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Quote:The Door Sitter/Leech falls in the category of anti-team player, I'd say, rather than anti-team character. To be an anti-team character, IMHO, it needs to be a powerset that is hard to mesh with team operations even with a good player.Originally Posted by Stone Daemon
Isn't it curious that whenever one of these threads pop up, it always comes down to knockback? Oh, and phasing enemy powers take the runner up prize.
My vote is for the Door Sitter/Leech and Auto Fire/Perma Follow powersets.
One time when running paper missions, so pretty straightforward stuff, I had a humanform Peacebringer join the team who used a lot of knockback powers. No other changes in team or missions were made, it was a large team, and just adding his character slowed down getting through spawns and missions significantly, at least 20%. He was a nice enough player, and nobody on the team was all that focused on XP speed, so it wasn't a big issue but I did find the contrast rather noticable.
Thats not so much a reflection of the evilness of knockback as it is the almost abusive efficiency of AoE damage, debuffs, etc. in the game. Anything that reduces AoE efficiency reduces kill speed, and with PbAoE radial knockback like the Peacebringer had its pretty hard to knock things into a corner to increase team efficiency, no matter how good the player. Playing my grav controller I've struggled with that issue with Wormhole as well, its relatively rare that I can find geometry that lets me use it without messing up the tanks taunt aura, the blaster running in for Fire Sword Circle or a nuke, etc. -
I wouldn't suggest deleting the character until you have experimented with some build and playstyle combinations, maybe with ideas from the Kheld forum. It is much easier to come up with an unplayable build with a Kheld then with a VEAT, and much easier to come up with a build that doesn't match your style, so some trial and error may be needed.
And even if you can't find something that works, I still recommend against deleting a level 50, because there have been numerous times in the past when devs changed either an AT, a power, or a system in such a way that made a character fun or playable again. I don't know how many people deleted their Fire tanks because Burn was nerfed to make mobs run out of it and are now regretting it since it no longer does that, but I'm sure there are some. -
Neither of these are cases where I was playing the Kheld, just on a team with one.
In a sharply angled passageway trying to ghost through the KTF mission where you just have to rescue somebody. Died twice to that one, once coming and once going from the dead end passage it turned out to be on, not so much because of the cyst, as because of the spawn of Red Caps that started shooting at me as soon as the cyst aggroed. They hit hard.
In another mission in Croatoa, something with half a dozen waves of ambushes we had to fight. As we were doing that, a friend logged on and asked for an invite. We invited him, and NEXT AMBUSH had a Cyst right on top of us, team wipe. We hadn't even realized he was on a Kheld, let alone have him enter the mission. . . -
Quote:I'd actually consider Taunt, in particular, to be a hard control, and one of the few that work on AVs. If you can FORCE a foe or group of foes to attack only a teammate who can survive it, its just as effective as using a Hold or Stun. In many cases more effective, since tanks tend to cause foes to clump up where they are more subject to AoE damage, debuffs, etc. Admittedly, its a problem if in fact the Taunter can't survive the aggro, but there are situations where any other hard control fails as well.Originally Posted by Vanden
Show signs? Having enemies attack the tank is the best soft control there is.
To the OP, if you are considering an Emp, an Emp/Sonic is not a bad choice. Relatively little AoE, so you aren't constantly getting aggro, and a substantial help in situations where Emps are often weakest, helping an already sturdy team more quickly take down hard targets like AVs. And if you want to solo, /Sonic has a nice AoE sleep which lets you safely take spawns down one at a time and deal with ambushes, the bane of soloing squishies. -
Quote:As you can see with MM pets and trick or treating and similar situations, critters (including our pets) can often target things before we can, and often even fire at them.Originally Posted by Rangle M. Down
Is it possible that the critters can target us before we rez completely? Considering that we can't "target" them before they've done so, would that be considered WAI or a bug?
To the OP, as mentioned, the purple patch means you have only a 39% chance to hit the foes with the knockback and stun. It might be worth trying slotting some Accurate Healing sets into Rise to get some accuracy in, assuming it doesn't take normal Accuracy SOs or IOs. You could try it on Test if you don't want to commit to a respec build on Live.
And I would guess the Devs made the self rezzes on the melee folks have a better untouchable period because its typically part of their AT power set, rather than a power pool, even an epic one. They generally try to make sure pool powers don't overshadow similar AT ones. -
Although I don't have an Ill character at all, I have to agree that it has a high level of versatility. I've several times been on TFs where a tank left/DCed/whatever, and an Ill controller had to handle tanking tougher spawns and eventually the AV with Phantom Army. Relatively few other "support" characters can keep a random team alive fighting the tougher AVs.
I do have lvl 50 rad/rad and cold/sonic defenders, both pretty much maxed out, and I'm still on the fence which is more versatile. There are times on the cold/sonic when I whiff on debuffs, or the AV runs around out of them, or I get mezzed or killed that I wish for the "fire and forget" nature of the rad debuffs and the high levels of self protection with Rad Infection. I could also take the Psi epic pool on the rad/rad, since I didn't need to build for soft cap defense, which gives versatility with Mass Hypnosis, great at shutting down ambushes or nosy nearby spawns. I don't consider the Mace PPP pool to be as versatile, but I wanted Scorpion Shield.
There are times on the rad/rad when the healing Nictus on an ITF or Ghost Widows heals are slowing or stalling a team that I wish for Benumb, or I'm mezzed or not in the area or not alive, or I'm trying to help on a Masters run that I think how handy the Cold shields are.
Overall, I'd say radiation is better before heavy IO investment (heck, its darned good with SOs, which I think is one reason its very popular on PUGs), but cold edges it out slightly with a high recharge, high defense, IO build. They are close enough in versatility, though, and different enough in playstyle that I like going back and forth between them.
I also have a purpled out Warshade, which has a lot of versatility, but IMHO its not as useful versatility to the team as what support characters can bring. Its great versatility for me as a player, lots of options (when I die, I can just about always think of something I could have done if I'd thought fast enough to avoid it. . .) It has ability to pinch-hit tank, like an Ill's PA, and do dps, but I've been on more than one TF with her that stalled on final AVs because we didn't have any competent buffer/debuffers, so I really like a character that can provide that.
And I think a WS brings more versatility then a PB, if for no other reason then the ability to stealth/recall in the many missions where thats handy. A PB can't take Recall Friend, which is a significant strike against it in my book. Assemble the Team works for some situations, but not so well for things like grabbing the teammate returning from the hospital in a long map for example, or getting that errant blaster corpse back for Vengeance. I think people underestimate what moving a team around can do to increase speed in some scenarios, compared to 10% more damage, say. -
Quote:I was going to mention this, I'll just add this concept applies to more then that one TF. A lot of content people run very frequently involves ambushes coming in, often from predictable directions. Think the post-Cyst ambushes in the ITF, the Dwarf/Nova ambush when taking the Seer to the alter in the same TF, ambushes in a couple of missions in the STF, ambushes in the Apex TF, and so on. In some cases, the team may even have to wait around for the ambushes anyway (the heroside respec in the reactor is particularly bad that way). The ability to store up damage and "control" (i.e. caltrops) for when the foes appear can be very handy in those cases.Originally Posted by Katten
That is one thing /devices does better than anyone else, the enemies spawn in huge groups at regular intervals in the same place during the kill mary macomber mission. Just enough time to get somewhere near 8 trip mines down. It WILL kill everything, every time, the instant they spawn leaving your team to just kill the AV.
With predictable missions, I would even argue it stacks up fairly well against boost powers like Buildup, and may provide a capability the team otherwise lacks, access point control. -
Quote:That may have been before the devs changed Council (and I think a couple of other groups) from "all tech" to "50:50 tech/arcane" salvage. Before that, you couldn't give rare tech salvage away, after that the tech and arcane rare salvage markets got much closer.Originally Posted by Lohenien
So some tech stuff was even cheaper than I remembered - it WAS 4 years ago....
I suspect there are 2 reasons rare salvage overall is up since a year or so ago, one is the ability of AMs to generate specific recipes people want, which they then go to the market to buy salvage for. Thus a higher ratio of recipes to salvage then before.
The second is with fewer recipe niches in the market to flip, again thanks to AMs which dropped prices on some recipes that previously were expensive because of extremely short supply, some market flippers moved to flipping salvage. While I agree with the market folks who say flipping can't drive prices up past the top of an equilibrium range, 4M may not be past the top of that equilibrium, and I could also see that range slowly shifting as people have more Inf to spend on salvage (AMs to save on pricy recipes, not spending 200M on a LotG buys a lot of salvage) and expectations of "reasonable" rare salvage prices creep up. -
As promised above, I'm posting the build of a kin/rad defender friend of mine. 46/38/30/24% Smash-Lethal/AoE/Melee/Ranged, which is not bad considering he couldn't fit Leadership for Maneuvers.
Its lighter on recharge and heavier on defense then I'd do, but he is a very aggressive player [his motto is "I can be SURE to get a good Fulcrum Shift if I beat the tank in! ] A couple of attacks are just slotted with defense debuff for the set bonuses, no damage, but a kin can get away with that more easily since they are often damage capped. Think of it as one extreme for whats possible on a defensive kin build, and see what you are comfortable with.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.91
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Ovrclk: Level 50 Magic Defender
Primary Power Set: Kinetics
Secondary Power Set: Radiation Blast
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Teleportation
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Transfusion -- Nictus-Heal(A), Nictus-Acc/Heal(3), Nictus-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(3), Nictus-Heal/HP/Regen/Rchg(5), Theft-Acc/EndRdx/Heal(5), Theft-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(7)
Level 1: Neutrino Bolt -- ShldBrk-DefDeb(A), ShldBrk-Acc/DefDeb(7), ShldBrk-Acc/Rchg(9), ShldBrk-DefDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(9), ShldBrk-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(11), ShldBrk-%Dam(11)
Level 2: Siphon Power -- Acc-I(A), RechRdx-I(21)
Level 4: Irradiate -- Oblit-Dmg(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(13), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(13), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(15), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(15), Oblit-%Dam(17)
Level 6: Super Speed -- Zephyr-ResKB(A), Zephyr-Travel(19), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(19)
Level 8: Recall Friend -- Zephyr-Travel(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(21), Zephyr-ResKB(23)
Level 10: Siphon Speed -- Acc-I(A), RechRdx-I(17)
Level 12: Speed Boost -- Winter-ResSlow(A)
Level 14: Electron Haze -- Det'tn-Acc/Dmg(A), Det'tn-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(23), Det'tn-Dmg/Rchg(25), Det'tn-Dmg/EndRdx/Rng(25), Det'tn-Dmg/Rng(27), Achilles-ResDeb%(27)
Level 16: Increase Density -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A)
Level 18: Kick -- T'Death-Acc/Dmg(A)
Level 20: Tough -- Aegis-Psi/Status(A), Aegis-ResDam(29), Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx(29), Aegis-ResDam/Rchg(46), Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 22: Weave -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), HO:Enzym(31), LkGmblr-Def(31)
Level 24: Combat Jumping -- Zephyr-Travel(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(42), Zephyr-ResKB(42), LkGmblr-Rchg+(43)
Level 26: Transference -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(31), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc/Rchg(33), P'Shift-Acc/Rchg(33), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(33), P'Shift-End%(34)
Level 28: Cosmic Burst -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(34), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(34), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(36), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(36)
Level 30: Proton Volley -- ShldBrk-DefDeb(A), ShldBrk-Acc/DefDeb(37), ShldBrk-Acc/Rchg(37), ShldBrk-DefDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(37), ShldBrk-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(39), ShldBrk-%Dam(39)
Level 32: Fulcrum Shift -- Acc-I(A), RechRdx-I(48)
Level 35: Neutron Bomb -- Det'tn-Acc/Dmg(A), Det'tn-Dmg/EndRdx(39), Det'tn-Dmg/Rchg(40), Det'tn-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(40), Det'tn-Dmg/EndRdx/Rng(40)
Level 38: Atomic Blast -- Oblit-Dmg(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(42), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(48), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(50), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(50), Oblit-%Dam(50)
Level 41: Scorpion Shield -- HO:Enzym(A), LkGmblr-Def(43), LkGmblr-Rchg+(43)
Level 44: Focused Accuracy -- GSFC-ToHit(A), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg(45), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx(45), GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx(45), GSFC-ToHit/EndRdx(46), GSFC-Build%(48)
Level 47: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 49: Inertial Reduction -- RechRdx-I(A)
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Level 1: Brawl -- Acc-I(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Clrty-Stlth(A)
Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Vigilance
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Heal-I(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A)
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Quote:Lets look at -resist debuffing, arguably the most important debuff for "hard" targets like AVs, since they resist other debuffs such as slow, -tohit and -regen to the tune of 87% at level 50.Originally Posted by Erin Go Braugh
I think that's why I enjoy playing the SoA. The only role is doesn't do exceptionally well is debuff. Exceptionally well, folks. I know it debuffs.
A rad defender, which is generally considered the "goto" choice for debuffing, debuffs resistance by 30% with Enervating Field. Ditto Dark defender with Tar Patch.
A Crab who takes Mako for a patron gets -20% resist debuff from Venom Grenade plus -15% from Arctic Breath. It takes some good recharge to make Arctic Breath perma, since its only a 10s duration, but a Crab tends to build for recharge anyway. Total -35% resist debuff, better then the defender. A Crab can also slot an Achilles proc in their fast recharge, Tier 1 attack, and average another 10% or so, which only the rad secondary can do on a defender.
So unless the defender takes Sonic as a secondary, the Crab can out debuff a rad defender for the main debuff needed for AVs, which is quite respectable performance-wise. The Crab is also inflicting damage during this, no animation time used to cast it.
I actually looked at the numbers to compare my Crab AoE attack chain to a Fire blaster's primary, since Fire is considered top tier. A Crab takes about twice as long, ~11 seconds, to do the same damage a Fire blaster does in about 6 sec, assuming Fire Breath + Fireball + Rain of Fire. The compensation is from about 5 seconds in, all the rest of the team damage starts going up from -resist debuffing from the Crab, so the total damage from a team may well be higher over a fight that takes 10+ seconds then from a Fire Blaster + team. I ignored Defiance for the blaster and Assault + pets from the Crab, since I was looking for an order of magnitude type comparison. -
Quote:I suspect they are mostly on Virtue and Freedom, where you can be more choosy about what ATs you pick and still fill a TF team quickly. One advantage on the smaller servers, I think, is that people will take who they can get, learn that the players are good, and seek them out next time.Originally Posted by Steel_Shaman
So where are all these teams that pick and choose specific AT's? They don't appear to be on Liberty.
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Quote:I wasn't saying that taking personal attacks makes a superior MM, just that it can speed things up a bit at low levels, since bots don't have a huge damage output at those levels compared to some other pets. I wouldn't recommend it unless you plan to respec anyway, or if you are mostly going to team.Originally Posted by kalashnikow
compared to what you can achieve with secondary skills personal attacks are waste of slots and respecs. i haven't seen a single mm that didn't won a mission because of the lacking of personal attacks. BUT i've seen a lot mms dead because they drew agro by personal attacks and were killed with one-two shots.
[snip]
i've killed bunch of AV and even tanked 3 super robots on first mission of apex tf. without provoke. is it surprising you?
[snip]
to state it clearly, if the bots die than that should be only because caltrops, poison gas trap and seeker drones are still on cooldown from previous fight.
I've also killed a number of AVs without Provoke, a good bots/traps can do it on SOs, so I"m not at all surprised, its arguably the best combo in the game for that (though a very good case can be made for Ill/Rad controllers). There were definitely cases where it would have been easier with Provoke, as I couldn't keep the AVs from launching ranged or AoE attacks at the bots once in awhile. I've never taken it, since as you say against normal spawns the rest of the traps toolkit pretty much keeps either you or your bots from getting scratched. -
Quote:Just as a note, personal attacks can be a significant fraction of your damage until the Tier 3 bot comes along, so its not a terrible idea to take one (assuming you don't have vet attacks) and respec out of it later when you have the slots to slot up Triage properly. The idea behind Provoke is to focus damage from EBs and especially AVs on you, since you can be well shielded, thus keeping your pets alive. Its more something to take for soloing AVs or GMs, which is interesting as a build test but not terribly worthwhile XP-wise.Originally Posted by kalashnikow
personal attacks, provoke and so on. worthless.
P.S. your drones will die anyway, regardless of what you do. stupid AI cause them to run in to melee range, so get used to it. at least they die less then arsonist from thugs or medic from mercs.
If you spam "Stay" it can help keep the pets from running in, or at least they don't run in very far before you halt them. If they are still in stay/defensive, they still provide Bodyguard mode. -
Nice analysis; as I'm soon going to be starting getting Alpha slot stuff together on my Crab, I've been wrestling with the same question. Unlike with a couple of other of my characters, theres not such an easy answer (darned VEAT versatility!
I need to fight the build against some AVs to see if I need the End Reduction, part of what I figure my Crab contributes beyond what a blaster would do is -resist debuffing. With Venom Grenade plus Frost Breath, thats -35%, as good as a rad defender can produce, but also requires firing two AoEs off pretty frequently, which could be rough in an AV fight. While one could argue fighting AVs is a small part of the game, its also the part where teams are most likely to stall in end game (think LRSF, STF, Reischman, etc.), so IMHO thats where it actually starts getting important what your build is. Frankly, if all you were running was paper missions, you'd never need to move beyond SOs. So Cardiac may be the way to go.
On the other hand, since I see the main role of a Crab on a team to be supplying damage, ideally AoE damage, that makes an argument for Musculature. As you showed in your numbers, its roughly 10% extra damage, and if you have purples slotted you can even put the proc IO in instead of the Damage IO, still have beyond ED damage and the procs on top of it.
Spiritual is nice on the long recharge powers, and bumps survivability. If you look at the extra 56 hit points you list for Serum, and assume its roughly perma (which it should be with a good IO build plus Spiritual), 56 out of the ~1480 hit points total you have with it running is about 4%, so its about the same as the extra resist numbers you cite from the Cardiac IO except that its "resist all", so covers toxic, psi, etc. I also actually do like the Stun that comes with it, I have the purple Stun set in Omega (plus a damage in the 6th slot) because a Crab doesn't have a lot of other crowd control options, and its handy for if the tank is getting overwhelmed, you want to stall an ambush, etc. While the baddies are wandering around, I can generally AoE them to death with my regular chain. Ironically, as you noted, a Crab is one of the few ATs that has a full AoE attack chain (and then some) so doesn't get to do significantly more damage with more recharge, other than maybe a bit more from Omega and faster pet recharge.
Finally, one other note on the Nerve Radial Paragon, Omega does actually take Taunt, so there might be some benefit from taking the Radial rather than Core if you don't need the 45% Acc vs the 33%, as I suspect is the case for most mature level 50 builds. -
Quote:I noticed a lot of difference in survivability on my Cold/Sonic defender after getting S/L defense to the soft cap, even in things with a wide variety of damage coming in like the LRSF AV fight, which I ran while over redside for Mace Mastery.Originally Posted by TensileSky
You're giving up some S/L/Psy Res, 21% Recharge, Dominate and Mass Hypnosis for significantly higher Defence values and some Toxic Res. I guess it comes down to how much value we can put on Defence going forward, and how much use she's likely to get out of Mass Hypnosis and Dominate. |
But part of it depends on what your girlfriend's playstyle is like. Some people would rather turn on some shields and just play their character and not have to worry too much, and since Kin is pretty busy anyway, thats not a bad call. Some people would rather have a wider variety of tactical choices and choose exactly the right tool for the situation, and rely on things like insps, timing attacks, etc. if its getting sticky. So I think either of the above options is a pretty decent one, and make the final call based on what she likes. -
Interesting; I don't think I've ever seen such an extensive guide written by someone who didn't like the powersets they were writing about. It sounds like what you were really wanting to play was a blaster, or possibly a scrapper, rather than a support character.
For another viewpoint, I'd like to mention that if you DO want to play a support character, a kin/rad is a very decent choice. Its among the best choices for an offensive force multiplier, and as a team leader if I'm looking for that kind of support I'd tend to pick a kin defender over a fire/kin controller, because a kin defender is more likely to know how to support something other than their fire imps.
Advantages of rad secondary;
Fast animation - especially Neutrino, which is good for kin which needs to be very reactive so you need to avoid long animations. If you don't want a quick, reactive set, don't play kin. Neutrino, slotted with the Achilles proc, can with constant spamming average something like a -10% resist debuff on an AV, which incidently does not scale down for the purple patch, so it still works on the STF for example. You are not doing this mainly for the damage, you are doing this to multiply other peoples damage, i.e. providing support.
AoEs - Best available to a defender, the only set with 3 AoEs (not including the nuke), unless DP has that, I don't know that set as well. More AoEs = almost always better on a team.
Cosmic Burst - as mentioned in the guide, great attack, none of the other defender blast sets get this kind of damage WITH a mezz stackable to shut down a boss.
Defense debuff - As mentioned, this is not often needed for well slotted characters, but for things like Paragon Protectors which go into MOG, Rikti Drones, etc. its pretty handy given the need for Kin to hit things for so many powers. Its other main use is to allow that Achilles proc to go in.
Really, the only defender secondary I'd consider for effectiveness over Rad is Sonic, because its a great AV debuffer. Its very single target oriented, though, which makes the rest of the game slower. One could make an argument for Dark, for the -tohit debuffing and ability to pin foes with the Tentacles Immob, but since both AoEs are cones it means a lot of zooming in and out of combat.
Finally, I do suggest that anyone playing a support character, especially a kin who can die without the ability to fire off powers, pick up a -knockback IO. At worst, even if you hate the market, do some tip missions on the way up and buy one with 2 alignment merits, making sure to get the lowest level one you can. -
A friend of mine is currently working on a high end Kin build, and I'll be doing one for one of my chars sometime soon, so we've thought about it a bit.
While your point about relying on soft capped defenses in Incarnate content is probably right, having high defense is still better then not having it for a squishy. As a kin, you don't have mezz protection, and deflecting half the shots is still much better then none because most of your defense is being able to move (consider Combat Jumping to avoid Immobs) and heal off a foe. Scorpion Shield is unfortunately the only way to make a decent start on that for most defender powersets. On the bright side, a reasonably careful defender isn't taking the number of shots a blaster or tank are, so cascade defense failure isn't as frequent, you are mostly worried about stray shots. Just exercise some care with Fulcrum Shift.
Another possibility is the Psi defender pool, Mass Hypnosis is great to shut down ambushes, an increasingly prominent feature of high level content. Slept mobs are not woken by Fulcrum Shift, by the way, providing a safer opener. Dominate is decent damage and can stack to shut down a boss. The controller Psychic pool gives the status protection power, unfortunately not available to defenders.
If I have a chance I'll post a Mids build chunk for what my friend and I had worked out, though its still a work in progress. -
Are there two villian alignment switch missions now too? I seem to have a choice of two, one had a title something like "Every Day Hero" and I don't recall the other. I am wondering which one would be faster, as I usually have to do these in about 15 minutes before work in the morning.
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JoeKent, I was considering working on the Incarnate slot on my bots/traps but was unsure whether Recharge would be better, for more trappy goodness but which does nothing for the pets, or Damage, which would pretty much just affect the pets, since I have no personal attacks (other than vet ones, which are plenty).
Did you really see a lot of difference from the Musculature? -
Quote:Also glad to see this, I was on a team where the leader was very demanding about shots every 30 sec, working down the team list as folks ran out. Since we were an HOUR defeating Reichsman on that particular run (only debuffer was a kin, who was either distracted or lazy), we almost ran out.Originally Posted by DSorrow
Never knew this, then again, I've never ever been on a team where Reichs wasn't shot with the ray gun at least once every 15 seconds. I just assumed they gave everyone the gun with multiple charges because those were needed. Learn something new every day, it seems
I thought I remembered a dev saying that only one shot was needed when questions had come up, back around when Khan was first out, but I can't swear to it. -
Quote:Another way to retain the OPs intent is, suppose you are setting up one of these TFs and you've advertised it on your server global channel and someone sends back a message "I'd like to join, I can log over and bring either a stalker or a scrapper, same powersets, and I'd be happy to play either, which would you like?"Originally Posted by Constant_Motion
I'd take the first one available, wouldn't much matter either way to me.
That takes "whichever player is more skilled" and "whoever asks first" out of the question.
I'd actually lean towards the stalker in this, if I have decent AoEs on the team already. Hard targets like EBs and some bosses can slow teams down, and I have a higher likelihood that a stalker can help take out hard targets quickly as they virtually all have good ST damage. A player who is thoughtful enough to offer a choice of ATs also stands a chance of being a thoughtful enough player to choose targets intelligently, though obviously this is unique to the response I invented above. -
Quote:That is two separate questions, so I will answer them separately.Originally Posted by Infinite Distortion
tl;dr, are empathy defenders really the best healers? If not, then what AT or powerset is better for the kind of group support I'm looking for?
An Emp defender is the best healer in the game. At low levels, say sub 20, heals are pretty helpful. Those levels go by fairly quickly though, and at higher levels an Emp is brought mainly for their buffs, and not usually considered critical to have on a team.
The best support in the game depends significantly on what level you are, what you are fighting, and what the rest of the team consists of. Rad and Dark debuffs combined with their other powers are generally better defensive support for a group then heals at all levels, and both would usually be more desirable for high end/hard target (AVs, GMs) content then an Emp. I've seen too many teams that wouldn't start without a Rad, specifically, though I think thats overrated, and thats from someone whose main is a Rad defender. For offensive support, its hard to beat a Kin defender or Kin controller.
If you are willing to invest in an IO build for high recharge, and want more challenging play for a support character, consider a cold/sonic defender. Great debuffing for hard targets, significant buffing with the shields, knowledgeable team leaders will beg to have you along.
I suggest having a couple of different support characters on your favorite server, if thats a playstyle you enjoy, as I do. The different support characters play so differently, between a healer, a toggle debuffer, a kin, etc. that its plenty of variety if you get tired of one and want to switch to another, or something else best fits a teams needs. -
Quote:Just as a note, here, I don't think its possible any more to lock GW down with Immobs. I've seen them stacked 5x to 10x on her and it only stops her when the purple triangles are down. You can kite her some, if you clear at least one side of the map, and between that and her stopping to fire at you and times when the triangles are down and making sure if she does get near enough to you to fire the heal off the rest of the team is away at that point, she doesn't get many good heals off.Originally Posted by GATE-keeper
Either we don't have enough Immob to lock GW down - which leads to me munching purples while taunting in front of her and telling everyone else to hit her from behind. Or not enough dps to take her down quickly. Or the blaster's "single pull" causes a few of GW's friends to decide to join the fun.).
Also, the pulling is highly unpredictable. I often use the snipe on my rad defender, which is low damage and even has a bit of range boost in it so I can stand extra far away, but even when I've never come in sight of GW and I'm firing from full inviso I've seen it bring Mako (my target), Black Scorpion and GW. I believe it depends somewhat on their facing, as well as possibly where the flier is, as it may boost their Perc. -
Quote:My first Khan failed, leader wasn't interested in debuffs, just dps, so I think we had an Emp and a Kin for support along with my Kheld in place of the rad/rad defender I offered. The kin didn't do much, and gave up and quit 5 minutes into the final Reischman fight, followed by the rest of the team who quickly decided (wrongly, IMHO) that it was impossible. . .Originally Posted by Kotchie
I do not expect any real bad stories will come of this weeks target, Kahn. As most of the runs I have done, are completed in less than 40 minutes, and I have never been on a failing team yet. But with as many times as I plan on running it, I am sure to get on some "interesting" teams, and am bound to fail once or twice. Stay tuned
No STF failures this week, but the time a couple of years ago a friend and I tried to do it on our Warshade/Peacebringer twins, we found out the Stone tank who had joined us was an AE baby, and totally incapable of (1) standing up to LR, or (2) following instructions to take insps BEFORE running in and faceplanting. He apologized, and said he'd fix his build, but that didn't help us much right then. The team was light enough on debuffs/damage multiplication that we couldn't take towers down in the time he could survive, and ended up giving up, elapsed time ~4.5 hours. Both times I've been on a STF that failed because of lack of tanking survivability, interestingly, it was with a Stone tank. . .
I did have another one where the tank, who also formed the team, DCed during the LR fight, AFTER all the towers were down. We tried a variety of things to survive fighting him, since all the rest of the team were squishes, but couldn't manage to drop him without losing critical dps due to deaths. Shivans helped, but when he would have his final bane bloom, they would start fighting the banes and he'd go back to killing us. After giving up, I was at the markets when the tank logged back on and expressed surprise that he was still on the TF, apparently when he DCed he decided to go out to get dinner. THATS what got me annoyed.
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As Arcanaville said, I've also been happy at how well some PUG STFs have gone. The most recent one was early Sunday morning (7 AM) on Triumph, and we had 3 tanks and 2 scrappers along with my rad/rad and two /kin controllers. I was actually a bit worried about fighting GW, as obviously this team wasn't going to take her down with ranged damage and I couldn't count on all 5 melees being able to stay defense capped long enough to drop her given her heal, but the kin +damage was enough to overcome her regen and heal, with a bit of kiting her around. We were ultimately victorious, total run 1 hour 14 minutes.
More broadly, I'm also happy the devs have put some lower level TFs into the Weekly mix. Not only does it make it easier for the characters I'm leveling to get XPs and Task Force Commander, but it also gives more variety in content that I'll be playing and makes me think more carefully about exemping with my builds. And I say this as someone who has relatively little play time each week, so its taking me awhile to get shards.