Jiaozy

One of my first herds in I4: Me lvl 18, trolls lvl 18-20

The first(I think)lvl 50 dingage with 5 people at once.

Everyone's dream: a cave filled with Council's Galaxy

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It's fixed alright, and has been for a while.

No Energy-Transfer-suicides for a long time now.

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I managed to suicide myself with ET while soloing about a month ago, so it's not been fixed _that_ long ago

Double Mire + Dark Nova FTW!
Oh, you're just a PB ( )

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Clearly my PB is worth sticking with from what you guys say.

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Those that play a PB are more likely to stick with them till lvl 50 because the PBs start easy in the low levels(they're some kind of blapper with shields and self heals)while those that play a WS(I know many of em, one being myself)try and stick with it for a bit, but since they start pretty sucky(don't say no, the only power worth picking till lvl 18 is dark nova)they often drop em in the mid-late 20s for another alt.

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So really I see no advantage to Power Leveling a Kheldian.

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That's the whole point.
I needed 4 respecs on my WS to find out a build I like to play, is effective and found out the best way to slot powers and when/how to use them.
Kheldians more than any other AT need to be played to understand HOW to play them, if you just PL them you'll end up with a useless and gimped toon due to the severe slotting and power picking issues you can get.

On the OP subject, I don't think Kheld will request PL more than any other AT.
Altho back in I4 the AT I've seen more in PI before lvl 30 was the PB...

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For blasters its a awsome power, yet for tankers with ET i think its less effective. Still serious high damage, rather long animation time but mag3 (i think) stun chance. [...]

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Mag4 if I'm not mistaken .

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Should be 100% mag3 and an 80% to add a mag1 stun.

TF and ET are the only reasons for wich Energy melee is good, I don't see why you want to skip one of them

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Personally I think a lot just don't know any better.

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Agreed.

A taunt has a maximum cap of 5 foes, right? That's kinda sucky.

Shrug.

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One thing I always wanted to ask, on the Taunts with a tohit check(Kheldian Dwarfs and Provoke)the cap is always 5?
Or is 5 people hit?
Because I clearly remember taunting a mob with my Dwarf Antagonize a second after my SK has gone to Hospital(don't say nothing..)and seeing like 8-10 'MISS' in that mob.

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And most importantly, I'm a member of each of them, so why wouldn't you want to join?

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Sayin like that, you're not making people willing to join

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TI is a resist shield, not a defence shield, unyielding is a def-shield iirc.

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Both are resist shields, TI gives res only to S/L, Unyielding to all but psi and debuffs your DEF by 5%.

IMO the only change needed would be to put the DEF and RES enhance in the 8-16-33%(A?) schedule, so that DOs would already make tanking viable and even TOs will help and when you get SOs you won't be overpowered but just a toon with the DEF and RES to survive the aggro you can grab...

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I've seen a post from Castle or Positron in the US boards sayin that they'll activate Gauntlet in PvP for tankers(because many complained that it's the only AT that doesn't have any use for his inherent),can't remember where I've seen it and when they'll put this change in-game.

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i saw that too, iirc they said by i7 at the latest, i believe this to be the reason for the recent nerf to taunt in PvP

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Taunt nerfed in PvP AGAIN?!
Dunno why but it doesn't surprise me that's not in any patch note...

I've seen a post from Castle or Positron in the US boards sayin that they'll activate Gauntlet in PvP for tankers(because many complained that it's the only AT that doesn't have any use for his inherent),can't remember where I've seen it and when they'll put this change in-game.

I'd lose the slot in barrage since I don't think you'll use it a lot in PvP, otherwise the build looks good, maybe swap an end redux in CE for a Slow..

I'll put this guide here in case you missed it on the other thread

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EDIT: Oh, btw Chi, alredy way ahed of yas with my Ice/Mace tank BEAT THE GIMPEDNESS!

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Now THAT is gimped
Edit: what next, Archery/Dev?

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Gratzez 2 Philo on getting his fourth 50 with TsubaXIII, his Katana/Super Reflexes scrapper.

It seems i must find another of Phil's toons to mock for being poor......

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With 4 level 50s, can we call him a noob anymore?

Grats again Phil!

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He's even more n00b, 4 50s and still never knows nothing bout the game
Well done dude

Seventh post after yours.

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But hey focused accuracy is uber, yo.

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Agreed but in PvE it has little to no use since ED because you can slot 1-2 accuracy and already be sure to hit anything because you can't 6 slot for damage(wich was the whole point of picking FA).
In PvE for aggro control there's nothing that can match Pyre Mastery, the fireball comes late indeed, but once you have it you're really an aggro magnet; along with Fire Melee AoE and Chilling Embrace there's no way you'll lose any aggro

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I think Golden_Crusder meant as in Dark Nova form, not the 'Nova' style Quasar attack.

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Why are you talking about PvP he said he is PvE only?

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If you can play as a Tank in PVP, than PVE should be no problem. I don't see why a PVP build wouldn't work in PVE for Tanks. I don't even think a Tank should need a different build for PVP than for PVE.

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For my PvP build on my Ice tank I'll slot 3 slows in Chilling Embrace(now it has only 2 slots, 1 end rdx and 1 taunt), pick powers in different order to be able to pvp even if exemped(in my current build I have only Barrage and Bone Smasher as attacks till lvl 35, I focused on taking damage, while for a pvp build you have to balance things bette )and maybe skip Icicles, Whirling hands and go for Energy Mastery epic(useful for FA in PvP but pretty pointless for tanking purposes in PvE)instead than THE PvE tanker pool: Pyre Mastery.

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WHERES YOUR NOVA???


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but have tried to build a controlling/tanking human/dwarf build

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nuff said, at least try to read other posts before replying

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Well, a dead mob is the best way of controlling them as it gives you 100% resistance to their damage and they're perma held.....
I think that a well placed Nova can be very controlling, making things dead and leaving only some survivors.
But teaming with the Rangers made me witness how a nova can also mess things up by scatterin stuff, spreading aggro and killing nothing.

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So the tankers i have seen (including mine but not my invuln as i was new then) herding up and holding aggro as of lvl 6 were completely imaginary...ok.

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No doubt you have the chance to do so, but you HAVE to be experienced and MUST have a proper team support, even with knowledge on how to tank if the team isn't workin perfectly towards keeping you alive you won't survive 10 seconds.
In a PuG as a new player you can't possibly hope to grab aggro and act as a tank at level 6. Fact.
You said that you've seen tankers getting mezzed at lvl 41 and you hope they could tank at lvl 6?
Before SOs as a tank you need complete team support to tank even for a 3-4 man team, because if you try to tank and the team isn't helping or everyone is doin feck all you'll be just another stain on the floor.
You can indeed start tanking soon, but with other experienced player in your team, that know what their powers do, know how you play, know what 'tanking' is like and what to do if you try to.

In a PuG where you see Defenders with 4 blasts and 3 pool attacks, controllers with all the pool powers they can pick and when everyone thinks that Defender = H3410rZ how can you possibly hope to tank and survive?

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Salt and wounds, as long as players persist with the viewpoint of 'tanks are rubbish coz it aint i4' they i'm going to continue to point out that its not true anymore.


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I think you don't understand what we're saying...
Spad is saying that _now_ starting a tank and being able to properly tank(get the aggro first and keep it)it's not possible till you're completely SO'd up.
We're not saying'We want I3 power levels back.' it's more like 'We want to have an effective AT off the box like any other AT', because any other AT can do his job pretty much off the box, they all become more powerful in the late game but everyone can start doin his job right away: Blasters can already damge stuff more than anyone else, scrapper can damage stuff and are tougher than any other AT bar tankers, defenders can use buffs/debuffs and blast, controllers can control and buff/debuff while tankers start as low-damage tough scrappers and they're able to _tank_ in the mid-20s, while every other ATs becomes ace at his job with SOs a Tanker becomes a Tanker worth the name.

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I usually get so depressed by the poor displays (and the debt I get) that I'll switch to Faulty and come on to show these youngsters how it's done. Am I the only one that feels sad that people no longer feel safe with a tank on the team?

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I don't think you are alone.. I don't play my tank anymore since I couldnt get over the fact that someone always died no matter what I did. Tanks can't keep teams safe on their own anymore, it requires much more coordinated effort from the whole team now.. I dont expect anything from tanks these days.

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I don't feel safe with a tank in the team nowdays, since many of em are just tough scrappers that can't care less of keeping the team safe.
As long as they don't get debt they're happy, so you see people goin Unstoppable to run away after a nearly team-wipe, GA tankers standing there and hitting some minions while the AV cleans the team up and so on.
I am really happy while playin my tank, tho, as knowing what to do and aiming to keep the team safe gets me some 'Well done!' and I hope it spreads the confidence and knowledge of what tankers really can do.
I've been told really often 'Wow, never thought that a tank still could tank _that_ good due to the latest changes!', you still CAN tank, but you need to be good at it because if a tanker sucks it's more obvious that a [censored], say, empath wich can just spam Healing Aura and throw in the casual Heal Other or Absorb Pain to save someone.

I can't comment on the human powers, but since the WS and PB shapeshifts are very similar I'll say a couple of things about em

If you want to make some use of the Dwar Antagonize you'll need it at least with 2 acc and 2 taunt, otherwise it'll miss a lot and won't last long enough to keep pesky targets on you(AV and bosses that are +2/+3 t you).
The self heal in Dwarf is very handy, altho the one from the Black dwarf works differently, I'll 6 slot the White Dwarf's too, with 3 recharge and 3 heals.
IMO the only attacks worth slotting from nova are the 2 AoE, with 3 dmg and 1 recharge in the AoE and 2 in the cone they'll chain very nicely and you'll be able to toss in the occasional single target attack.

I slotted my Dwarf for damage, but that's cos I have spare slots from the human powers, wich I neglected on my WS, the Dwarf is good for taking damage, not dishing it out, the Flare can be worth slotting tho, as it helps keepin aggro on you.

My $0.02

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He's probably the "worst" of the controller pets

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Give me Animated Stone over Jack Frost any day.