The problem with "best secondary" discussions is that they're purely subjective and we may not build or play the way you do.
I like Ninjitsu because it's got enough tools that I have an answer for almost everything, but that's if you're going to build for extra defense (to get as close to or over the soft cap as you can) and recharge (to bring back the extra tools more quickly). It manipulates the mob AI, has decent defense numbers to build on, and has a self-heal... but it can run into endurance issues, has a knockback hole in its protection that you have to plug, and other available sets are capable of being more sturdy from a raw numbers perspective.
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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Gotta agree with Siolfir.
My personal preference is to go with a defense set, since with low hit points it's better not to be hit then to die in 3 hits instead of 2... but you could take wilpower and IO-up to the softcap (especially with a primary that gives defense bonuses) and then you'll just giggle the Silly Super Reflexes set... until cimerorans hit you and take away your defenses while the Super Reflex guy laughs at you and charges his lightning rod 20% faster. Meanwhile the ice stalker ran to order a pizza because everyone around him is going SLOOOOWWWWW and... what was I talking about again?
You'd get a better answer if you told us what your primary was and how much influence you wanted to spend and if you had any other goals. (Rock the ITF? Solo Crates in the Lambda? AoE minion Blender? Pylon Challenge Record Breaker?)
OK I think I had too much coffee again...
EDIT: I just noticed you said "Street Justice"... that set really goes with everything. Dark Armor will probably give you crippling endurance issues until you IO up, but everything else would be fine. I've got a StJ/Nin up to 50 that was loads of fun. Um.. I took ninjitsu because it was the one armor set I hadn't played before and caltrops are funny! Caltrops can also kill things that get stuck in walls very.... very.... slow.....ly.
I'm hardly an expert on Stalkers since I'm leveling my first one now but that Staff/Nin plays very much like a Scrapper. I've been soft capped to all positions since the late 20's and I find it highly durable at everything I've run across so far.
Currently at 48 I've run all of the blueside TF's except the STF and haven't found anything it can't handle. Overall the durability is roughly comparable to my BS/Shield Scrapper and the burst damage is considerably better, as you'd expect from a Stalker.
COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
I'm definitely a fan of Bio Armor myself. Not quite as easy as some of the others to soft cap solo, but the flexibility to go all out when you don't need the extra survival is quite appealing.
I can't wait until it finally goes live.
Proud member of the Twilight Avengers
Shunya~DB/Electric Scrapper capable of 262 DPS pre Incarnate
Mindtrix~Ill/Cold Controller soloed Lusca pre Incarnate
Psyanara~Night Widow/Fortunata 300+ DPS w/ Reactive
I normaly recommend for a new stalker to try either ninjutsu or willpower..i would suggest staying away from regeneration or superior reflexes until you are comfortable doing the entire stalker game play.
The other sets work well.... but each has a specific trick to it....like for example electric armor is resistance based...so is dark armor...sure they help you not take as much damage....but you are not going to be in hide state and pulling off an assassin strike while in the middle of say a damage effect or continual attacks with them either very much...instead you wil be relying on the focus mechanic more...or on building up defense in other ways with invention enhancements.
To answer the question though....about which secondary is best...
The best secondary set and most fun anyone can have....is actualy when you know your armor very well...enough to know what to expect while you use it and its weakness.
So i guess you could say there is no best secondary....there is only what is your best preference....everyone has their favorites....but i dont think any of them make the stalker more then the player playing them.
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My Spines/Electrical should pick up Shadow Meld tomorrow. |
Originally Posted by PsychicKitty
The other sets work well.... but each has a specific trick to it....like for example electric armor is resistance based...so is dark armor...sure they help you not take as much damage....but you are not going to be in hide state and pulling off an assassin strike while in the middle of say a damage effect or continual attacks with them either very much...instead you wil be relying on the focus mechanic more...or on building up defense in other ways with invention enhancements.
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Obviously you can start every fight with Assassin Strike if you choose, but frankly I find BU, Throw Spines, Ripper to be a wonderful way to open and chew through crowds.
Under construction
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Like i said...I dont think there is truly a best secondary...there is only what is someone's best preference and everyone always has a favorite...because playing a stalker isnt just about the armor or powers...its about the player playing it.|
Originally Posted by Erratic
My Spines/Electrical should pick up Shadow Meld tomorrow.
Obviously you can start every fight with Assassin Strike if you choose, but frankly I find BU, Throw Spines, Ripper to be a wonderful way to open and chew through crowds. |
Though one thing...i have found over many years...is that sometimes...it can take alot of trial and error on making a character to find something that a player will end up sticking with....as one person might think some combination is the best in the world...and really say how great it is....but then another person might try it out and find it either too boring, too difficult, too lame or just simply not what they want to play.
My first stalker for example....was a Ninja Blade/Ninjutsu Stalker...I played until about level 30....then started getting bored...i just couldnt seam to get into playing that character...then i tried something new...i tried to play like a real ninja assassin....i tried to play where i killed the target and nothing else...tried to hide and sneak into the impossible mission and do the minimal on the missions...and i found by doing that it was actualy alot of fun....a challenge to get to the click items with out alerting or killing anything as sometimes some would be totaly surrounded.
I got that character to the maximum level at the time of 40...then got to 50 when the maximum level got raised.
But my point is....that there is no best secondary...it literally all boils down to preference and play style....with the best being the one that keeps you playing for a while.
How easy is it to soft cap defenses with Ninjitsu? Is base 17.3?
@Nova King
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Easy. Not as easy as Super Reflexes mind you, you have to put a little effort in, but you don't have to break the bank. Between Ninja Reflexes, Danger Sense, and Hide you'll be starting at just under 16% during combat. | How easy is it to soft cap defenses with Ninjitsu? Is base 17.3? |
What you get in return are some fun tools in the form Blinding Powder (meh), Caltrops (YES), and your heal. Ignore Smoke Bomb's existence. At the end of the day that heal is the real, practical reason you take Ninjitsu. Slotted up you get half your health back every 30 seconds which is an incredible backup to your high defense.
The only two drawbacks are the KB hole which is easily plugged by slotting 1-3 Zephyrs/Karmas, and relatively low DDR. DDR is the only one you have to watch out for from time to time - you only have 34.6, so cascade failure is a possibility when facing mass numbers of Cims, Longbow, etc. Still those situations are extremely rare and you can always just carry a few extra purples or spam caltrops.
The Grim Saint - Virtueverse [1323 Badges]
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By itself, Blinding Powder is okay - minion-level sleep and confuse with a 15 second long 7.5% AoE tohit debuff that helps bolster your defenses a bit, reduces perception radius, and doesn't generate aggro.|
Originally Posted by Grim Saint
What you get in return are some fun tools in the form Blinding Powder (meh), <snip>
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Throw in the Coercive Persuasion: Contagious Confusion proc, and you have a longer recharge Seeds of Confusion that also includes tohit and perception debuffs.
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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How does Ice compare? I would think it would be relatively near the top?
@Fail (Used to be @Tux) and @Tuxedo Infinitus Defiant/Freedom/Champion
Favourite Toons: Prosper [Ill/Rad] Controller :: Infinitus [Fire/Elec] Blaster :: Pocket Dynamo [Fire/Shield] Scr :: Fast [Cold/Sonic] Def ::
Inspire [Plant/Storm] Controller :: Quality - SS/Fire Brute :: Double Down [DP/Kin] Corr :: Pwnz [Fire/Cold] Corr :: Fail [Fire/Son] Corr
Ice is another one of the top performers, yes. I think Bio will be also, although I haven't played it nearly enough on a Stalker to claim any personal experience with it (I got bored soloing at level 10).
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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before the changes I couldnt get a stalker above lvl 20, now I have a StJ/DA stalker that is probably the funnest toon I have. Im also working on a DB/Energy Aura one, but Im not enjoying it as much
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This is all true, and at the very least Blinding Powder can serve as a mule for a cheap purple set. |
Originally Posted by Siolfir
By itself, Blinding Powder is okay - minion-level sleep and confuse with a 15 second long 7.5% AoE tohit debuff that helps bolster your defenses a bit, reduces perception radius, and doesn't generate aggro.
Throw in the Coercive Persuasion: Contagious Confusion proc, and you have a longer recharge Seeds of Confusion that also includes tohit and perception debuffs. |
The best thing it has going for it is it's ability not to generate aggro, so you can toss it on a mob to soften them up a bit before pouncing out of hide. Still, as your power level increases you'll find yourself rarely using it since that tohit debuff won't mean squat against your softcapped defenses and the confuse will quickly mean nothing when you drop an AOE.
So not useless, but certainly deserving of "meh" in my book.
The Grim Saint - Virtueverse [1323 Badges]
I've always liked Energy Aura believe it or not. I dont have any experience with the stalker version however. How does it stack up compared to Ninjitsu and Ice Armor?
@Nova King
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It does well - especially with the recent hp cap increase allowing Overload to be more than just extra defense debuff resistance (although I still haven't bothered to respec into it on my KM/EA) and EA's ability to completely mitigate Overload's crash just by timing Energy Drain correctly. I haven't taken the stun aura, nor have I really needed to.|
Originally Posted by PurpleHippo
I've always liked Energy Aura believe it or not. I dont have any experience with the stalker version however. How does it stack up compared to Ninjitsu and Ice Armor?
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Numerically compared to the other sets, Ice is probably a little sturdier because of Icy Bastion throwing a lot of resistance behind the defenses you get but Energy Aura is easier to softcap (at least, to everything except Psi damage) than Ninjitsu because of the stacking defense buffs in Energy Drain. Just because it's prettier (IMO) than Ice Armor, I end up using it when I'm not using Ninjitsu.
Compared to Energy Aura from a Scrapper or Brute, you lose a little of the top end for +recharge but have 20% consistently (even with nobody around you) and don't have the taunt aura built in, the resistances are rolled into one power and slightly lower, and Energy Cloak's defenses are rolled into higher base defense numbers in the other toggles and Hide. Unlike Energy Cloak, Hide suppresses, so you'll generate more adds from an EA Stalker than you will with a Brute or Scrapper, but otherwise it plays about the same.
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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Agreed. My first stalker is/was an Electric/Ninjitsu who was perfectly fun to play up into the mid-30s but kinda lost steam from there for me. It plays differently from my newer Spines/Electrical and the play difference is what has hooked me on the newer character.
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Originally Posted by PsychicKitty
Though one thing...i have found over many years...is that sometimes...it can take alot of trial and error on making a character to find something that a player will end up sticking with....as one person might think some combination is the best in the world...and really say how great it is....but then another person might try it out and find it either too boring, too difficult, too lame or just simply not what they want to play.
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Under construction
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Not too hard, and with some investment the Incarnate soft cap is reachable as well. I'm about 1% off that with my /Nin build.
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Originally Posted by PurpleHippo
How easy is it to soft cap defenses with Ninjitsu? Is base 17.3?
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Like others have mentioned there's no real standout secondary because it's highly dependent upon the player. Some like resist others prefer defense it's really boils down to what your play style is .
I'm a 6 year veteran but ive NEVER played, perhaps not even created a stalker. My knowledge of them is pretty limited. Lately I've been reading up on the stalker threads and it finally inspired to create one. The only problem is that I'm a little lost.
So I ask you stalker gurus, what is the best stalker secondary? I've heard good things about Ninjitsu. My primary is most likely going to be Street Justice. I dont know if that has any impact on synergy or anything.
Also, please explain your reasoning why whatever secondary you think is the best, is the best.
Thanks
@Nova King