Suggestion: Buffs for Blasters!

Likewise when I state that something like this is "annoying" or "not worth it" I don't personally have to come up with hard numbers to support my position when I know there are other people out there like Arcanaville who are far more willing and knowledgeable about that sort of thing. It's not just me alone blindly begging the Devs to consider something that's semi-intangible or unprovable.

Sometimes a given person just has to state the bleeding obvious and then defer to others that the bleeding obvious ALSO has real numbers to back it up.

Comments added inside quote.

edit: wow that red hurts my eyes, sorry, but too lazy to edit!

Annoying and not worth it are not reasons the devs use to change powers, which will not change based on spin doctoring.

Wow, I'm having flashbacks to exactly this same argument two pages ago.

First, those ARE reasons they use to change powers. They have done so a number of times. Asserting otherwise (again) doesn't make you not (still) wrong.

Second, as Lothic says in the very post you quoted, there are very strong justifications for changes, even totally aside from how players feel about the powers or the AT. Individual posters don't all have to prove their own points with ironclad logic and undisputable math; a few people with math and lots of people with gut reactions that match the math is entirely acceptable.

I have never seen any red letter use "annoying or not worth" it as reasons for changes when explaining them if you have kindly point me to the post and I will gladly accept that as fact.

I said nothing more than they don't use "annoying and not worth it" so adding that additional stuff in that I did not say is the place where you get into those self arguments. Nobody said anything about math or gut reactions, it is directly about the devs using "annoying and not worth it" as their measure for changing powers period.

Off the top of my head, why was the original Unyielding Stance changed to not root you? Because it was ANNOYING. Players just took Teleport and mostly got around the limitation of not moving, so it didn't restrict them much, but was still really annoying.

The Rage crash went through several iterations. IIRC, it was first a high-but-not-quite-high-enough-to-penetrate-mez-protection stun, which was potentially dangerous to use while tanking, because another stun landing would mez you, and at the time that meant all your toggles turning off, not merely suppressing. Death quickly followed. This made the power often not worth using. The stun was later changed to an Only Affecting Self, which also made it not worth using, because a tanker can't tank if he can't attack or taunt (and brutes didn't even exist yet, then). Eventually we arrived at the damage debuff we have today, which is a major downside (and annoying, to some), but not so cripplingly bad it makes the whole power not worth using.

So there you go, two powers that were changed because they were annoying or not worth it. I can't literally quote a red name describing their reasons for the changes and using those specific words, but I think the changes pretty much speak for themselves here.

Edit: And these examples only fit into one category: annoying but worth it, or not annoying but not worth it. Surely, pivotal and defining powers for an entire AT that are both annoying AND not worth it are at least as deserving of change.

It's not quite exactly the same thing, but Arbiter Hawk had this to say just a while ago: A bad power choice that's not worth taking is kind of synonymous with "annoying or not worth it" though in my mind.

Actually, correct on the first but not on the second. To the best of my recollection, the devs stated a power change was explicitly due to a power literally being not worth taking exactly three times. Two occurred before you joined (based on your forum date). When the devs replaced Fold Space with Singularity was the first. Technically, they should have replaced Wormhole with Singularity since Wormhole was the tier 9 power. But it was Fold Space that the devs said was basically the "worthless" power and because of that not only was Singularity added at tier 9, wormhole was shuffled to tier 8 and Fold Space was eliminated.

The second: Elude, in I2. The original version of Elude was a power that conferred something like a combination of superspeed and PFF. As in while its on you run fast, you have really high defense but you can't attack anything. Yeah, people picked that power a lot.

The last, most recent change: MoG. Although that was less that the devs said it was not worth taking at all and more addressing the fact that the players believed that to be true.

There are other changes that were likely due to the devs believing a power was not worth it, but I have no direct knowledge they said so directly. Storm Kick is one.

And there was one game mechanical change that simultaneously changed several powers behavior that the devs explicitly stated was due to the mechanic being simultaneously annoying and worthless. That was when they changed the mechanics of Terrorize. It used to cause critters to flee, but they changed it to the current behavior of stand in place and quiver, and occasionally attack back if hit, because the devs stated that the original behavior was so annoying and worthless it was causing players to avoid taking or using any terrorize powers.

In the modern era, the only one I can think of is MoG, so its very rare now. But it was a bit more common in the past.

Ironically Power Thrust is in the same set, so /em blasters can still quite easily neutralize single bosses even without mag 4 total focus.

So you just totally gloss over the numbers side of stuff, then?

Numbers and 'annoying and not worth it' are not totally detached subjects in this argument.
And yes, we get it, you don't really care/want/agree. So....why are you still here again?

Originally Posted by Zwillinger GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.

Originally Posted by Captain_Photon NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

I remember this change and I don't recall ANY dev literally stating we are changing this power because it is "not worth taking". You claim they have twice before 2007 which does not cover the five years I have been here(therefore has no place in the conversation) and claim they have said those exact words once since I have been here. Who said it, which dev used those exact words here in this forum as the basis for changing the power?

This question clearly indicates that you have either missed the point of my literal posts more than once or you are trying to wind stuff up for nothing.

This. Also;

Originally Posted by Zwillinger GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.

Originally Posted by Captain_Photon NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

Being literal is essentially the opposite of trying to skew something as others have from the start. No I am not skewing a thing. I have be consistent in saying that I have not seen a dev post here the reason for changing any power was because it was annoying or not worth it. At least one person has already said the devs never posted "annoying" as a reason.

I asked which dev allegedly said that the reason they made a power change was because it was "not worth taking". I await the response to that.

You are right none really, they are going to continue to use the same reasoning for changing powers that they have always used as listed in their posts here to us. No worries.

IDK, I see as more not allowing people to lie about what you said, but you and Vanden have made an excellent point.

Along those lines, I do feel that Blasters deserve a full review of the AT and powers. I also think the devs would do well in expressing the role they want Blasters to play in COX 2012 if it has indeed changed from the last time they made blaster changes.

But hey, for anyone who missed it, they can now pick up Afterburner!

Originally Posted by Arcanaville Softcapping an Invuln is fantastic. Softcapping a Willpower is amazing. Softcapping SR is kissing your sister.

That would be Castle, but the posts from that period are long gone from the forums.

Bingo, this is what I recall as well.