WP is effectively identical for brutes and scrappers. The only advantage for brutes is that they get slightly more HP. This results in slightly more regen. Wowie.
However! I would suggest to you that SJ is not so busy a primary that you couldn't stand a secondary that is itself a little more active. Energy aura, for example, is a very apt pairing for SJ since it was revamped. It isn't that WP would be a bad option, I just think EA is a little more versatile, now. Other good secondaries include, well, SJ pretty much goes with anything. EA and probably ELA match it especially nicely however.
I personally suggest anything but Willpower. I find the toggle up and smash things approach as being very boring. I also generally prefer Scrappers to Brutes because I like criticals. You may have a different opinion. Something you may want to look at is SJ/Invuln. You could probably softcap S/L/E/N defense and still have good resistances. With a Winter's Gift IO (conveniently available right now) /Invuln can also have 40% total slow resistance. Plus it comes with Unstoppable which is fun. SJ/Regen might also be a good pairing since /Regen is so active and SJ features a number of mitigation effects in the form of AoE knockdowns and stuns. In that case you'll want to go Scrapper for sure so that you can get Shadow Meld.
@Rorn ---- Blue Baron ---- Guardian
Quote:
StJ/Inv is much better on a brute. Dull Pain makes that much of a difference, and the higher resist caps make it overwhelming. Unstoppable on a tank/scrapper is less than useful.|
Originally Posted by Vauluur
I personally suggest anything but Willpower. I find the toggle up and smash things approach as being very boring. I also generally prefer Scrappers to Brutes because I like criticals. You may have a different opinion. Something you may want to look at is SJ/Invuln. You could probably softcap S/L/E/N defense and still have good resistances. With a Winter's Gift IO (conveniently available right now) /Invuln can also have 40% total slow resistance. Plus it comes with Unstoppable which is fun. SJ/Regen might also be a good pairing since /Regen is so active and SJ features a number of mitigation effects in the form of AoE knockdowns and stuns. In that case you'll want to go Scrapper for sure so that you can get Shadow Meld.
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I'm actually looking hard at one of these myself, if I ever get my current crop of projects anywhere close to being finished.
OMG, over seven years and STILL so much to do.....
Vauluur dislikes how common it is to see WP toons, so take his advice with a grain of salt. Personally I would look at Fiery Aura to add some more AOE damage due to the general lack of it in StJ.
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I'm not sure disliking WP is a good reason for others to ignore one's opinion about WP. It's a boring set. SJ gives you enough leeway that you're going to miss it if your secondary doesn't provide anything else to do. If AF_Bill wanted to pair something with titan weapons, on the other hand, WP would be a better choice since TW puts plenty on your to-do list all by itself.
SJ/Anything is not going to feel overactive by comparison, thus it seems perfectly reasonable to suggest spicier secondaries, no?
At this point I've got decent time in on these types of SJ characters (low to mid 40's, except 1 on beta I only got to mid 30's before they wiped SJ):
SJ/WP Scrapper (beta) - Street Judge
SJ/WP Brute (live) - Street Rules
SJ/Regen Brute (live) - Verdict
SJ/SR Scrapper (live) - Street Legal
For me, the SJ/WP Brute plays the best and is the most fun. The SJ/SR Scrapper had a lot of END and AoE problems until the late 30's, but now is on track to be possibly the most dangerous of the 4 as softcap is coming together across all vectors.
They're all pretty good however.
I don't get why no one's mentioned SD yet. A well saturated AAO + Crushing Uppercut is like stalker level spike damage, and both sets have -damage components which stack together nicely.
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I've so far had enormous amounts of fun with my StJ/SR/Body scrapper and I recommend the combo wholeheartedly. That said, the toon is an end hog and I've had to put in a lot of work to get her to where I wanted her. That is softcap, permahasten, musculature alpha and sustainable end running a decent attack chain aoe dps uguuuu~~~.
Well, the aoe isn't that great even backed with Spring Attack but I feel reasonably awesome. Facepunching-SS-CR-SA-SS and variations on that theme are good clean fun.
I'm seriously tempted to do a StJ/SD but I'm not confident I can get that steady attack chain with a fast recharging Spinning Strike, especially without going into Spirit instead of Muscle. That may well be me being bad at builds though, never did get a permahastened FM/SD with softcap and good DDR to work.
Thanks for the thread posts folks... I went SJ/Energy, well... because I have not tried either. I am interested in trying SJ/SD or SJ/DA and I just might. I don't have a /sd toon.
I want to get another toon to 50, so I shall see if SJ is what I'm looking for. Thanks folks!
Quote:
Just so I understand it, you dislike WP because it is "Toggle up and go", but you recommend Inv instead? Inv has fewer toggles (more passives) than WP, and the only regular click power is Dull Pain. So...1 click once in a while takes a set from boring to nonstop excitement?| I personally suggest anything but Willpower. I find the toggle up and smash things approach as being very boring. I also generally prefer Scrappers to Brutes because I like criticals. You may have a different opinion. Something you may want to look at is SJ/Invuln. |
Why not just open up with "I don't like WP, and I think there are too many WP characters in the game", and not try to hide the real origin of your opinion?
Some of us LIKE having a secondary that we don't need to fuss around with, particularly with a primary that attacks as fast as StJ. I find having to micromanage my defenses to be very boring, when it's not very irritating. Under no circumstances is it ever fun or exciting or interesting. Perhaps when dispensing advice, you could at least pretend to have some objectivity on the matter.
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Personally, I like to pair SS and SJ, you can jump far and run fast. Great for traveling around.
J/K
Personally, I haven't gotten a StJ past lvl 18 yet, but both my StJ/WP, and StJ/Inv brutes are fun as hell.
Willpower has more passive regen than Regen does. Who thought that was a good idea?
Can we get a fix for Energy Melee instead of more new sets?
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While I think WP is a great set, and suggest it to many while telling them they may find it boring with it's toggle and go playstyle, I have to say INV having that one click heal does make a difference in the feel of a toggle and go set.|
Originally Posted by Matuse
Just so I understand it, you dislike WP because it is "Toggle up and go", but you recommend Inv instead? Inv has fewer toggles (more passives) than WP, and the only regular click power is Dull Pain. So...1 click once in a while takes a set from boring to nonstop excitement?
Why not just open up with "I don't like WP, and I think there are too many WP characters in the game", and not try to hide the real origin of your opinion? Some of us LIKE having a secondary that we don't need to fuss around with, particularly with a primary that attacks as fast as StJ. I find having to micromanage my defenses to be very boring, when it's not very irritating. Under no circumstances is it ever fun or exciting or interesting. Perhaps when dispensing advice, you could at least pretend to have some objectivity on the matter. |
WP on Stalkers for instance is more fun for me to play as I feel the use of Reconstruction adds to more than just hitting attack buttons, and thusly I continue to wish they'd make WP 2 for Scrappers, where RTTC is replaced by Reconstruction.
I'm probably in the minority on that want though
To the OP, I suggest StJ/SD, but that's because I personally didn't care for EA on Scrappers. But admittedly that's because I don't like how the mez protection has to be turned off to effectively use the Stealth power.
Though, I have been enjoying my StJ/Regen. It's level 50 with some of Incarnate abilities unlocked and plays nicely
It'd be fully Incarnated by now if it wasn't for me trying to level up my ELA/TW Tanker.
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One of the things I like about EA on scrappers is that the stealth is effectively just a bonus. You don't give anything up for it, so you might as well look at it as though you don't even have stealth, except that a lot of the time you do. It goes surprisingly well with an aggro aura - without teammate interference, you can pick off the sybils on the ITF without the main spawns in a room even knowing you're there, yet the hostage-keepers won't run away from you. Intriguing!
I went with SJ/EA, I've been busy in RL, and by scrapper isn't anywhere pimped out as I would like.
I tried EA wayback when it first came out with City of Villians, and I wasn't too impressed with it then. I had wanted to try it now that they have did some improvements on the set, and also with a scrapper alt, now that the set has been ported.
I went with SJ since it was a new set, that looked interesting
WP wouldn't be a bad set to pair with SJ, WP is perhaps the most well rounded set out there, but the main reasons why I stayed away from SJ/WP was that it was way too common, and have done WP
As far as how things worked out( currently at 39), EA is much better now than it was, and as someone else mentioned, the stealth aspect works better on scrapper, and the combination has worked out great. w/o pulling my old EA brute out of mothballs, I'd say EA is better for scrappers than for brutes.
SJ, it has beautiful graphics for all of its powers, which is great. In terms of effectivness, I'd describe it the WP of the melee sets, in that it is a set well balanced between ST and AE damage, as well as DPS and Burst Damage. Its not overlly strong in any, but not overlly weak either
And the the two sets, seem to have worked well together.
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As has been said, Dull Pain actually makes a significant difference. It may be true that I don't like Willpower, it may also be true that there a lot of people that do. I don't recall saying anything about people not liking it. In fact, my post says that I don't like the toggle up and go set because I find it boring. It then says "You may have a different opinion."
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Originally Posted by Matuse
Just so I understand it, you dislike WP because it is "Toggle up and go", but you recommend Inv instead? Inv has fewer toggles (more passives) than WP, and the only regular click power is Dull Pain. So...1 click once in a while takes a set from boring to nonstop excitement?
Why not just open up with "I don't like WP, and I think there are too many WP characters in the game", and not try to hide the real origin of your opinion? Some of us LIKE having a secondary that we don't need to fuss around with, particularly with a primary that attacks as fast as StJ. I find having to micromanage my defenses to be very boring, when it's not very irritating. Under no circumstances is it ever fun or exciting or interesting. Perhaps when dispensing advice, you could at least pretend to have some objectivity on the matter. |
@Rorn ---- Blue Baron ---- Guardian
Sorry, I'm having a little trouble grasping this.
How does clicking dull pain every 2 minutes or so add some huge extra dynamic?
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Because one thing to think about is more than zero things to think about by an indefinite degree.
Quote:
Pretty much this. It just adds a little more to how you survive. And with a IOed out INV it becomes less of a need really, buuut, it still just adds a bit more.
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
Because one thing to think about is more than zero things to think about by an indefinite degree.
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Quote:
Because if you click it every time it's up you're not getting the full effect. I use mine when I need it. Not more or less than that.|
Originally Posted by Matuse
Sorry, I'm having a little trouble grasping this.
How does clicking dull pain every 2 minutes or so add some huge extra dynamic? |
I'm not saying it's as active as a Regen or anything. Nothing is. I'm just saying it's more active than Willpower and gives me something to think about while I'm wading through minions.
@Rorn ---- Blue Baron ---- Guardian
Nope, not buying it. At best, this would represent a microscopic change in how the two sets play.
I don't see any difference between Dull Pain and using a green skittle once in a while, other than the availability of the Insp.
Great Wall of Prophecy, reveal to us God's will that we may blindly obey.
Free us from thought and responsibility
We shall read things off of you.
Then do them
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Quote:
Oh, well some of do challenges, like not nomming on those green skittles.|
Originally Posted by Matuse
Nope, not buying it. At best, this would represent a microscopic change in how the two sets play.
I don't see any difference between Dull Pain and using a green skittle once in a while, other than the availability of the Insp. |
It's also just different using a power and using inspirations.
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Would Street Justice and Fire be really, really bad? How is synergy between these two? Anyone have any thoughts?
I'm leveling a StJ/Fire brute right now, and it works quite nicely. The damage aura and Burn raise StJ's AoE ability from "moderate" to "good". As always, I imagine it works better on a brute than a scrapper, to keep enemies from running away from Burn and etc.
Edit: That's "as always for /fire", not "as always for everything", I mean.
I do agree that Inv is a little more active thanks to Dull Pain, but I still call it a toggle and go set. DP for me is a heal that gives you a significant HP boost. I save it for when I need it and enjoy the after effects.
I main an Inv/SS Tank, specced to the 9s. She is awesome.
I just started a Stj/Inv Scrapper today. While I am aware Inv is better on a Brute if you take Unstoppable (And even without due to the HP difference) I went with the Scrapper do to the higher base damage and Crits. Mids build is a little low on recharge (48.8%, no Hasten) but softcapped to S/L/E/N.
Hello folks,
I've been a busy guy in RL and just now unlocked SJ. I'm wondering if pairing it with WP is a good option, which I'm sure it is. However, is SJ better for brutes or scrappers, or does it even matter?
Thanks in advance!