A Small Guide to Pulling --by Dwimble
Yay! Finally a good, succinct post on pulling.
Thanks Dwimble
Currently listening to: Sibelius Symphony No. 4
good guide. having come from a game(anarchy online) where you could not survive if there wasn't a good puller on the team, i am constantly amazed at how few people in coh have any idea how to pull properly. pulling just doesn't play much part in this game, but when you need it, it's hard to find.
sadly, the best pullers i've come across in this game are when i'm kraken farming. and i think they do it out of routine than any formalized pulling strategy.
I have a couple things to add if others can back it up.
When you are pulling and do not want to aggro the entire group, try using low or no damage powers (Siphon power, transfusion, single target taunt). From my experience, the mob is much less likely to call attention to your presence if you do little or no damage.
The duck-around-a-corner as soon as you fire tactic can also be accomplished by having a wall/gate/railing between you & the mob. Simply select the target, activate the power (it won't fire until you have line of sight) then jump up just high enough so your power will activate.
When running door missions, you can sometimes encounter densely packed groups of mobs. If your team can handle a single group, try pulling out one of the fringe groups to your team to first thin out the room.
Also, as a */Dev blaster, Trip Mine tends to aggro/pull mobs if they are never aware of your presence (i.e. you stealthed in, planted the TM and ducked around a corner out of LOS before it blows). If this happens, the mobs will aggro on the first thing visible to them (any teammate or if you go back into LOS).
One more thing, to facillitate keeping your teammates behind cover while pulling, try this. Keep them updated on what you are doing. Ask if they are ready. Tell them you are going to pull, then do it. Also, after you whittle the group down to the point where you think pulling will get the entire group, tell them. This will satisfy their curiosity and bolster their confidence in your abilities. This is much more important in the early levels since a mistake can end up in many dirt naps.
And another point. Only employ one puller in the group. Having two or more people pulling can mess the whole thing up.
Thanks for the added info. I've never tried the lower damage attack thing to notice a difference. I'll have to play around with it a bit. Thanks.
Also, I forgot to mention that about standing behind a fence/crate and jumping up. I do it all the time, I can't imagine why that slipped my mind. I'll have to add that in if I ever expand or revise it.
Thanks again.
Dwimble
great guide! Being a sniper and new at this game. I know some of those tricks (jumping up, and edge) but i often shoot the boss first, Never again! and I will diffently be the puller on the team now after reading those tactics.
Just a little story, a group of 8 of us were playing the tommy 2 guns mish, and our puller went up and shot tommy, and we TP'd him back to us, well Tommy came by himself!!!!!!!!!!! I couldnt believe he just pulled the main boss surrounded by his men, and he came alone! crazy
I am pretty new, but had an experience or two with the Tsoo yesterday. My group was a pickup mostly, but the controller invited me as the tank. We had worked together before so I accepted. We soon found out that it is not wise to pull A) a sorcerer, and B) anywhere close to a sorcerer. These guys not only can heal their pals and TP, they will also TP to you after you have run away and then TP their pals to you as well. It did not help that our blaster had an itchy trigger finger, and tried to solo the above sorcerers, but eventually he waited for the group and we killed them.
Aragon the Bold Level 17 Invuln/War Mace Tank
An extra tip for pulling, try not to pull with attacks that can knockdown, or kockback a foe. I have a lvl 41 ar/dev blaster and when I pull with burst I have more succesfull pulls then when I pull with slug.
Another good tactic I use for pulling, or even killing a mob within a group. Turn on SS, CJ and Cloaking Device... move within burst range, SS back up and right before you get out of range take a jump and press attack button. Due to SS and CJ you draw your weapon in midair but keep finishing your jump and you land out of l.o.s. firering your weapon. In most cases the foe doesn't know what hits him, until you get back in his range again. If you wait it out a bit, the agg drops.. and you can do this all over again. Might take some practice, but it works =)
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An extra tip for pulling, try not to pull with attacks that can knockdown, or kockback a foe. I have a lvl 41 ar/dev blaster and when I pull with burst I have more succesfull pulls then when I pull with slug.
Another good tactic I use for pulling, or even killing a mob within a group. Turn on SS, CJ and Cloaking Device... move within burst range, SS back up and right before you get out of range take a jump and press attack button. Due to SS and CJ you draw your weapon in midair but keep finishing your jump and you land out of l.o.s. firering your weapon. In most cases the foe doesn't know what hits him, until you get back in his range again. If you wait it out a bit, the agg drops.. and you can do this all over again. Might take some practice, but it works =)
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I've done this but with super jump it works the same, just becareful where you land! lol
The "cover-snipe" also works well with Hover, and in any case pull shots work best with a non-instant shot.
Ice bolt isn't an instant shot- the bolt takes a bit to actually strike and aggro. Lightning bolt is- the shot hits immediately after reaching the target.
Long animation shots work too. A snipe that won't kill the target does great- start the shot outside of cover, drop into cover, shot goes off, you hit and are out of immediate LOS. Good pull.
Note that dropping someone near a group is one of the best ways to get the entire group to come find out why. Don't do it. It's one reason to be cautious using a big shot to pull.
I've gotten my sniper rifle to the point that I cant pull with it, I've been killing some orange mobs (family) almost every yellow mob encountered and every white mob with 1 shot. So i've been pulling the bosses if they are red cause I cut them in half. But those are the missions i do when the highiest baddie is red and not purple, its a different story when im on missions 3 or 4 levels ahead of me.
if asked how i have my sniper sloted , im lvl 23 and its 6 slotted with all 25 SO damage enhances and stacked to the max. My aim bot is 3 sloted with to hit buffs stacked so i'm hitting stuff like 80% of the time.
Take a minute to determine who might be the best puller on the team. This seems so obvious that it shouldn't need mentioning, but I've been on way too many teams where a scrapper or tank insists on trying to pull, when there's a perfectly good blaster with a snipe on the team. If the blaster doesn't yet know how to properly pull, it doesn't take long to teach them.
Also, please keep in mind that defenders are part blaster! Most people seem to forget this. A lot of defenders have a snipe (mine had his at 4th level). However, in the low levels I would frequently find that I was completely ignored whenever I offered to pull. Trust me, defenders are often very good pullers. They have to be when they solo.
I have an 18 Elect/Ice blaster and 18 Rad/Dark defender that I play occasionally. When I get an even-con door mish, I always spare a few minutes toying with the fine art of pulling. (Mostly I fail, but I'm learning a lot in my experimentation.)
The one conclusion that I've realized is this: Even if you follow the advice as given above, Snipe powers seem to have only a 50/50 chance to single-pull a target. Both my defender and blaster had their snipe power for many levels, and even though I'll snipe a baddie from 100+ yards away and quickly duck around a corner, 50% of the time ALL the mobs come running.
when I get a chance, I'm going to copy over to the Test server and load up my lvl 1 blaster power (Charged Bolts) with two accuracy and 4 Range increase DOs. It's my weakest ranged attack power. I'll see if there's any change which using that blast power as opposed to my snipe.
Also, I'm getting quite good at pulling as a Scrapper. I've become a good judge of distance. I'll get my Spine/Regen scrapper to within 60 yards of the closest mob, and just wait. Within a few seconds, he'll turn to face me. Usually there's anywhere from 1 - 10 second pause where the mob is thinking "hey, is that a hero is see over yonder?" Eventually he'll whip out his pistol and take a shot. As soon as I see him reach for his gun I back peddle. I have to take that first shot of course. But that mob now has to come running after me, seperating himself from the group. Just back peddle a safe distance from the whole group and engage the mob alone.
Even better, sometimes he'll bring one two of his friends. I can handle 3 minions at once no problem. And now that scary group is 3 minions less to deal with. So far, I havn't encountered a case where the whole group comes ... just 3 at most.
Something to add to the hide after your shot section.
If terrain permits combine shooting a mob with a lateral jump behind cover that breaks line of sight. When done correctly it will appear that you are firing through the intervening terrain.
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An extra tip for pulling, try not to pull with attacks that can knockdown, or kockback a foe.practice, but it works =)
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I've had success with my main (energy/energy blaster) in pulling with a knockdown snipe. I just have to be reeeeeally careful when I do. The direction that the foe gets knocked back into comes into play do NOT knock the foe back into the rest of his group, as this will bring them all to you.
Interesting thing, too, is I've had success in actually sniping from within the mob, targeting a foe on the edge, so he is knocked away from his buddies. With SS and stealth on, of course. There is a need to do this sometimes in tight mission maps, like labs or caverns. Just remember that the target still needs to be some distance away from the rest of the mob.
By the way, thanks for the awesome guide, Dwimble! Now, to find a way to cram this info down the throats of all dem pick-up groups...
My little hint is to not ignore TP Foe. It's no longer the suicide button it was last year and is very practical, especially when slotted with range or accuracy. It's major advantages are that a) anyone can get it and b) You don't need line of sight, just target run behind the wall and activate.
Excellent guide, bravo!
You know, I think I KNOW captain Impatient...is he the dimwit who INSISTS that it is IMPOSSIBLE to "single pull in this game", and ruins every single pull just to prove his point, be he a blaster, Controller, defender, scrapper, or tanker? My favorite is the Tanker Captain Impatient who insists on taunting every single mob being pulled while the other mobs are still in the radius of his taunt power...or the blaster who pulls with fireballs, or the Kheldian (who should know better) who pulls with his AOEs....or...
(EDIT): Speaking of Khelds, they have one of the BEST pulling tricks around.
In squidform, start on ONE side of a doorway, target a mob out of your line of sight and activate your wimpiest single target attack, then move as fast as possible to the other side of the dooway. Your flight momentum will carry you across and your shot will go off when you are alread out of the mobs' LOS.
The Optimist says the glass is half full.
The Pessimist says the glass is half empty.
While they argue about it, the Opportunist comes along, drinks what's left, and removes all doubt. - Redwood
Alvays remember, schmot guy...any plan vere you lose you hat...is a BAD PLAN!
Also it seems that some group have different AI. Banished panteons and vahz come in mind but I don't remember if the zombie was easier to pull of the lt's. I haven't played in those level for a long time. I think if you pull the mort all the zombie will follow but I'm not sure. Someone can confirm this?
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Interesting thing, too, is I've had success in actually sniping from within the mob, targeting a foe on the edge, so he is knocked away from his buddies. With SS and stealth on, of course. There is a need to do this sometimes in tight mission maps, like labs or caverns. Just remember that the target still needs to be some distance away from the rest of the mob.
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Just in case it wasn't obvious, the above no longer holds true due to Suppression in Issue 4.
Pulling a hostage guard group from a packed room full of mobs using stealth+sspeed:
Target one of the hostage guards. Pull using one of the techniques listed above. When the target is clear of the room and approaching your safe area, toggle off sspeed to drop out of invis to stealth only. This will bring the rest of the guard group without agro'ing anything else in the crowded room. Finish off the mobs. You've just rescued a hostage from a room of death with minimal gambling.
-Sandolphan
"When heroes fail, the Angels will save you."
MASTERMIND NUMERIC KEYPAD PET CONTROLS
HAMIDON NUKE RAID GUIDE
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Thanks for the added info. I've never tried the lower damage attack thing to notice a difference. I'll have to play around with it a bit. Thanks.
Dwimble
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It makes a huge difference, I would rank it in the top 3 things to know when pulling.
the other two being the watch the way the opponents are facing and get out of the range of the one you are trying to pull. If he/she fires a shot in earshot of the other mobs, they will come.
Great guide. There's one tactic I haven't seen listed here that's worked really well in groups with my mind controller. I use Mass Hypnosis on the group we want to pull from, which puts them to sleep and is aggro-free, so we don't have to worry about automatically drawing aggro from the ones not hit by the sleep. After that, the person doing the pulling can pull whomever they want, and at worst the pull will just drag along the few mobs that didn't get put to sleep. Pull them far away enough and you don't have to worry about drawing aggro from the slept group when they wake up.
This is somewhat specific to mind controllers (Earth Controllers get Salt Crystals, a PBAoE, but that's a little more dangerous since they actually have to run into the group to set it off; I also don't know if it draws aggro or not), but it's extremely effective and something to keep in mind for those groups where they're too big and dense to pull a small enough group to be safe.
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Also, I'm getting quite good at pulling as a Scrapper. I've become a good judge of distance. I'll get my Spine/Regen scrapper to within 60 yards of the closest mob, and just wait. Within a few seconds, he'll turn to face me. Usually there's anywhere from 1 - 10 second pause where the mob is thinking "hey, is that a hero is see over yonder?" Eventually he'll whip out his pistol and take a shot. As soon as I see him reach for his gun I back peddle. I have to take that first shot of course. But that mob now has to come running after me, seperating himself from the group. Just back peddle a safe distance from the whole group and engage the mob alone.
Even better, sometimes he'll bring one two of his friends. I can handle 3 minions at once no problem. And now that scary group is 3 minions less to deal with. So far, I havn't encountered a case where the whole group comes ... just 3 at most.
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The proximity aggro seems to work really well with my scrapper as well. The other thing I've noticed is that the closer you are to the spawn point of the group when you actually do damage (if you happened to pull more than you intended), the more likely it is that the whole group will continue to follow you instead of turning around and heading back when you get outta range.
Small Update
I've been planning on updating this guide for a while now. Hopefully I'll get to it soon. In the mean time, I thought I'd add a little point to the thread.
Since I wrote this small guide I've found that the changes that were made to TP Foe a little while back made it the best and most useful pulling power in the game. In my opinion there is no better way to pull. You can target something, get out of sight, and then TP it right to you. A TP'd foe has no chance to shoot at you when near his buddies, and thus alert them to your presence. Further, there is very little chance of agroing the remaining mobs, and when you miss, it never (or almost never) causes any agro. TP Foe is now a GREAT power for pulling...nothing else even comes close.
Note though, that the TP'd mob will probably be able to get an attack off after the TP but before you can do something else. That is seldom a problem though, in my opinion.
I posted this in a reply to a question about pulling in the Player Questions section, but seeing that is had the makings of a small guide to pulling I am posting it here.
Here are some tips on pulling that may help to solve the mystery for some of you who want to pull successfully but just can't seem to master it:
Pull from the edge
As much as possible try to pull villains that are separated from the group to which they are "attached". Frequently there are some that walk around and you can catch them when they are at a good distance from the others. If none are walking around then try to pull someone from the edge of the crowd.
Pull mobs the others aren't facing
If a group of mobs is standing around, try to pull one that the others aren't looking at. Mobs are much less likely to notice when you shoot someone whom they AREN'T facing. For example, if two guys are fighting, don't try to pull one of the ones fighting, pull someone watching the fight. If one mob is speaking, don't pull the speaker, pull someone listening to him, and so on.
Don't pull bosses
Don't pull bosses! Many people just don't get this or won't believe it. Occasionally it will work, but not very often. Typically if you try to pull a boss he will bring everyone with him. You can frequently pull Lts successfully with practice, but try to stick with minions as much as possible until you have no choice but to try a Lt.
Get as much range as possible
Get as far away as possible from the group you are trying to pull. While it is possible to pull with shorter range attacks, it is much more difficult. Use a snipe if you have it, and at long range. If you must use a shorter range attack then try to use something with at least an 80' to 100' range. Get out of range, target the enemy, hit the attack, and then slowly move forward until it goes off. That will ensure maximum range on the attack. You can't do this with snipes because moving will interrupt them. Snipes will, however, still give you the "out of range" message, so you can just keep inching forward and pausing to hit the attack until it finally starts.
Get your team out of sight or at least back
This is typically one of the most difficult parts (especially on pickup teams) because oftentimes people don't listen, are too impatient, don't care, or simple don't know what they are doing. But, I've seen more pulls gone bad than you can imagine for this simple reason. People are too close, so when you shoot and the mobs look your way, they see everyone and all come.
Hide after your shot
As much as possible you should pull to a corner or an obstacle like a crate or column. Take your shot and then QUICKLY step behind the crate or around the corner. This will force the mob to come all the way to the corner or crate before he can attack you (very important when trying to pull mobs who use ranged attacks).
Move quick after your shot
As mentioned in the previous point, move QUICK after you take your shot. Get out of sight or Super Speed way out of the mob's range immediately. Frequently if a mobs has time to shoot at you while he is still near his buddies then that will alert all of them to your presence. If he has to run to a corner or get himself within range of you before he attacks then they won't see.
Move/Hide even if you one shot the mob
If you one shot the mob then you should still hide for a few seconds. If you don't hide then the others will notice that their buddy just hit the dirt and look around to find out who did it. If they see your group standing there then they'll all come running.
Your team must WAIT to attack
This is the other common thing that wrecks pulls. You hit a mob, he starts moving toward you (hopefully to the corner you just stepped behind if you are smart) and Capt. Impatient on your team just can't restrain himself and shoots when the mob is only halfway to you. So what happens? The mob stops and shoots at Capt. Impatient, alerts his buddies to your group's presence, and then they all come running. If your team will restrain themselves enough to get around the corner with you and then let loose on the evil guy when he rounds the corner, then things will go nicely. Further, they should have him pre-targeted or be assisting you so that they can attack him before he gets the chance to attack you. Why? Because the mob hates you of course. He wants to kill you and will frequently run past everyone else trying to get to you. Since it's likely you are one of the weakest guys on the team, that could spell death for you if your team isn't ready to pounce on him as he rounds the corner.
Dealing with "packed" groups
Occasionally you will find large groups who are very tightly packed together with no "edge" to pull from. Don't be surprised in those situations if the whole group comes. They can be very hard to pull, if not impossible. In those situations if pulling is very important due to group size, weak defenses, and so on... use some "hit and run". Hit one mob and everyone run until agro is lost. Wait a little while to make sure they've "forgotten" about you, and then go back. Sometimes that will have loosened up the group a bit so that you can now find an edge to pull from.
Summery
Get way back, near a corner or obstacle, with only you visible. Pull a minion from the edge who doesn't have the group's attention. The instant your attack goes off step behind the obstacle or super speed well out of the mob's range.
If you follow that procedure you will frequently succeed. Sometimes two or three or several may come, but rarely the whole group, and even more rarely the boss with them (assuming there is a boss). However, some types of bosses come more often than others. Vahz bosses, for example, almost always come, as do the Lts. But of course Vahz are different in many ways...many rules just don't apply to them. For pulling or otherwise.
Dwimble