Gaheris
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Posts
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Joined
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Quote:Good for you! Thugs/Traps is a solid and capable build, quite adept at soloing AVs. It was my main for about 2 years, til I played it to death and got sick of it. So you're off to a good start, but then you said something rather silly:Originally Posted by Jordon_Justice
Hello all, I have recently created a thugs/traps to duo with my cousins Dualpistols/trick arrow defender. I have a few questions as to how to slot my pets, powers,
Setting your hopes a *bit* too high here. Ten Thugs/Traps players will give you 10 different opinions based on their personal experience and playstyles, however minute the differences may be. I used the powers you chose to make a Positionally Defense-capped toon, with over 1000 HP and 68.9% Smashing/Lethal resistance, as well as a not-too-shabby 55% global recharge bonus. Only difference is, I didn't have enough slots left over to put into both Medicine powers and Stamina/Health, so 1 of them had to go.Quote:Originally Posted by Jordon_Justice
and make sure you all agree on my power decisions.
So I took out Tactics (you don't need it), Aid Other and Aid Self, moved the slots to Health/Stamina, and gave you Combat Jumping/Super Jump for some extra Defense and a travel power, as well as Acrobatics for some KB protection (just a suggestion, as critters KBing you can get annoying on /Traps). Which means if you were to use this build you'd probably need to run around with an inspiration tray full of greens and some break frees.
Also, your pets should be soft-capped...let's see, 15.4% from FFG...3.76% from Maneuvers...both Pet Defense Aura IOs at 5% each...a little over 8% from each Enforcer at lvl 50...should put the pets at about 45%, all by your lonesome. Anything your friend provides will be gravy. Might want to set up a bind that uses the numpad to toss green inspirations to your pets, since you'll be lacking any targeted healing.
Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.90
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Level 50 Natural Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Thugs
Secondary Power Set: Traps
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Presence
Ancillary Pool: Field Mastery
Villain Profile:
Level 1: Call Thugs -- SvgnRt-Acc/Dmg(A), SvgnRt-Dmg/EndRdx(3), SvgnRt-Acc/EndRdx(3), SvgnRt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(5), SvgnRt-Acc(5), SvgnRt-PetResDam(7)
Level 1: Web Grenade -- Enf'dOp-Acc/Rchg(A), Enf'dOp-EndRdx/Immob(34), Enf'dOp-Acc/EndRdx(37), Enf'dOp-Immob/Rng(39), Enf'dOp-Acc/Immob/Rchg(40), Enf'dOp-Acc/Immob(40)
Level 2: Caltrops -- ImpSwft-Dam%(A), Posi-Dam%(31), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(50)
Level 4: Triage Beacon -- Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx(A), Dct'dW-Rchg(7), Dct'dW-Heal/Rchg(25), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(25), Dct'dW-Heal(31)
Level 6: Equip Thugs -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 8: Maneuvers -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(9), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(9)
Level 10: Acid Mortar -- ShldBrk-DefDeb(A), ShldBrk-Acc/DefDeb(11), ShldBrk-Acc/Rchg(11), ShldBrk-DefDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(19), ShldBrk-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(21), ShldBrk-%Dam(21)
Level 12: Call Enforcer -- BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg(A), BldM'dt-Dmg/EndRdx(13), BldM'dt-Acc/EndRdx(13), BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(15), BldM'dt-Acc(15), BldM'dt-Dmg(17)
Level 14: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
Level 16: Force Field Generator -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def(17), LkGmblr-Rchg+(19)
Level 18: Gang War -- ExRmnt-+Res(Pets)(A), C'Arms-+Def(Pets)(23), EdctM'r-PetDef(23)
Level 20: Poison Trap -- Lock-Acc/Hold(A), Lock-Acc/Rchg(40), Lock-Rchg/Hold(43), Lock-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(43), Lock-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(46), Lock-%Hold(50)
Level 22: Super Jump -- EndRdx-I(A), Jump-I(50)
Level 24: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 26: Call Bruiser -- BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg(A), BldM'dt-Dmg/EndRdx(27), BldM'dt-Acc/EndRdx(27), BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(29), BldM'dt-Acc(29), BldM'dt-Dmg(31)
Level 28: Seeker Drones -- Cloud-ToHitDeb(A), Cloud-Acc/ToHitDeb(33), Cloud-Acc/Rchg(33), Cloud-ToHitDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(33), Cloud-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Cloud-%Dam(34)
Level 30: Tough -- TtmC'tng-ResDam/EndRdx(A), TtmC'tng-ResDam(45), TtmC'tng-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 32: Upgrade Equipment -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 35: Trip Mine -- Oblit-Dmg(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(36), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(36), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(37), Oblit-%Dam(37)
Level 38: Weave -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+(39), LkGmblr-Def(39)
Level 41: Provoke -- Zinger-Taunt(A), Zinger-Dam%(42), Zinger-Acc/Rchg(42), Zinger-Taunt/Rng(42), Acc-I(43)
Level 44: Temp Invulnerability -- TtmC'tng-ResDam/EndRdx(A), TtmC'tng-ResDam(45), TtmC'tng-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(45), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(46)
Level 47: Acrobatics -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 49: Assault -- EndRdx-I(A)
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Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Supremacy
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Mrcl-Rcvry+(48)
Level 2: Stamina -- P'Shift-End%(A), P'Shift-EndMod(48), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(48)
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Set Bonus Totals:- 6% DamageBuff(Smashing)
- 6% DamageBuff(Lethal)
- 6% DamageBuff(Fire)
- 6% DamageBuff(Cold)
- 6% DamageBuff(Energy)
- 6% DamageBuff(Negative)
- 6% DamageBuff(Toxic)
- 6% DamageBuff(Psionic)
- 10% Defense
- 12.06% Defense(Smashing)
- 12.06% Defense(Lethal)
- 13% Defense(Fire)
- 13% Defense(Cold)
- 10.5% Defense(Energy)
- 10.5% Defense(Negative)
- 3% Defense(Psionic)
- 17.38% Defense(Melee)
- 18% Defense(Ranged)
- 17.38% Defense(AoE)
- 2.25% Max End
- 2.5% Enhancement(Held)
- 20% Enhancement(Accuracy)
- 55% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
- 3% Enhancement(Immobilize)
- 4% Enhancement(Heal)
- 10% FlySpeed
- 66.26 HP (8.252%) HitPoints
- 10% JumpHeight
- 10% JumpSpeed
- MezResist(Confused) 7.75%
- MezResist(Held) 9.95%
- MezResist(Immobilize) 5%
- MezResist(Sleep) 12.15%
- MezResist(Stun) 13.25%
- MezResist(Terrorized) 9.95%
- 8% (0.134 End/sec) Recovery
- 40% (1.341 HP/sec) Regeneration
- 20% Resistance(Smashing)
- 20% Resistance(Lethal)
- 21.26% Resistance(Fire)
- 21.26% Resistance(Cold)
- 20% Resistance(Energy)
- 21.88% Resistance(Negative)
- 20% Resistance(Toxic)
- 20% Resistance(Psionic)
- 10% RunSpeed
*Edit* Ok, if you want Aid Self, you can drop Combat Jumping/Super Jump/Acrobatics for Aid Other/Aid Self/Something Else, take the slots from Health, Stamina and Super Jump, move them to Aid Self and put in 5x Doctored Wounds. You'll lose your KB protection and about 2.5% recharge, and you won't be soft-capped defense without your buddy, but you'll still be pretty close. You'll almost certainly have to go Cardiac as your Alpha Slot.Code:| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1584;760;1520;HEX;| |78DAA594594F534114C767BA500B2DBD6D2985B209B209F442A3262E0F266E894AB| |1065CA2467223853629B7B54B22AE7C001F14B7275FFD0626461F8D71F918EE1B8B| |0AEE5ACF32584C1FBD69FFBF3BE7CECCF9CFB933377A6A874B88E9AD426ADB53462| |E371A3572F9787632698E39868C7C216BA4844308112CC547870B939369531F4914| |26728115F16D85F1717D246B6472DEDD66229E8D9B797DF9C6134BA753FA60DC188| |B67738964C6B5DCCE24CD09373576252712796879A91535CC64A69032F2C9B4E9DB| |99499E80E7F1D498F23755079E36C0FFBE5DA8AB68170B8088B07C607C24D83E311| |609154B8429DB8A519724865A2F13DA67089D57085D5719D708A76194E45116790B| |EE9A44F31D9A2F729B70063A58B983CDBA97C654C4087551C610A1791FE1017867F| |B45616FA519BC506B87E4148E00F55AA531FC84B390C2A99C3BA5153D545A185682| |CF46A8B1332A080F214D951A55F59632B9DE31DE13AA671973046D9E500B66DC6C4| |6B8D9CC3948EF51FE3C6C4CAB21F8B8C323C8E45535F22E5A689AA716F450FB0682| |5DE23CCCE05756FC4BD4A1EB33A1E70BE32B21FC8D10F94E088295008F92012E55A| |49B20E14950153158844B3C060BF52A433D2F36C48B0DF1621B79B18DBCD8665EEC| |05F0D5A046353C23C7AB9F335E305E125A5F315E13AC90BD49D5A3A9872AD0A713C| |261C21330D3A2ECB5B0F169C8D4A632B5FDA0E5ADF9C9F8C5F84D682F32704BC106| |864C1D2A530757BE934BDEC92F20041DBAD5E6EB3669E8DA1CE32423CBF50D918B9| |826442FCF67EDFDC7791F3B0F076987D7C1B4BA5A80CE0BF0416840850638D4583A| |50F0C3B730581689958E8F90148996FAFCD775173E613CB5737F25DC0D838803288| |7B07918E508CA518C1D43398E328A52BCE75A76E1D9888636A16C46D98212804289| |8BD8D38147A80AC585E246A946F1A068287E9410CA4D94A253FBFB4528CEA203759| |C6498CA36B732C4FB79BE1492F220BD89FE3D124FCE42E98945DEA077D93FC3B84E| |18282B794F59245216595F165957162995FA0FFF173C3D| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|
As always, YMMV.
Gaheris -
Ok, the thread was officially over as soon as this was said:
Quote:But that's ok, because we were also blessed with:Originally Posted by Siolfir
Stamina didn't make the low level endurance issues worse. Poor decision-making made the low level endurance issues worse.
Both quite quotable. Thanks to the OP for making it possible in the first place.Quote:Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
Top men in the field of science have discovered a direct correlation between people that don't like inherent Fitness and people that spend way too much time door sitting in AE missions.
Wise man say, "What measure you are measuring out to men, they will measure out to you in return." Yeah we're probably being too hard on them, maybe they are sincerely confused, but they came in making a statement rather than asking a question, and a somewhat irrational one at that. Even if you're confused or unsure about how something works, posing as if you *are* sure is pretty foolish, as methods go.Quote:Originally Posted by Angelofvalor
It is funny how some of you appear quite intelligent but at the same time have no patience and jump to conclusions and go just as low as everyone else, true intelligence never jumps to conclusions and understands that patience and wisdom also needs to be used.
Of course, in the CoX forums, even the most humble, polite and respectfully asked question puts you in danger of someone logging on and telling you're an idiot for even asking. Oh well, C'est la Forums.
Gaheris -
Quote:I like what you did there, I remember being (recently) pleasantly surprised how easy it was for an MM to get their positional defense up using set bonuses. However, as far as the pet buff goes, I mean, the pet buff is pretty reliable. Not 100% all the time, but really it's pretty good. It's going to happen, you can't stop it, so you might as well factor it into your build. While it's possible to max out your defense and then some just from set bonuses, if you're willing to cut back on it a little, and use the pet buff to make up for what you lost, you can get in other bonuses that overall may carry the build farther.Originally Posted by plainguy
I think its a decent build. But if your gonna go, then go all the way. Get the Defense Cap without relying on your pets and be sure less hits are gonna get through.
A good example is frankenslotting the Protector Bot. Instead of 6x of a Pet set, how about 3x Blood Mandate, 1x Cytoskeleton, 1x lvl 50 Defense IO, and Edict of the Master +5% Pet Defense. Most of what you lost in set bonus defense is made up by the Protector Bots' shields getting better, and that shield provides Def vs All, and it gets your pets closer to their own Def caps, along with Edict's 5%.
And since Web Grenade doesn't need a full set of anything really, how about just 2x 50++ Endoplasms, freeing up 4 slots for other powers. You can maybe add a 3rd slot to Weave for some more +Defense to all...if you have the money you can turn all those Red Fortunes in LotG's and pick up some +HP bonuses along the way. If one of those LotG slots is a 7.5% rech IO, then in addition to all of the above, you've gained some recharge bonuses as well, good for a clicky set like /Traps.
And your positional defense is still at or above the soft cap, and you've still got 3 more slots to put somewhere. Anyway not trying to insult or put anybody down, but I did want to share what popped into my head after what I saw. My two cents, for what it's worth.
Gaheris -
Quote:Long post. The TL;DR version is at the bottom.Originally Posted by Shadow Wail
What would be the best for a Mind/Psi/Leviathan?
I am still stuck on respec'in her to Mind/Psi/Ice or Mind/Psi/Psi...not sure! What will go best with Incarnate or should I just dual build her?
I have a Mind/Psi/Ice, I'll share what my experience has been.
I went with Ice because I wanted to be at the S/L defense cap, which means either Mace or Ice, and between the debuffs and the health restoration options, I think Ice is a better choice. I haven't tried the Psi EPP yet so I can't really say much about it.
As far as Incarnates go, it depends on what I'm doing. Most TFs I do are at 50, so I usually run around with the Cardiac Core for Endurance reduction and Range, which allowed me to take the slots out of Health and Stamina for other stuff. The End Rdx isn't game breaking but it sure is nice. I run Tough, Weave, Maneuvers, Assault, Sprint, Super Speed, Frozen Armor, and sometimes Hover, all with no extra slots in Stamina.
When I'm doing Apex, Tin Mage, or something higher level I'll switch to Nerve, as most of my powers are slotted low to moderate for accuracy, and even though my Dom has +66% accuracy from set bonuses, I want all I can get against level 54 enemies. I originally went with Nerve Radial, but since it only amounted to about a ~2.5% defense boost (with all my toggles running), I switched to Core for more hold duration.
You can make a case for Musculature since I think most agree that you can't possibly have enough damage, but looking at the very rare slots for the Musculature path I just don't see much in there that I need.
Spiritual seems kind of useless for my Dom since he runs around with 120% global recharge + Hasten. It might shave off a second or two off of my AoE mezzes, but since it won't speed up Domination, I don't have any Stuns or Tactics, I don't jump and I don't need more Slows, the Spiritual road seemed kinda "meh" to me.
TL;DR version:
In short, I'm gonna be upgrading both Nerve and Cardiac paths, as those paths seem to boost more of my powers than the other two. Since we only get uncommon slots for now I'm using Core boosts, but when the higher echelons open up I'm planning on switching to Radial.
Gaheris -
Quote:I didn't know that, but it makes perfect sense. My thugs always took longer to farm on +8 missions than my bots do, but my thugs can kill bosses faster (usually) than the bots could.Originally Posted by Katie V
Because of the way Incindiary Missiles works, the damage per target goes up with the number of targets: the missiles summon one burn patch per target hit, with a target cap of eight.
Consider a standard three-minion group: the Assault Bot fires Incindiary Missiles, creating (at best) three burn patches; each minion takes (at most) three patches' worth of damage.
Now consider a group of 16 mixed minions and LTs: the Assault Bot fires Incindiary Missiles. The streakbreaker and target cap mechanics interact to ensure that eight burn patches are created, and each burn patch hits ten enemies per damage pulse, switching targets as enemies are defeated. The average minion takes five burn patches' damage; because of target-switching and overall durability, the LTs probably take damage from all eight.
I think I'm gonna go with Thugs, mostly because of my impatient personality. When some of my pets die, I want to resummon them, buff them, and GO GO GO. It's easier to do that with Thugs than with Bots due to the Enforcers' Leadership toggles. I'll miss the burn patches for sure...that Assault Bot is a beast.
Thanks to all you who've chimed in with your thoughts and opinions, this is the kind of feedback I was hoping for.
Gaheris -
Quote:Well I haven't gotten down into the nitty-gritty numbers of all the pets, but I played Thugs for a while, and when I switched to Bots, the first thing I noticed was, "Sheesh it's taking my bots forever to kill something stronger than a Lt." Their AoE dmg is amazing but as far as single target goes, it's kinda lacking. Also, I'm able to slot Achilles' Heel twice in my Thugs/traps MM, which may help explain the damage gap.Originally Posted by Arbegla
Ya know, i think bots actually out damage thugs, due to the main sources of damage being a higher tier. Assault bot burn patches out damage arsonists burn patches, and the assault bot can take alot more of a beating then the arson can.
On your own subject though, Having played a bot/traps, I'd say theres better debuff senergy with bots/ then with thugs/ so it really depends on what your wanting to do.
For AV/GM soloing, i'd have to vote bots, due to the stacking of seeker drones allowing you to forgo some defense, and the -dmg stacking up pretty high to allow your pets to soak some damage the AV/GMs dish out.
My Bots MM certainly does better as a Tankermind though. I pop a single luck and I'm over the soft cap, with a resist shield for gravy. Provoke keeps the AV off my pets. But my Thugs mow down bigger targets faster. Gonna be hard to choose.
Gaheris -
I have both toons, but want to focus my limited resources into one of them for now. I was going over what I thought were pros and cons, and this is what I've come up with so far:
BOTS PROS
1. Lieutenants can heal other bots and each other, albeit slowly.
2. Mostly energy damage, smattering of other dmg types
3. Possible, with FFG and the pet defense IO and Maneuvers, to soft cap Assault Bot's and Battle Drones' defense
4. Protector Bot's shield makes soft-capping your own defense possible, making for a good Tankermind build, as well as making Trip Mine easier to use in a firefight
5. Bots blow up immediately when using Detonator
CONS
1. Having your Protector bots cast shields takes time. If your bots die and you re-summon in the middle of a fight, they won't be at soft capped defense immediately. And if your Protector Bots are switching back and forth between buffing and fighting it'll take even longer. (Having Provoke in your build helps to offset this problem.)
2. Weaker overall damage output, even with energy damage
THUGS PROS
1. Easier time soft-capping defense on all pets, as the Enforcer toggles affect themselves as well as your other thug pets
2. Thugs can slot both Pet +def and Pet +resist IOs thanks to Gang War
3. The Enforcers use toggles for +defense, so it's there even if you re-summon during a fight
4. Other players thugs' buffs can buff your thugs, and vice versa
5. Higher overall damage output, even with mostly Smashing/Lethal dmg, also upgraded Enforcers have Assault
6. Don't need to slot for as much accuracy on pets, upgraded Enforcers come with Tactics
CONs
1. Next to impossible to soft-cap your def, as thug's leadership does not affect you
2. No healing available from pets.
3. Mostly Lethal/Smashing damage.
4. Arsonist is NOTORIOUS for running into melee and getting himself killed.
5. Animation time on detonator is several seconds longer on thugs
Anything important that I've missed? I'm sure there's got to be a few things I'm overlooking...
Gaheris -
Quote:Ok, I moved around those powers to pick them earlier. Aid Self is there simply 'cuz I like self heals. But say I drop it, what do you think would be a suitable replacement? Perhaps Stealth and Grant Invisiblity? Nothing else is popping out at me...Originally Posted by _Malk_
Both Flash and Poison Gas Arrow are being taken way, way too late. The debuff on these is fairly sizeable and WONDERFUL for soloing and team play. Why are you leaving them for so long?
Why aid other and aid self?
Gaheris -
Ok, this is my very first defender that I've ever tried to make. I have a lvl 50 Corruptor version of this toon already, slotted similarly but still a little different. I was fine with it until I looked at the Defender's debuff numbers, and after realizing the damage isn't that far apart from the two ATs, I decided I wanted to reroll her as the hero version.
I usually slot for +def on my ranged toons, but since /TA is all clickies I went for a sort of +rech build with some +dmg to augment a fender's lower numbers, and I thought assault would help too. Am I overlooking anything vital? Meant for both teaming and solo, although teaming is preferred.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.803
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Level 50 Magic Defender
Primary Power Set: Trick Arrow
Secondary Power Set: Archery
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Medicine
Ancillary Pool: Power Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Entangling Arrow -- Enf'dOp-Acc/Rchg(A), Enf'dOp-EndRdx/Immob(29), Enf'dOp-Acc/Immob(31), Enf'dOp-Immob/Rng(31), Enf'dOp-Acc/Immob/Rchg(31)
Level 1: Snap Shot -- Decim-Acc/Dmg(A), Decim-Dmg/EndRdx(15), Decim-Dmg/Rchg(15), Decim-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(17), Decim-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(17)
Level 2: Aimed Shot -- Decim-Acc/Dmg(A), Decim-Dmg/EndRdx(9), Decim-Dmg/Rchg(11), Decim-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(11), Decim-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(13)
Level 4: Fistful of Arrows -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(5), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(7), Posi-Dmg/Rng(7), Posi-Dam%(9), Range-I(13)
Level 6: Hover -- Flight-I(A), Zephyr-ResKB(23), Krma-ResKB(34), LkGmblr-Rchg+(50)
Level 8: Glue Arrow -- RechRdx-I(A), Range-I(36)
Level 10: Blazing Arrow -- Dev'n-Acc/Dmg(A), Dev'n-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(19), Dev'n-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(21), Dev'n-Dmg/EndRdx(21), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(45)
Level 12: Acid Arrow -- AnWeak-Acc/DefDeb(A), AnWeak-DefDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(23), AnWeak-Acc/Rchg/EndRdx(36), AnWeak-Acc/Rchg(37)
Level 14: Fly -- Frbd-EndRdx(A), Frbd-Fly(25), Frbd-Stlth(25)
Level 16: Aim -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(48)
Level 18: Ice Arrow -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(19), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(27), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(27), Lock-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(29), Lock-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(36)
Level 20: Disruption Arrow -- EndRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(37)
Level 22: Assault -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 24: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(34), RechRdx-I(42)
Level 26: Oil Slick Arrow -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(37), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(40), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(40), Posi-Dam%(42), LdyGrey-%Dam(46)
Level 28: Aid Other -- Heal-I(A)
Level 30: Aid Self -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(43), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(46), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(50)
Level 32: EMP Arrow -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(33), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(33), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(33), Lock-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(34), Lock-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(43)
Level 35: Flash Arrow -- ToHitDeb-I(A), ToHitDeb-I(46)
Level 38: Rain of Arrows -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(39), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(39), Posi-Dam%(39), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(40)
Level 41: Power Build Up -- AdjTgt-EndRdx/Rchg(A), GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx(42), RechRdx-I(43)
Level 44: Force of Nature -- TtmC'tng-ResDam/Rchg(A), TtmC'tng-ResDam(45), TtmC'tng-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(45)
Level 47: Temp Invulnerability -- TtmC'tng-ResDam/EndRdx(A), TtmC'tng-ResDam(48), TtmC'tng-EndRdx(48), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(50)
Level 49: Poison Gas Arrow -- EndRdx-I(A)
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Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Vigilance
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 1: Swift -- Flight-I(A)
Level 1: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 1: Health -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(5)
Level 1: Stamina -- P'Shift-End%(A), P'Shift-EndMod(3), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(3)
------------
Set Bonus Totals:- 12% DamageBuff(Smashing)
- 12% DamageBuff(Lethal)
- 12% DamageBuff(Fire)
- 12% DamageBuff(Cold)
- 12% DamageBuff(Energy)
- 12% DamageBuff(Negative)
- 12% DamageBuff(Toxic)
- 12% DamageBuff(Psionic)
- 5.5% Defense(Smashing)
- 5.5% Defense(Lethal)
- 3% Defense(Fire)
- 3% Defense(Cold)
- 8% Defense(Energy)
- 8% Defense(Negative)
- 3% Defense(Psionic)
- 4.25% Defense(Melee)
- 5.5% Defense(Ranged)
- 3% Defense(AoE)
- 4.5% Max End
- 6% Enhancement(Heal)
- 3% Enhancement(Immobilize)
- 57.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
- 27% Enhancement(Accuracy)
- 5% FlySpeed
- 129.7 HP (12.8%) HitPoints
- 5% JumpHeight
- 5% JumpSpeed
- Knockback (Mag -8)
- Knockup (Mag -8)
- MezResist(Immobilize) 5.5%
- MezResist(Sleep) 4.4%
- MezResist(Stun) 2.2%
- 11.5% (0.19 End/sec) Recovery
- 42% (1.78 HP/sec) Regeneration
- 4.73% Resistance(Fire)
- 4.73% Resistance(Cold)
- 1.88% Resistance(Negative)
- 5% RunSpeed
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Ok, so I took my lvl 50 bots/traps MM and tested Detonator (using my Assault Bot) on a lvl 48 arachnos bane spider scout, and bane spider commando, simultaneously. No enhancements in the power on the first check:
Minion received 180.43 and 171.84 dmg
Lt. received 156.04 and 140.85
Then I slotted Detonator up with 5x Javelin Volley (all except the chance for dmg) and tried it again, and got the same results, even though I had an 89% dmg boost from the enhancements. I also noticed that the chance to hit wasn't displayed, it simply said twice that the power was auto-hit.
Then I swapped builds, tossed in 2x Acc 3x dmg lvl 50 SOs, and tried one more time, on the same enemies.
Minion received 186.01 and 177.15
Lt. received 176.8 and 159.59.
I also noticed that both chance to hit notices were displayed this time, calculated to be 95%. It also mentioned the two auto-hit notices. Anybody know what's going on?
Gaheris -
Quote:How do they get past the auto-rez to the hospital? If you stay faceplanted for longer than 60 or 90 sec (can't remember which) you end up in the recovery ward.Originally Posted by Leandro
People with two accounts farm PVP IOs for cash while AFK easily. Take a character with a self rez power; lock it on an Ouro TF mode with the no enhancements and debuff challenge sets to make it really weak. Take a Fire Controller/Dominator or MM. Park them both in Warburg (if both characters are the same faction) away from people's sight. Let the pets/henchmen kill the character with self rez, have the character have the self rez on auto. Sure, you have to wait until the self rez recharges, but the rep/drop timer is there to prevent drops even if you could rez any faster.
Gaheris -
Pretty much what Spiritfox said. My thoughts:
I've used both Thugs/Traps and Bots/Traps for farming and they're both a beatstick. Thugs tend to pack more damage because they've sacrificed any way of healing themselves, as well as any useful secondary effects from their attacks outside of -Def. Also? The stupid arsonist can GDIAF. He usually does anyway.
Bots however, tend to be slightly more survivable. They also have the advantage of making it easier to soft-cap your own defense which, when combined with your patron shield, opens up the obvious choice of using Provoke to keep the mobs close to you and off your pets. Being soft-capped will also make it easier to toe-bomb in the middle of a crowd. And bots don't look like Matrix rejects.
If you go /Traps, you'll get different viewpoints on how to slot it. Some say go full-out soft-cappnig on +Def so you can Tankermind with ease. I, OTOH, say go for about 37.5% and use 1 luck to take you to 50% so you can handle the alpha, then when most of the mob's dead you don't need to be soft-capped anymore. It's a little more work, but it'll free up your build for other slotting possibilities, such as using a billion damage procs (ok ok more like 10, but it'll *feel* like a billion when you see all the orange numbers). Most of the damage procs you can slot are pretty cheap as market prices go, although a couple are expensive.
Anyway, those are the first things that come to mind. Hope this helps a little bit.
Gaheris -
Ok, that's what I thought, thank you. However, I still need to know, how much +def, if any, does the Glad's Armor unique IO grant in PvE?
Has anybody ever slotted this proc and know with 100% certainty?
Gaheris -
Does the Gladiator's Armor +def unique IO give the same amount of def in PvE as it does in PvP? Also, the tp resistance...is it a 20% chance to resist every time someone attempts to teleport? you?
Gaheris -
Quote:Ok, say I swap in mace. What else, in your opinion, what would make it better?Originally Posted by _Nanu_
It depends for arena I would go with poison but for zone I would have to say thermal. For a epic pool, you can't go wrong with mace. Also you can have a much better build for alot cheaper.
Gaheris -
Quote:Oh...ok...is it because of Power Boost? The -jump/-fly elements of his web powers? Both? Something else?Originally Posted by black_barrier
at this point, i wouldn't roll any mastermind that's not /mace.
Gaheris -
Ok, still stubborn and wanting to keep to playing MMs in pvp, mostly because I just like playing them despite their weaknesses. What I'd like to know is what has more potential in pvp? I personally think /thermal...everybody seems to complain about thermal corrs, and it would allow me to heal my pets. /Poison's debuffs seem more wide ranging though, and more readily available.
Also: For my patron set, I'm looking at either Soul or Mu. Mu has higher base dmg for the attacks I'd be using, but it'd be more often resisted as well. Any thoughts?
This is what I came up with for my thermal MM
Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Level 50 Natural Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Thugs
Secondary Power Set: Thermal Radiation
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Mu Mastery
Villain Profile:
Level 1: Call Thugs -- HO:Nucle(A), HO:Nucle(7), BldM'dt-Dmg/EndRdx(7), BldM'dt-Acc/EndRdx(9)
Level 1: Warmth -- Panac-Heal/EndRedux(A), Panac-EndRdx/Rchg(3), Panac-Heal/Rchg(3), Panac-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(5), Panac-Heal(5)
Level 2: Fire Shield -- GA-End/Res(A), GA-Res/Rech/End(19), GA-RechEnd(19), GA-ResDam(21)
Level 4: Cauterize -- Panac-Heal/EndRedux(A), Panac-EndRdx/Rchg(21), Panac-Heal/Rchg(23), Panac-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(23), Panac-Heal(25)
Level 6: Equip Thugs -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(9)
Level 8: Combat Jumping -- Krma-ResKB(A), Ksmt-ToHit+(34), LkGmblr-Rchg+(36)
Level 10: Plasma Shield -- GA-ResDam(A), GA-Res/Rech/End(11), GA-End/Res(11), GA-RechEnd(17)
Level 12: Call Enforcer -- Achilles-DefDeb(A), HO:Nucle(13), HO:Cyto(13), S'bndAl-Dmg/Rchg(15), S'bndAl-Acc/Rchg(15), S'bndAl-Dmg/EndRdx(17)
Level 14: Super Jump -- Zephyr-Travel(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(34), Zephyr-ResKB(34)
Level 16: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 18: Health -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A)
Level 20: Assault -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 22: Tactics -- AdjTgt-ToHit(A), AdjTgt-ToHit/Rchg(25), AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx/Rchg(33), AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx(40), AdjTgt-EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 24: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-End%(37)
Level 26: Call Bruiser -- S'bndAl-Dmg(A), S'bndAl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(27), S'bndAl-Build%(27), BldM'dt-Acc/EndRdx(29), BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(29)
Level 28: Forge -- AdjTgt-ToHit(A), AdjTgt-ToHit/Rchg(31), AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx/Rchg(31), AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx(31), AdjTgt-Rchg(33)
Level 30: Flurry -- Hectmb-Dmg(A), Hectmb-Dmg/Rchg(40), Hectmb-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(43), Hectmb-Acc/Rchg(43), Hectmb-Dmg/EndRdx(46)
Level 32: Upgrade Equipment -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(33)
Level 35: Heat Exhaustion -- Acc-I(A), Acc-I(36), EndRdx-I(36), RechRdx-I(37), RechRdx-I(37)
Level 38: Melt Armor -- AnWeak-DefDeb(A), AnWeak-Acc/DefDeb(39), AnWeak-Acc/Rchg(39), AnWeak-DefDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(39), AnWeak-Acc/Rchg/EndRdx(40)
Level 41: Static Discharge -- Ragnrk-Dmg(A), Ragnrk-Dmg/Rchg(42), Ragnrk-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(42), Ragnrk-Acc/Rchg(42), Ragnrk-Dmg/EndRdx(43)
Level 44: Electrifying Fences -- GravAnch-Immob(A), GravAnch-Immob/Rchg(45), GravAnch-Acc/Immob/Rchg(45), GravAnch-Acc/Rchg(45), GravAnch-Immob/EndRdx(46)
Level 47: Electric Shackles -- Apoc-Dmg(A), Apoc-Dmg/Rchg(48), Apoc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), Apoc-Acc/Rchg(48), Apoc-Dmg/EndRdx(50)
Level 49: Charged Armor -- GA-ResDam(A), GA-Res/Rech/End(50), GA-End/Res(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Supremacy
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Gaheris -
I have a thugs/traps I enjoy some casual pvp with from time to time on Freedom. Was wondering how much KB protection I should aim for. I'll never hit the 41 pts (or whatever it is) to be immune to anything, most I can hit is about 19+Acrobatics. If I went down to say, 11+Acro, will that be enough, you think, to provide at least general KB protection, while still being vulnerable to power thrust / lift / etc.?
I figure since my pets are doing the majority of the fighting it won't be quite as important for me. Has anybody discovered it to be otherwise?
Gaheris -
Quote:Yeah, I knew a guy on infinity who was an absolute pro at petsay skits. I remember watching his thugs act out part of a Monty Python movie script. I never got the hang of it myself, and when I decided I should finally learn, I realized petsay was broken back in...issue 13? I don't quite remember, but it's been a while. I don't think you can see the chat bubbles above the pets anymore, except when you use the pre-programmed macros that all pets come with. You can still see the text in your pet chat channel, just no one will see the bubbles.Originally Posted by spiritfox
Now I just need to learn to make petsay skits.
Gaheris -
Quote:/inspexec_pet_name inspiration petnameOriginally Posted by spiritfox
I have a question for anyone to answer.
I've been looking up and down for a way to macro inspirations into my assault bot. I found insp_exec commands, but they only execute on my actual character, I can't find a single slash command that allows me to give inspirations to one of my pets.
/inspexec_pet_target inspiration
I got those from http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/List_of_Slash_Commands
Hope this helps.
Gaheris -
That was awesome to watch! I really like what you have going on there. The whole build idea along with the insane AoE damage your bots put out is impressive. I had a Thugs/Traps on infinity named Smokin' Ace. I've dumped about as much infamy into her as you have into yours...it's a shame, I don't think we ever got to team, that would've been a blast. I bounced her to Freedom so I can have fun in RV again.
I love to pvp though...and I'd really like one of these days to go toe-to-toe with yours in the arena if I ever get Ace back to Infinity. I'll look you up when I can, Infinity is my main server.
Gaheris -
Hi spiritfox, your post is too long to quote so I'll simply try to cover some of your points in this one. And thank you for taking the time to respond.
1. Ok well, the first thing I should say is that I strongly disagree with trying a "tankermind" out of anything other than a bots/XX because, no matter how much def you can get from sets, you'll get more from your bots giving you a shield. I had provoke on my thugs/traps for over a year, I finally tossed it and don't miss it. I think a bots/FF or something like it would tank much more reliably. If I need defense I'll pop some lucks.
2. Why does the Bruiser need to be six-slotted? The whole idea is to maximize output with the fewest amount of slots, isn't it? You can't beat Hamidon Origins in this particular case, and I was fortunate to get mine to be 52+. As far as the soulbound proc goes, it's only in there cuz I wanted 2 +HP bonuses from those sets, it's a playstyle preference mostly I suppose. I'll toss around the idea of getting the soulbound Proc over to him, though, but with the way he attacks it seems like a waste.
3. You mentioned that you felt too many procs takes away from the set, but really procs are what makes the /Traps set, aren't they? Slotting Poison Trap for anything other than procs and recharge is a real waste IMHO, the damage you're sacrificing to do so is considerable. 10 procs in 2 AoE auto-hit powers? Why would you pass that up?
4. I really do miss trip mine. Letting it go was just a playstyle preference, and because I really like to pvp. I'm too impatient to set them up before battle, and toe-bombiing when I'm plowing through +8 mobs becomes problematic even with max Defense. I miss seeker drones too, I dropped them for acrobatics as a pvp decision...if I find that I don't need it after all, I'll put one of these two powers back in.
5. Again, I hear the recommendation to only leave a single end rdx in my upgrade powers. I really don't like the idea but I'm willing to try it.
Anyways, thank you for your replies. I have a few things to think about that I didn't before, which was the whole point of the original post.
Gaheris -
Quote:Hmmm...well no you didn't offend me at all, I *did* ask for opinions. To cover some of the points you brought up:Originally Posted by Simak
Very very very expensive build which I'm afraid wouldn't perform well. I'm not that familiar with either thugs/traps that I could quickly make an example of another build. But here are some things that troubles me:
Your defence is low, only ~20% at every position. Yet you have even personal melee attack (in addition of 1-2 other attacks). Gang war has a terrible recharge. Enforcers have only 23% defence buff. Thug upgrades have unneeded extra slots that could have been used somewhere else etc etc.
I don't mean to offend you but you asked opinion. One thing I liked was slotting of Caltrops. But other than that, well it's expensive build.
1. Up until now, if I need more defense, I simply pop a luck. They'll never be a luck shortage so I figure I'll use them. Also the patron +resist shield further increases the usefulness of Bodyguard mode, so far I've been doing well with that. Still, I wouldn't mind more defense.
2. Gang War is in there simply to provide a place to put the pet IOs, I feel Gang War is rather useless for anything else against the type of enemies I plan to face. Any damage and they fall over. I went a little lax on def on my enforcers because between the pet IOs in gang war, the FFG, and their maneuvers, my pets are at 46% def to everything. Shots still get through occasionally, whiich was the reason for slotting the pet +res IOs as well.
3. I'll try your suggestion about one less IO in the upgrades. I don't like the idea from the outset, because during fights (especially in pvp) where I lose pets, bringing them out and back up to speed again, while still maintaining my output of traps, sucks a LOT of end. Still, I'll give it a shot. Thank you for your input.
Gaheris -
Ok the answer I got from Castle, after looking for an answer and not being able to find it, was that each 10% chance to resist is checked separately. So 5 bonuses means 5 independent 10% chances for 1000% resist. Castle didn't mention how often the check is made, however. Still wondering about that one.
Gaheris -
Ahh ok ty for that After looking at Mid's, my next question would then be, if I had 4 pvp sets that each gave 10% chance for 1000% repel resistance, do the bonuses stack? Would it be 40% chance for 4000% resistance? Or 4 seperate 10% chances? Also, how often is the check made? And if successful, how long does the resistance last?
Also: Is all this documented somwhere accruately where I can research it?
Gaheris