Should I play Chapter Six?
By
Aura_Familia,
Posted on: 2012-03-21 24:51 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Hrm... I'd say run it just for curiosity's sake, because it won't kill you (Aeon hasn't figured out how to do that yet).
I'd say that seeing Penelope in action might be a reason to run it, but you may not like the new Penelope, so that might be another strike against it.
While a lot of the negative criticisms about this chapter are true... It's also not that bad. If the ending is actually not quite fully revealed yet, perhaps the ending is not quite as bad as we suspect (still a dumb plan that ends up being tedious - and poorly executed - and ending in personal drama you couldn't prevent, but... that sounds a lot like life when I let others run the show too).
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
I liked the cutscene.
Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
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Well, 7 should drop next week. Wait til then and play them back to back.
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Originally Posted by SlickRiptide
Despite having re-upped my sub for a couple of weeks, I have not yet played Chapter Six. Given yet another chapter of despair, loss, and failure for the Heroes, I find myself mustering very little desire to play through it.
I'm really struggling to see how this story is going to have any kind of uplifting ending for Blue. Given that I already know how it turns out, and I don't care particularly about the alignment merit reward, is there any reason to bother with it? Is there something in the mission that makes it worth running aside from the story? |
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For the record, I did too. Although, I wasn't in the best frame of minds while watching it due to the slogging back and forth through Oranbega for what I thought was a bad plan. Remove that aspect from it and take the ending on its own and I liked it (overly dramatic comicbook scenario accepted and enjoyed for what it is). I thought the cutscene was done very well and that is something me gusta.
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Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
I liked the cutscene.
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@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
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Are half-month VIP subs now available? |
Originally Posted by SlickRiptide
Despite having re-upped my sub for a couple of weeks
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Hey, for all of the overstating that gets done on these forums, it's a refreshing change!
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Are half-month VIP subs now available?
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@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
Considering it's little more than a demo for Penny Yin with "er, wha?" story progression shoehorned into the final mission.
Maybe? I dunno.
It just seems like they wanted to show off Penny, and then realized at the last moment that it's part 6 of a 7 part that has nothing to do with her.
As for Penny in action, my villain flattened her without too much fuss, and my hero dearly wished for the same opportunity. 
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Go Vigilante and you can. Kicked her *** right after working with her |
Originally Posted by Wynele
Considering it's little more than a demo for Penny Yin with "er, wha?" story progression shoehorned into the final mission.
Maybe? I dunno. It just seems like they wanted to show off Penny, and then realized at the last moment that it's part 6 of a 7 part that has nothing to do with her. As for Penny in action, my villain flattened her without too much fuss, and my hero dearly wished for the same opportunity. |
Tyger (50), Mutation-Controller Mind/FF - oldest Mind/FF on Union
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Originally Posted by Dispari
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.
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I saw of it more as like the episode where they introduced Cousin Oliver on The Brady Bunch.|
Originally Posted by Wynele
Considering it's little more than a demo for Penny Yin with "er, wha?" story progression shoehorned into the final mission.
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Only, in this case, I didn't dislike Cousin Oliver. More, "Neat powerset." and "Oh my, that's a nice glowy yellow ball you have there."
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<collapses in epileptic fit>
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Originally Posted by ThePill
"Oh my, that's a nice glowy yellow ball you have there."
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I thought about this comment and others like it, and I'm struck with something of a realisation. And mind you, I don't have a problem with anyone liking the cutscene. Let me explain:|
Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
I liked the cutscene.
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I'm sure the cutscenes are good. Great even... Maybe. But the thing is, we're not playing Final Fantasy or Heart of Darkness, i.e. we're not watching an interactive movie with gameplay elements serving only to bring us from one cutscene to the next. People come here to play a game, and the problem with the SSAs (and Graves and Twinshot, etc.) are that they're trying to tell a complex, multi-faceted story that's not just about combat... In a game that's just about combat. The result of this is a story which is taking place on its own, as if in another realm devoted to its own narrative, and that we're only ever allowed in when there's stuff to kill.
However, "when there's stuff to kill" is usually the filler in the story as it is presented, with the actual narrative taking place through exposition and cutscenes, with the player constantly on the outside looking in. Statesman dies? Cutscene. Psyche dies? Cutscene. Alexis dies? Cutscene. The person I WAS JUST WITH dies? Cutscene. I'm only ever allowed in to play in places where it really doesn't matter what I do. And, yes, I realise that's a limitation of the system, but putting it out on display is not a good way to handle it. I KNOW I can't affect the story, but creating a story that ostensibly doesn't need me in it except when stuff needs to be killed just rubs that in my face.
If in movies you should "show, not tell" and in games you should "do, not show," then the SSAs just don't succeed in either. Most of the narrative is delivered through briefing exposition and what's not in there is delivered through cutscenes. Even the much-maligned Launch content handles this better, as much of the story is comprised of what I need to do, with the narrative coming down to what I meet in the mission, all ending with a larger frame of explanation giving context to the events. But crucially, very rarely are there events in Launch story arcs that move the story which I wasn't somehow involved in. If there's someone who needs to be questioned, I do the questioning. If there's a plan that needs to be stopped, I do the stopping.
In general, "cutscene-itis" is something that has become epidemic in modern gaming. That's essentially a game driven by its cutscenes with everything else (i.e. gameplay) only serving as padding that doesn't really correspond to how the actual narrative presents things. Why, for instance, couldn't I use a Phoenix Down on Aeris? Why couldn't I resurrect the Statesman?
These are games where I simply don't fear the gameplay. If I'm in control of my character, I won't die, because I won't let myself get killed. If I have control of my character, I won't let my allies die because I'll do something about it, or else reload and try again. If I have control of my character, I'm confident that I can take anything the game has to offer. It's when the game takes control of my character and stuffs him in a cutscene when people die and I fail miserably. When a game takes control away for the express purpose of making me fail is when I have a problem, and that is the only thing I fear the most. I know that every ally I have who is subject to my in-game actions will live, but when Katie does something story-related that's out of my hands as a player, THEN I know bad things are going to happen. It's to the point where I've grown to utterly dread cutscenes, because then something bad is guaranteed to happen.
To be honest, I'm just tired of watching cutscenes of signature character having a wangsty story that I'm not invited into unless there's grunt work to do. That's not a good way to present a story, and it's at the root my growing discontent with contemporary writing. It's not so much that I keep failing, and miserably, so much as I keep failing because the game fails me inside a cutscene where I can't do anything about it.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
These are games where I simply don't fear the gameplay. If I'm in control of my character, I won't die, because I won't let myself get killed. If I have control of my character, I won't let my allies die because I'll do something about it, or else reload and try again. If I have control of my character, I'm confident that I can take anything the game has to offer. It's when the game takes control of my character and stuffs him in a cutscene when people die and I fail miserably.
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It's not just cutscenes. I had control of my character in WWD#2 but I could not (cardiac) arrest Wade, a known Rularuu nut and someone Monty didn't want in the club. I wanted to in my first run through when it was first released. It is why I only run #2 once per character. It is the point of ultimate personal herofail. I'll put up with the ambushes of #1 for my merit runs.
Even if the character doesn't know Wade's background Monty does. Although keeping the Midnighters Rulu-shin free doesn't let *them* beat Wade down, they still just stand around like he's not standing right in the middle of them and your character is never told(or allowed) to take *all* intruders down.
If you think you won't like something, don't do it. This is a game, not trying the green eggs and ham. No one will think less of you, and if you don't care about the rewards, the story, or the gameplay, there is nothing for you to miss.
Of all the things that irritate me about complaints, the one that irritates me the most is that people seem to enjoy putting themselves in situations where they're driven to do it.
"Bombarding the CoH/V fora with verbosity since January, 2006"
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Honestly, I've played several parts of "Who Will Die?" multiple times, but I'm not running through Chapter Six (hero-side) ever again on my main, quite possibly on any character.
My problem with it is basically that everyone involved got handed the Idiot Ball, and we're supposed to act like this is good writing. Why of course no mystical characters would scout the location once we know where it is, because obviously, no one has teleportation or super-speed. No science-y characters could scan the area either, determining that MAAAAAYBE Darrin Wade is trying to pull another trick here.
And amazingly, the medical transporters don't work for Sister Psyche, although if you get dropped during the mission.....
Frankly, unless Darrin gets his head handed to him by someone in Chapter 7 (preferably the character running the mission, but I would not be averse to a "Lord Recluse is VERY upset with you..."), I'm going to be a bit irked. I'm not of the opinion that the heroes should always win, but when two signature characters hero-side are dead, and villain-side it's pretty much business as usual... (You know, with all the backstabbing.)
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We ARE paying for the SSAs, though. It's one of the relatively few new additions that's part of the VIP subscription package. Whether we buy those arcs directly (and Lord knows why anyone would accept being so overcharged for them) or get them as part of the $15 we pay each month, they're still a for-sale perk that ought to be held to a higher standard than regular content.|
Originally Posted by Olantern
Of all the things that irritate me about complaints, the one that irritates me the most is that people seem to enjoy putting themselves in situations where they're driven to do it.
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For reference, Unai Kemen's "Your princess is in another Castle" story arc is terrible, and whenever I make the mistake of running it to remind myself, I will complain about it. But I didn't pay extra for it. It wasn't advertised to me as one of the perks of subscribing. Now more than ever, it's just a thing that exists that I don't have to mess with.
The SSAs are different. Whether I play them or not, my subscription is funding them and my subscription includes them. I may not like them, I may even highly suspect I won't like them, but I feel compelled to at least try them at least once. Not least of all because MAJOR PLOT DEVELOPMENTS THAT INFLUENCE THE GAME WORLD happen in them, and if I don't at least know the plot, I'm missing out on important events.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I got too used to a galaxy far far away's cutscene quality for me to really be stunned by CoH's head bobbling. The story seems to be spiraling downward after Statesman's death. It sort of reminds me of a certain character death in Death Note that sort of made the series boring and predictable.
http://www.virtueverse.net/wiki/Shadow_Mokadara
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Originally Posted by Olantern
Of all the things that irritate me about complaints, the one that irritates me the most is that people seem to enjoy putting themselves in situations where they're driven to do it.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
We ARE paying for the SSAs, though. It's one of the relatively few new additions that's part of the VIP subscription package. Whether we buy those arcs directly (and Lord knows why anyone would accept being so overcharged for them) or get them as part of the $15 we pay each month, they're still a for-sale perk that ought to be held to a higher standard than regular content.
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Even if we choose to never play them, we are paying for them, either via the fee to access or because that part of our VIP stipend is producing these extremely lame SSA episodes instead of something enjoyable.
I hope the next arc is worthwhile. Laying aside whatever technical merit some of the cutscenes may have had, this arc has been terrible.
"How do you know you are on the side of good?" a Paragon citizen asked him. "How can we even know what is 'good'?"
"The Most High has spoken, even with His own blood," Melancton replied. "Surely we know."
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Not defending the writers, but I feel like "Who Will Die?" was just meant to be something to catch our attention so we may actually look forward to the next one. |
Originally Posted by Melancton
Hear, hear. *applause*
Even if we choose to never play them, we are paying for them, either via the fee to access or because that part of our VIP stipend is producing these extremely lame SSA episodes instead of something enjoyable. I hope the next arc is worthwhile. Laying aside whatever technical merit some of the cutscenes may have had, this arc has been terrible. |
I just want the maps for AE >_>;
http://www.virtueverse.net/wiki/Shadow_Mokadara
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People keep saying "we should have cut scenes in MA!" and I keep saying "no, we shouldn't" and they say "why not?!?!?" and I say "because you would use them".
| I'm sure the cutscenes are good. Great even... Maybe. But the thing is, we're not playing Final Fantasy or Heart of Darkness, i.e. we're not watching an interactive movie with gameplay elements serving only to bring us from one cutscene to the next. |
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The only reason to play chapter six is to laugh at just how freaking bad it is. IMO, it's the worst story arc to be released in -ages- and is something I'd use as an example for others.
"You see what they did there? Don't ever, ever, do that."
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I LOL'd cause I can already see the hair-pulling overuse that folks who make AE stories would put cut scenes to. WHEN we get a skip button for general cutscenes then sure. UNTIL then not just no, but hell no to cut scenes in the AE.|
Originally Posted by Venture
People keep saying "we should have cut scenes in MA!" and I keep saying "no, we shouldn't" and they say "why not?!?!?" and I say "because you would use them".
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Back to your regularly scheduled thread.
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SlickRiptide, If I were you I'd wait for chapter 7 - you might simply decide to skip Aeon's signature story arcs altogether if you're not into depressing stuff.
Paragon Studios should be glad there isn't much rage against all these bad endings heroes keep getting. Bioware is facing a riot over the way Mass Effect 3 ended, and from the looks of it they had to give in and were forced to create free "good ending" DLCs to appease their rapidly declining fan-base.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M0Cf864P7E
IMO, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realise that people only think they want bad things to happen to popular characters, especially things that can't be fixed. I know I'd much rather see a protagonist blow up the Deathstar and get a medal from a princess than have him tricked into murdering little children, then sliced in half by his former mentor and dropped into a pit of lava as the credits roll in...
Just saying...
I want the maps not the cutscene feature.
Gawsh y'all.
http://www.virtueverse.net/wiki/Shadow_Mokadara
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The problem with this kind of sensationalist headline-grabbing is that what we got is pretty much exactly what it usually leads to - stories built around shock value expressly because they lack any other means of affecting their audience. We're supposed to care about these stories because they involve famous people and some of them die, not because of any artistic or gameplay merit they bring. And for something that's supposed to be just a headline grab, we've already murdered three people, so the question of "who will die" seems not just relevant, but crucial. These aren't arcs concerned with telling stories, they're arcs concerned with killing signature characters because we're supposed to react to that.|
Originally Posted by ShadowMoka
Not defending the writers, but I feel like "Who Will Die?" was just meant to be something to catch our attention so we may actually look forward to the next one.
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And my reaction, personally, has been disgust. I hope whoever came up with that damn depressing storyline gets dragged away from the writing table and is never allowed to write for City of Heroes again. Give them a job making maps or writing encounter scripts or designing NPC powers or something. Just stop putting the fate of what's left of our fictional world in their hands, because the systematic dismantling of everything that made City of Heroes interesting and unique is becoming physically terrifying to me.
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Originally Posted by Zemblanity
Paragon Studios should be glad there isn't much rage against all these bad endings heroes keep getting. Bioware is facing a riot over the way Mass Effect 3 ended, and from the looks of it they had to give in and were forced to create free "good ending" DLCs to appease their rapidly declining fan-base.
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There may have been a time when City of Heroes players might have had the same passion about the game's story, but not any more. These days, even those that used to praise the game's unique setting and storylines all too often advise people to pick missions with badges or temp powers in them, as opposed to those that tell a good story. Speaking purely for myself, the original spirit of the game has been defiled to such an extent I just find it increasingly hard to get invested in anything. Even in the old stuff I used to like. The whole tone and direction has gone right off the deep end and I find myself subscribing to a game I never actually asked for. I didn't ask for a "kill everybody" story arc to the best of my knowledge.
And apparently, we're back to Jack Emmert's vision of what the game should be, as expressed by a concentrated effort to destroy everything that came before and replace it with the pet project of whoever is doing this. And Matt Miller is all too happy to let it go because what kind of boss would he be if his game had any integrity, consistency or history? Forget that, old stuff is old. It's not like the old stuff is what made the game popular.
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Originally Posted by Zemblanity
IMO, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realise that people only think they want bad things to happen to popular characters, especially things that can't be fixed. I know I'd much rather see a protagonist blow up the Deathstar and get a medal from a princess than have him tricked into murdering little children, then sliced in half by his former mentor and dropped into a pit of lava as the credits roll in...
Just saying... |
Seriously, if ******* Silent Hill could include a rainbows and unicorns happy ending, why can't WE have one?
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Despite having re-upped my sub for a couple of weeks, I have not yet played Chapter Six. Given yet another chapter of despair, loss, and failure for the Heroes, I find myself mustering very little desire to play through it.
I'm really struggling to see how this story is going to have any kind of uplifting ending for Blue.
Given that I already know how it turns out, and I don't care particularly about the alignment merit reward, is there any reason to bother with it? Is there something in the mission that makes it worth running aside from the story?