects that can be stacked on non-scrapper/non-tankers due to the utter LACK of defensive cards.
Here's hoping they can get it rebalanced for the first expansion. It's got potential, let's hope it doesn't get wasted like the MMO did.
Well, my collecting of this game has been briefly halted as my city has -sold out-. O_O And no, it wasn't me.
I did get a foil, though!
DJs for The Cape Radio
Makes videos & podcasts about reviewing toys, covering conventions, and more at Vangelus.ca
I probably need to play a lot more before I can accurately comment on its shortcomings. I've played 1 on 1 and 3-player free-for-all, and both games were very fun.
I actually enjoy the choices we have each turn... the decision to move to a new combat tactic, to 'rest', to 'recharge' or to attack greatly effects how the game is played. Learning when to make use of these things seems to have a dramatic effect on gameplay. I'll have to check out more varied powersets before I feel like I have a real grasp on the game though.
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Here's a question...
What are the largest team battles you have tried?
I'm trying a 2-on-2 this Friday (assuming we all show up), but I'm wondering if larger team play is viable/fun.
(Yeah, I guess I could ask this on the AEG boards, but I don't get to check them as often as these 
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We've played up to 5v5 here in the office - it's great fun, but runs into 2 problems:
1. Early eliminated players get bored.
2. It's too easy for one team to gang up and wipe out a player before their first or second turn and they get going. The next time we do one this size, we're going to try out a targeting restriction of some kind (only the player across from you and the 2 on either side of him) to force the attacks to spread out a bit. The more I think about it, I like the idea of using that rule and then being able to use the move action to switch your position in the table instead of your combat tactic.
hehe.
That could be interesting. I'm looking forward to team battles myself.
Combining responses to a couple of different posts.
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The card game's chief difficulties is that it moves too slowly.
There's a lot of turns where nothing happens.
...
Back to the slow moving, with the frequent discards than are long stretches of game where both players are doing nothing but resting. My brothers and I are considering a house rule that every round requires you to draw one card, rest would turn that to 3 cards.
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Why are your "do-nothing" turns taking a long time? If both players need to draw up, the game should go "Draw-draw-draw-draw-back to the action."
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In addition, the mechanics (not the rules) are a bit overly complex.
Look at magic:
The chief mechanic is:
Tap to Use or Always in play.
Lands: tap to use
Creatures: tap to use
Artifacts: tap to use
Enchantments: the exception, either always active, or you tap other things to use...notice, however, the mechanic is still: tap to use
Now, CoH:
Toggles: Tap all the way around and leave it tapped until it is turned off. And you can only have two active at a time.
Clicks: Tap 45 degrees for 1 click, 90 degrees for 2 clicks, 135 degrees for 3 clicks.
Constants: Always active
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Eh....I guess if "potential card positions" are your criteria for complexity, you could say that CoH is more complex than Magic. Timing is usually the real rules kicker in CCGs, though, and while both games have thorny timing situations with certain cards, COH's alternating action structure is a lot simpler than Magic's The Stack. (I like the Stack, don't get me wrong, but you can't say alternating actions is more complex.)
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In addition, the edges are confusing. Can they be used at any time, or do they count as an action?
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I'm going to take a guess that you've never played a CCG made by AEG before. I can see how the React timing could be difficult to get at first if you haven't been exposed to it...
Anyway, Edges (or inspirations, or power effects) that say "Action" on them take up an action. Ones that say "React" on them do not take up an action, and can only be played when their trigger takes place (all reacts should specify when they can be played).
Multiple reacts with the same trigger (which has been unusual in other AEG CCGs, but is common in CoH with defense and accuracy edges and inspirations having a trigger of "when targetted by an attack") are resolved by going around the table and allowing each player to play a React or pass. If any player plays a React, all players get another opportunity to react to the original trigger; if all players pass consecutively, the timing for Reacts to that trigger closes and the game moves on. The "keep going until everybody passes" thing isn't that much different from Magic, and the alternating reacts mirrors the way regular Actions alternate.
Inspirations do not all have the same timing. Catch-a-Breaths and Respites are Actions; Insight and Luck are Reacts played when an attack is targetted; Break Free is a React played before you take an Action; and Enrage is a React played before targetting an attack (meaning that you have to play all your Enrages before you start battling over accuracy and defense). These timings are all listed on the rules sheet under Inspirations.
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My general opinion of the game is: Meh.
AEG has made some awesome games in the past, but this one is simply a 'meh.'
There are two cards (one power: Air Superiority and one Edge: Knock out of the Sky) that remove the Flight ability, and only one card (Edge: Out of the Sun) that makes positive use of flight. Flight is completely useless for anyone other than a melee archtype (the edge card increases Melee damage).
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Apparently, the travel powers used to have some innate ability (back when the game was being playtested) and Flight was overpowered; hence all the anti-Flight cards and the lackluster Flight-specific edge. The innate abilities were removed, but the weak Flight support wasn't revamped. My main is a flier, so this kind of annoys me, too.
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Mez effects are 100% (unless you have mez protection, which is also 100%). Heartbreaker's deck is so one-sided it's not terribly useful to play.
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Break Free is tied with Insight for the most popular inspiration on cards. Stun rounds in our games are usually spent recharging and resting until you're built up enough to have something you want to use a Break Free on.
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It's been my experience that whoever gets the first turn wins the game (unless I'm playing HB, then she wins).
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Haven't encountered this problem, really. The first player has an advantage, but it's not insurmountable. There are a lot of cards that can produce greater than a one-action swing.
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Also, with ties going to the attacker, it makes defending dang near impossible, since there are nearly 5x as many cards that increase accuracy as there are that provide any defense (including Luck insp discards).
With constructed decks you can only have 3 of any card. So, for a non-FF controller/Defender you can only have a pitiful number of defense-increasing cards (3x Bob & Weave and 3x of either the Jump Dodge or Defensive Teleport for 6 cards if your using the relevant movement type). Only the FF powerset has "Luck" inspirations meaning that you aren't going to have many of them.
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Ice Armor, Ice Manipulation, and Ice Control also have Lucks.
The game would be much slower if a successful attack always required you to spend a ton of cards on accuracy, especially if accuracy was hard to come by. As long as everyone is in the same boat with regards to accuracy and defense, I don't see why there is any problem. Why would the game be better if you only hit half the time or less?
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The reply from AEG was that they didn't want the game to bog down into a defensive morass. They had no idea. I spend most games completely stunned (much like the real COH) because of the vast number of status effects that can be stacked on non-scrapper/non-tankers due to the utter LACK of defensive cards.
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Where are your Break Frees? Why aren't you spending your stunned turns drawing (to get to Break Frees or defensive cards)?
My Synapse hero beat Arctic_Sun's Statesman hero last night while playing the CCG with about 5 other people. Synapse is a blaster, States is a Tank. I just kept pelting him for tiny damage and forcing him to be unable to get any cards. *muahahaha*
Seriously, I played for the first time really last night. We did a two on two team game and then had a bunch of one on one matches. Teaming was cool - we had a few rules questions (we would all like a complete rule book) but when in doubt we checked AEG's forums or defaulted to "How would this work in the MMO?" and it usually answered the question.
It was interesting to see that some matches went pretty fast - while others took so long the place closed on us before they could finish.
It seems to depend on how many powers you both have out - if you only have a few powers out the game moves quickly - but if you both get more than 4 powers + sidekicks out then you better be ready for the long haul.
I had heard people say "its just like the MMO" but when I played Mynx (claws/regen) it hit home. Awry smacked me with her tricked out blaster for a ton of damage - until I was almost dead, then on my next turn I healed back nearly all of it with regen powers. I just started laughing out loud because it was so similar to the game.
Then Arctic_Sun pulled out his Statesman card and whacked Mynx on the head and "nerfed" her.
Good Times.
I really like the CCG - can't wait to play with some of you guys at the player-meet!
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My Synapse hero beat Arctic_Sun's Statesman hero last night while playing the CCG with about 5 other people. Synapse is a blaster, States is a Tank.
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So, basically what you're saying is that the CCG is absolutely nothing like the MMO?
C'mon, you knew it was coming...
Anyway, that sounds fun. If I get a chance to try it I will, and to be honest, I'm more interested in it now after having read that than I was before. Thanks, Cuppa.
Brother of Markus
The Lord of Fire and Pain
The Legendary Living Hellfire
Fight my brute!
hmmm. This sounds somewhat like elements of the Highlander card game.
I have yet to crack open my pack from CoV collector's box, wanting to keep it collectible.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
Wait.... since when is Mynx Claws/Regen?
I only have one question about this...
Will there be any Devs at KublaCon?
I hope so, I would love to try out my deck against yours!
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Wait.... since when is Mynx Claws/Regen?
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Since always? What else would she be?
Interesting that you can actually solve rules questions by referring back to how the MMO works. I think that's the sign of a well-crafted card game. Of course, that begs the question of whether or not game imbalances affect the card game as well.
I don't know much about the game, so one point of curiosity. Just how well do those 'self-made' cards of your own heroes that you can print off stack up against the existing 'face' heroes?
Arc #41077 - The Men of State
Arc #48845 - Operation: Dirty Snowball
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..Then Arctic_Sun pulled out his Statesman card and whacked Mynx on the head and "nerfed" her.
Good Times.
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I can't believe you came out with this in context of saying that the CCG was just like the MMO! 
Seriously, though. All but one of my r/l friends who play the MMO are buying and playing the card game (great idea for starters). The one who doesn't, would be playing but his work schedule doesn't coincide.
We've drafted a non onliner into playing the CCG, so we're covered.
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Wait.... since when is Mynx Claws/Regen?
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Since always? What else would she be?
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Have you fought her in CoH?
She's not Regen. She's Inv. I've watched her pop Unstoppable
Well, they don't have SR in the game yet, so, she's regen.
Here's a question...
)
What are the largest team battles you have tried?
I'm trying a 2-on-2 this Friday (assuming we all show up), but I'm wondering if larger team play is viable/fun.
(Yeah, I guess I could ask this on the AEG boards, but I don't get to check them as often as these