To try and give some simple answers/responses...
You, and others, have made a false distinction. There is no dependency on new tech in order to charge for new powersets. They've never said that was the reason for something to be paid-for or free.
It is just something that's been pointed to by the community, due to the extra work, time and resources required, but nothing has ever been said about explicitly attaching new tech to additional pay.
It just stands to reason that things requiring more time and resources to create are more likely to be used to get more money back.
The simple answer to the question is because they are using more income to fuel more additions to the game.
The why this or that is down mainly to marketing decisions. The reasons are somewhat clear if you look at it objectively... and I'm not talking down about it, but the ones we've gotten for free aren't as popular and/or as enticing as the ones they've sold. That's business.
The snarky answer is a patronizing sit-down about the real world and how everything costs money... 
Also, there was no talk about "2 free powersets a year".
Also, Mr. Snuffleupagus was real.
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
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Excellent point and suggestion!|
Originally Posted by Steele_Magnolia
Explain to them that as VIP they will get points each month. Those points can be used to buy the sets without spending any money.
They may not realize that if they've only just subscribed. |
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Originally Posted by Spatch
I'm pretty certain powersets have been 800 pts since Freedom's launch. I could be wrong, but that's my recollection.
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Early Beta prices may have been higher, but they were never on sale at a higher price than 800.
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
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Matt Miller interview with Ten Ton Hammer:|
Originally Posted by Electric-Knight
There is no dependency on new tech in order to charge for new powersets. They've never said that was the reason for something to be paid-for or free. It is just something that's been pointed to by the community, due to the extra work, time and resources required, but nothing has ever been said about explicitly attaching new tech to additional pay.
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Ten Ton Hammer: Moving on to the power sets then, some of those will be available for all players, but some will be unlocked through subscription or direct purchase only. How did you decide which of the power sets made the most sense to include on either side of that split?
Positron: It really is a matter of how much time and money we put into the set. Like the ones where we kind of went a little bit overboard on, in terms of animations and effects and tech to make the set work at all, those are going to be the premium sets that everyone is going to need to buy.
But things like Time Manipulation that we had the tech for, and we didn’t need new tech, and the effects weren’t crazy, the animations weren’t crazy, but the end result is awesome. You’ll be able to manipulate time on your enemies and friends – so those are going to be for VIP players, but a free player can purchase those as well.
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Defiant @Grouchybeast
Death is part of my attack chain.
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Thanks! I knew I felt too sure about that. I freely admit I was wrong to say it's never been stated! |
Originally Posted by Grouchybeast
Matt Miller interview with Ten Ton Hammer:
Ten Ton Hammer: Moving on to the power sets then, some of those will be available for all players, but some will be unlocked through subscription or direct purchase only. How did you decide which of the power sets made the most sense to include on either side of that split? Positron: It really is a matter of how much time and money we put into the set. Like the ones where we kind of went a little bit overboard on, in terms of animations and effects and tech to make the set work at all, those are going to be the premium sets that everyone is going to need to buy. But things like Time Manipulation that we had the tech for, and we didnt need new tech, and the effects werent crazy, the animations werent crazy, but the end result is awesome. Youll be able to manipulate time on your enemies and friends so those are going to be for VIP players, but a free player can purchase those as well. |
There is a vague qualifier for what they would deem extra/overboard work, but citing Time Manipulation as an effort that'd be for VIPs is interesting.
Not that I expect them to be held by this standard, but it is indeed out there and has been said!
One could say that the animations for Staff are the "overboard" qualifier, along with the Staff Mastery options (not really the same as DP or any of the other combos).
I stand somewhat corrected!
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
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Originally Posted by Grouchybeast
Positron: It really is a matter of how much time and money we put into the set.
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The problem here is that "it really is a matter of how much time and money," something we have no visibility into. What's too much for free? I really can't tell by looking at a power or animation how much time was spent creating (or refining, or debugging) it. Nor can I tell which ones require new "tech" (is that shorthand for "software engineering?").
I understand, I think, the desire by players to quantify how a thing should cost, but really we're just making guesses, and usually pretty wild guesses at that.
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Originally Posted by Electric-Knight
One could say that the animations for Staff are the "overboard" qualifier, along with the Staff Mastery options (not really the same as DP or any of the other combos).
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My 2 inf.
I wonder how many scientologists will mistakenly stumble across this article and all its mentions of new "tech"..lol
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I'm sure this is part of it. Staff is an entirely new weapon type, which means it needs new walk/run/fly/swim/ninja run/etc animations while it's drawn. Some of those can be modified from existing ones, but others I bet they had to make whole new animations for. Not to mention the labor of hooking up new modes, and testing all the edge cases to make sure they don't conflict with anything else in the animation system.|
Originally Posted by gameboy1234
I don't think it's just that the animations for the powers themselves are difficult, but I think interfacing a two-handed rig into all the other animations in game (walk, run, ninja run, fly, probably a bunch more). I think the main issue is there there is often a lot of behind the scenes work to get something out, which doesn't affect it directly but still has to be present. Otherwise it's just not going to work, or it'll be half-arsed in some way.
My 2 inf. |
Also, there's the matter of scheduling. Without selling them in the market, say they only have the resources to make two powersets a year. So how do the decide which two? Part of it is low hanging fruit, like Posi mentioned. Part of it is how many players want it. But I'm sure another big part of it is balance. If they can make a new set for an AT that really needs it, or yet another melee weapon set when there are already more of them than anything else, which do they choose?
So assume they're still using the same logic they always have in order to pick the Free for VIP powersets, and then also making others that are much requested and they think will sell well enough to justify the cost.
Re: new tech, doesn't Staff Fighting utilize motion blur in its animations, which has previously been unseen? I recall when the infamous video was leaked, someone "debunked" it as a fake (lol) because of motion blur.
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
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I remember that. And I remember also lol'ing because I was able to verify through certain means that the set did indeed exist. Heck, Sands of Mu has motion blur. But I'm pretty sure the blur is drawn-in animation.
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Originally Posted by DarkGob
Re: new tech, doesn't Staff Fighting utilize motion blur in its animations, which has previously been unseen? I recall when the infamous video was leaked, someone "debunked" it as a fake (lol) because of motion blur.
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Speeding Through New DA Repeatables || Spreadsheet o' Enhancements || Zombie Skins: better skins for these forums || Guide to Guides
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I guess this slipped past me as well. I'm not saying that's difficult now a days, but still.
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Originally Posted by VoodooGirl
I don't necessarily remember the "2 free a year" statement. I'm only asking this since I was getting grilled by a new VIP player who didn't understand why it wasn't free. I tried to explain as best as I could why it wasn't free for VIPs, but I was curious myself as to why it wasn't.
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Maybe not, but one would generally assume that something as basic as a set would be unlocked for those who "front" the sub and summarily locked for the time comes to unsub. Perhaps the afore mentioned "2 sets per year" became easily forgotten by many/most when we've received so many since Freedom without cost. Granted, I do need to mention that I may have simply purchased something and forgotten that as well. >.<
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Originally Posted by Texas Justice
You are getting the contents you pay for.
We've had powersets introduced in the past that only came with a purchase (Dual Pistols, Kinetic Melee, Demon Summoning, and Electric Control required purchasing the GR expansion). There are free for VIP powersets that have been released since Freedom launched and there are paid powersets that have been released since Freedom launched. Nothing has ever been stated that all powersets that are ever released will be included as part of the subscription. |
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So which one do you save up for first? What if you don't know about something because your a freem/preem and don't have access to things like Beta server/forums? Nice concept, but unless the devs put out a calendar of "things to come" market wise, then it'll always be beyond annoying to those of limited means.
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Originally Posted by gameboy1234
So if you are clever, you save those points and always have about 800 points (only two months worth) on hand, so you can just buy any new power sets with your free points.
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You are getting the content you pay for. The paragon points you get covers all power set additions. What the paragon points dont cover is costume items, and the extra like xp boosters, more trays, costume slots.|
Originally Posted by Gilliam_EU
Really i can't be bother with all this. Im paying for the game allready and i dont have the Points to buy this or half the other stuff i want from the market. !! i Flatly refuse to pay any more real money for points. Give me the contents i pay for !! thats what i say !!
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The things that were pay for items to begin with.
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
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Then arent you having to pay for everything anyways if you're Premium?
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Originally Posted by WanderingAries
So which one do you save up for first? What if you don't know about something because your a freem/preem and don't have access to things like Beta server/forums? Nice concept, but unless the devs put out a calendar of "things to come" market wise, then it'll always be beyond annoying to those of limited means.
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BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
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Why would you have to? It's going to be paid for or free one way or the other. He could of just said that instead of "time and money and tech" and said "we'll pick and choose" wouldn't have made it any different.
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Originally Posted by gameboy1234
The problem here is that "it really is a matter of how much time and money," something we have no visibility into. What's too much for free? I really can't tell by looking at a power or animation how much time was spent creating (or refining, or debugging) it. Nor can I tell which ones require new "tech" (is that shorthand for "software engineering?").
I understand, I think, the desire by players to quantify how a thing should cost, but really we're just making guesses, and usually pretty wild guesses at that. I don't think it's just that the animations for the powers themselves are difficult, but I think interfacing a two-handed rig into all the other animations in game (walk, run, ninja run, fly, probably a bunch more). I think the main issue is there there is often a lot of behind the scenes work to get something out, which doesn't affect it directly but still has to be present. Otherwise it's just not going to work, or it'll be half-arsed in some way. My 2 inf. |
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
Power sets that come with issues will be free-for-VIP, and power sets that are released between issues will be paid-for-all.
Paragon Wiki: http://www.paragonwiki.com
City Info Terminal: http://cit.cohtitan.com
Mids Hero Designer: http://www.cohplanner.com
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Originally Posted by Dispari
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.
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Originally Posted by WanderingAries
So which one do you save up for first? What if you don't know about something because your a freem/preem and don't have access to things like Beta server/forums? Nice concept, but unless the devs put out a calendar of "things to come" market wise, then it'll always be beyond annoying to those of limited means.
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If you are Free/Preem then the whole "Free Points" concept doesn't apply, right? So your idea that "they wouldn't know" in no way affects my argument. They don't have any free points to save, period. This whole argument is over "why aren't things free for VIP?" Not "why aren't things free for Free/Preem." You've sort of missed the whole point with that comment.
So, which do you save for first? It's your choice. You control how you spend points, and you get to decide which you get first, second and third.
All VIP have access to the beta and test servers, and to the beta forums. If they just weren't looking... so they save points for two months, then buy it. No big deal.
You always get more free points, so if you do miss something, or there's more than you can afford released in a short time frame, you just save up for a while. It's not hard, either as a concept or to actually do.
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Originally Posted by BrandX
Why would you have to? It's going to be paid for or free one way or the other. He could of just said that instead of "time and money and tech" and said "we'll pick and choose" wouldn't have made it any different.
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Why would I have to what? Sorry, didn't understand that comment.
If you're talking about players second guessing developers' time and costs, yeah I'm saying it's not possible. That was the point.
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Beam rifle was released with the launch of I21. Beam Rifle was a paid-for-all powerset.|
Originally Posted by Aggelakis
Power sets that come with issues will be free-for-VIP, and power sets that are released between issues will be paid-for-all.
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Obligatory ParagonWiki link.
If the game spit out 20 dollar bills people would complain that they weren't sequentially numbered. If they were sequentially numbered people would complain that they weren't random enough.
Black Pebble is my new hero.
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That's what I mean, if you're VIP, then getting Sets shouldn't be an issue. Preem/Freem is a different story because they're not paying the light bill.
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Originally Posted by BrandX
Then arent you having to pay for everything anyways if you're Premium?
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Beam Rifle was never announced as part of Issue 21.|
Originally Posted by Texas Justice
Beam rifle was released with the launch of I21. Beam Rifle was a paid-for-all powerset.
Obligatory ParagonWiki link. |
Power sets that come as part of an Issue are free-to-VIP, like I said.
Paragon Wiki: http://www.paragonwiki.com
City Info Terminal: http://cit.cohtitan.com
Mids Hero Designer: http://www.cohplanner.com
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Originally Posted by Dispari
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.
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<.<
>.>
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
edit: why is it showing "PERC Representative" under my sig now? Very odd.
Q. Just wondering Posi, where are the new dance emotes we were told would come with GR?
A. Positron: Whoops, my bad.
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