Werner
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Posts
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Joined
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Quote:I'm SO in if we do that.Originally Posted by Rieze
We gotta do this the next time we run an all scrapper ITF. I don't even care it we just do this then dissban. This sounds like it fun.
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Quote:Grant Cover only gives defense to your teammates, not to you. It gives you defense debuff resistance.Originally Posted by War_Hero_NA
He mentioned dropping grant cover for manuvers. That seems kindof silly to me. GC gives more +def for less endurance.
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Quote:I agree, and in that order.Originally Posted by Neogumbercules
I'm no WP expert but typed defense, +HP, and +regen seem like a good place to start.
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To put some numbers on it, Storm Kick -> Crane Kick -> Storm Kick -> Crippling Axe Kick does about 85% higher DPS than Thunder Kick -> Boxing -> Air Superiority.
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You're not missing anything. It's a great combination.
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Assuming we're talking about an IO'd out build, the top Martial Arts DPS chain is Storm Kick -> Crane Kick -> Storm Kick -> Crippling Axe Kick. But you may be talking about something to use while leveling.
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Umbral, the only thing that's making me sad in your build is that Tough isn't slotted up. How's the endurance? For 0.10 EPS, you could pull the endurance recovery IO out of Stamina and stick a +3 ribosome in Tough. It's not a lot, but it's a step in what I think is the right direction. Probably better to do something a little more thorough, though. I'm also guessing it has enough recharge to use the damage instead of damage/recharge in Hack and Head Splitter.
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Quote:And you can get some SERIOUS DPS out of Katana/Super Reflexes. OK, not Dark Melee/Shield Defense serious, but pretty serious. Plus Katana will turn a very late blooming secondary into a reasonably early-blooming combination. Just take Divine Avalanche while leveling, and spec out of it later when you no longer need it. I personally think it's a great choice.Originally Posted by Umbral_NA
In general, I'd keep away from kat/sr if you're aiming for IO optimization simply because one of the biggest benefits of having Kat is Divine Avalanche, which */sr doesn't need at all, but, even so, that would allow you to focus on using Kat for dps rather than having to sacrifice DPS for survivability.
Katana/Willpower seems to be the consensus recommendation for a do anything build. Easy to build, easy to play, easy to level, and gives up nothing on top end power. Reasonable single target and passable AoE damage. The other combinations are great too, but Katana/Willpower might be considered the simplest path to greatness.
I really need to finish leveling that Katana/Dark. I was spending all my effort on my Broad Sword/Shield Defense, both leveling and planning out the build. And now that I have the level 50, the planned build and the influence, I'm just not so much into it. The build I designed was to be as tanky as possible in as many situations as possible, including to-hit buffs, pets, defense debuffs, and so on. DPS suffered, and would often be lower than my two mains while solo. So now I'm looking at that build and thinking, Why not just play a DPS tank?
Katana/Regen is my personal favorite, but it can require a lot of focus and experience. For example, I've done no temp no inspiration storm palace laps with Katana/Regen and with Dark Melee/Super Reflexes. The DM/SR can pretty much sleep walk through it. The Katana/Regen was nail biting, heart pounding focus for over an hour, and once I relaxed after completing the lap, I was very quickly defeated. Now, I love playing that way, but not all the time. My poor blood pressure can't take it.
Frankly, there's nothing wrong with Katana/Invuln. You should be able to make an incredible powerhouse out of it if you have the budget.
Really, there's nothing bad to pair Katana with. It goes well with everything. It's more a matter of how you want your secondary to play. -
Hack has the same activation time and does 64% more damage than Slash. It doesn't take late game IOs to make it better. It's just better. If you're concerned about endurance burn, just attack more slowly, as it has the same DPE as Slash.
(Edit: Wait, is it the recharge you're worried about? End game builds are activation time limited, not recharge limited, so maybe that's what you meant by your late game comment. Early game builds tend to be endurance limited. While leveling up, I might take Hack AND Slash, just to fill out the attack chain. But I'd probably take Hack first.) -
Quote:Yeah, we'd probably start Sunday at 7:00 PM eastern time like we've done before.Originally Posted by Cynic
Am gonna guess this is happening stateside so good luck
Still, it looks like if the US started late morning to early afternoon, Europe could join in on the fun. I'm on the west coast of the US, but I'm happy to start at 10:00 AM or after. That's only 8:00 PM out in eastern Europe if I'm reading my map correctly (not a skill we Americans are known for
).
I personally believe that US Americans are unable to do so because some people out there in our nation don't have maps and I believe that our education like such as South Africa and the Iraq everywhere like such as and I believe that they should our education over here in the US should help the US should help South Africa and should help the Iraq and the Asian countries so we will be able to build up our future for our children. -
I'll probably be up for it, but you'd best put me on the alternate list since I'm not committing. So if anyone else wants in, they get first dibs.
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Quote:Not one that takes any top end slotting into account. But for just raw, unenhanced numbers, you're losing about 20% DPS compared to the top DPS chain (Golden Dragonfly -> Gambler's Cut -> Soaring Dragon -> Gambler's Cut). Divine Avalanche hurts. Still, the recharge requirement is MUCH lower, and it does enough DPS for Pylons and most AVs.Originally Posted by Dornn
Just out of curiosity do you have any kind of DPS comparison for this attack chain vs a best DPS chain for Katana?
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OK, I think we agree, then, SteelKing. I see a Scrapper's primary job as damage (like a Blaster), and secondary job as protecting squishies (such as a Blaster). I also agree that Scrappers should be largely self-reliant, one less squishy for others to worry about.
If Leadership helps you achieve that, great. If Leadership doesn't help you achieve that, but you can fit it in without much compromise, great. If Leadership doesn't help you achieve that, and you're compromising your damage and survivability to fit it in, then you're weakening your primary team role for something that is only slightly helpful. -
Huge, huge amounts of recharge. Then defense. Plus Umbral will probably post an uber build for you, making it easy.
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Since you're willing to farm up the influence, I'd probably go MA/SD. You can push Martial Arts damage output quite high. I think you'll be able to hit the same number of AVs as other scrappers. In theory, there's nothing stopping you from beating Dominatrix's 50% smashing resistance.
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Divine Avalanche -> Gambler's Cut -> Golden Dragonfly -> Gambler's Cut -> Divine Avalanche -> Gambler's Cut -> Soaring Dragon -> Gambler's Cut
Technically, the double stack drops for a fraction of a second in that chain. I will generally use that chain, then dynamically drop one or two Gambler's Cuts depending on the situation, such as if I'm doing a lot of moving between enemies, or I missed a Divine Avalanche, that kind of thing. You're looking at 90% recharge in Gambler's Cut, which is trivial. Put an Achilles' Heel in Gambler's Cut. If you can afford it, I'd use five Hecatombs (all but damage/recharge).
Mind you, I'm assuming best here means best single target sustained DPS. -
Quote:I'm a big fan of Leadership, even when soloing. If it gets me kicked from a team, LOL @ team. What's the problem, you think my build must suck because there are obviously too many compromises in it if I have Leadership? OK. Your team's loss.Originally Posted by SteelKing
1. Adding four leadership powers to your build would dramatically increase the chance of being kicked from teams with good reason.
2. Anybody who expects more than damage and some occasional tanking from a scrapper is probably nobody I'd like to team with.
Yet another reason to add to my list of reasons that I don't team with pick up groups. *chuckle* -
I think Strength of Will tends to be underrated. A 30% resistance buff may not sound like much, but as stacked on your other resistances, it's going to cut smashing/lethal damage in half, and knock a third off the others. It's a significant survivability boost. I'll agree, while cringing, that it's skippable. But I wouldn't skip it.
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Something else I thought I'd throw out there is that to some extent on a Regen, +regen and +recharge accomplish equivalent things. Both give you more hit points per second. They're not exactly equivalent, but in Umbral's rectangle visualization, they both largely contribute to the length of one side of the rectangle and not the other. Moment of Glory being the big exception. And of course +recharge can be very useful for other things as well, such as attack chains. But on a Katana/Regen, not so much, as the defensive chain of DA-GC-SD-GC-DA-GC-GD-GC comes together at a mere 90% recharge.
I like your rectangle visualization, Umbral. Good way to think of it. -
Quote:Yeah, that's what I have, a lowbie SD/DM tank. Slotting and playing him like a scrapper. Oh, and gave him wings, Hover, Flight, Swiftness, and slotted them. Going for fun, since tanks are such a pain to solo. So I'm actually begging for people to not convince me to ALSO have a DM/SD scrapper, because that would be kind of redundant, plus would make me not want to touch my tank.Originally Posted by BillZBubba
As we have determined DM/SD to be the end all be all on potential damage output, and as I my rebuild for my main villain is DM/WP, and as I already have a FM/SD brute, I have decided that SD/DM tank should be the way I go on that combo.
Matter of fact, it'll be SD/DM/Pyre Mastery. Should be a hoot and not completely painful to play like most tanks are for me.
Thanks for yet another push, scrappers! -
Quote:I thought maybe I should discuss survivability for a bit.Originally Posted by Maelwys_EU
Personally I'm still partial to maximum damage output and +Regen rather than scraping together a little mix of Defence or Damage resistance (which frankly /Regen doesn't need, and Katana/ even less so with Divine Avalanche to fall back on...) enough recharge for Perma-Dull-Pain is certainly nice to have though - about 55% Global Recharge with Hasten and Dull Pain properly slotted.
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I've killed all the AVs in the Preatorian arc with this build, and tanked several of them too...
I'm not saying that I agree with every decision in the build I posted (Val Blademaster's build, designed by Umbral). My own Katana/Regen is sitting at about 800% regeneration and has low recharge, for instance, and like you, I can do some impressive things with it. But for maximum survivability, defense and recharge seem to be key, and passive regeneration seems to be quite a ways down on the list. If I were redesigning my build today (I'm currently using an I12 build), I would design it more along the lines of Val Blademaster's build, because my interest is in maximum survivability.
To put some numbers on it, my survivability spreadsheet gives your build a score of 1459 and Val Blademaster's build a score of 2236. The score is in proportion in some way to the amount of incoming damage that you can survive indefinitely. More specifically, it's in proportion to the amount of incoming damage that would on average make your hit points do a random walk rather than steadily moving up or down. It does, however, ignore the possibility that such a random walk will take you below zero, and thus is only a moderately effective predictor of survivability. For instance, since Regen's health probably fluctuates the most wildly of all the secondaries, it is probably the most overweighted by my spreadsheet. All that said, I think it's reasonable for at least comparing two relatively similar builds, such as two Katana/Regens. That is, in fact, why I created it in the first place for the fine tuning of my builds.
Anyway, what I'm suggesting is that Val Blademaster's build will survive about 50% more incoming damage than yours. I agree that Katana/Regen doesn't NEED that much more survivability for 99% of the game. So most of the time, yes, you might well get more out of more damage output. And you might not like clicking your heals, so +regeneration may just make life easier. And so on.
So I'm definitely not saying that your build sucks or anything like that. I didn't dig deep, but it looks decent enough. I'm just trying to make sure that people don't read into this for maximum survivability, I should go with +regeneration instead of +defense. It's usually the other way around. -
Quote:To add to the confusion, I calculated 160 including the DoT assuming a 95% chance to hit.Originally Posted by Jeff_Vader
Sorry, forgot the 10% crit chance (stupid Jeff!!!
).
The actual DPS is 161, but that's not taking into account the DoT at the end of the AV combo. -
Quote:I can no longer open it either. I believe it's this one. EXCELLENT build if you can afford it.Originally Posted by Kanto2
I'm trying to open this build bu not having much luck, I'm not sure if it's the new forums or what. Any chance you could repost it?
Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build |
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Katana/Regen is my all-time favorite. Just be aware that Regen can be very clicky, so you'll be redrawing your weapon a lot. Getting good survivability out of it will require some focus and experience. Regen is school of hard knocks, so you may find yourself face planting more often than usual as you learn the proper timing for everything. I love it, but it isn't for everyone. Definitely worth trying out, though.
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Nothing new in the attack chains. They're just your standard well known extreme recharge DPS chains:
Dark Melee: Smite -> Midnight Grasp -> Smite -> Siphon Life
Katana: Golden Dragonfly -> Gambler's Cut -> Soaring Dragon -> Gambler's Cut
Dual Blades: Blinding Feint -> Ablating Strike -> Sweeping Strike -> Ablating Strike
Claws: Follow Up -> Focus -> Slash
Martial Arts: Storm Kick -> Crane Kick -> Storm Kick -> Crippling Axe Kick
Broad Sword: Head Splitter -> Hack -> Disembowel -> Hack
Crippling Axe Kick is better DPS than Dark Blast, though you could probably get better DPS out of Dark Blast slotted up since it could take a purple proc. However, you'd then introduce a gap into the chain and fall behind again.
The Martial Arts build has Hecatomb and Mako's Bite procs in Storm Kick, Mako's Bite and Explosive Strike procs in Crane Kick, and Mako's Bite and Trap of the Hunter procs in Crippling Axe Kick. It has +25% damage from set bonuses, +10.5% damage from Assault, and an average of +2.625% damage from the Gaussian proc in Tactics. While playable, it isn't a build I would play, as it sacrifices far too much on the altar of DPS.
For more details, let me just quote myself from another thread:
The builds are in this spreadsheet. You do NOT want to play these builds, though. They sacrifice too much for damage. They're soft-capped, but that's about it. No Aid Self and they'll last maybe two minutes in a fight before burning out their endurance. I was trying to get an idea what the top end numbers would look like and how the primaries compared, not trying to come up with playable builds. They're also all using the same build template for simplicity and a level playing field, which means that they're not individually optimized for each primary.