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Yeah, I know what you mean. Peacebringers seem like a mixed bag of tricks, compared to the uniformity of a warshade (if that makes sense).
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Originally Posted by Jeremia_Bane
Oh and the longer i look at the WS abilities the more i feel i rolled literally the "light" kheldian ... Damn that stuff is actually useful(gogo group flight and pulsar), shadow cloak, stygian circle, gravitic emanation, 30 sec mire ... You can actually stun a boss and a whole group of mobs in the time it takes a PB to stun a LT. I mean i had a rough idea of the difference, but looking at the CDs and durations on some of these ... There is alot of synergy between the abilities and forms, somehow i don't see that yet on the PB.
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Hmm i would say a PB is like a hammer, and a WS is like a whole toolbox. |
Originally Posted by Stone Daemon
Yeah, I know what you mean. Peacebringers seem like a mixed bag of tricks, compared to the uniformity of a warshade (if that makes sense).
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About the only thing a PB can do is send stuff flying while doing damage to it. The strongest debuff he has only affects his teammembers
, yeah im talking about group flight.The WSs abilities are just so ... useful. Recall friend, shadow cloak, unchain essence, etc. I can see myself using those all the time without making the melees in a team swear. About the only drawback i can see is some reduction in single target durability, down to about brute level maybe
.Nah, i still like my PB. Just wish he would be as awesome as a triformer as the WS is.
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It's not always the words themselves, but they way they are used that makes me not understand what it being said.|
Originally Posted by Stone Daemon
What terms, for example? You say half, so I'm guessing it's just a matter of learning the lexicon we use in this game, but perhaps we can help shed the light on some of them.
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For example:
I am going to guide you along the leveling path. Characters don't start at 50 with a full compliment of IOs. - Assuming IO means invention enhancement recepies, I assume I don't have to worry about those in the start of the guide.
Absorption doesn't really do much and is not optional, but that's allright because you need a place to put a Steadfast KB protection IO anyway. - Huh, what? I have no idea what is being said here.
Recently, pool powers have opened up at level 4, so Hasten is a good option. - Ehm, why? I don't seem to have any abilities that would benefit from it, all my abilities have recharge times of less than 10 seconds.
Gravimetric Snare might be nice if you had the slots to devote to it. - Actually I used it a lot, crowd control and battle field control are king in this game.
With the level six ding you need to pick up Dark Nova. - Ok. I didn't know that, so I picked it up at level 10. It was a big contributing factor to stop playing my warshade. I don't like the looks, and the attacks are boring, all use the same sound and purple beam. It's like a boring version of my fire/fire flying blaster. It trades some defense for being to more easily outrange your enemies, especially melee types. It does nothing to help against Quantum.
Not switching to a different bar when switching forms automatically is cumbersome, but can me circumvented with a macro.
The next thing to do is a respec if you have one. - Or just use the second build? I suppose he means a respec token, otherwise you need to be level 24, right?
Somewhere in this phase you'll want to grab Hasten, provided you didn't at level 4. Put it on auto - Huh what?
Other notably good powers here are Sunless Mire, Shadow Cloak and Gravity Well. Mire is a clone of the tier 8 power from dark melee, except you get it at level 12. It gives more damage bonus over time than Build Up with just one enemy. Saturated, it's like holding down the build up button for 30 seconds. Shadow Cloak is great for all the TFs you'll be doing since recall friend is an inherent power too. You can pick up Super Speed to have full stealth on the cheap. Gravity Well is a medicine. At this point it treats quantum-stomach, but later it will provide relief for sapper-aches and surgeon inflammation. - This entire paragraph needs a translation for me.
I have to break you of that bad habit before you even get it. You do notdo not shift into nova when your team needs a blaster or shift into dwarf when your team needs a tank. Never, have forms. You no never, not ever think of yourself as a character who shifts into forms as the situation arises.You are The MFing Warshade!
You are all forms at all times. Thinking anything else will cripple you without you even realizing it. You are never stuck in one form. Nova thrives on human and dwarf buffs. Dwarf protects human and nova. Human fuels dwarf and nova. Embrace this idea. - I stopped playing World of Warcraft because this could no longer be said of Druids. It's why I tried the warshade.
I will not go into detail about the 20+ portion of the guide.
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| And yes, soloing a kheldian for your first several levels can be painful. It's not something I would recommend to new players. You should probably find a team for it, if you're interested in continuing. Once you get Gravity Well, I find that things become a bit easier. |
With the other Archetypes you get all kinds of different abilities, at level 4-6 you feel like a super hero/villain already. Even Trick Arrow is cool once you get the Glue Arrow. My Warshade just doesn't feel like that at level 10, even the different attacks you have all use the same sound and are very similar in appearance. He feels weak and unorganized. There isn't one ability yet that made me chuckle or go wow that's cool. Every other character I made and played past level 8 has made me do that.
Maybe I need to level something else to 50 first, like it was originally intended.
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| To focus directly on this--I would argue that there are many power combinations that suffer in low levels solo. Getting a team is generally the best way to get through those levels too. I can agree, to an extent, that kheldians have things a bit more difficult than most, but it is by no means impossible. Just difficult. |
Thanks for all the advice, but my Warshade gets shelved until I figure out what to do with it. Not just because of how much of a struggle he is to level, but also because I don't like the looks and sounds.
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He's saying that you won't be awesome from the get go. Advice to keep in mind with a lot of late blooming powersets, I'd say.|
Originally Posted by RogerWilco
It's not always the words themselves, but they way they are used that makes me not understand what it being said.
For example: I am going to guide you along the leveling path. Characters don't start at 50 with a full compliment of IOs. - Assuming IO means invention enhancement recepies, I assume I don't have to worry about those in the start of the guide. |
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
Absorption doesn't really do much and is not optional, but that's allright because you need a place to put a Steadfast KB protection IO anyway. - Huh, what? I have no idea what is being said here.
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
Recently, pool powers have opened up at level 4, so Hasten is a good option. - Ehm, why? I don't seem to have any abilities that would benefit from it, all my abilities have recharge times of less than 10 seconds.
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
Gravimetric Snare might be nice if you had the slots to devote to it. - Actually I used it a lot, crowd control and battle field control are king in this game.
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
With the level six ding you need to pick up Dark Nova. - Ok. I didn't know that, so I picked it up at level 10. It was a big contributing factor to stop playing my warshade. I don't like the looks, and the attacks are boring, all use the same sound and purple beam. It's like a boring version of my fire/fire flying blaster. It trades some defense for being to more easily outrange your enemies, especially melee types. It does nothing to help against Quantum.
Not switching to a different bar when switching forms automatically is cumbersome, but can me circumvented with a macro. |
Personally, I prefer that the game doesn't automatically switch my power tray. What lots of newbie kheld players don't realize is that a good tri-former is not just a flying squid, or just a crab, or just the human form. You can be all three. In other words, you don't want to stay in one form 24/7, or you're just limiting yourself. And then you really WILL be just a weak blaster.
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
The next thing to do is a respec if you have one. - Or just use the second build? I suppose he means a respec token, otherwise you need to be level 24, right?
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
Somewhere in this phase you'll want to grab Hasten, provided you didn't at level 4. Put it on auto - Huh what?
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
Other notably good powers here are Sunless Mire, Shadow Cloak and Gravity Well. Mire is a clone of the tier 8 power from dark melee, except you get it at level 12. It gives more damage bonus over time than Build Up with just one enemy. Saturated, it's like holding down the build up button for 30 seconds. Shadow Cloak is great for all the TFs you'll be doing since recall friend is an inherent power too. You can pick up Super Speed to have full stealth on the cheap. Gravity Well is a medicine. At this point it treats quantum-stomach, but later it will provide relief for sapper-aches and surgeon inflammation. - This entire paragraph needs a translation for me.
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
I have to break you of that bad habit before you even get it. You do notdo not shift into nova when your team needs a blaster or shift into dwarf when your team needs a tank. Never, have forms. You no never, not ever think of yourself as a character who shifts into forms as the situation arises.You are The MFing Warshade!
You are all forms at all times. Thinking anything else will cripple you without you even realizing it. You are never stuck in one form. Nova thrives on human and dwarf buffs. Dwarf protects human and nova. Human fuels dwarf and nova. Embrace this idea. - I stopped playing World of Warcraft because this could no longer be said of Druids. It's why I tried the warshade. |
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
I will not go into detail about the 20+ portion of the guide.
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
I like playing shape/role shifters. I've played World of Warcraft for 5 years and my one and only character above level 10 there is a Druid. I would like to like the Warshade. If it's any indication, my character is named RogerWilco, I was hoping to make it my main character. But some of my other characters are now nearly level 30, and I can't get myself to log in my warshade, all of my other characters are more fun.
With the other Archetypes you get all kinds of different abilities, at level 4-6 you feel like a super hero/villain already. Even Trick Arrow is cool once you get the Glue Arrow. My Warshade just doesn't feel like that at level 10, even the different attacks you have all use the same sound and are very similar in appearance. He feels weak and unorganized. There isn't one ability yet that made me chuckle or go wow that's cool. Every other character I made and played past level 8 has made me do that. Maybe I need to level something else to 50 first, like it was originally intended. The Warshade spends to much time between hospital and mission door. Even my Archery/Trick Arrow Defender is more fun solo and he struggles compared to my other characters. |
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
Thanks for all the advice, but my Warshade gets shelved until I figure out what to do with it. Not just because of how much of a struggle he is to level, but also because I don't like the looks and sounds.
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What do you mean with mule?|
Originally Posted by Stone Daemon
He's saying that you won't be awesome from the get go. Advice to keep in mind with a lot of late blooming powersets, I'd say.
The power itself isn't useful, because by itself it's not that great, and on an endgame build, it's absolutely useless, as with Eclipse your damage resistance will be capped anyway. What the power is good for, then, is to be able to mule unique IOs to help with other things. Knockback protection, for example. |
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| You should really look past your first couple powers, then. Eclipse, Dark Extraction, Unchain Essence, Sunless Mire...there are many powers that hasten will help you on. |
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| Grav Snare is a power choice that is something of a personal taste pick. If you like it, fine, go for it. A lot of kheldian players don't waste their time or slots on a limited use single target immobilize power. You get better powers for crowd control, anyway. What he is saying, though, is that you will have other powers that will probably need those slots more. |
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Not everyone likes Tri-forming. The problem you're facing, then, is that you're reading a guide to being a tri-former. If you don't like it, don't take it. Simple as that. Personally, I prefer that the game doesn't automatically switch my power tray. What lots of newbie kheld players don't realize is that a good tri-former is not just a flying squid, or just a crab, or just the human form. You can be all three. In other words, you don't want to stay in one form 24/7, or you're just limiting yourself. And then you really WILL be just a weak blaster. |
Changing into the Nova form is really slow, so that doesn't seem to be a good idea in the middle of combat.
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| That advice is mostly for vets, because they'll have lots of freebies. The reason for this is, after you have access to Nova/Dwarf, you can respec and put slots into their attacks starting at level 1. A useful trick, no? |
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| Auto. Also called auto-fire. You hold the ctrl button, and click on the power, and it will activate as soon as it's done recharging (assuming you're in human form). Very useful on certain self buffing powers. |
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| He's comparing powers between other powersets. Sunless Mire is an area attack that functions somewhat like build up, in that it raises your damage/tohit--but for every enemy it hits. Shadow Cloak is a semi-invisibility power, and if you get super speed (or the stealth IO), you'll be fully invisible to most enemies. |
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| With a warshades inherent ability to TP, you can ghost missions. |
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| Gravity well is very useful in the sense that it will take problem enemies out of commission, so you can take care of Voids/Quantums before they kill you, and so on with other problem enemies. |
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| And so far it doesn't sound like you're embracing it, if you think the Nova form is just a weak blaster. Read what I said above about making use of all your powers. |
I either have [Shadow Bolt, Ebon Eye, Gravimetric Snare, Shadow blast, Absorption, Gravity Shield] in human form, or I have [Dark Nova Blast, Dark Nova Bolt, Dark Nova Emanation, Dark Nova Detonation and some Fly/Hover ability] in Nova form.
If I need the snare I stay or switch to human form, if I can hover out of range of my enemies I use the Nova form. Switching to Nova form in combat seems to slow to be useful. Is there any more to it?
It mostly feels like my Fire/Fire Blaster with Hover/Fly, it has Flares, Fire Blast, Fire Ball and Ring of Fire. Only the WS has no Rain of Fire and the Blaster no Gravity Shield or Orbiting Death otherwise they are quite similar?
In each form the abilities of the other are greyed out, so why not switch action bars when switching forms? Why have abilities on your bar that can't be used in your current form?
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Ok. Frankly, it just sounds like you're not quite sure how to play it yet. |
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I will guarantee you that the first several levels can be quite difficult, but learning how to play a tri-form warshade is a process. Some people become quite good at it, others never quite get it. I would suggest teaming with others a lot until you get to 18-26. Make sure you take a moment to look at the powers you get at later levels, too. If you still finding yourself not liking to play it by, say, 32, perhaps the AT is just not for you. It's something that grows on you--or doesn't. Good luck. |
Thanks for the replies. It's appreciated.
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Maybe i can help a bit with some answers. What he means is putting a IO into the power not to improve the power(which is weak to begin with), but to get the special effect a few chosen IOs have. The steadfast protection IO in question can only be put into Resistance powers, but does not improve the resistance on them. Instead he gives you KB protection, like those toggles your stalker has, just specific to only KB.|
Originally Posted by RogerWilco
What do you mean with mule?
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| Why worry on level 4 about things you get 30+ Wouldn't it be more useful to take something that helps at level 4 and then "respec" or use the second build when you do get those high level powers? |
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| I got the shield and the snare in human form, and the flying in nova form, but otherwise the blasts seem similar? So I fly if I can, and otherwise use the human form, if I end up in melee? |
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Interesting, I didn't know you could do that. Does that work on things like Rage and BuildUp as well? Sounds useful, similar to my Stalker I suppose? |
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| Ghost missions? |
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| So after level 18 things become easier? I should just avoid doing missions until that level, so I don't encounter any Quantums? And go back to what people called street sweeping in this thread? |
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Well, would you care to try and explain it again if it's not to much trouble? As I said, I'm coming from a WoW druid, which might have me make the wrong assumptions. I either have [Shadow Bolt, Ebon Eye, Gravimetric Snare, Shadow blast, Absorption, Gravity Shield] in human form, or I have [Dark Nova Blast, Dark Nova Bolt, Dark Nova Emanation, Dark Nova Detonation and some Fly/Hover ability] in Nova form. If I need the snare I stay or switch to human form, if I can hover out of range of my enemies I use the Nova form. Switching to Nova form in combat seems to slow to be useful. Is there any more to it? It mostly feels like my Fire/Fire Blaster with Hover/Fly, it has Flares, Fire Blast, Fire Ball and Ring of Fire. Only the WS has no Rain of Fire and the Blaster no Gravity Shield or Orbiting Death otherwise they are quite similar? |
An example would be:
Human part
1. Position yourself favourably vs a group with your Shadow Cloak. (you won't draw aggro and can take your time getting into the perfect position)
2. Use the cone of Gravitic emanation to stun said group. (Its a mag 3 stun, meaning it stuns anything below bosslevel in a cone shaped AoE)
3. Use Ecplise and Sunless Mire on the group. (Resistance buff and Damage/Tohit Buff based on how many targets around you)
Dwarf part
4. Use Black Dwarf Mire on the group (Same like Sunless Mire, but only 10 sec instead 30 so be quick on next part)
(4a) Use dwarf heal depending on health
Nova part
5. Use your cone and AoE on the group. (with 2 mires running and the 40% from nova form they will hit very hard)
Human part again
6. Use Unchain Essence/Dark Extraction on one of the dead mobs(some stuff should be dead by now, first is a nuke, second summons a pet)
7. Use Gravity Well and Shadow Blast to cull whatever still lives. (Maybe a boss or a LT you missed, immob to prevent them getting away)
8. Use Stygian Circle to get full endurance/health. (with 3+ corpses this is a very big heal and probably a full blue bar)
Thats just an example ofc, depending on situation you might have to react differently. Assuming your hitting about 5 npcs it would give you capped resistances during the whole fight, an damage buff of over 130%(in human form, more for nova) and have most enemies being stunned most/all of the time.
This is what i meant earlier in the thread when i talked about how AT defining abilities come all pretty late, early on you really only have some weak copies of other ATs weak attacks. For example nova doesn't work for you because its squishy, in the example above it would have 85% resists against everything which would make a tanker drool and a blaster flatout faint. Also the stygian circle at the end means you have 0 downtime between fights.
I'll skip over most of your questions, as Jeremia answered them. I just want to elaborate on a few...
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I have no idea what a druid is, as I have never played WoW. That said...|
Originally Posted by RogerWilco
I got the shield and the snare in human form, and the flying in nova form, but otherwise the blasts seem similar? So I fly if I can, and otherwise use the human form, if I end up in melee?
Changing into the Nova form is really slow, so that doesn't seem to be a good idea in the middle of combat. Well, would you care to try and explain it again if it's not to much trouble? As I said, I'm coming from a WoW druid, which might have me make the wrong assumptions. If I need the snare I stay or switch to human form, if I can hover out of range of my enemies I use the Nova form. Switching to Nova form in combat seems to slow to be useful. Is there any more to it? It mostly feels like my Fire/Fire Blaster with Hover/Fly, it has Flares, Fire Blast, Fire Ball and Ring of Fire. Only the WS has no Rain of Fire and the Blaster no Gravity Shield or Orbiting Death otherwise they are quite similar? In each form the abilities of the other are greyed out, so why not switch action bars when switching forms? Why have abilities on your bar that can't be used in your current form? |
As you level, your tactics will have to change. There are lots of powers that you will get that are what I like to call "Game Changers." Gravity Well is one of them, Gravitic Emanation is another. The biggest ones, in my opinion, are Gravitic Emanation and Eclipse.
Let's pretend you're 50, for a moment. Like Jeremia said, you'll want to start your fights in human form. Position yourself carefully to the mob, and unleash Gravitic to throw them all back stunned. You can skip using Gravitic if the enemies pose no threat to killing/mezzing you right away. You then rush forward and Eclipse/Mire. At this point, you can Gravity Well someone (or move to dwarf, depending on the difficulty of the opponents you're fighting). You can take out a troublemaker with Gravity Well, or use it to take out a minion and use unchain essence and summon your pet. You can switch to nova and blast the rest of them, or you can then go into dwarf and bash some heads. I generally favored Nova form more than dwarf, unless there was a hard target I needed to bash, and the double mire would be useful in keeping my damage up.
For low levels, you'll be relying on Nova to kill your enemies before they kill you a lot, and then on Dwarf post 20 to survive mezzers. You'll want to keep an eye on your life/endurance and use Stygian Circle as necessary. And of course, use your human powers to control the battle.
Obviously, you'll be switching back and forth through forms a lot during battles. You have to keep your eye on Mire/Eclipse to make sure to use them whenever they wear off, and summon our your pets, use your mezzes as necessary, etc. So yes, there is a very good reason to have those abilities on your bar. You WILL be using them.
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
So after level 18 things become easier? I should just avoid doing missions until that level, so I don't encounter any Quantums? And go back to what people called street sweeping in this thread?
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
What you're basically saying is that while every other archetype in the game is fun to play from somewhere around level 4-8, you need to be well on your way to level 30 before warshade becomes any fun? Until you basically need others to powerlevel you or it's a major pain?
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Jeremia_Bane and Stone Daemon, thank you both for your replies, it did clarify a lot of things.
I think Warshade just isn't my cup of tea. I just can't bother to try and fight another Quantum. I'll park the character on the last slot of the character select screen, and maybe revisit him when I've levelled some of my other characters and have more experience.
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If you're having some trouble in the lower levels I have something that might help, if you want to take another stab at a 'Shade. |
Originally Posted by RogerWilco
Jeremia_Bane and Stone Daemon, thank you both for your replies, it did clarify a lot of things.
I think Warshade just isn't my cup of tea. I just can't bother to try and fight another Quantum. I'll park the character on the last slot of the character select screen, and maybe revisit him when I've levelled some of my other characters and have more experience. |
If you have access to CoH: going Rogue, you can sneak into preatoria through pocket D and take advantage of the "double xp" patrol day job (if its still there). You'll get double xp for killing bad guys on the streets. It will get you to dwarf form quickly with the advantage of Sunless mire, and nova form.
1. Jump into a large group
2. Mire
3. Fly UP and out of range to blast with your AoE's.
4. Easy double xp gained
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Welcome to the game and the wonderful world of Hero Epic Ats. Any way to answer your question yes it takes a while but eventually your abilities get strong enough to allow you to battle a Void without constantly dying. Sounds like you are a ways off yet but I have a 50 level Warshade that is +3 with all incarnate powers at tier 4. She is primarily a Human/Dwarf and on some trials I actually use both forms depending on the situation:|
Originally Posted by RogerWilco
Hey,
I've started playing this game around Christmas and find it's a great game. I've upgraded to VIP and tried a Warshade. I found that any time I encounter a group with a Quantum, it's multiple trips to the hospital. I'm only level 4, but I looked at the Paragon Wiki and it doesn't seem Warshades get much more to combat these guys. They're specifically designed to make my life miserable. Am I missing something? I often only get 2-3 shots in before I'm at the hospital. I'm only level 6 now, and not looking forward to level 10+. I've got a Brute, Scrapper, Blaster and Widow and none are such a PITA to play. |
BAF prisoner phase.. human form is perfect with tons of ranged attacks to deal with prisoners attaempting to escape
BAF AV battles... When no tank is available I have pulled Nightstar and Siege so the league can attack them.
LAM .. Outside in the courtyard Human form is great for damaging mobs. Inside when hunting glowies Dwarf allows me to survive and grab them quick.
Keyes .. Again on the Reactor phases Dwarf mode allows me to taunt mobs away from terminals so team mates can activate them and for the final battle with Anti Matter human form adds a lot of damage.
TPN ... I can whatever the league needs. if there are enough taunters I stay in human form and attack technicians IF Not I go dwarf and pull mobs away from terminals
MOM ... Mostly just stay in human form on this for the damage but if required I can go dwarf to hold aggro on AVs or the monsters in the final battle that need to be pulled.
UG .. I can switch back and forth. Human to deal damage and then Swarf, if needed, to taunt AVs.
Admittedly it took me a while to warm up to my WS, and she is the ONLY one I have, but I enjoy playing her now. It will be tough for a few levels yet and NO the Voids never go away and when you team any time a Crystal shows up in a mission YEAH that would be your fault! LOL
Now I don't know if you ever visit the DARK (Red) side and play villains but if so Try out the Soldiers of Arachnos. I have three 50 level incarnates all +3 and all powers tier 4. Just MY opinion but they did a much better job on the VEATs that the HEATs. But try both and HAVE FUN. Again welcome to COH/V... our motto on Virtue is .."You don;t have to be crazy to play here but you will be soon enough!"
�We�re always the good guys. In D&D, we�re lawful good. In City of Heroes we�re the heroes. In Grand Theft Auto we pay the prostitutes promptly and never hit them with a bat.� � Leonard
�Those women are prostitutes? You said they were raising money for stem cell research!� � Sheldon
If it makes you feel any better, back in the day the Voids/Quantums used to deal unresistable damage to khelds. What this meant was that instead of being a mild annoyance in low levels due to their stun/knockback ability, they were a genuine threat at all levels. (And Shadow Cysts used to mean your team was probably about to wipe.)
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How long ago did they change this? Back before i took a leave of absence I remember voids/quantums being a terror...but im not sure if it was ever that bad.
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Originally Posted by Stone Daemon
If it makes you feel any better, back in the day the Voids/Quantums used to deal unresistable damage to khelds. What this meant was that instead of being a mild annoyance in low levels due to their stun/knockback ability, they were a genuine threat at all levels. (And Shadow Cysts used to mean your team was probably about to wipe.)
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Early 2008.
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Originally Posted by Bionut911
How long ago did they change this? Back before i took a leave of absence I remember voids/quantums being a terror...but im not sure if it was ever that bad.
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You have options for dealing with Quantums even before you get Gravity Well at 18 (which is when they cease to be anything more than a slight concern). I'd have to see what it is you're doing in combat that makes dealing with them so difficult for you, though.|
Originally Posted by RogerWilco
Jeremia_Bane and Stone Daemon, thank you both for your replies, it did clarify a lot of things.
I think Warshade just isn't my cup of tea. I just can't bother to try and fight another Quantum. I'll park the character on the last slot of the character select screen, and maybe revisit him when I've levelled some of my other characters and have more experience. |
As for Hasten at 4... I'm tempted to say "just trust us" and leave it at that, but the thing about Kheldian triformers is that early on, your power choices pretty much come down to blasts you'll never use, shields you'll never use, places to put LotG/KB mules, or helpful auxiliary powers. Hasten falls squarely in that last category. When doing sewer trials, I not only had Nova from the start, but I could blast faster, too.
It's a fun archetype and everything I know about playing it I owe to Dechs Kaison's guide, but it requires a high degree of flexibility as well as acceptance of the AT's limitations, and not everyone can handle that.
@Mister Gerald, below are two combat logs, both ended in a hospital trip before I could kill the Void Seeker.
The second one I was flying too low and they could hit me with melee attacks, but I don't think it makes much of a difference, as I lost in the first one too.
I have 225.3 Health
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You transform into a Dark Nova!
You are flying!
You activated the Dark Nova Emanation power.
Dark Nova Emanation missed!
MISSED Guard!! Your Dark Nova Emanation power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 95.55.
HIT Life Mage! Your Dark Nova Emanation power was forced to hit by streakbreaker.
HIT Void Seeker! Your Dark Nova Emanation power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 75.06.
You hit Life Mage with 29.27 points of negative energy damage from your Dark Nova Emanation and slow him!
You hit Void Seeker with 12.87 points of negative energy damage from your Dark Nova Emanation and slow him!
Void Seeker MISSES! Quantum Array gun power had a 30.00% chance to hit, but rolled a 89.24.
Void Seeker HITS you! Quantum Array gun power had a 75.00% chance to hit and rolled a 33.70.
Void Seeker blasts your with his Quantum Array gun for 12.92 points of negative energy damage!
Void Seeker devastates your with his Quantum Array gun for an extra 38.78 points of Nicti damage! There is something in that weapon that is tuned to your Kheldian energy signature!
Guard HITS you! Hand Crossbow power had a 50.00% chance to hit and rolled a 28.70.
Guard shoots you with a Hand Crossbow for 7.6 points of lethal damage!
Guard shoots you with a Hand Crossbow for 6.45 points of negative energy damage!
Life Mage HITS you! Poison Staff power had a 57.53% chance to hit and rolled a 47.09.
You activated the Dark Nova Detonation power.
HIT Void Seeker! Your Dark Nova Detonation power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 19.30.
Void Seeker HITS you! Quantum Array gun power had a 30.00% chance to hit and rolled a 25.29.
Void Seeker HITS you! Quantum Array gun power had a 75.00% chance to hit and rolled a 53.06.
Void Seeker blasts your with his Quantum Array gun for 12.92 points of negative energy damage!
Void Seeker devastates your with his Quantum Array gun for an extra 38.78 points of Nicti damage! There is something in that weapon that is tuned to your Kheldian energy signature!
You are unable to use any powers!
Life Mage drains you for 22.8 points of toxic damage to heal himself!
Your Dark Nova Detonation deals 11.57 points of negative energy damage to Void Seeker and slows him!
You are unable to use any powers!
Guard HITS you! Hand Crossbow power had a 50.00% chance to hit and rolled a 12.82.
You can use powers again.
Guard shoots you with a Hand Crossbow for 7.6 points of lethal damage!
Guard shoots you with a Hand Crossbow for 6.45 points of negative energy damage!
You activated the Dark Nova Bolt power.
HIT Void Seeker! Your Dark Nova Bolt power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 78.78.
You hit Void Seeker with 14.82 points of negative energy damage from your Dark Nova Bolt and slow him.
You activated the Dark Nova Blast power.
HIT Void Seeker! Your Dark Nova Blast power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 78.00.
Life Mage HITS you! Poison Staff power had a 57.53% chance to hit and rolled a 0.76.
Void Seeker MISSES! Quantum Array gun power had a 30.00% chance to hit, but rolled a 64.03.
Void Seeker HITS you! Quantum Array gun power had a 75.00% chance to hit and rolled a 54.81.
Your Dark Nova Blast deals 24.83 points of negative energy damage to Void Seeker and slows him!
Dark Nova Bolt is recharged.
Life Mage drains you for 22.8 points of toxic damage to heal himself!
Void Seeker blasts your with his Quantum Array gun for 12.92 points of negative energy damage!
Void Seeker devastates your with his Quantum Array gun for an extra 38.78 points of Nicti damage! There is something in that weapon that is tuned to your Kheldian energy signature!
Guard HITS you! Hand Crossbow power had a 50.00% chance to hit and rolled a 0.27.
You activated the Dark Nova Bolt power.
HIT Void Seeker! Your Dark Nova Bolt power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 18.24.
Guard shoots you with a Hand Crossbow for 7.6 points of lethal damage!
Guard shoots you with a Hand Crossbow for 6.45 points of negative energy damage!
You hit Void Seeker with 7.76 points of negative energy damage from your Dark Nova Bolt and slow him.
Dark Nova Emanation is recharged.
Dark Nova Blast is recharged.
Life Mage MISSES! Poison Staff power had a 57.53% chance to hit, but rolled a 66.26.
Dark Nova Bolt is recharged.
Void Seeker MISSES! Quantum Array gun power had a 30.00% chance to hit, but rolled a 63.01.
Void Seeker HITS you! Quantum Array gun power had a 75.00% chance to hit and rolled a 64.61.
You activated the Dark Nova Blast power.
HIT Void Seeker! Your Dark Nova Blast power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 39.77.
Void Seeker blasts your with his Quantum Array gun for 12.92 points of negative energy damage!
Void Seeker devastates your with his Quantum Array gun for an extra 38.78 points of Nicti damage! There is something in that weapon that is tuned to your Kheldian energy signature!
You are no longer flying.
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You transform into a Dark Nova!
You are flying!
You activated the Dark Nova Emanation power.
HIT Life Mage! Your Dark Nova Emanation power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 79.08.
HIT Guard! Your Dark Nova Emanation power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 49.62.
HIT Void Seeker! Your Dark Nova Emanation power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 11.18.
You hit Guard with 29.27 points of negative energy damage from your Dark Nova Emanation and slow him!
You hit Life Mage with 29.27 points of negative energy damage from your Dark Nova Emanation and slow him!
You hit Void Seeker with 12.87 points of negative energy damage from your Dark Nova Emanation and slow him!
Guard HITS you! Hand Crossbow power had a 50.00% chance to hit and rolled a 13.01.
Life Mage HITS you! Poison Staff power had a 57.53% chance to hit and rolled a 23.62.
Void Seeker MISSES! Quantum Array gun power had a 30.00% chance to hit, but rolled a 96.47.
Void Seeker HITS you! Quantum Array gun power had a 75.00% chance to hit and rolled a 4.94.
You activated the Dark Nova Bolt power.
HIT Void Seeker! Your Dark Nova Bolt power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 26.63.
You hit Void Seeker with 7.76 points of negative energy damage from your Dark Nova Bolt and slow him.
Void Seeker blasts your with his Quantum Array gun for 12.92 points of negative energy damage!
Void Seeker devastates your with his Quantum Array gun for an extra 38.78 points of Nicti damage! There is something in that weapon that is tuned to your Kheldian energy signature!
Life Mage drains you for 22.8 points of toxic damage to heal himself!
Guard shoots you with a Hand Crossbow for 7.6 points of lethal damage!
Guard shoots you with a Hand Crossbow for 6.45 points of negative energy damage!
You activated the Dark Nova Blast power.
HIT Void Seeker! Your Dark Nova Blast power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 19.08.
Dark Nova Bolt is recharged.
Your Dark Nova Blast deals 13 points of negative energy damage to Void Seeker and slows him!
Guard HITS you! Sword power had a 50.00% chance to hit and rolled a 18.53.
You activated the Dark Nova Bolt power.
Dark Nova Bolt missed!
MISSED Void Seeker!! Your Dark Nova Bolt power had a 91.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 91.62.
Life Mage MISSES! Poison Staff power had a 57.53% chance to hit, but rolled a 71.07.
Guard hacks you for 33.45 points of lethal damage.
Dark Nova Blast is recharged.
Life Mage HITS you! Brawl power had a 66.73% chance to hit and rolled a 34.91.
Dark Nova Bolt is recharged.
Void Seeker HITS you! Quantum Array gun power had a 30.00% chance to hit and rolled a 25.64.
Void Seeker HITS you! Quantum Array gun power had a 87.00% chance to hit and rolled a 47.00.
Life Mage hits you for 25.84 points of smashing damage!
You activated the Dark Nova Blast power.
HIT Void Seeker! Your Dark Nova Blast power was forced to hit by streakbreaker.
Void Seeker blasts your with his Quantum Array gun for 12.92 points of negative energy damage!
Void Seeker devastates your with his Quantum Array gun for an extra 38.78 points of Nicti damage! There is something in that weapon that is tuned to your Kheldian energy signature!
You are unable to use any powers!
Dark Nova Emanation is recharged.
Your Dark Nova Blast deals 24.83 points of negative energy damage to Void Seeker and slows him!
You can use powers again.
You activated the Dark Nova Detonation power.
HIT Void Seeker! Your Dark Nova Detonation power had a 82.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 38.22.
Life Mage MISSES! Brawl power had a 66.73% chance to hit, but rolled a 78.84.
Void Seeker HITS you! Brawl power had a 58.00% chance to hit and rolled a 23.36.
Your Dark Nova Detonation deals 15.51 points of negative energy damage to Void Seeker and slows him!
Void Seeker hits you for 12.67 points of smashing damage!
Void Seeker hits you for 7.32 points of negative energy damage!
Void Seeker slams you for an extra 54.29 points of Nicti damage! That attack seems to be directed at your Kheldian energy signature!
You are no longer flying.
Quote:
I have no clue what you're talking about here, but I assume its level 50 stuff. My highest level character is 26 now.|
Originally Posted by Wicked_Wendy
Welcome to the game and the wonderful world of Hero Epic Ats ... but I have a 50 level Warshade that is +3 with all incarnate powers at tier 4. ...
BAF prisoner phase...BAF AV battles... LAM .. ...Keyes .. ...TPN ...MOM ... UG ... |
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| Now I don't know if you ever visit the DARK (Red) side and play villains but if so Try out the Soldiers of Arachnos. I have three 50 level incarnates all +3 and all powers tier 4. Just MY opinion but they did a much better job on the VEATs that the HEATs. ... |
Thanks for the nice welcome though.
When I said, " I'd have to see what it is you're doing in combat..." I meant literally see. The only thing significant I could deduce from your log was that you popped exactly 0 inspirations, which is a mistake. Enough purples (Luck) and you can survive almost anything, and reds (Enrage) help you kill faster.
As Gerald was implying, it's not just your lack of using inspirations (though that indeed can mean the difference between life and death) that hurt you, your build and fighting strategy equally matter. If you have the means of uploading a video, Roger, perhaps we can get a more in depth look at what you're doing? If you don't currently have a way of making a video, xfire has a nifty program that uploads video onto their website easily.
Quote:
That's MISTER Gerald, bub. Mister G if you're nasty. :P
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Originally Posted by Stone Daemon
As Gerald was implying...
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Quote:
I would just like to end this discussion now. It's already gone further than was my intention.|
Originally Posted by Stone Daemon
As Gerald was implying, it's not just your lack of using inspirations (though that indeed can mean the difference between life and death) that hurt you, your build and fighting strategy equally matter. If you have the means of uploading a video, Roger, perhaps we can get a more in depth look at what you're doing? If you don't currently have a way of making a video, xfire has a nifty program that uploads video onto their website easily.
|
Stone Deamon, Mister Gerald, and anyone else who replied, your answers were appreciated, and I do understand some aspects of the game a lot better now.
For now I have 12 other characters that I find fun to play and don't have trouble with. Apparently Warshade has a much higher learning curve, I will revisit the Archetype at some point in the future, but for now I've decided that I don't want to invest any more time.
Thanks for all the help provided. I did learn a lot.
Quote:
I agree that a Warshade is probably not the best thing for a new player to make. The learning curve is high, but once you familiarize yourself with the game more and more, you'll eventually be ready to take on the mantle. I sort of think it was good design to have Kheldians locked behind playing a character to level 50 because of the added difficulty and plethora of diverse play style and build options, but what can you do. |
Originally Posted by RogerWilco
I would just like to end this discussion now. It's already gone further than was my intention.
Stone Deamon, Mister Gerald, and anyone else who replied, your answers were appreciated, and I do understand some aspects of the game a lot better now. For now I have 12 other characters that I find fun to play and don't have trouble with. Apparently Warshade has a much higher learning curve, I will revisit the Archetype at some point in the future, but for now I've decided that I don't want to invest any more time. Thanks for all the help provided. I did learn a lot. |
All this being said, once you acquaint yourself better with mechanics and get a better "hang" of things in general, you'll find that a Warshade is one of the most potent AT's in the game with an incredibly rewarding experience to boot. If you ever feel the need to get inspired, myself and I'm sure many others would be happy to provide you with an in-game demonstration at any point.
For now though, enjoy the game. There's so much fun to be had that it's ridiculous.
Quote:
Honestly, that is probably your best bet. I would personally never recommend Kheldians to relatively new players, explicitly because of the thread of Voids among other things. There are ways to mitigate them as there are to mitigate anything and everything in the game, but unless you like challenge content almost anything else will probably be a better introduction into the game than Peacebringers or Warshades. Warshades in particular eventually become monsters at high level, but you have to get there first.
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Originally Posted by RogerWilco
Jeremia_Bane and Stone Daemon, thank you both for your replies, it did clarify a lot of things.
I think Warshade just isn't my cup of tea. I just can't bother to try and fight another Quantum. I'll park the character on the last slot of the character select screen, and maybe revisit him when I've levelled some of my other characters and have more experience. |
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Quote:
Well, *I* was going to come in here and plug your guide, but it seems you have it well in hand. |
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
Self plug, I recommend checking out the MFing Warshade guide in my signature. Warshades can be a lot of things, but simple is not one of them.
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So instead, I will just chime in and say to the original poster "The MFing Warshade guide is good. Just so you know, MF doesn't mean what you may think it mean."
You mean it doesn't stand for multi-faceted? 
Maestro Mavius - Infinity
Capt. Biohazrd - PCSAR
Talsor Tech - Talsorian Guard
Keep Calm & Chive On!
It's unfortunate to hear about your server
But really, i play my PB as a human form only still even though i have a tri form secondary built. Its just way easier than trying to make a slotstarved triform work. Especially the high damage mag 3 stun is useful.
That being said i think there are quite a few early abilities that could be switched with later ones to make leveling easier. Abilities that while useful, simply can't be used early on due to lack of slots or endurance. I mean there are so many AT defining abilities, and they all come so late. Instead of the fun stuff that makes later gameplay fun you get boring toggles you can't run because of endurance issues.
Oh and the longer i look at the WS abilities the more i feel i rolled literally the "light" kheldian ... Damn that stuff is actually useful(gogo group flight and pulsar), shadow cloak, stygian circle, gravitic emanation, 30 sec mire ... You can actually stun a boss and a whole group of mobs in the time it takes a PB to stun a LT. I mean i had a rough idea of the difference, but looking at the CDs and durations on some of these ... There is alot of synergy between the abilities and forms, somehow i don't see that yet on the PB.