SlyGuyMcFly

SD gets some good mileage out of this one too.

Monsieur is quite correct.

Unless the NINJAS ARE ON FIRE!

A few of mine:


PainJunkie, SS/WP brute: The Determinator and Omnicidal Maniac
Suzie Uzi, Thugs/Traps MM: Slasher Smile, Ax Crazy and Corrupt Corporate Executive (she has her own record label, specializing in boy bands)
WitchHunt, DM/fire scrapper: Heel Face Turn and Redemption Earns Life with a healthy dash of The Atoner
Rajani of the Blades DB/SR scrapper: Powers via Possesion and Physical God
Space Ranger Lita arch/em blaster: Blue Skinned Space Babe and By the Book Cop
Alexia Invicta, shield/WM tank: Knight in Shining Armor and Ridiculously Human Robot

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Video Number Two

Mary Poppins. In this clip, the children have just complained that flipping for inf is a boring chore. Mary Poppins attempts to teach them otherwise, as well as instructs them on how flipping reduces prices.

Video

In ev'ry job that must be done
There is an element of fun
you find the fun and snap!
The job's a game

Nad ev'ry task you undertake
Becomes a piece of cake
A lark! Aspree!
It's very clear to see

That a...
Spoonful of flipping helps the prices go down
The prices go down-wown
The prices go down
Just a spoonful of flipping helps the prices go down
In a most delightful way

A flipper I-O-ing his nest
Has very little time to rest
While gathering his
Bids of twine and twig


Though quite intent in his pursuit
He has a merry tune to toot
He knows a song
Will move the job along

For a...
Spoonful of flipping helps the prices go down
The prices go down-wown
The prices go down
Just a spoonful of flipping helps the prices go down
In a most delightful way


The flipping bees that fetch the nectar
from the farmers to the comb
never tire of buzzing to and fro
because they take a little nip
from every niche that they sip
and hence (and hence)
they find (they find)
their task is not a grind.


Video Number Three


Beauty and the Beast. In this sequence, Gaston, global name @Gaston, is down in the dumps because he didn't get invited to closed beta. His Sidekick Lefou tries to cheer him up by reminding Gaston of his favourite activity, marketeering.

Video

Gosh it disturbs me to see you, @Gaston
Looking so down in the dumps
Ev'ry guy here'd love to be you, @Gaston
Even when taking your lumps
There's no man in town as admired as you
You're ev'ryone's favorite guy
Ev'ryone's awed and inspired by you
And it's not very hard to see why
No one's slick as @Gaston
No one's quick as @Gaston
No one's toons as incredibly rich as @Gaston's
For there's no man in town half as wealthy
Perfect, a pure Paragon!
You can ask any @Tom, @Dick or @Stanley
And they'll tell you whose team they prefer to be on


No one's been like @Gaston
A king pin like @Gaston

No one's got a swell niche in his screen like @Gaston

As a specimen, yes, I'm intimidating!

My what a guy, that @Gaston!
Give five "hurrahs!"
Give twelve "hip-hips!"

@Gaston is the best
And the rest is all drips

No one flips like @Gaston
Bids quite like @Gaston

In market PVP nobody owns like @Gaston!

For there's no one as wealthy and braw ny

As you see I've got billions to spare

Not a bit of him's SO'd or scrawny

That's right!
And ev'ry last inch of me's slotted in purples !

No one flips like @Gaston
Matches wits like @Gaston

In a flipping match nobody flips like @Gaston

I'm especially good at arbitrage!

Ten points for @Gaston!

When I was a lad I flipped four dozen slots
Ev'ry morning to help me get large
And now that I'm grown I flip five dozen slots
So my wallet's the size of a barge!

Oh, ahhh, wow!
My what a guy, that @Gaston!
No one flips like @Gaston
Makes those bids like @Gaston

Then goes tromping around owning mobs like @Gaston

I use purples in all of my enhancement slots!

My what a guy,
@Gaston!

OK, thanks for the advice. I'll see how miserly I can be while getting a passable amount of recharge.

I didn't know that. I would have thought it was harder than that, but my math background isn't so great. Thanks for the info, now I can get me some better numbers for my Arch/EM

Archetype A has X, Archetype A has X and Y. Thus, for AT A, X is more relevant than it is for B, because B, in addition to X has Y. Scrapper's have controls options and indeed consider them when comparing Primaries. However, the effectiveness of these controls are a secondary consideration because their entire secondary has a much greater effect on their survivabiliy.

Blasters don't have a secondary powerset dedicated for defense. Therefore, the only mitigation tools they have become much more important to them. It's not much mitigation, but it's the only mitigation Blasters get until Ancillaries. Barring killing mobs really, really fast, a Blaster has no other tools to mitigate damage. Thus, those tools, perhaps of doubtful effetiveness, are relevant to any discussion on the subject of Blaster survivability.


Just because it's a monumental task to apply numerically does not mean it should be discarded. And if it is in fact "relatively speaking a miniscule factor" give me a counter-argument to this:

No, really. Until you do it, you can't discount Blaster controls as irrelevant.



That is true. I was oversimplyfying the matter to raise a point. To do it right, you'd have to factor in ranges, recharges, % of the mezz, duration, and how you'd want to slot the power. Probably a few more things. I agree with you on that it's a monumental task that nobody is going to be crazy enough to do.

Yep! Happens for roughly once for every twenty times I attack.

On a more serious note, no I haven't.

I thought I'd like weather in CoH, but this post has made me think twice.

god yes.

True.

Not vast. Relevant. Yes, they are extremely hard to quantify, much like Defiance's damage buff. But they are relevant, as they are an important part to Blaster survivability.

Not unique, not unusually effective. True. They do have a relevant effect. If they didn't, a Sonic/EM would be just as survivable in solo play as a Fire/Fire. This is demostrably not the case.

And yes, I'm aware I've used the word relevant a lot in this post. That's because it's the only point I've tried to make thus far.

...


Relevant.

...

Relevantrelevantrelevantrelevantrelevantrelevantre levantrelevant.

...

I'll stop now.


On the actual subject of this thread, Scrapper vs. Blaster damage, comparing the respective toughness of the two ATs, my take on the matter is that it's a fairly simple issue. You want them on teams for (mainly) one thing: Damage. Or filling a farm, but I think they are perfectly balanced for that.

Blasters offer damage, damage and more damage. The down side is that they require some attention and loving care to deal this damage. A Blaster practicing facial agriculture can't do his or her or its job.

Scrappers offer less damage, particularly in the AoE department. On the other hand, they don't require any attention or care, except to tell them not to go aggro another spawn, or to wait for the rest of the team, or any other of those delightful behaviours Scrappers love indulging in and are so proud of.

So what you have is a tradeoff. Will the team be able to keep the Blaster alive? In that case you want a Blaster. The Scrapper's higher survivability is a moot point, because he won't be needing it. Might as well turn his toggles off/not click defensive powers and use the extra end to kick more ***. However, if the team doesn't have enough aggro management/debuffs/buffs/controls, then the Scrapper becomes a better option because the Blaster's better damage is irrelevant if he spends his time running away from angry mobs or tasting free samples of carpet.

In conclusion, I don't think Blasters need any particular buffing. They perform well at their intended role on teams and can solo at a very decent pace if they leverage what mitigation they have. Do scrappers solo better? Damn right they do. It's their speciality. It's what they do best. They pay for it by not having a specialised role in teams. They can tank, but not as well as Tankers. They do damage, but not as much as Blasters. They can control and buff/debuff, but everybody does that better than them.

TL;DR: Blasters are fine.

Not true. Most blasters have a fair amount of controls available to them, usually enough to negate a mayority of incoming damage in solo situations.

Let´s have a look at all the sets. I'll ignore the nukes because they don't come too often into solo play. I'm considering solo play over team situations because (in my experience, YMMV, warranty void in Oklahoma) teamed Blasters don't have to deal with more than one or two enemies per spawn. Less than solo encounters.

-Fire Blast: Not having mitigation is what it does. Gets extra damage in exchange.
-Ice Blast: Two holds, all attacks give slow and -rech.
-Elec Blast: One hold and an end drain of doubtful utility
-Archery: One stun and an AoE with chance for KB.
-Assault Rifle: One stun and two AoEs with chance for KB
-Energy Blast: All powers have a chance for KB/D
-Psychic Blast: One chance for sleep, one chance for KB, an AoE with KU and a stun. All powers without a mez effect do -rech.
-Sonic Attack: AoE Sleep that is perma before slotting, AoE KB and stun.

The secondaries:

-Devices: Immob with - rech, Caltrops, short range stun, minor -tohit in Smoke grenade, KB in the mines.
-Energy Manipulation: Meelee KB, two chance for meelee stuns and two meelee stuns. Plus Powerboost, that gives a very large boost to all mez effects the Blaster can throw out during 15 seconds.
Electric Manipulation: Immob, two meelee chances for sleep, one with chance for KD, AoE KB and chance for Stun, meelee KB with chance for stun and AoE KB, End drain power of doubtful utility, unless paired with Elec Blast.
-Fire Manipulation: As with the Blast set, fire exchanges the safety of mezzes for extra damage. It still gets a rather useless fear effect in Burn and a much more useful slow+fear in Hot Feet.
-Ice Manipulation: Immob, two AoE slows and -rech, location-based AoE KD, hold, AoE sleep that is perma without enhancements. All meelee attacks also deal -rech.
-Mental Manipulation: Immob with -rech, meelee KB, PBAoE with small chance for confusion, short duration ranged fear, PBAoE with chance for stun.

Barring extreme the rather extreme case of Fire/Fire most Blaster combinations in fact do offer substantial amounts of control. No, this is not as much as Dominators or Controllers get. It is, however an amount that damn well should be considered when considering Blaster survivability levels. Those controls are one of the main two ways Blasters have of significantly mitigating incoming damage.

By that argument Dominators are roughly as "defenseless" as Blasters, as they have comparable inherent defenses other than controls. Specifically, Dominators get less HP while having slightly higher numbers on Epic pool armours. And that's just silly.
Mind, I'm not saying that Blasters aren't squishy, I'm just raising the point that leaving out controls when considering Blaster squishyness is not going to be in any way accurate.


As for the OP, amongst the various problems with his/her "by the numbers" analysis that have already been pointed out, I can't help but notice that despite mentioning Defiance in the post, no mention of it's actual effects on Blaster damage is made. I know that it's very difficult to estimate it's overall impact on damage, but it still has to be considered.

It is my deepest hope that Dual Pistols will offer this

Ditto. Bad, but more funny than annoying. I guess me sense of humour is just that messed up