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This isn't alcohol or drugs we're talking about.|
Originally Posted by Twigman
I'm not saying not to delete accounts of scammers, I'm saying allow the sites that aren't scammers to be publicly known as credible.
Maybe if it weren't illegal in this country ... we would have US based (credible) "gold" traders. Making something illegal doesn't stop a problem or address a problem, just creates a bigger problem. -prohabition- |
This is like telling someone that robbing banks is fine, just frowned upon and the government isn't responsible for what the bank does.
OF COURSE more people would rob banks if they weren't afraid of the police.
Also, allowing people to violate copyright laws gets you to the point of companies not wanting to make products. That's why those laws exist, to allow the companies to feel safe that they can make a profit off of them.
I don't think you fully understand the consequences of what you're asking for. It would likely have some of the effects that you say, and then have far more negative repercussions.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
More to the point, and explanation of exactly why gold sellers will never be welcomed by the developers of the games they peddle their "wares" in:
I guarantee you that the Internet Crime Division of the FBI is aware of exactly how much credit card fraud is perpetrated by these companies on a daily basis. But, since the physical location of he person committing the crime is outside their jursidiction, there is nothing they can do about it.
Now, if Paragon Studios took leave of their senses and said "Sure! Go ahead and sell stuff in our game!", what happens next?
It does not take a rocket surgeon (or law student) to figure that out.
Since the companies selling the stuff in the game are known to the IC Division of the FBI to be committing credit card fraud, suddenly Paragon Studios is willingly and knowingly enabling them to commit a crime. That makes them an accessory to credit card fraud on a massive scale. Since Paragon Studios is physically located in Northern California, they DO fall into the IC Division's jurisdiction, who will probably jump at the chance to punish someone for all this crime they are helpless to stop.
End result? The FBI forcibly shuts down the servers the very next day pending a full investigation. Knowing how long those things take, it is likely NCSoft will cut their losses and leave them shut down for good. Additionally, it is also possible that our favorite dev team will spend some time in jail, possibly a significant amount if it can be proved that they were knowingly engaging in credit card fraud.
Not good for the game in any instance. Even if the FBI allows them to bring the servers back up, how many people are going to trust them with their credit card information from that point forward?
So, in spite of how "harmless" you keep claiming it is, allowing these companies to operate in the game stands a very good chance of killing the game, practically immediately.
Why do you think the online sale of in-game items is prohibited by the ToS of every single MMO on the market that caters to an American playerbase? The scenario I just gave you is exactly why.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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illegal as determined by the game, and the game can change it's mind.
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Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
---snip--- Goldfarmers break the law by selling someone else's intellectual property without their permission. That is illegal, and if they were doing it from anywhere but China, they'd be prosecuted. But China chooses not to follow international law in these matters. |
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And why would they? Copyrights need to be protected. If NCSoft were to say that one aspect of its game is free-use, then what's to stop other people from coming in and saying that other parts of it should be free-use as well?|
Originally Posted by Twigman
illegal as determined by the game, and the game can change it's mind.
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Additionally, if the act of credit card fraud is illegal (which it is), and the Devs know exactly how people will exploit their game to enable credit card fraud, then why would the parent company allow for that act to happen?
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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Denial ain't just a river in Egypt. |
Originally Posted by Twigman
illegal as determined by the game, and the game can change it's mind.
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Outragiously incorrect analogy. |
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
This isn't alcohol or drugs we're talking about.
This is like telling someone that robbing banks is fine, just frowned upon and the government isn't responsible for what the bank does. OF COURSE more people would rob banks if they weren't afraid of the police. Also, allowing people to violate copyright laws gets you to the point of companies not wanting to make products. That's why those laws exist, to allow the companies to feel safe that they can make a profit off of them. I don't think you fully understand the consequences of what you're asking for. It would likely have some of the effects that you say, and then have far more negative repercussions. |
I'll agree that some bad things could result, but in what case has something been done that a bad result didn't occure? At least with my way, people could talk about the good and advise others on the bad, and the game wouldn't add insult to injury by deleting your account.
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Originally Posted by Twigman
IMHO ... CoH should embrace the sellers -to an extent-. Make a chat that they can use, and give them an account they can monitor. example: CoH advertises "In an effort to promote small business owners, We are making account changes so "gold" traders can advertise without harrasing." Then they ask all new accounts if they are a "gold" trading site. If they answer yes, they are allowed a F2P account with a limit to only one chat (advertising chat) and the ability to RESPOND to tells. The advertising chat is so they won't post on all the other chats. those that are interested and would purchase "gold" can go there, all the rest can remove that chat from the list.
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If I understand your suggestion...
A) A Channel/Tab would be created that the Gold Sellers would be allowed to advertise on.
B) Advertisement outside this channel would continue to remain as it is (Not Allowed/Banned)
c) Players would be able to choose to have the Advert Channel on or Off.
Now if this is your suggestion then unless you can solve the problems listed below it looks like it will fail.
1) From my understanding most people avoid repeated advertisements for the same general service. After just one day of this system what percentage of the players do you honestly think will keep a channel open that advertises Gold/PLing 24 hours a day? 1%, 5%, 10%, 50%, 75%?
2) Even if you limit the adverts to one per account per hour the Gold sellers will create multiple accounts and domain names to increase there exposure on the Advert Channel. After all if I advertise 6 times an hour under various websites/names and my competition with the same service and price advertises once an hour, I am likely to get 6 times the business. (This is a common practice in our local yellow pages for Locksmiths since 2-3 calls from a desperate locked out homeowner pays more then the cost of an extra advert and real service cost.) Pretty soon all the RMTers will be doing it and you wind up with 100's of adverts an hour from the same 20 companies. One week after this system is in place with 100's of Adds an hour on this Avdvert Channel what percentage of the players do you think listen to the Advert channel? 1%, 5%, 10%, 50%, 75%?
3) Since advertisers will spend thousands of dollars to reach less then 1% of a population, assuming you did not answer 100% to both questions 1 and 2 , Why would a RMT be foolish enough to NOT use a (Free to Play) FtP account costing $0 to spam the local/help channels, just as they currently are, so they can reach the 25%, 50%, 90% or 99% of the players who have turned off Advert Channel?
4a) If your answer is that the advertised RMTer would be banned/sanctioned, than what is to stop RMT #1 who wants to eliminate the competition from RMT#2 or a player who didn't like RMT#2 from setting up an FtP account and advertising RMT#2 thus getting them banned?
4b) If your answer is to punish all RMTers (Ex. "No one can use Advert Chanel for 1 hour because an advert in local was done in RMT#2's name!") for the actions of one, Then what is to stop a Griefer/Disgruntled player from setting up an FTP account and advertising a RMT# thus getting them ALL banned and leading right back to the current system? "Biggest CoH Grief ever for Epic Win!" Did I say that right
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It's not an incorrect analogy. There have been studies done where people have said that they would rob a bank if it wasn't illegal. Basically, the only thing stopping a decent amount of people from robbing banks is the fact that it's illegal. The same has been done for some recreational drugs, with similar results.|
Originally Posted by Twigman
Outragiously incorrect analogy.
I'll agree that some bad things could result, but in what case has something been done that a bad result didn't occure? At least with my way, people could talk about the good and advise others on the bad, and the game wouldn't add insult to injury by deleting your account. |
As such, removing the ban-worthyness of using goldfarmers means that it is very likely that more people would use them. This would in turn mean that there is more influence in the game just by virtue of having more goldfarmers doing nothing but trying to earn influence and selling it. And this would drive up prices for everyone, meaning that more and more people would believe that the only way to compete is to buy gold, such that they either leave or begin to use the services themselves.
But this is a fairly pointless discussion, because even if the Devs did consider doing this, they'd have their whole legal team shouting back at them telling them that they can't do this, and that they HAVE to take the position that it's against the TOS. I'm sorry if you think that's wrong, but it's really not. It is in the best interest of NCSoft, Paragon Studios, you and me to have the use of goldfarmers be against the TOS and EULA.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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Letting us talk about bad and GOOD sites would stifle the scammers and bring the companies that just perform a service to the surface.|
Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
More to the point, and explanation of exactly why gold sellers will never be welcomed by the developers of the games they peddle their "wares" in:
I guarantee you that the Internet Crime Division of the FBI is aware of exactly how much credit card fraud is perpetrated by these companies on a daily basis. But, since the physical location of he person committing the crime is outside their jursidiction, there is nothing they can do about it. Now, if Paragon Studios took leave of their senses and said "Sure! Go ahead and sell stuff in our game!", what happens next? It does not take a rocket surgeon (or law student) to figure that out. Since the companies selling the stuff in the game are known to the IC Division of the FBI to be committing credit card fraud, suddenly Paragon Studios is willingly and knowingly enabling them to commit a crime. That makes them an accessory to credit card fraud on a massive scale. Since Paragon Studios is physically located in Northern California, they DO fall into the IC Division's jurisdiction, who will probably jump at the chance to punish someone for all this crime they are helpless to stop. End result? The FBI forcibly shuts down the servers the very next day pending a full investigation. Knowing how long those things take, it is likely NCSoft will cut their losses and leave them shut down for good. Additionally, it is also possible that our favorite dev team will spend some time in jail, possibly a significant amount if it can be proved that they were knowingly engaging in credit card fraud. Not good for the game in any instance. Even if the FBI allows them to bring the servers back up, how many people are going to trust them with their credit card information from that point forward? So, in spite of how "harmless" you keep claiming it is, allowing these companies to operate in the game stands a very good chance of killing the game, practically immediately. Why do you think the online sale of in-game items is prohibited by the ToS of every single MMO on the market that caters to an American playerbase? The scenario I just gave you is exactly why. |
If the FBI did that, I would be sorely worried about the intellegance of the people of the nation. Making changes for long term good shouldn't be stifled. Letting evil be hidden in the shadows, doesn't protect anyone.
Me: a dark alley that many people get mugged in ... lets put a street light down there.
Community(it seems): NO!!! Just tell your kids not to go down there.
Me: Wouldn't a light scare the scum away?
Community(it seems): Why change things? A few a month are no big deal.
That sounds more like a "I don't care if you're scamed" approach to me.
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This is the most (my) mind changing comment/aregument yet.|
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
And why would they? Copyrights need to be protected. If NCSoft were to say that one aspect of its game is free-use, then what's to stop other people from coming in and saying that other parts of it should be free-use as well?
Additionally, if the act of credit card fraud is illegal (which it is), and the Devs know exactly how people will exploit their game to enable credit card fraud, then why would the parent company allow for that act to happen? |
I changed an approach to legal to buy, illegal to sell. I still believe that, buys being allowed to talk about buyers expirience would save some people from being scammed. Though, it goes against the OP if the sellers can't be noticed and put into an AD account.
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Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
It's not an incorrect analogy. There have been studies done where people have said that they would rob a bank if it wasn't illegal. Basically, the only thing stopping a decent amount of people from robbing banks is the fact that it's illegal. The same has been done for some recreational drugs, with similar results.
As such, removing the ban-worthyness of using goldfarmers means that it is very likely that more people would use them. This would in turn mean that there is more influence in the game just by virtue of having more goldfarmers doing nothing but trying to earn influence and selling it. And this would drive up prices for everyone, meaning that more and more people would believe that the only way to compete is to buy gold, such that they either leave or begin to use the services themselves. But this is a fairly pointless discussion, because even if the Devs did consider doing this, they'd have their whole legal team shouting back at them telling them that they can't do this, and that they HAVE to take the position that it's against the TOS. I'm sorry if you think that's wrong, but it's really not. It is in the best interest of NCSoft, Paragon Studios, you and me to have the use of goldfarmers be against the TOS and EULA. |
"gold" isn't the bread and butter of any MMO, it's the expirience, the fun, the friendships, etc.
That being said, robbing a bank is stealing someone elses money. where as "gold" traders, They pay their monthly dues (not stealing) for the ability to "earn" the inf, and they are selling the excess. Also, selling the "gold" to another player doesn't stop the other player from playing, or paying (not stealing) for the game. SO ... they aren't stealing from NCsoft, and they aren't stealing from other players. They are making the "gold" the same way we all are(in theory).
BTW: I posted another solution to the OP request.
Just make the "spammer" emote make their messages appear on their screen only. They'll think they're advertising ... and nothing is showing on ours. FTW
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1) If we talked about the bad sites, they'd change their names, and then someone would have to get scammed before anyone knew if it was a good or a bad site. By then, it could be 6 months to a year before anyone actually got their credit card information sold and used. So the "bad" site would have plenty of credit cards on file to sell. How do you handle that? And how many "good" sites are out there doing something that is at the very least immoral (at worst illegal)?|
Originally Posted by Twigman
Letting us talk about bad and GOOD sites would stifle the scammers and bring the companies that just perform a service to the surface.
If the FBI did that, I would be sorely worried about the intellegance of the people of the nation. Making changes for long term good shouldn't be stifled. Letting evil be hidden in the shadows, doesn't protect anyone. Me: a dark alley that many people get mugged in ... lets put a street light down there. Community(it seems): NO!!! Just tell your kids not to go down there. Me: Wouldn't a light scare the scum away? Community(it seems): Why change things? A few a month are no big deal. That sounds more like a "I don't care if you're scamed" approach to me. |
Any site doing it now is inherently a "bad" company. If the Devs opened it up and said that you can sell influence for profit for their game, there are a number of consequences to that, besides the argument above.
1.1) The IRS could tax influence gains in the game, as it is potential profit. And they could base the taxable rate on the going rate for the sales.
1.2) Again, more people would use a "legal" service than one that isn't legal, which would affect the in-game economy. Either that, ot to counter the influx of influence in the game, the Devs would have to adjust influence gains for everyone, lessening the ability of normal players to make money, especially free and premium players.
2) Complicity in a crime is not stupid to assume. If people are getting ripped off, they want their money back, and the FBI can investigate those who provide even relatively safe harbor for those responsible. This is NOT a far off possibility.
3) Your light analogy is a bad one, again, because a) it's not the same, and b) you don't take into account any other potential harms of the light to people trying to sleep, etc., and c) you don't take into account the fact that the criminals would just change alleys, leaving the population to deal with all of the negatives, without creating any positive outcomes.
In summary, by the time you could tell if a site is bad or good, it's much, MUCH too late. Then there are other possible outcomes to consider, many of them with negative connotations for the average player and Devs. There is no logical reason for the Devs to do what you're suggesting versus leaving it the way it is.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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You've stated that these "good" sites exist several times, but I have no reason to believe that's true. Yes, theoretically, there might be non-scammer sites out there, but that isn't borne out by my experience in-game where almost all of the advertising comes from the same 1-2 sites, the ads for which read like spam email. The burden of proof lies with you here. Do you have ANY reason for thinking these sites exist, other than "You cannot directly prove they don't?"|
Originally Posted by Twigman
Letting us talk about bad and GOOD sites would stifle the scammers and bring the companies that just perform a service to the surface.
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(I'm not trying to bait you into sharing your personal experience with such a site, if you have it. That would not be a wise thing for you to do.)
Besides that, even if such sites exist and do business without harming players, games already exist that sell all kinds of stuff for real money (on a level of "pay-to-win" far beyond what we currently have). They're reasonably popular, in their own niche, but reviled by most players I've spoken to. If CoH goes too far down that path, I will leave, and I know I am not alone in thinking such.
Interesting thread, just thinking about what attracts gold farmers. I guess they figured theres a need for a lot of influence. Only feature in this game that requires a lot of influence is the market.
So, lets look at the market and make steps to decrease its impact on the game ala account bound items. This would of course require access to all IO related content for all players, but then they could somehow earn it.
Now you wouldnt need money to make the world go round, just need to play the game.
Something like that anyway...
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I like this ... It doesn't fight me, actually recognizes that what I've said has merit. Also, it removes the debate and gives the personal opinion of how you would feel and the result for you as a gamer. |
Originally Posted by Hopeling
You've stated that these "good" sites exist several times, but I have no reason to believe that's true. Yes, theoretically, there might be non-scammer sites out there, but that isn't borne out by my experience in-game where almost all of the advertising comes from the same 1-2 sites, the ads for which read like spam email. The burden of proof lies with you here. Do you have ANY reason for thinking these sites exist, other than "You cannot directly prove they don't?"
(I'm not trying to bait you into sharing your personal experience with such a site, if you have it. That would not be a wise thing for you to do.) Besides that, even if such sites exist and do business without harming players, games already exist that sell all kinds of stuff for real money (on a level of "pay-to-win" far beyond what we currently have). They're reasonably popular, in their own niche, but reviled by most players I've spoken to. If CoH goes too far down that path, I will leave, and I know I am not alone in thinking such. |
Thanks.
I don't disagree and also wouldn't stop playing the game if things remain the same (6 years of playing proof) But, I was just giving an option and supporting it.
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New feed back ... I can breath free again |
Originally Posted by Celestial Might
Interesting thread, just thinking about what attracts gold farmers. I guess they figured theres a need for a lot of influence. Only feature in this game that requires a lot of influence is the market.
So, lets look at the market and make steps to decrease its impact on the game ala account bound items. This would of course require access to all IO related content for all players, but then they could somehow earn it. Now you wouldnt need money to make the world go round, just need to play the game. Something like that anyway... |
This would be cool. Change to a (percentage of game played system. or badge system) Where you unlock the ability to use enhancements based on expirience in the game. That makes more LORE sense anyway. Every toon would have to go through the steps too ... not just one. Though. I traditionally hate this concept on other games. it's applicable to this game.
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I'm not in denial, just stating a fact and you're stating reality. I do believe that NCsoft corporate; though, they could change the policy, never will change it.
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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
Denial ain't just a river in Egypt.
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Every time you respond to me, you make it very clear that you do not fully understand how serious things could get for the developers of CoH if they allowed those companies to do business within their game. |
Originally Posted by Twigman
Letting us talk about bad and GOOD sites would stifle the scammers and bring the companies that just perform a service to the surface.
If the FBI did that, I would be sorely worried about the intellegance of the people of the nation. Making changes for long term good shouldn't be stifled. Letting evil be hidden in the shadows, doesn't protect anyone. Me: a dark alley that many people get mugged in ... lets put a street light down there. Community(it seems): NO!!! Just tell your kids not to go down there. Me: Wouldn't a light scare the scum away? Community(it seems): Why change things? A few a month are no big deal. That sounds more like a "I don't care if you're scamed" approach to me. |
You keep talking about gold selling being legal or illegal, but that isn't the issue at all.
The fact of the matter is it isn't about whether goldselling is illegal or just against the ToS of the MMos involved. It's about the fact that a number of the RMT sites are KNOWN to engage in credit card fraud. Now, you may be unaware of this, but credit card fraud is a serious and very punishable crime if you are caught doing it.
If the developers said "Go ahead and sell stuff in our game", they are willingly and knowingly enabling people in a foreign country to commit credit card fraud against their own customers.
The Internet Crime Division of the FBI takes a very serious stance on things like that. As far as they (and US law in general) are concerned, allowing the goldsellers to do business unopposed makes Paragon Studios just as responsible for any credit card fraud that occurs.
Since they can't go after the goldsellers themselves, they are left with the choice to A) Do nothing and allow the crimes to occur unchecked, or B) go after the responsible party they CAN go after....namely, Paragon Studios. Now, since this is the FBI we're talking about here, which option do you think they'll choose?
It is a situation that, at bare minimum, will lead to the game being shut down for being the tool through which the fraud occurred. It also has the very real possibility of the developers being sent to prison for it.
For the record, this is NOT me just making crap up to try and prove you wrong. This is what can, and more than likely WILL happen if the devs decide that goldsellers should be allowed to do business within the game that THEY own.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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Okay. Just glad to hear that you understand that there is a difference. Reality can be a real <bleep> sometimes. |
Originally Posted by Twigman
I'm not in denial, just stating a fact and you're stating reality. I do believe that NCsoft corporate; though, they could change the policy, never will change it.
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I don't remember dismissing it. Or stating it couldn't happen, I said that if the FBI went after a company that tried to make a, I believe, positive step in a good direction. I'm disappointed. It would also show how much fear is in the hearts of the United States. |
Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Every time you respond to me, you make it very clear that you do not fully understand how serious things could get for the developers of CoH if they allowed those companies to do business within their game.
You keep talking about gold selling being legal or illegal, but that isn't the issue at all. The fact of the matter is it isn't about whether goldselling is illegal or just against the ToS of the MMos involved. It's about the fact that a number of the RMT sites are KNOWN to engage in credit card fraud. Now, you may be unaware of this, but credit card fraud is a serious and very punishable crime if you are caught doing it. If the developers said "Go ahead and sell stuff in our game", they are willingly and knowingly enabling people in a foreign country to commit credit card fraud against their own customers. The Internet Crime Division of the FBI takes a very serious stance on things like that. As far as they (and US law in general) are concerned, allowing the goldsellers to do business unopposed makes Paragon Studios just as responsible for any credit card fraud that occurs. Since they can't go after the goldsellers themselves, they are left with the choice to A) Do nothing and allow the crimes to occur unchecked, or B) go after the responsible party they CAN go after....namely, Paragon Studios. Now, since this is the FBI we're talking about here, which option do you think they'll choose? It is a situation that, at bare minimum, will lead to the game being shut down for being the tool through which the fraud occurred. It also has the very real possibility of the developers being sent to prison for it. For the record, this is NOT me just making crap up to try and prove you wrong. This is what can, and more than likely WILL happen if the devs decide that goldsellers should be allowed to do business within the game that THEY own. |
I still hold to the belief that, giving the players that use the services the ability to talk about good expiriences would bring the "gold"traders into the light, not leave them to lurk in the dark.
Nature example: "gold" traders are snakes, and all snakes bite. However, not all snake carry venom. vemon is the ID theaves and the like. The ones that just bite are the ones that make you pay for the service.
CoH example (should get at least a chuckle I hope): You can defend yourself from being scammed by following simple online purchase rules: don't give out passwords, don't use personal CC, research the companies, etc. However, the player that uses these sites have a hole in the armor ... and that is other purchasers reviews. CoH can be the defender that fills those holes. HEHE ... funny analogy :P
again, I'm not dismissing the very real possability for authority to find a scape goat like they've done in other cases. Just saying that it's a sad, pathetic thing that companies have to fear that outcome.
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Thanks. |
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
Okay. Just glad to hear that you understand that there is a difference. Reality can be a real <bleep> sometimes.
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I appriciate the conversation and debate this became, it's been fun.
It was topic oriented and respectful. I love that many of the players are as mature as this. It was a little cyclical for a while, but then information that made me reasses my opinion came out. Then it got a little intense trying to talk with 4-5 at once. LOL But, fun
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And then you'll have people using the /ignorespammer command to grief other players into being unable to talk to anyone.|
Originally Posted by Twigman
BTW: I posted another solution to the OP request.
Just make the "spammer" emote make their messages appear on their screen only. They'll think they're advertising ... and nothing is showing on ours. FTW |
What's your global again? Just in case this gets implemented.
If the game spit out 20 dollar bills people would complain that they weren't sequentially numbered. If they were sequentially numbered people would complain that they weren't random enough.
Black Pebble is my new hero.
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Good questions. thanks|
Originally Posted by Cathulhu
If I understand your suggestion...
A) A Channel/Tab would be created that the Gold Sellers would be allowed to advertise on. B) Advertisement outside this channel would continue to remain as it is (Not Allowed/Banned) c) Players would be able to choose to have the Advert Channel on or Off. Now if this is your suggestion then unless you can solve the problems listed below it looks like it will fail. 1) From my understanding most people avoid repeated advertisements for the same general service. After just one day of this system what percentage of the players do you honestly think will keep a channel open that advertises Gold/PLing 24 hours a day? 1%, 5%, 10%, 50%, 75%? 2) Even if you limit the adverts to one per account per hour the Gold sellers will create multiple accounts and domain names to increase there exposure on the Advert Channel. After all if I advertise 6 times an hour under various websites/names and my competition with the same service and price advertises once an hour, I am likely to get 6 times the business. (This is a common practice in our local yellow pages for Locksmiths since 2-3 calls from a desperate locked out homeowner pays more then the cost of an extra advert and real service cost.) Pretty soon all the RMTers will be doing it and you wind up with 100's of adverts an hour from the same 20 companies. One week after this system is in place with 100's of Adds an hour on this Avdvert Channel what percentage of the players do you think listen to the Advert channel? 1%, 5%, 10%, 50%, 75%? 3) Since advertisers will spend thousands of dollars to reach less then 1% of a population, assuming you did not answer 100% to both questions 1 and 2 , Why would a RMT be foolish enough to NOT use a (Free to Play) FtP account costing $0 to spam the local/help channels, just as they currently are, so they can reach the 25%, 50%, 90% or 99% of the players who have turned off Advert Channel? 4a) If your answer is that the advertised RMTer would be banned/sanctioned, than what is to stop RMT #1 who wants to eliminate the competition from RMT#2 or a player who didn't like RMT#2 from setting up an FtP account and advertising RMT#2 thus getting them banned? 4b) If your answer is to punish all RMTers (Ex. "No one can use Advert Chanel for 1 hour because an advert in local was done in RMT#2's name!") for the actions of one, Then what is to stop a Griefer/Disgruntled player from setting up an FTP account and advertising a RMT# thus getting them ALL banned and leading right back to the current system? "Biggest CoH Grief ever for Epic Win!" Did I say that right |
The concept of the cat would be that advertising would be unlimited on the chat, spam all day and night if they like.
If a F2P account was marked for AD spamming they would be sent to the AD account.
If the F2P account was eith maliciously or accidentally switched to an AD account, they can pettition to be moved back.
The full F2P game would be available whether reguardless of account status. So, the player whose account was incorrectly moved can still play solo and maybe even teams(debatable)
The only reason an AD account would be deleted is for (proven) ID theft, etc
oh, The AD chat would be set as an auto on all new toons. So, new players are guarunteed to see it and then those who are interested in "deals" can keep an eye on the AD chat continuously.
If these companies are surviving on whatever percentage that are willing to risk account deletion, then they'll survive with just an AD chat. LOL
That is why EBay and Craiglist both ban accounts that they know to be scamming people or doing things that are against the TOS. Similarly, CoH could get in trouble if they did not do anything to prevent known criminal activity in their game. And that is what this is, whatever you choose to call it.
----snip----
Maybe if it weren't illegal in this country ... we would have US based (credible) "gold" traders.
Making something illegal doesn't stop a problem or address a problem, just creates a bigger problem. -prohabition-