Master_Templar
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Posts
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Joined
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No Explosive Strike proc on big bot?
-MT -
BAWNG,
Good stuff here. I haven't actually tried soloing any of the big stuff yet myself (not quite 50 yet, about one bub from 48), but I think I could handle it. Curious what build you were using before and after LR since you said you respec'd and it sounds like now you're seeing better results. I know Dechs uses Ice for Hoarfrost and lots of HP bonuses to get the most out of the BG mode. I opt for Mu pool with RES instead (and softcapped DEF of course). Plus the AoE immob keeps big bot from knocking things around. It seems you go pure DEF so I'm wondering how you set your build up.
Also, any particular advice for our OP?
Best,
MT -
Quote:Why not both? I'm sotcapped to S/L & positionals (M/AoE/R) and pretty close on Energy/Fire/Cold/Negative (1-2% away from the cap), and I run the RES shield out of Mu APP for 40% resist to S/L/E. You make it sound like people say that BG mode/Taunt is necessary for the PLAYER to not die. In fact, it is counterintuitive..if I'm taunting I'm taking more damage/aggro than I normally would...what's stopping me from just sending my pets to their doom on every spawn? This poses pretty much zero risk to me.Originally Posted by BAWNG
It can help for sure, but I wanted to point out that MM's do not need to be bodygaurd dependent to be effective.
Over the course of many respecs and different builds tried, I found I enjoyed a defense build the best. I've used the taunt/resistance BG dependent build before. It's a great tough build, for sure. I found however, that building for defense is certainly no less survivable and for me personally, was more fun to play because I can set tripmines in the middle of an angry group and tell all my bots to focus on one enemy.
IMO, the point of BG/taunt is to take attention away from the pets since you are more survivable than they are, and they are the ones doing most of the attacking. When baby bot does his AoE cone (this generates aggro of course), you don't want 6-8 (or whatever) angry mobs shooting back in his face. He's gonna get a load of spike damage that might knock him down to 33% health, or perhaps lower. And if he keeps the aggro and isn't healed soon, he could die. (NO DISASSEMBLE!!) Why not channel it through you (BG/taunt), through your DEFs and RES, and then SHARE the damage among yourself and your bots? Otherwise baby bot gets smacked around needlessly. If you're doing it right, you should see all bots health drop together (albeit very slowly)..this is where Triage comes in, aid other, repair, protector bot heal, etc. Of course someone is gonna go wander off and smack a boss with brawl..but that's where your Provoke and aggro generation comes in
Also, if you are not in BG mode, and you get hit hard, you take the full amount of the damage..and if you're dead and your bots have full health, your bots now have no health.
As always, YMMV
Best,
MT -
I paid about $850 at least 2 years ago for an off the shelf ASUS from Best Buy and couldn't be happier with the graphics performance. I mean, it can't run the HIGHEST settings but I play with zero choppiness. I can post exact specs if you want, but seriously, check out the ASUS lines and do your homework. I can post links to where I feel you should look for GFX performance and overall notebook performance, but PM for that.. probably cannot post that in this thread.
I've also built my own computer in the past so while my "techie" skills definitely aren't #1 in this forum, I can still hold my own. I just run a laptop now for portability since ones with good graphics have finally become affordable (under 1k).
Spending $500 (or any amount) on integrated graphics in this day and age is just a waste of money, IMO.
Best,
MT -
Quote:I wouldn't bother with end redux personally; it isn't an attack power in a traditional sense, it's more fire and forget..so what if it takes a bit more end to use.Originally Posted by Psylenz
End game or not, it's the AV killer - lots of -regen. Toss some end reduction in it with heavy recharge and hold enhancement.
Thanks a lot for this..we were discussing whether or not the multi-attribute IOs affected the ACC of the initial hold in another thread.Quote:Originally Posted by Muon_Neutrino
It's not autohit - or, rather, the part that offers the initial mitigation isn't.
Poison trap has two effects when it's set off. The first is the pulsing -regen -recharge chance to vomit, which is autohit and lasts for 30s. The second is the initial hold, which goes off once, lasts 6s by default, and is *not* autohit. It's this non-autohit component which provides most of the power's mitigation (generally you plant it in the middle of the spawn at the start of a fight), giving you time to toss a couple more traps - if it hits and lasts long enough.
Poison trap doesn't take accuracy enhancements, however accuracy from hold set IOs *does* improve the initial hold's chance to hit. Nowadays the power isn't a damage proc monster like it was before they fixed it, so I like to slot it for acc, hold, and recharge along with the lockdown proc. A 4 pack of basilisk's gets you some decent numbers to start, and you can fill it out with the lockdown proc and something else to round off the enhancement numbers.
As for the comment about it not being a dmg proc monster...it can still accept 5 damage procs though? (6th slot for lockdown)
-MT -
Quote:The two toons are Industrial Ascent and Industrial Architect; one is Bots/Dark the other is Bots/Traps..not sure which I will be sending to the SG yet though.Originally Posted by Hillmm09
Just so I know when you send me a tell, what's your toon's name?
-MT -
Quote:Good catch. It confused me a bit personally since it does not accept ACC IOs, so I figured that part of the enhancement was simply "dead". So I guess it is more of a question of whether or not a set IO can enhance the ACC of the initial hold or not.. that, I am not sure of.Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
This is slightly wrong. The pulsing hold is auto-hit but the initial hold is not (I'm not certain if it actually benefits from ACC or not).
-MT -
Stuff I would do:
Web Grenade:
Switch out another power for Electrifying Fences and throw in (at least in the default slot) the Gravitation Anchor: Chance for Hold. So this power now does
-AoE immobilize (that the big bot will NOT KB them from)
-generate aggro for you (which is good)
-Chance for 25% hold on each target
Acid Mortar:
-Get a 6th slot in there and get the Achilles' Heel proc
Poison Trap:
...I cried at the zero love that this got. This power is so very, very good.
-6 slot it!
-Procs to add:
1. Lockdown: Chance for +2 Mag Hold (if you do anything with this power, do this)
2. Neuronic Shutdown: Chance for Psi DMG
3. Ghost Widow's Embrace: Chance for Psi DMG
4. Gladiator's Net: Chance for Lethal DMG
5. Unbreakable Constraint: Chance for Smashing DMG
-Last slot = recharge IO
-It is now a passive pulsing hold + damage machine. Welcome to the terrordome.
People generally slot this with hold sets..if a set IO is giving me ACC/END/Range, to me, it is a waste (remember, it is auto-hit!...it can't take ACC IO can it now?). This power can eat so many procs, you should load up on those.
Drop Boxing and Vengeance
Also don't need tough or weave, you can softcap with just your Primary/Secondary (+ IO sets & your ProtBot, give him DEF IOs or Hami-Os. Maxed, his shields give 11.8% DEF IIRC)
Drop Detonator
Take Hasten, at lesat 2 slot it wih recharge
I would pick up Trip Mine...in a fight, after you drop your traps, you are doing what..if not provoking, attacking...and if everything's in a nice little bundle from your AoE Immob, what better thing to do then lay on massive AoE damage?
And you should be softcapped to M/R/AoE and S/L. You can do this *without* Fighting pool and *without* epic pool shields (use that for resistance instead).
One word...PROCS PROCS PROCS, PROCS PROCS PROCS!! (EVERY-BODAYYY!!)
......wow. I apologize for that infraction...yet it was necessary!
Bots/Traps is a procs beast...please look at all available options for them. Some can dish out some serious (passive) damage for you.
Some that I didn't cover yet:
-2 Pet uniques for DEF and RES (make sure to fit these in!)
-Explosive Strike for Assault bot
-Damage procs in mortar
-KD proc & damage procs for caltrops (although before ED, I think 2 DMG IOs are better)
-probably forgetting a few..don't have build in front of me
General strategy:
1. Send in seeker drones (from distance)
2. Queue AoE immob and approach mob, it will fire off when you are close enough
3. Run in and drop poison trap right at their feet.
4. Acid mortar (around this time your bots will lumber in and start blasting. Defensive/Follow ONLY, do not tell them to attack a target otherwise BG mode doesn't work!)
5. Caltrops ON the mob. Pee yourself in giddy happiness (optional)
6. Provoke
7. Trip mine
8. Drop triage somewhere in there
Or: 1, 3, 5 (functions more as control here than damage), 4, 6, 7
The point is that you want the bad guys targetting YOU (cuz you are all softcapped and 1337 now anyway), and not your bots. Ordering your bots to directly attack a target is probably one of the worst things you can do..especially when that attack eats an alpha in return.
Probably forgetting stuff, but those are the tweaks I would make, at least for now. YMMV
Best,
-MT -
I'll PM you tonight to your global. I needed a home for this guy
-MT -
Quote:Nice info here. My #1 I might not realize as much (the latter part) because I never solo. Even if I'm the first in the fray, the team usually isn't far behind. So, if it is like you said, that "lag" in the commands is just long enough for the foes to target other toons aside from me (e.g. something with more threat level from attacking: scrap or w/e). Because I've had cases when I run in first, the mob starts going after me, bots clomp in and follow, rest of team follows, spawn is getting whittled down and bots are still standing around picking their noses. This is on Def+Follow. Sometimes I will throw them on Aggressive if the mob is "easy enough" and just let them have at it, or, issue a direct attack at a boss or something.Originally Posted by Master Zaprobo
Your first definition is already active ingame. Regardless of an attack hitting or missing you (or one of the henchmen) your henches will return fire. However, they may stand there for a little bit if you recently issued any commands to them (for instance, running into the spawn, then hitting a "Follow" command - they will endeavour to undertake this command first, before aggroing based on the attacks you have been subject to)
I'd actually not like to see either 2 or 3 make their way ingame. The henchmen have discrete controls for a reason - I don't want them to link to what I'm doing! Your 2 and 3 would be more suited to the Aggressive stance in my mind.
For reference, I very rarely use Bodyguard and am more liable to issue multiple "Attack" commands in any given fight.
The difference between 2 and 3 vs Aggressive is of course BG vs. non-BG. Also I think of it in this way: Aggressive should be just that, go crazy on whatever you see. Defensive should be "back me up when I get in there, no matter who starts the fight!"
I guess what I would like to see is a "follow" based on ACTIONS (both attacking and physical movement), not just "follow" in terms of strictly movement. Aggressive is not this, and neither is Defensive.
MT -
Quote:Dechs, what APP/PPP are you using?Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
Bots/traps, without alpha, moderate IOs: Very yes.
The only difference between +4 and +2 is that I start the fight with seeker drones and already have a mine or two planted.
MT -
Cedric, I agree with you. Before I start, I have a 43 Bots/Traps and a 35 Bots/Dark.
The only way to remain in BG mode, which, to me, is a major reason/purpose of playing an MM, is Defensive+Follow, and Defense+GoTo. Anything else (even Defensive+Target), and the player is taking the full brunt of the damage.
I'm traps, so I've built for high DEF in my build. I'm also aggressive in my playstyle. I won't always wait for Seeker Drones to recharge before jumping in, and sometimes I start off with Provoke from inside my FFG. The point is that I willingly jump into the muck and lay that PGT ASAP. But because of the high DEF, I don't always get hit right away. Sooo the bots stomp along in right beside me, and...stand there. Only when I actually get HIT (or they do, I think), do they start blasting away. I don't like getting hit. If my bots were TRUE "bodyguards," *any* offensive action against me and my bots would act.
Example: I get into a fight. My bodyguard is standing right there. My foe swings once, misses me. Bodyguard stands there eating a twinkie. I swing back. Bodyguard is now eating a Twix bar. My foe swings again and nails me in the jaw. Only THEN does the bodyguard decide to drop the beef jerky and takes action to beat up my foe? That is one fired bodyguard!
Suggestion: If they are in Defensive+Follow, I want them to start blasting as soon as I "actively engage with an enemy."
This can be defined as:
1. An enemy attacking me, whether they hit OR miss me
2. I start a "direct attack" an enemy, assume ST or AoE attack
3. I start an "indirect attack" (trap, pet, debuff, etc) and an enemy is within the bot's aggro radius
Also, Defensive+Target should not cancel BG mode. To me this is just focusing efforts and is much different than aggressive because it is in effect, micromanagement.
Bottom line: If I want my bots to stand around, that's what I have Passive for!
My $0.02
MT -
Quote:Maybe I was a little unclear too haha. I completely understand defensive mode, BG, etc. I am softcapped to all but Psi in my build and use the MM commands, etc.Originally Posted by MaelwysAlts
I suspect that the OP is saying they draw aggro onto themselves via using a "Taunt" power from the Challenge Pool, and leave their henchmen in bodyguard mode. Combined with the mitigation from defence/resistance/regen this enables MMs to effectively Tank an AV.
This would be the standard Single-Target soloing Tactic used by "Tankermind" builds, which usually works wonders (barring any interference from the current stupid, stupid ignore-follow-or-goto-orders-and-run-into-melee-PBAoE-attack-range-of-my-target pet AI)
I was wondering for Katie specifically whether she was using JUST attacks (perhaps the AoE attack from the Mu PPP), or JUST Provoke? Or both? I guess I was asking more on a playstyle/"attack chain" and not so much the concept behind it (which I completely understand and use myself currently)
MT -
Quote:Katie,Originally Posted by Katie V
If they've got sub-par builds and are leaving their pets in aggressive mode, sure. With my bots/traps, I've got 41% resistance to S/L/E and I'm softcapped to all positions and most types. With my bots in bodyguard mode and Triage Beacon out, I've got more resistance than a stone tank in Granite, better defenses than a forcefielder, and regen to rival that of a Regen scrapper, but only if the attacks are focused on me.
This is a bit cryptic to me. Are you saying that you take personal attacks for the MM (which may be from the primary and/or PPP) to draw aggro on yourself, or just that you run in BG mode? (or both?)
MT -
I figure the Knockdown proc in Caltrops would help with mitigation. However, if you use Electrifying Fences (to stop knockback from Assault Bot and Trip Mine), does this also stop knockdown (thereby making the proc in caltrops useless)? Just wondering.
Thanks
MT -
I'm curious what people are using for an attack chain for Bots/Traps. I'm guessing this will vary slightly depending on whether or not you're opening up with Seeker Drones and whether or not you're tanking.
MT -
Quote:Ah okay, the pet uniques. Got it. Wasn't thinking of that. If it said unique pet procs I would have realized ^^Originally Posted by anonymoose
The +RES and +DEF unique procs grant the bonus to any pet within the MM's "aura", that's a fairly large radius, I don't recall exactly how big at the moment.
Yes but the protbots bubble your tier1 and tier3 pets twice, hence 22% or so.
This is true. They only buff the player once though. Maybe I misread the original statement. I read it as being able to softcap the player (bots as a set), not the actual bots themselves. Sorry!
MT -
Quote:Not really sure what the "aura" is..are you talking about APP/PPP DEF shield? It isn't needed. You can hit the softcap with bots/traps with IO set bonuses and the other stuff you mentioned. You don't even need Weave.Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
Traps can softcap Bots too - you just need to have Manoeuvres and the aura +defence unique. FFG is 15, Manoeuvres is 4, the Prot Bots are 22, and the aura is the slack.
FF can soft cap the prot bots, who otherwise are not capped, though - but that's really about all it has going for it over traps.
If you want to do things besides use your secondary, FF is probably a good choice. If you want to use your secondary, Traps has all the tools you'll want to keep using (don't forget web grenade's -recharge; it's pretty hefty, and good for mitigation).
And I think your Prot Bot bubble numbers are way off. Slotted out for +DEF and they hit around 12%, not 22.
I would choose Bots/traps over Bots/FF. I came from Bots/Dark too. As always, YMMV
MT -
Quote:That's what I thought. If anything, I would slot out -to hit as well. Even slotted out with Dark Watcher you get about -7.5% to hit per drone, which is nothing great. The best part here is the -20% DMG and the ability to take an alpha, IMO.Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
The main purpose of seeker drones is as a sacrificial pet to take the alpha strike. That being said the -to hit and -damage debuffs are pretty useful so I recommend a bit of -to hit slotting along with recharge. The stun is not particularly useful.
EDIT: Is each drone -10% or -20% DMG? In Mids, on the info tab for the power, it says -5% to hit. If you go to effects, it says -10% to hit. So, it makes me think that the Info tab is per drone, while the Effects tab is the "whole power" (i.e. both drones). So, the Effects tab says -20% DMG. Can someone confirm if this is PER drone or you get the -20% for the "whole power" (both drones)? Because I read a guide on here that says it is -40% DMG...thanks!
MT -
Quote:It was more of a question is the base high enough to bother enhancing? After checking in Mids, the answer is a definite yes. I'm getting ~32.5% debuff out of it.Originally Posted by Bronze Knight
From a Bots/traps standpoint yes because its the only -def you have.
For a AR/Traps Cor or a Merk/Traps its not nearly so important because you have other sources of -def to stack. Remember -defense is like +tohit for everyone.
Another question...what is the purpose of Seeker Drones? Should you slot for Stun or ToHit Debuff? Both effects seem to be relatively lackluster even after slotting out. This power seems to be a jack of all trades, master of none. It does damage, stun (hold), and to hit debuff, but none of it all that great...can someone fill me in here? Thinking of pumping slots into PPP hold for a legit, stackable hold.
MT -
Not trying to thread jack, but should Acid Mortar be maxed for Defense Debuff in addition to recharge? Does the Debuff matter? (assuming you have the -RES proc already)
MT -
Quote:So you run either Chill or Mace Mastery? None of the MM PPP/APP seem to be particularly ... good. Maybe it's just me, but I always thought actually attacking myself as an MM was a waste of time. Perhaps I'm wrong.Originally Posted by JoeKent
I've found taking a def shield works better against most enemies than a resistance shield. I tested in out with my 2nd build and it just seems to work better 99% of the time. Plus with musculature slotted everything is DEAD before they can hit me anyway.
I do miss the dmg and anti-knockback from electrifying fences though, and my anti mezz procs were nice too.
Edit: Was this Bots/traps or bots/dark?
MT -
Quote:Well I wasn't intentionally trying to limit myself. It's just that S/L is the first/easiest to go for. I just wasn't aware exact what the limits were/what was possible.Originally Posted by Katie V
Restricting yourself to softcapping S/L on a bots/traps is a waste. You've got a strong enough defense base that you can easily softcap everything: your choice of S/L/E/N/F/C or range/melee/AoE -- or both. Add in bodyguard mode, provoke, and the resistance shield of your choice, and you're tougher than a stone tank running Granite.
MT -
Same question as OP. Posted here instead of a new thread to not clog things up.
That said, I'm 34 Bots/Dark. The bots are kind of squishy and I don't feel like I'm doing GOOD damage, I feel the damage is just mediocre. I have considered multiple times rerolling as Bots/Traps. I never solo, just TFs/teams.
Looking for some input for/against rerolling, etc. Just seeking general advice.
Also, I have softcap to S/L on a few other toons and it is quite powerful. Doing that for a bots/traps with FFG and running in Bodyguard mode..is it as survivable as it sounds? What about throwing Provoke in the mix?
Also, is FFG the only trap that follows you? KBing stuff out of my -RES Tar Patch is getting old...
Best,
MT -
Quote:This looks to have been released in i18 actually. However I have no idea if Freedom TFs uses it.Originally Posted by Master-Blade
Or.. is the chantimeout command actually working yet? I saw in the patch notes that it was supposed to be working now, but I haven't seen anybody actually confirm it. If it works, that would be a way a mod could get rid of some inactive people and free up space.
What constitutes an inactive user? Does someone have to chat in the channel to be considered active, or do they just have to login with a account/toon who is in the channel?
Just wondering, thanks.
Best,
MT