Local_Man

Valid complaints . . . but I don't see this today nearly as much as we used to see it. On my 4 Kins (2 Defenders, 2 Controllers), I have a macro set up explaining that I'll do my best to keep folks SB'ed, and I'm not offended by a reasonable and polite request if I fall behind. However, repeated rude requests will be met with a boycot of that player or, if it is really bad, me quitting the team. If the teammate runs off and misses out on SB, oh well.

Since I wrote that little macro, I have had almost no rude "SB plz" spammers and no situations where I felt I needed to quit the team. Communications goes a long way to fix problems. Unfortunately, that can't fix the "forgetful teammate" situation.

Bad players aside, SB is one of the very best buffs you can give to a team to help them complete missions faster and better. My personal opinion is that if you don't want to SB the team, you should either play solo or pick another secondary. I feel that skipping SB is a very selfish choice by someone who isn't looking out for the best interests of the team over himself.

If I'm leading a team with a Kin who won't (or can't because he/she didn't take the power) SB the team, I may not kick the character (because I really think it is rude), but I will make a note and probably never team with that character again.

If you don't want to take it, that's fine. But don't expect me to want to team with you.

You would be surprised at how affordable it has been . . . of course, some of it is because I have been around for a while, and have "earned" a bunch of things in that build rather than bought them. For example, I used to participate in twice-weekly Hami-Raids, so I built up a bunch of Hami-Os.

Still, none of the purples I have in my build are overly expensive. The really expensive ones are the Damage sets. I sell those when I'm lucky enough to get a drop.

With that combo of a Shield Brute and a Plant/Rad controller? I would lean towards something with a lot of AoE . . . like a Fire/Kin Corrupter. I can see an easy strategy: Brute goes in to gather foes up into a tight group. Plant/Rad goes in to hit them with Seeds+Roots. Fire/Kin Corr goes in to Fulcrum Shift and then Rain of Fire while the Plant/Rad debuffs with EF and more Roots. By then, all the minions are dead and the Lieuts are pretty close to it.

My Ill/Rad still gets boosts to Recharge and Heal . . . the buff to healing makes me think that Defense may be less important, too.

There is still a lot to digest there. I'm fairly sure I'll go with the "Spiritual" route for the Recharge and Heal buffs. Since Recharge has a lessening effect the more you get, I suspect that I may reduce some of my Recharge from one or two sets. I'm thinking that I might reduce the number of slots in Spectral Terror to use them in other places. My build has always been tight on slots, and that will provide some opportunities to fix that. There is always the option to try to replace some of the Recharge for Defense . . . but with the boost in healing, I'm not sure how important that will be.

I'm more of a "wait-n-see" kind of person that a "wildly speculate" kind of person. Once the Mid's revisions are done, it will be fun to play around with the various options. I'm definitely saving my second "freespec" until I get the Incarnate slot and make some decisions on changes I might want.

Communications is the key. My view is that if a teammate is using a power in a way that it creates a problem, I try to explain the problem rather than tell the guy, "Don't use that power!" Sometimes I ask (nicely) if I can make a suggestion -- if you use it this way rather than that way, it will help the team. Every once in a while, the guy is a bit of a jerk and won't take suggestions -- and that's usually a guy I won't team with again. I have even had people do the same with me -- I have even learned a few things from them.

I recall when a buddy of mine decided to pick up one of the Phase powers on a character. This was a guy that I team with regularly, so we were all on voice chat. I was on a scrapper, I think, or maybe one of my Tanks. I pick a target and begin to pound away when I realize I'm accomplishing nothing. Grrr. I explain to my buddy that in the heat of battle, it is hard to notice the minimal effects of a phased foe. So, we worked out a system for him to pick out a particular foe who might be a problem, and announce to everyone which foe he is phasing so we know to look for the FX. While I still am not crazy about phasing powers, this was a fair compromise that seemed to work well and still let him use his power. (He eventually gave up on the power.)

If you are playing a tank and don't want to chase after the confused guy, tell the Illusion Controller that he's responsible for chasing down any confused guys who run off. He should be able to use Blind-SW to take that foe down on his own. And if the 'troller is still working on that guy when the rest of the team is done, you can either help him out or move on to the next group.

I find that usually when a "team" doesn't want someone to use a particular power, it is really one or maybe two guys on the team who care, while everyone else doen't really care. If the conflicts can be resolved, then everyone can have fun. Frankly, I have always found Deceive to be one of my favorite powers in the Illusion set, and I would rather not be on a team where I was told or even asked not to use it. I'm willing to adjust my use to some degree for team harmony, but I won't agree to stop using one of my best powers.

I try to put this in terms of what "I" would do. Some folks aren't all that fond of Deceive and would be perfectly willing to give it up for team unity. Some folks will do whatever the team wants. That's fine, since everything is influenced by personal playstyle and team make-up.

I was on an STF last night with an amazing team. 1 Shield tank, 1 Cold/DP Defender, 1 Fire/Rad Corrupter, 2 Ill/Rad controllers (me and my buddy), 1 Ill/Storm controller, 1 Scrapper and 1 Necro/FF MM. I think 6 of us were experienced players who had run the TF a bunch of times. Everybody was softcapped during the entire TF, and we did the run (with a PUG) in just over an hour. I didn't use Deceive much because it wasn't needed. Every now and then, I used Deceive to bring a straggler into our zone of death, but that was its main use.

On a large, fast moving team, Deceive has fewer good uses. It still is not wasted any more than a single target hold is wasted, but that kind of team doesn't need its special benefits nearly as much. On the other side, there is a much lower chance of missing out on any potential XP on those large, fast moving teams since everything dies quickly with almost no time for the confused foe to do much damage.

While I acknowledge there are a very small number of situations where Deceive can be counter-productive, I don't agree Deceive should not be used on teams. Properly used, Deceive should help the team gain more XP over time by (a) reducing mez powers being used on the team which can substantially slow down the team, (b) taking problem foes out of the fight and thereby reducing the damage being taken by the team, (c) getting foes who may have wandered off or who may be running away to return to the area where his buddies are getting clobbered -- so that nobody has to chase them, (d) turning aggro away from squishier teammates, and (e) letting your team get a little bit of bonus XP that they did not earn while completing missions faster.

I advocate adjusting the way you use powers to the playstyle of the team, but I don't agree with not using one of your best powers when teammates don't understand how useful it is. If somebody tells me, "No pets right now {for some good reason}," then I'm fine with that. But if somebody says for me to not use Phantasm because of his knockback before they have seen how I use him, then I have a problem with that. Unless you know that the person using Confuse powers is using them poorly, I think you make a mistake by asking him to stop using Confuse.



Let me give you a few examples of times that Deceive can be used on a team without drawing aggro of a large spawn -- all of which will help the team:

• Against Malta, using Deceive against Sappers -- your team will kill faster if they actually have endurance.
• On the ITF, using Deceive against the Surgeons - thereby stopping them from healing the foes (I do this one a lot).
• Against Circle of Thorns, using Deceive against Earth Thorn Casters to stop the casting of Quicksand, or stacking Deceive on Ruin Mages to stop the casting of Earthquake and Stone Cages (Don't these slow down the team a bunch?).
• Against Rikti, using Deceive on Guardians will prevent them from casting shields on other Rikti -- especially the drones -- letting you kill them faster (I hate it when I keep whiffing when trying to take out drones); if you do it right, those Guardians may give your team a dose of AM, too.
• Against Devouring Earth, Deceive on a Guardian can neutralize those crystals put down by the Guardians, thereby stopping the huge Defense Debuff for all of your defense-based teammates (quite common today).
• Against Crey, Deceive can prevent Paragon Protectors from doing big chunks of damage on squishier teammates.
• Against Carnies, Deceive on Illusionists can prevent them from using their controls, including the AoE hold, from holding teammates without mez protection.
• I can go on and on . . .

If somebody is using confuse powers wrong, I agree that confuse powers can be counter-productive -- such as confusing a foe that the blaster has just tried to pull. But I feel pretty strongly that it is a huge mistake to kick people from a team for using confuse powers as long as that player knows what he or she is doing. Any loss of potential XP is so small that it really makes no difference, while the benefits of Confuse can be huge. Illusion and Mind have single target confuse powers . . . how much XP are you really missing out on? Mind has Mass Confusion as a key part of its control set . . . Do you really think that the fairly small amount of potential XP that you might miss out on is worth giving up all that control? Especially when you are likely to kill the groups faster? Plus, you have a very good chance of getting bonus XP that you didn't even earn?

Control = faster killing safely. Confuse is a form of control where the benefits far outweigh the small detriments. There are times that Knockback and even Phase powers can be used effectively -- although I personally hate phase powers -- I won't kick somebody for using them unless they are using them stupidly. And even then, I'm pretty tolerant.

I'm not an advocate of the "democracy of ignorance" on a team. Some people don't understand how good powers can be when used properly -- and I don't agree that is a basis to kick people from the team. If somebody tells me to stop using Deceive, I quickly explain that if they read the relevant guides on the forums, they will see how Confuse can be used smartly to increase XP over time, and I know how to use it smartly. If they still want to kick me (which hasn't happened in a long time), then I'm happy to make a note of a person I won't team with again and move on.

A Plant Controller that lines up a large group and hits them with Seeds of Confusion and Roots will guaranty that your team will not miss out on hardly any potential XP because Roots is doing damage to the group -- and the group is completely controlled and "rooted" in place for nice, juicy AoE attacks to wipe them out quickly. If you try to tell my Plant/Kin that she can't use Seeds+Roots to set up a nice tight group for Fulcrum Shift . . . and I'll go find another team who appreciates my controls and buffs.

*/Storm controllers run into the same problem . . . there have been a lot of not-very-good players who turn */Storm into a chaos machine that create problems for the team. So, I have run into a number of players who think that all Stormies are bad for a melee team. But a well-played Stormie is a huge boost for the team. Just limit the knockback to the right times, and Storm can be awesome on a team. I have several times had folks in PUGs send me a tell that they had never seen Storm played well before . . .

My opening varies depending upon the team. If we have a good tank or someone else going in to draw aggro, then I usually start with Quicksand for that huge Defense Debuff that lets everything else hit with ease. Then I follow with one of the three AoE controls depending upon the foes. I most often use Stalagmites+Stone Cages if the group is mostly minions and lieutenants, and Earthquake if the group has some bosses. However, sometimes I just have to use Volcanic Gasses because it is just so good. None of the AoE controls sit on my tray unused for very long. I follow up with Freezing Rain in pretty much all cases because the debuffs are so good.

If we don't have a good tank (or a scrapper who acts like one), I may lead Rocky into the group, then turn around and hit them with Stalagmites+Stone Cages, then run it to stack the stun with Thunderclap. Then Freezing Rain and Quicksand. Once the 12 second -knockback is up on Stone Cages, I may throw out Earthquake if needed.

Lightning Storm is used if the team needs a little more damage, but some teams kill so fast that it is a waste to use it. I generally save Tornado for those "special times" when it is really useful.

I don't even have Snow Storm on my Earth/Storm build . . . I like it for the -Fly and -Recharge, but I just couldn't fit it in. I'll be adding it for I-19.