Weathering the Storm 2.0: An I5 Invuln/SS Guide.

Iron_Vixen · 09-18-2005 09:05 PM

Hello and welcome to my Issue 5 Invulnerability/Superstrength guide.

First I want to thank all of you that have sent me PMs or posted for a new guide. And to those that I had meaningful discussions with. This includes the Tanker section, all those that have replied to my old guide, all those that PMed me about the guide, and the general forum community at large.

I have not made massive changes to the guide overall, as many things are still true for Inv/SS even now. However, there are many important changes I have made, mostly covering new numbers and expanded the aggro part of the tactics section.

Invuln took a severe hit in I5. The passives far too hard but I have been able to get a respecced build that has been working since they adjusted Inv on test to what is currently on live. I have stuck to my guns and am keeping my build mostly defensive. The reasons are twofold: 1)I prefer my defenses heavy and refuse to play a "scranker" (I wish it to be clear that I am not saying it is not a viable way to play, just not what I made a Tanker for.) and 2) I wanted to see how viable a defense-centric build can work in the I5 world.

This guide is not meant to be the be-all, end-all guide for Inv/SS Tankers, but a reflection on how I tank and solo. I do not claim it is the "best" or only viable guide, only that it should be helpful to people.

This guide is in parts, with series of *********** between the parts, so you can skip around by looking for them.

Please note, that I do not use this build for herding, so it may not work for that. I do missions, TFs, Trials, and street sweeping; solo or in groups, but I have only herded twice, so I make no claim to how effective my guide would be for that. Also as PvP is not something I am interested in and cannot of course test, this guide is for solo and group PvE.

Contents:
1-Issue 5 changes
2-Introduction
3-My build/slots
4-Invulnerability overview
5-Superstrength overview
6-My Pool Powers and some thoughts on others
7-Tactics and Teamwork

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1-Issue 5 changes:

Issue 5 severely curtailed some of our abilities. We now rely on Invinc more than ever and our non Smashing/Lethal Resistances are poor on our own, yet we still have the 90% cap.

Summary:

Resist Physical Damage(RPD):Cut to 7.5% Smashing/Lethal resistance
Resist Elements(R/El):Cut to 7.5% Fire/Cold resistance, now also has 7.5% Toxic resistance.
Resist Energies(R/En):Cut to 7.5% Energy/Negative Energy resistance.
Unyielding(Uy):Cut to 5% Smashing/Lethal resistance, 10% all other non-psi resistance.
Tough Hide: Cut to 5% defense
Invincibility(Invinc):Now caps at 14 mobs for it's +def and +tohit per mob.
Temporary Invulnerability(TI):Cut to 30% Smashing/Lethal resistance.
Taunt is now capped at 5 mobs in it's AoE. It is still auto-hit however.
Punch-Voke is now called Gauntlet and is our inherent power. It has a limit of 5 mobs taunted per attack.
Aura-Voke (in our case, Invincibility's Taunt effect) is capped at 10 mobs.

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2-Introduction:

What is a Tanker? We are the walls of our teams, we take the brunt of of foes damage so that our friends and teammates can do well. We solo at a slow but steady pace, using our defenses to survive tremendous punishing, using our strangely underrated damage to best effect. A good Tanker can use our defensive powers to help keep our teammates alive through some extreme dangers. And we can work well with all other ATs. Using each others strengths to make the whole far greater then the sum of it's parts. We have a responsilibity in teams to keep aggro on us, so that our more vulnerable friends can perform.

What is an Invulnerable/Super Strength Tanker? We have an impressive array of defenses combined with a fun and underrated melee powerset. We are not better or worse then any other Tanker, but it is my favorite power combination. I hope that my guide will inspire people to try Tanker, and also to lift the spirits of those that may feel they are not tanking well.

In my guide, I use the best data I have. If any errors occur in the following, please let me know and I shall fix them. I will try to be as accurate as possible, but am willing to admit to errors. The guide is based over 1500 hours of tanking solo and teams of doing all old TFs (Positron-Numina) some of them multiple times, the new Katie Hannon TF, 3 respecs, and teams of 1-8 vs story arcs, up to and including the Praetorian arc up to Tyrant. This is not meant to sound boastful, but is instead to supply my "credentials" as it were.

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3-My Build and Slots:Important note! This is a repsec build. I will go over some possible modifications after I list it. For legibility purposes, I will list a powers full name and then it's acronym in () after. Slot levels are listed like so (1,5,7) would mean it got it's first slot at 1 (i.e. when the power was acquired), 2nd at 5, and 3rd at 7.

Level 1 Temorary Invulnerability (TI): 6 dmg res (1,3,5,7,9,11)
Level 1 Jab: 1 acc (1) 3 dmg (5,46,50)
Level 2 Punch: 1 acc (2) 3 dmg (3,15,50)
Level 4 Dull Pain (DP): 4 recharge (4,7,13,31), 2 heals (42,45)
Level 6 Resist Elements (R/El): 6 dmg res (6,17,37,42,43,45)
Level 8 Unyielding (Uy): 6 dmg res (8,9,11,13,15,23)
Level 10 Taunt: 1 recharge (10)
Level 12 Combat Jumping (CJ): 1 defbuf (12)
Level 14 Super Jump (SJ): 1 jump (14)
Level 16 Resist Energies (R/En): 6 dmg res (16,17,37,42,43,45)
Level 18 Invincibilty: 5 defbuffs (18,19,19,25,27), 1 tohit buff (29)
Level 20 Knock Out Blow: 1 acc (20), 5 dmg (21,21,23,27,29)
Level 22 Haymaker: 1 acc (22), 5 dmg (25,31,33,34,46)
Level 24 Swift: 1 run (24)
Level 26 Health: 1 heal (26)
Level 28 Rage: 2 recharge (28,33)
Level 30 Stamina: 6 end reccov (30,31,33,34,36,36)
Level 32 Tough hide (TH): 6 def buff (34,36,37,40,43)
Level 35 Resist Physical Damage (RPD): 1 dmg res (35)
Level 38 Footstomp: 1 acc (38), 5 dmg (39,39,39,40,40)
Level 41 Unstoppable: 1 end recov (41)
Level 44 Conserve Power (CP): 3 recharge (44,46,50)
Level 47 Laser Beam Eyes (LBE): 1 acc (47), 3 dmg (48,48,48)
Level 49 Hand Clap: 1 disorient (49)

This is after I respecced and sorted my slots out.

--Important note--
All my Slots for resists are filled with 52 (green +2) SOs at this time. White SOs for resists are +20% of base, green +2s are +22% base a piece, not a huge difference, but I need to point this out for my numbers.

I use the following acronyms:

S/L=Smashing/Lethal
E/N.E=Energy/Negative Energy
F/C=Fire/Cold

Sub-Totals for resists by power:
RPD: 7.5% base+(1.65)=9.15% S/L
TI: 30.0% base+(6.6*6)=69.6% S/L
Uy: 5/10% base+(1.1/2.2*6)=11.6% S/L resist-and- 23.2% F/C, E/N.E, and Toxic resist
R/El: 7.5% base+(1.65*6)=17.4% resist to F/C/Toxic
R/En: 7.5% base+(1.65*6)=17.4% resist to E/N.E
Unstoppable: 70% base to S/L, F/C, E/N.E, and Toxic

Totals:

"Normal" Mode (Normal mode is using all toggles+passives but not Unstoppable. I run CJ+TI+Uy+Invincibilty, in most situations).

Normal mode:
S/L: 90.35%
F/C/E/N.E/Toxic: 40.6%

Unstoppable mode: This is where I use unstoppable and shut off TI.

Unstoppable Mode:
S/L: 90.75%
F/C//E/N.E/Toxic: 110.6%

Our caps are 90% resist and barring S/L and not running unstoppable we fall far short now. I wait till late in the build to get RPD to cap S/L resistance in normal mode. I am a huge fan of resistance, and we lost too much non-S/L resistance in I5.

Defense: defense is harder to measure, since the Invincibilty numbers are still up-in-the-air. However I can give the following, like my resists all my SOs are +2 greens for +22% a slot:

Uy: -5 def debuff
CJ: +2.5 def buff base+(.55)=+3.05% defense melee and ranged
TH: +5 def buff base+(1.1*6)=+11.6 To defense against S/L, F/C, E/N.E attacks, but not psionic attacks (possibly not Toxic, still not truely sure if it does or not).

Total "Normal" Defense: +9.65%+ Invincibility's bonus.

TH: is listed as defense vs. damage categories (S/L, F/C, E/N.E, Toxic), not attack types (range, melee, cone, AoE). So should work against all with the approriate damage category.

These would take a huge list (Psi cone, psi melee, S/L cone, etc.) So will not bother to list them here in total. Against non-psi damage we have exellent damage mitigation. Psionics go right through us however, so be prepared when psionic attacks abound.

My build has worked well solo and in teams, and I am very pleased with it. The only changes I would stress are to slot end reducers early, and then slowly replace them once you get stamina slotted up and with higher quality enhancements. I always slot accuracies into my attacks, I really hate missing, and the damage loss from one less damage SO, is more then acceptable to me. I have noticed that even with Invinc on when I took the ACCs out that I did miss more often.

I am a firm believer in slotting resists, even with the terrible numbers we have now. It keeps me alive in long pitched battles and is why I call my guide: "Weathering the Storm." I tend to solo slowly but surely with this build. And it allows me to tank large missions successfully.

Possible Build Changes:I have the luxury of being 50 and picking and slotting basically as I feel. It's why Stamina is so late now. I would recommend the following possible alterations: <ul type="square">
[*] Slot End reducers early: I find that end reducers are more effective for toggles like Uy and TI early. Slotting them with Training dmg res is not too terribly effective and end is at a massive premium till Stamina.
[*] Getting Stamina: If you can move things around (like R/En as an example) you can push Stamina in earlier. I would stress that you definately want Invinc at 18 unless you can't fit it in until later. Invinc has gone from important to absolutely critical.
[*] Haymaker: Haymaker is available at 10. I wanted to guarantee having Taunt when exemped, so I pushed it way back. Haymaker is a very good attack early, and you can easily move it to 10 and shift powers around.
[*] Other changes:Moving Unstoppable to an earlier level is possible. I find I do not truely need it till Sappers and Carnies very much. Moving CP to 41, Unstop to 35 and RPD to 44 could work as an example.[/list]
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4-Invulnerability Overview:

Invulnerability is my personal favorite powerset. Even with the massive gutting it got, I still love it. The passives lost much of their luster, but overall the set still works, even if it is not very good in the pre-DO and pre-SO world. It is decent if slotted and once SOs are acquired. I fully think the set needs to be tweaked some more, to bring the passives to a far better level and reduce Invinc's easily abused power. I am not really pleased with the efficiency of the passives under I5, the slotting is not as good as it should be, but I feel we need to max our defenses as part of my own phiosophy.

Resist Physical Damage (RPD): (passive) Available at level 1: This power provides 7.5% base resistance to S/L damage.

It's resistance is not huge, but it lets us hit cap with TI and Uy heavily slotted. Alone it is now poor at best.

Temporary Invulnerability (TI): (toggle) Available at level 1: This power provides a 30% base resistance to S/L damage.

As a toggle it's an end burner, but it's also more efficient then RPD. It should be 6 slotted with SOs to help get close to our cap for S/L resists.

Dull Pain (DP): (click) Available at level 2: This power is +health and a also a heal.

I have it slotted with 4 recharges and 2 heals. This pushes my 2155 health to 2906 health and heals me for 1299. It is not perma, but has a small window of downtime (roughly 20-30 seconds, I have not timed it). I could alter my slotting to 6 recharges to make it perma if needed. Perma-DP gives a nice regen boost since it raises your health and regen is based on your current max health, but I find the heal more useful to me.

Resist Elements (R/El): (passive) Available at level 6: Provides +7.5% base resistance to F/C and Toxic damage.

This power got cut far too much in I5. It's depressing how poor it is now, even with slotting, but I can see no way around it. Not as common as S/L damage but many dual attacks have one or the other. Also many higher level villain factions have more elemental attacks.

Unyielding (Uy): (toggle) Available at level 8: **NOTE** This power is labelled as Unyielding Stance in the manual and says you lose mobility, that has been changed. Uy now no longeer "roots" you, you can move with normal mobility. Uy gives Status protection (protects you from sleep/hold/immobilize/stun/knockdown) that scales up as you level, capping at 35. It also gives 5% base resist to: S/L damage and 10% base resist to: F/C, E/N.E, and Toxic. It's downsides are -5 def debuff and very costly in end.

I cannot stress enough how important this power is! You should get it at 8 but slot it when you can. Start with a mix of dmg res and end reducers and then try to get as close to 6 dmg res as you can. And I recommend getting this power to 6 dmg res when you can spare the slots. It lost far too much resistance as much of our set has, but it's still a large portion of our reistance, especiall non-S/L resistance.

Resist Energies (R/En): (passive) Available at level 12: Provides 7.5% base resistance to E/N.E damage.

This was a decent power that has been cut too far in I5. These damage types are not as common as S/L damage but things like Clockworks and many "magic" attacks are E/N.E based. also some dual attacks have one of these 2 as a component.

Invincibility: (toggle) Available at level 18: Provides defense bonus (except for psionics), and an accuracy bonus based on the number of foes in melee range. It also constantly "Taunts" up to 10 foes in melee range.

This power got barely touched in I5, and in fact the number of mobs that give us benefits due to it has been increased to 14! It is a major help, and like Uy, is as close to a "must-have" power as you can get. In fact if not for Invinc, the set would be in far worse shape than it is. Invinc is almost a crutch for non-S/L mobs now, and too easy too abuse due to being poor against single mobs and huge against hordes.

Tough Hide (TH): (passive) Available at level 26: Provides a passive +5% def buff to any non-psi (non-toxic), non-AoE attack.

This power is one of the most underrated powers in the set. The minute I got it, and even before I slotted it. I noticed a consistent and reliable (though small, it's 5% remember) reduction in the number of hits I was taking. Also, it is passive. This means that even stunned or held or what have you, you still get this def buff. It got cut in I5, but far less then some other powers (like Weave or most of the rest of Invuln).

Unstoppable: (click) Available at level 32: Unstoppable lasts for 200 seconds and then crashes hard. During the 200 seconds it provides: +70% to resist Toxic, S/L, E/N.E, F/C; Extreme status protection;And a bonus to endurance recovery. When it crashes, you fall to 10% of your current max health, and lose all end.

This is a situational power, but without it, some battles would be untenable. Malta Sappers and Carnie bosses are the biggest threats here, since they can kill end and then toggles crash. Both of these factions can kill you without toggles very fast. And this is compounded in a team setting. You can survive without it, and until you have adapted to it, it can kill you, but I fully support it's use at the right time. It literally is fantastic if used properly.

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5-SuperStrength Overview:

A fun and vastly underrated set, Superstrength has some useful powers, and lots of ways to do some short-term incapitation of mobs. All Tanker attacks have some aggro bonus built-in to them, and this aids our aggro retention.

All my damage samples are with my slots from section 2 and against the same level 50 Nemesis Dragoon guinea-pigs.

Jab (click) Required at level 1:

My damage: 63.49
My damage with Rage: 87.69

Jab is a required power, a fast, weak attack.
Cost: 5.1
Animation time: 1.1
Recharge time: 2
Taunt Mag: Moderate-4
Disorient Chance: 10%: Mag-2

Jab is fast and not the most impressive attack. It is required, and can be a big part of an attack chain.

Punch (click) Available at level 2:

My damage: 93.37
My damage with Rage: 128.96

Punch is a slightly slower but more powerful attack then jab.
Cost: 7.5
Animation time: 1.2
Recharge time: 4
Taunt Mag: Moderate- 4
Knockdown Chance: 30%

Punch is a more damaging attack then Jab. It is not too shabby really.

Taunt (click) Available at level 4:

Taunt makes mobs in it's AoE get more aggro towards you.
Cost: 0
Animation time: 2.7
Recharge time: 3 (note: this may be longer now, I believe it is 5 or 7.5 seconds now)
Taunt Mag: Very High-4

Taunt is a great tool for aggro. It is currently auto-hit AoE and ranged. It is now also capped at 5 targets. Used well, Taunt can keep those mobs on you and off your teammates. A very good aggro management tool.

Haymaker (click) Available at level 10:

My damage: 206.58
My damage with Rage: 264.95

Haymaker is a powerful attack with a high knockdown chance.
Cost: 12.3
Animation time: 1.5
Recharge time: 8
Taunt Mag: Moderate-4
Knockdown Chance: 60%

I love Haymaker. Very nice attack with a satisfying chance of knocking foes on their butts.

Hand Clap (click) Available at level Available at 16:

Hand Clap is an AoE knockdown+stun attack, it deals no damage.

Cost: 18.8
Animation time: 1.2
Recharge time: 30
Taunt Mag: Moderate-4
Knockdown Chance: 50%
Disorient Chance: 50% Mag-2

A hotly debated power at times, Hand Clap is good at stunning annoying mobs like Ink Men, Sorcerers, Sappers, and their ilk. It is not good to use it in a team with an AoE teammate, as it knocks them outwards radially. It also does not make the aggro it should, as mobs get up, and quite often attack who ever is near. It is better solo, or to get mobs off teammates in a hurry.

Knockout Blow (click) Available at level 20:

My damage: 458.99
My damage with Rage: 585.69

Knockout Blow is a slow but very powerful attack with a small hold component.

Cost: 18.8
Animation time: 2.2
Recharge time: 25
Taunt Mag: 4
Knockups target
Hold Mag: 3

This is my favorite attack in the set. Fantastic power in my opinion. Very slow to recharge however. Get this and slot it and love it!

Rage (click) Available at level 28:

Rage gives 120 seconds of +80% base damage and +66% accuracy to all attacks. When it crashes it makes end fall by 25%, makes you unable to attack for 10 seconds (I call it the NAP:Non-Activity-Period, term first used by WillyW), and gives a -10 (?) def debuff in that 0 second period.

Rage 3.0, as it is as of this writing is much better then Rage 2.0 was. I did some testing on 49-50 mobs, and was able to hold aggro in the NAP period. I still believe this power is better for soloing, but after my testing, I believe it can also work for groups. I used Taunt a lot, and let my Invincibilty aura hold aggro as well. As of now, I like Rage 3.0, if they do tweak it more, I will add to this. But I believe Rage has returned to being a useful tool for us.

Hurl (click) Available at level 35:

My damage: N/A
My damage with Rage: N/A

Hurl has you rip part of the ground up and then throw it as a short ranged weapon.

Cost: 13.5
Animation time: 3.8
Recharge time: 8
Taunt Mag: Moderate-4
Knockback Chance: 50%
Range: 40

Hurl is just too slow and too short ranged. It is the only power in the SS set I would stay away from. Hand Clap is another optional power, but at least seems to be far more useful. Hurl was much better back when Uy was UyS and rooted you. Now, I would avoid it as a power choice. It is fun, but lacking.

Footstomp (click) Available at level 38:

My damage: 178.87
My damage with Rage: 229.4

Footstomp is a PBAoE attack. Tends to knock foes down.

Cost: 26.7
Animation time: 2.1
Recharge time: 20
Taunt Mag: Moderate-4
Knockdown Chance: 80%

This, along with KO Blow are the jewels of the SS crown. Absolutely fun and incredible power. Also makes a ton of aggro and knocks most people on their dupas.

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6-My Pools and some thoughts on others.
I am not a huge devotee of grabbing too many pools. I do however have some and list them in this section, along with other possibilities.

Leaping : I got both Combat Jumping and Super jump out of this pool. CJ gives a small defense bonus and also was one of my 2 options for getting Super Jump, which is my favorite travel power.

Fitness : As most are aware, Stamina is huge. I actually did without till I respecced it in at 42, but am glad I got it. I got Swift , Health , and Stamina . Stamina has helped me immensely in my tanking and soloing.

Energy Mastery : Yes, I mostly got this pool for Laser Beam Eyes (LBE) , but the power I needed for it turned out to be Conserve Power (CP) , and it's a massive help with end. It is not up all the time, but when it is, it's great! LBE does the exact same damage as Punch but at range.

Other Pools:

Fighting Pool : I fully admit having an intense hatred of this pool. Some love it, and it can be handy, but I have a defensive power set as my main function, so will not touch this pool.

Concealment : I do not like the graphical effects for it, and as a Tanker, it did not fit my concept.

Speed : Many people love Hasten . I find it ok on my BS/Regen Scrapper, but it does not fit my concept, and I do not like the end loss. Rage and Unstoppable do that now.

Flight : A useful pool, many love Air Superiority (AS) , but I prefer SJ, and am fine without AS. I must stress that AS is a very good attack, basically Punch with a -fly, and better knockdown. But, since AS does not make the BOOMS! of Superstrength, I didn't want it.

Leadership : An endurance heavy set. It can be handy, but Tankers in general have enough end problems now, I did not see a reason to compound it.

Medicine : No room for it in my build. It can be very handy if you can find room for it though.

Presence : We used to dip into this pool for Provoke . Now that Taunt is the same thing but better, I dropped it. This pool has uses though.

Teleportation : TP Friend [/color]is great, but again no room for it. The other powers are not to my liking much. TP itself is less fun for me then SJ, and another non-concept power.

Other Epic/Ancillary Pools: I find Pyre Mastery on my Fire/Fire Tanker, Combustrana, extremely handy. Char , Fireblast , and Fire Ball have all been very handy powers in her arsenal. I do not have data on any of the others, but none of them fit me either. I can only tell you to look them up from those with experience.

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7-Tactics and Teamwork:
This section goes over some basic things I feel will help you tank and solo well. I have developed these through many battles.

Cluster-Pulling: Now that Taunt is no longer a single target power, it cannot single pull. However it can be used to cluster-pull. This entails Taunting a mob in a crowded room in a mission. It allows you to whittle numbers down in a nasty room situation (Malta is a big one, 8 person Malta mission rooms can be nasty.)

1-Have your team go around the corner or as far back as able if no corner presents itself. This is far more effective with corners however.

2-Find the closest mob you can, that is also in a less dense cluster if able.

3-Taunt this mob

4-Run around the corner (or way back if no corner), making sure to keep your teammates away from you! AoEs can still kill them if you get too close to your allies.

5-Wait for the mob plus any friends it brings, and then defeat them.

6-If needed repeat till the room is thin enough to charge into. Or just plow in if it's ready.

Protecting your team: This is crucial. We are a critical part of the defensive capabilities of a team. It is our duty to our team to help keep them alive. Between our aggro tools (Gauntlet, Taunt-Auras, and Taunt powers), and any teammates that can lock-down or otherwise help keep mobs off the more fragile team members, we can really help keep the 'squishies' alive. They can also help themselves by being aware of what is transpiring around them.

Aggro: Aggro is a 2-way street. We must strive to hold it, but the team must realize that they can only help themselves by being responsible for their own aggro too. Invincibility's aura, IOur inherent Taunt effects in all our attacks, Taunt, and Gauntlet are huge tools for us. Although Gauntlet only kicks in at 5+ and it scales, it is still a nice tool.

Aggro management has become more dynamic than it used to be. Taunt is capped at 5, Gauntlet at 5, and aggro auras at 10. These changes require us to be more active and we have to switch targets in large battles sometimes. Sometimes, merely switching to a target not previously in Invinc's aura and Punching them can aggro them and some of their cronies, this is a combo of our inherent Taunt's in all our attacks and Gauntlet. At higher levels, Gauntlet is extremely strong, but it is far weaker at the earlier levels we get it. Aggro has become much more complex and easier to lose control of in I5. You may be shocked if not ready for it. Try to be prepared and always be aware of your teammates and any mobs.

AoEs: I cannot stress this enough. You must keep any teammates you can out of AoEs. Whether cones, or PB AoEs, or ranged AoEs. We must keep the team out of them whenever possible. Only melee should be close to the mobs and in AoEs, some Auras are needed for us at times. But try to consult with the Controller/Defender in your team. They must try to stay as far as possible, some AoEs can one-shot most non-Tankers (Nightstar killed a 50 BS/Regen Scrapper with hers!). If it's a cone, turn the mob's back to the team. If ranged or PB AoE, try to keep them as far away from you as possible. A good Tanker strives to keep the team out of the danger of these AoEs. Most Scrapper can take the heat better then anyone else, but even then they should try to avoid these AoEs whenever they can.

Retreats: Yes, I know you don't like this word. But sometimes it's unavoidable. We must hold the line so our compatriots can go. I use Unstoppable for this many times. If you are a non-Tanker in a team, and the Tanker says run, please do so, and fast! That means we are holding our enemies until you get safe, then we follow. A good Tanker holds the line for the team.

Cooperation: Obvious perhaps? But some seem to miss it. No one AT/powerset is better then another. All have strengths to lend to the team. The team should work together, that means that you may have to stop and plan attacks. Also work together to keep aggro on you, the Tanker. No one who is working hard and contributing needs to feel left out or unappreciated.

Soloing: We are very good soloers. We are slow but steady. When soloing it is vital to assess the situation, and make sure you can handle it. Never think that just because someone else might be soloing faster that you are not capable. We can achieve much on our own. <ul type="square">

[*] Judging a mob cluster: This is important. If you feel you can not handle it, then do not aggro. As a Tanker, most mobs are not a huge threat for us, barring special cases that ramp up as you level. We are to my knowledge, the only AT that watches our end bar more then our health bar. Usually, I forget to look at the green and only watch the blue! Sometimes, you will be there, surrounded and gasping, if you were unprepared, but as the title of my guide says;Weather the Storm, and you shall eventually emerge victorious!

[*] Responsible soloing: This applies to groups as well, but usually groups blow through things pretty fast, whereas solo, we can take some time. Never train a person intentionally. If you find yourself over your head, try to get to the police drones if possible or failing that, try to get the mobs to follow you away from people. It is poor taste to intentionally give others debt, and sometimes you may accidently train someone. Try to make amends if you can. The same goes true for kill-stealing (KSing), never do this on purpose, although it can happen by accident. If it does try to make it up to the person(s) in question.

[*] Soloing tactics: Use corners to force mobs to close to melee range. Use SJ and a qeued attack on fliers. Never fight in vastly open spots if possible, always try to control terrain "choke-points" and keep mobs as close as you can. Use ranged attacks to finish up carnies when you can, so the end drain does not hit you. Sappers must be defeated before any other Malta mob, hit them with all you have! Rikti Mentalists and Mezmerists will pull their swords out if in melee, do not let them shoot you with psi if you can help it. And above all: Watch your end bar![/list]
New Invuln dynamics and what this means to you: Invuln went from heavy def with capped res to heavy def with capped S/L res, but poor other res. We still have a 90% cap, but can no longer reach it alone (this is my biggest complaint with I5. They could have fixed Invinc which is 3in1 anyway and left our resists alone instead of this oddball new Invuln we have). S/L foes will be almost no different for us, but the others will be better if you have a lot in melee to give +def per mob, up to 14. We have issues with tanking non-S/L AVs and monsters without these 'helper monkies', but soloing and in good teams we can still succeed. I5 Invuln is not as bad as some have said, but neither is it 'honky-dory' either. I have been able to do decently in a few AV, TF, and normal teams since I5 and lots of soloing to test out my build and survivability. My verdict is that it is working to a point but needs tweaking still. I do advise you to be more aware of who/what you are fighting and make sure you have a solid team for the harder missions/TFs/AVs and you should still be quite effective.

Final words: I still feel that Invuln/SS is viable and fun. However the early levels, which were always hard for us, have gotten even worse, the passives got cut too much, and Invinc is still good a power on it's own. If you are struggling: Do not give up! Try different tactics. Copy to test and if you have available respecs, try using those to change your build till you get what a build that works and is fun. My guide is for defense-centric people, maybe a Scranker would work better for you if you are having problems with my build. Remember that this is a game first and foremost, you should have fun no matter what build you use.

Well that wraps it up for now. I will probably add appendices as needed. I hope you like it, and whatever you do remember to always:

Weather the Storm.

Iron_Vixen · 09-18-2005 09:23 PM

This is part of a post I made earlier about I5. I thought I should tack it on the end of the guide while it's still fresh in my mind.

I will share my I5 experiences with Iron Vixen both team tanking and soloing. <ul type="square">
[*] Kronos Titan Ambush: My good friend's 47 Kat/Regen Scrappe got this last night. I had a comp issue and had to frantically come back in to help. She was getting beaten on hard, and had used a lot of greens in my absence. I got into melee with it, Taunted it, and proceeded to get and hold that big git. It went pretty well overall. His Stomp I barely noticed, but his beam was doing 283 a pop and since Invinc is, to put it mildly, a hunk of crap with only 1 foe, it wasn't helping much here. I DPed once, and our Empath healed me once, so not a problem as far as tanking, but it magnifies the fatal flaw with I5 Invuln: Good for S/L and lots of foes, and poor for small numbers of non-S/L foes.

[*] Katie Hannon TF: Got exemped down to 35 for this. The 10 AV ambush thing was annoying and due to how long it takes to get aggro on so many foes, we had some issues in the initial charge of the witches. Way too much end drain too, actually lost toggles once thanks to all the lightning, since there were so many that getting them all into melee was not working out. Once I was able to get the mobs into melee and keep the AVs attention, it went decently. The Ice Tanker with us had more serious issues with the damn lightning clouds. That merely reinforces the fact that Ice still needs serious consideration. The worst part of the 10 AV in a row issue was the 2nd attack caused not only my toggle crash, but we had 2 teammates fall as well. After her 2nd attack it went smoother, although the Ice Tanker died to the clouds as I mentioned earlier when we were split tanking a slightly seperated witch ambush. It was a good TF, but the difference between having and not having "helper monkies" is extreme.

I also want to add that Red Caps are farking annoying when you do Smashing damage!

[*] Soloing in RCS: I took Vixen to RCS several times and dealt with groups of Rikti (concentrated on 50s) including:

2 Chief Soldiers, 1 Chief Mentalist, 2 Headman Gunners, 2 minions

2 Chief Soldiers, 1 Chief Mentalist, 4 Headman Gunners, 4 minions

1 Chief Soldier, 1 Chief Mesmerist, 2 Chief Mentalists, 2 Headman Gunners, 4 minions

The last group was the worst due to being able to get the Mesmerist in melee so he would use his sword but the mentalists were too spread out and no terrain to force melee LoS on them. I had to DP on that group, but the others all went well. The group with 4 headman Gunners I lost CP and Rage with 2 of the Headman still left, and had to force them to melee using a bus stop shelter and wait for end to finish them off! But it worked.

[*] Soloing in PI: Fighting mostly 50s, CoT, Nemesis, Rikti, Malta, and Carnies.

CoT: 2 Orange Death Mages can force a DP, but otherwise not too terrible. The non-S/L damage feels high, but can be handled.

Nemesis:Interestingly enough (when compared to 2 50 Death Mages as above). I am having no real issue with Nemesis. Orange WarHulk+Fake Nemesis+White Dragoon I barely noticed the damage. The Warhulk in this example also "missed" when he blew up. Doing better against these than CoT.

Malta: Taking Sapper out first is SOP. I use Rage+KO Blow to take them out, and have Unstop to fall back on if needed. After that, not having any problems here either. The Titan Beams/Missles can add up if I am not in melee (this was from a mission I duoed with a Scrapper) when I was in melee with one group and another group with a Titan aggroed and shot at me several times. Once in melee, no problems.

Rikti: Basically the same as my point above in RCS. All the Energy beams can add up, but many will come to melee (or be forced to melee via using LoS to our advantage when able)
and this is critical for the psionic users anyway.

Carnies: I noticed no change here. Minions/Lieuts still laughable until they die and drain end (LBE can help at times here to coup de grace one from range). Bosses still very hard.

[*] 48 Infernal as sole Tanker: Me, Kat/Regen Scrapper, Dark and Empathy Defenders. Scrapper and Dark went for portal, while the Emp and I held chuckles. Never had an issue at all here. He was 2 levels lower, and that has to be considered, but he never really hurt me much (and my teammates know from past experience to keep away so he can't get them with his Whirling Axe!)

[*] 50 Tyrant with 3 other Invulns: This was a weird group. We had 4 Invuln Tankers, 1 Controller, 1 Defender, and 1 Blaster. One of the Invulns did die, but I found out he had used Unstoppable early in the fight and when he crashed Tyrant smacked him. I got a love tap from him once (NOT Total Focus, something else) and a few of the Whirling Hands hits, but it went a lot better than I expected.

Verdict: I don't feel invuln is garbage, but neither is it really where I think it should be. The whole being safer vs a lot over just one is still improper at best, and extremely poorly-thought out at worst. The times when a Tanker should really be wanted is for AVs and Monsters, since you can always break large numbers of smaller foes down anyway, and it's not working properly for Invuln right now.
[*] General Team Tanking: Taunt and LBE are great long range aggro tools. Invinc is still very effective at aggro in melee. The reduction of our aggro-target caps makes me run around and attack more which is good overall. Active tanking is far more satisfying and enjoyable than sessile taunting anyway. Some of the larger groups are hard to deal with in certain team compositions which is saddening as it moves towards cookie-cutter teams. Mixed-AT teams are good and desirable but should not be required. [/list]
Team tanking has gotten more difficult and requires more attention and would be far easier with a Controller/Tanker combo for crowd control+aggro management. A Controller would have really made the TF a lot smoother, but Red wanted to play an alt instead of exemping his Controller.

I sincerely hope they look at Invuln and adjust it for better single target tanking and maybe less so for horde tanking.

Gatecrasher · 09-18-2005 09:55 PM

As ever, coherent and well-thought out. Thanks for giving this Troll something to chew on, Ivy!

Later on,
Gatecrasher

@Generator
Mostly Pinnacle, with scattered alts on Liberty, Freedom, and Justice.

I had a great time playing with you!

Leehouse · 09-18-2005 10:15 PM

if you don't mind me asking how can you survive without end reducers in toggle and without stamina for so long and keep up a decent attack chain to hold aggro?

Work_Ethic · 09-19-2005 03:33 AM

Yeah, this guide is going in my comp favorites. It is an honest look at I5 without having to wade through all the [censored] and moaning. Thanx!!

What is your opinion on Acrobatics?....debating it for my next power, between Invic., or KO Blow.

Probably take either KO or Invic after reading your guide.

Again- Cheers and thanx!

(EDIT:- What is your Difficulty lvl set at?)

"I'm not scared of anyone or anything Angie. Isn't that the way life should be?"
Jack Hawksmoor, The Authority.

Iron_Vixen · 09-19-2005 05:24 AM

[ QUOTE ]
if you don't mind me asking how can you survive without end reducers in toggle and without stamina for so long and keep up a decent attack chain to hold aggro?

[/ QUOTE ]

I addressed this in the build here:
[ QUOTE ]
Slot End reducers early: I find that end reducers are more effective for toggles like Uy and TI early. Slotting them with Training dmg res is not too terribly effective and end is at a massive premium till Stamina.

Getting Stamina: If you can move things around (like R/En as an example) you can push Stamina in earlier. I would stress that you definately want Invinc at 18 unless you can't fit it in until later. Invinc has gone from important to absolutely critical.

[/ QUOTE ]
And I also stress that it is a repsec build right before my build/slots are laid out. I fully recommend slotting end reducers early, and if you can, getting Stamina earlier (even at the cost of Rage or Haymaker if needed).

Iron_Vixen · 09-19-2005 05:27 AM

Acro is not needed for invuln, Uy is fine for status protection.

Invinc is extremely critical and I would say to get it ASAP. But don't put KO Blow off too long.

Mine is still on heroic as always. I don't have any missions at 50 anyway, and Some of my friends set theirs higher and that is when I get to test against nastier enemies, especially when exemped.

Reckage · 09-19-2005 07:58 AM

as always, extremely well done

Sentinel_Queen · 09-19-2005 10:16 AM

Great stuff, as always Iron Vixen! A question for you. As I approach 50 with my newest generation of tanks, the choice of Energy Mastery for Conserve Power seems less appealing with how we need to actively manage aggro now.

My question is, have you any experience with the Pyre Mastery pool with say a slotted Fire Blast and Fireball to replace one or two of the lower SS attacks and enable an increased ranged aggro-management? Both blasts would be a nice addition to Taunt for ranged command & control. I know for thematic reasons, you chose not to go Pyre on Iron Vixen....just wondering if you toyed around with the combination at all while you were on Test.

I'm thinking the blasts (and possibly all the SS attacks) would require at least one EndRed, if not two in the bigger end-suckers, to account for the lack of Conserve Power and the high burn-rate of the Blasts...but as this is my first SS tank, and the first of my tanks planning on passing on Energy Mastery upon 41, I'm hungry for anyones' thoughts/experience (Test play or Live) with a setup like that.

Thanks again for a great read!

Iron_Vixen · 09-19-2005 10:31 AM

My Fire/Fire Tanker has Pyre Mastery.

Char-1 acc, 2 holds
Fireblast-1 acc, 3 dmg
Fire Ball- 1acc, 5 dmg

Fireball is extremely handy for aggro. Ranged AoE is very nice, and I use FE+BU to really make it sting. I use Char for Sappers and other annoying foes (guardians, ice thorns, etc). Fireblast is also handy for aggro (single target), but I can also use it to pull in highly congested situations where we don't want to pull too many at once (like the multi-tiered room of death if it has Malta).

As for end? Hard to judge since Combustrana has Consume. I really cannot give enough praise to it! I find CP very handy on Vixen, and use LBE for some ranged aggro. You could maybe try Energy Torrent out of the Energy Mastery pool if you want CP?

King_Moloch · 09-19-2005 11:06 AM

Incredible work, Vix. Almost convinced even me to come back!

Stand UP.
FIGHT BACK!

Roxstar · 09-19-2005 11:09 AM

thanx so much I've been needing a good guide for my in/ss tank. I've been mainly Stone since I started so this'll be a nice change!

Justice Blues · 09-19-2005 01:50 PM

I have the Ice Mastery pool on JB as part of a concept build.

Block of Ice is a great hold, and it stacks nicely with KO Blow for the occasion hold on AVs and Bosses. I use it against Sappers in Malta missions, then run up and hit them with KO Blow. That takes out White or Yellows, and a follow up Footstomp will take care of higher levels, as well as hit the others in the spawn. I found this to be very effective 95% of the time in Malta missions on Invincible.

Ice Blast I don't use much, it does decent damage, recharges nicely and doesn't seem too bad on end usage. OTOH, someone here on the forum recently pointed out that Chilblain does the same damage, uses less end, recharges faster, immobilize, and is -fly. To offset this, it is DoT and has a shorter range. Even so, I will be switching to it when I finally do my I5 respec. Oh yeah, both powers are -Recharge, -Speed.

Ice Storm I do not have and do not recommend for Inv/ tanks. It has a scatter effect that completely overrides any taunts. As IV pointed out, this is a very bad thing for us now.

As for putting EndRedux in your SS attacks, I only have one in Footstomp. All my other attacks are 1 Recharge/* Damage, with * from 2 to 5, depending on attack. 6 slotted Stamina obviously, but that is all. The only time I have endurance troubles is Sappers or Carnie Bosses. An AV fight would cause problems if it was solo due to length, but it since it is always a team event, no problems.

IV, nice guide, but isn't the duration on Unstoppable now 180 seconds instead of 200? I agree with your philosophy on both max resists and avoiding the Fighting pool. I am a tank, my purpose is taking damage. I do like the regen effect from perma-DP and 6 slotted Health, even though it costs me extra slots. And while the heal is not as great as what you get, I do get it more often.

My experiences with AVs since I5 have not been as consistently good as yours, but I am still on my I4 (or I3?) build. My S/L resist is only 52 right now without Unstoppable. When I respec, I have no doubt things will be much better.

Justice Blues, Tech/Tank, Inv/SS
----------------------
Fighting The Future Trilogy
----------------------

Iron_Vixen · 09-19-2005 03:06 PM

[ QUOTE ]
IV, nice guide, but isn't the duration on Unstoppable now 180 seconds instead of 200?

[/ QUOTE ]
Ah rats, I forgot to change that duration back to 180 seconds. I went over my old numbers to repair them but missed this one. It also has a 1000 second recharge for quite some time.

[ QUOTE ]
I do like the regen effect from perma-DP and 6 slotted Health, even though it costs me extra slots. And while the heal is not as great as what you get, I do get it more often.

[/ QUOTE ]
Totally viable of course. I really was debating between 6 in health or 6 in TH, I could not afford both and went with TH. As for DP, I have found the big heal really helps me with alphas. The regen of perma-DP is certainlty nothing to sneeze at though.

[ QUOTE ]
My experiences with AVs since I5 have not been as consistently good as yours, but I am still on my I4 (or I3?) build. My S/L resist is only 52 right now without Unstoppable. When I respec, I have no doubt things will be much better.

[/ QUOTE ]
My AV experience has been pretty limited since I5, and I hope we get the AV damage reduction soon. Tyrant never hit me with his Total Focus in the example above and I know it really hurt Combustrana.

BinkDeBook · 09-19-2005 05:37 PM

Once again Iron Vixen, great guide. When I eventually do get around to respec'ing my Inv/ss tanker, I'm going to heavly borrow from this. Thanks for taking the time to do this!

Take Care,
BinkDeBook
Virtue: CaptainMayhem-50 Inv/SS Tank; NaomiArmitage-50 DM/Inv Scrap; Captn Randomizer-50 MC/Kin Cntrller; Murky Thecat-50 Claws/SR Scrap; Professor Junk-50 Bots/Traps MM; +Others Arc Id #77311, #227436

_MuK_ · 09-20-2005 12:54 AM

Great guide, but I'm still not convinced INV is fun to play pre-18. I struggled with mine to 11, and finally gave up.

I hope INV will get some love soon.

Thanks for all the excellent work,

bpphantom · 09-20-2005 08:31 AM

First time looking at your new guide IV. I think I'll copy it to our SG forums (with credit of course).

Good guide, covers all the bases and really helps with the number crunching.

As for struggling to 18, I hate to say it but just get PL'd, or go scranker until you can respec into a post invince build. My invulns are doing it the hard way, but as tenthiary (what is the word for 10th on the playlist) characters I can easilly only play them when I have a good team.

@bpphantom
The Defenders of Paragon
KGB Special Section 8

Sentinel_Queen · 09-20-2005 09:10 AM

The biggest reason I ask about the Pyre pool and endreds in SS/pyre attacks is that I run perma-hasten. I'm not going to bother with REn/REl/RPD and am planning on a sixed UNS (Rech) for the uh-oh moments that perma-DP, sixed TH/TI/UNY/INV/Health can't deal with.

Perma-Hasten brings UNS back all the sooner, as with DP...but means I'll be able to attack more frequently and of course burn much more end than I can regen. Of course, this is the other "benefit" to having UNS handy more frequently...the increased end recovery will allow me to more fully utilize my hastened build and throw aggro-control and damage every which way before I crash and burn.

I guess I'll find out soon enough via trial/error where the best bang for my buck is in endred placement.

Bayani · 09-20-2005 09:34 AM

Rock on Iron Vixen!

masterpiece · 09-20-2005 09:59 AM

I did something similar as what you have but only 6 slotted TI, UY, TH, stamina and 1 slotted RPD and invinc.

I took on 2 Orange Death Mages and was eating respite, plus 1 activation of DP, and then finally Unstoppable.

Thanks IV for the post, even though I have a Invul/Fire/Eng tank, the defense is where I was wondering about. Going to test it and see what happens! Cheers!

Synfoola · 09-20-2005 10:37 AM

Great stuff, dear. I may finally have enough inspiration to respec my Invuln/Stone and grind those last 3 levs out to 50.

Ice Knight · 09-20-2005 08:01 PM

Excellent guide and right into my favorites.

Justice Blues · 09-20-2005 09:55 PM

IV, I really need to respec, since my next mission is Tyrant. He wasn't bad the time I helped an SG mate, but that was before I5.

Running perma-Hasten, I would definitely go with EndRedux in my attacks. You can still hit the damage cap very easily, and the saved endurance will be a big help on avoiding Unstoppable.

Justice Blues, Tech/Tank, Inv/SS
----------------------
Fighting The Future Trilogy
----------------------

judgestarx · 09-21-2005 05:11 AM

awesome post, and guide!

Iron_Vixen · 09-21-2005 08:48 AM

[ QUOTE ]
IV, I really need to respec, since my next mission is Tyrant. He wasn't bad the time I helped an SG mate, but that was before I5.

[/ QUOTE ]
He hit my Fire/Fire Tanker for over 1400 with his Total Focus between the Energy/Smashing damage (800/600 or so), I hate to see what he does energy-wise with Invuln's poor Energy res now. The smashing part should not be too bad.