Elec/ in need of a better secondary...
Speaking from my own experience, /SR on brutes is so much better than /SR on scrappers that it is actually a little bit depressing. The much improved reordering of powers alone sold it for me, and the taunt aura is the icing on the cake. Easy softcap means lots of room to play with other options, like +recharge and +HP. Chasing Fury isn't as bad as it seems; generally speaking after five seconds of being beaten on by a spawn, I am at or near the max fury I am likely to generate anyway. A great choice!
Like you, I am in love with the new EA. I haven't tried it on a brute yet, but on a scrapper it's been an awesome ride. Having a nice heal and basically bottomless blue bar (after 35) is amazing. Having Entropic Aura grant such a hefty recharge bonus just plain feels good, and you can devote some more attention to capping all that typed defense. You do run into a bit of a psi hole, but even then it's not that bad at all. Another great choice!
If I had to choose between Elec/SR brute and Elec/EA scrapper, I would probably go with the Elec/EA scrapper, because I like all the utility it has without having to dip into pools.
Speaking from my own experience, /SR on brutes is so much better than /SR on scrappers that it is actually a little bit depressing. The much improved reordering of powers alone sold it for me, and the taunt aura is the icing on the cake. Easy softcap means lots of room to play with other options, like +recharge and +HP. Chasing Fury isn't as bad as it seems; generally speaking after five seconds of being beaten on by a spawn, I am at or near the max fury I am likely to generate anyway. A great choice!
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Like you, I am in love with the new EA. I haven't tried it on a brute yet, but on a scrapper it's been an awesome ride. Having a nice heal and basically bottomless blue bar (after 35) is amazing. Having Entropic Aura grant such a hefty recharge bonus just plain feels good, and you can devote some more attention to capping all that typed defense. You do run into a bit of a psi hole, but even then it's not that bad at all. Another great choice! |
If I had to choose between Elec/SR brute and Elec/EA scrapper, I would probably go with the Elec/EA scrapper, because I like all the utility it has without having to dip into pools. |
Because there are people who made SR Scrappers before they ever gave Brutes SR and put a taunt aura in it.
They shouldn't have it added when they don't want it, just because Brutes (and then Tankers) obtained it and had one put in. Want a SR with a taunt, make a tanker/brute.
That said, have you thought of going Shield or EA both of which have taunt auras and rely on defense?
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
1) Reroll him as an Elec/Energy scrapper. I've got one toon fairly high with the new /EA, and I'm loving it. It would work with his existing powers without too much explanation, and I'm entirely willing to reroll my scrapper with this combo (the time investment isn't a big deterrent for me, as I love mindlessly plowing through missions on nights off of work).
2) Reroll him as an Elec/SR Brute. I'm not sure about this, as I can't always keep up the "Go! Go! Go!" needed for Fury. It would, however, be nearly exact with his current build, with the addition of actually having a taunt aura in Evasion to keep mobs from running to the hills. 3) Keep him as-is, but pick up Provoke, Caltrops or Web Grenade to "fix" the running. This is my least-favorite option. While taunting foes is definitely in-character for him, he's not supposed to have any "tools" or "gadgets" he relies on (I'm currently having to pretend his aid-self device... thingy is a taser he uses on himself to heal up). I suppose both of these would work, but again, I have the disposable time that I'd prefer rerolling unless it's just plain a Very Bad Idea, in which case I don't want to make that mistake. |
Option1.... Ehn. it would certainly work, and is thematic.
Option 2 is MUCH better. It's simply true, brutes are better.
However, I would suggest option 4: Re-roll as an elec/inv. Set your invuln graphics off. You are extremely tough (tougher than either SR or EA once you get a build on it) and get all the electrical crash and boom you could ever want, and invincibility GLUES them to you.
Try it, you'll like it. Elec/inv is a very good combo on a scrap, one of the few which is near-equal to a brute. (Pet damage FTW!)
Option 3 is a bad idea. Every second spent actively stopping runners is a second NOT spent arresting.
Option1.... Ehn. it would certainly work, and is thematic. Option 2 is MUCH better. It's simply true, brutes are better. However, I would suggest option 4: Re-roll as an elec/inv. Set your invuln graphics off. You are extremely tough (tougher than either SR or EA once you get a build on it) and get all the electrical crash and boom you could ever want, and invincibility GLUES them to you. Try it, you'll like it. Elec/inv is a very good combo on a scrap, one of the few which is near-equal to a brute. (Pet damage FTW!) |
I'm... not really sure /Inv is an option. I don't have the funds for the glad 3% Unique right now, or five sets of Kinetic Combat with which to softcap it. I may try and poke around in Mids, but the character isn't supposed to be invulnerable/unbreakable (Yes, I'm that much of a stickler for theme).
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The important thing is to have fun!
You forgot about the part where Scrapper Lightning Rod does something like 40 or 50% more damage than the Brute version.
It's similar to Shield Charge, except Lightning Rod is an even more powerful attack.
It's not even remotely close. Those two Scrapper attacks are in another league compared to the Brute versions.
Originally Posted by Kazz
1) Reroll him as an Elec/Energy scrapper. I've got one toon fairly high with the new /EA, and I'm loving it. It would work with his existing powers without too much explanation, and I'm entirely willing to reroll my scrapper with this combo (the time investment isn't a big deterrent for me, as I love mindlessly plowing through missions on nights off of work).
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This is your best option out of what you listed.
EA is a very solid set now, with good utility and nearly unlimited endurance.
You can go musculature alpha for sure, and this will give a nice boost to LR as well as a massive damage increase on Judgement's Damage.
If you can work Shield Defense (maybe using the electric or energy elemental shield costume parts) into the concept, Elm/SD is an exceptional AoE burst powerhouse.
You forgot about the part where Scrapper Lightning Rod does something like 40 or 50% more damage than the Brute version.
It's similar to Shield Charge, except Lightning Rod is an even more powerful attack. It's not even remotely close. Those two Scrapper attacks are in another league compared to the Brute versions. |
This is your best option out of what you listed. EA is a very solid set now, with good utility and nearly unlimited endurance. You can go musculature alpha for sure, and this will give a nice boost to LR as well as a massive damage increase on Judgement's Damage. If you can work Shield Defense (maybe using the electric or energy elemental shield costume parts) into the concept, Elm/SD is an exceptional AoE burst powerhouse. |
Also, I didn't know Musculature would increase the judgement's damage. Nifty!
I did notice all the Elec/SD toons a while ago and figured it was just the FotM. Is it a decent toon all-around, and not just in AoE competitions, though? I know Elec has... subpar ST damage, to be kind.
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You're not going to be any less well rounded going SD vs. SR. You'll get a bigger boost to your big hitters through AAO (since when you use AoEs you're generally surrounded anyway) and you'll also get a nice HP bonus and some resistances to take the edge off of hits.
OWTS is also a much more user friendly T9.
The main difference is that SR is much, much, easier to softcap as well as having capped DDR with just basic slotting - SD needs to squeeze a bit more for that stuff.
It's great fun too, I'm loving tossing T4 Musculature Core Fueled Pyronic Judgements on my StJ/SD Scrapper.
You can go musculature alpha for sure, and this will give a nice boost to LR as well as a massive damage increase on Judgement's Damage.
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Is this a bug or working as intended?
I was about to dispute this as I was under the impression that there weren't any damage buffs that affected Judgment powers. Then I logged in my dom who has t4 musculature and t4 pyronic only to find out that Musculature does indeed increase Judgment damage (by about 220 damage to a -1 minion).
Is this a bug or working as intended? |
Of course, that adds like, 1.8 dps....
STILL GLORIOUS.
You forgot about the part where Scrapper Lightning Rod does something like 40 or 50% more damage than the Brute version.
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Oh, no, I know exactly. I have an incarnated elec/elec that I love to pieces.
However, if you want to stop runners, which seemed to be the OP's main concern, a brute is your hot ticket. EA's taunt aura on a scrapper is quite weak, or so I am given to believe.
Is my info incorrect?
If you can work Shield Defense (maybe using the electric or energy elemental shield costume parts) into the concept, Elm/SD is an exceptional AoE burst powerhouse. |
However, I personally find carrying a shield to be a real deal-breaker concept-wise on many toons. YMMV.
I would definitely recommend rerolling as /shield. While it takes a little more work, once fully IO'd it plays like a SR - capped defenses, and capped DDR. However, on top of that, it gets 4 things SR does not offer...
1. The strongest taunt aura in the game. Mobs will stick to you like glue.
2. More Resistance. Not much, but every bit helps.
3. More Max HP. This one's rather nice.
And then...
4. Shield Charge. Glorious, glorious Shield Charge.
Trust me when I say that Build Up + Shield Charge + Lightning Rod is just plain godly. I still cackle madly when I fire it - nothing survives it; it's like judgement, only better. Did I mention you get to do it every 25 seconds? :3
EDIT: Well, since you said builds are welcome if one is exceptionally bored >.> <.< This here is a modifed version of the build I use for my own Elec/Shield - Focused on capped meele/ranged, endurance and recharge. As alpha I would strongly recommend Agility, which will perma hasten and bring meelee/ranged to 48% and AOE up to 40,5. There is room for aid other/aid self, I suppose, if you drop Electric Shackles/Recall friend, but slots are very, very tight. I personally chose to go with the Rebirth regen tree, and that solved that.
There are expensive pieces in this build, specifically the lotgs/miracles/numinas and 3 membrane Hami-Os in Active Defense - the membranes are vital to capping a /shield's DDR, so sadly, there are no cheap substitutes for them.
Someone mentioned Elec/SD scrappers picking up Spring Attack as well, to which I'd say... please don't. Waste of slots on a tight build, and nothing survives SC+LR anyway :3 Not to mention that Spring Attack is a very weak attack - any epic pool AOE has higher damage, and recharges faster.
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I would definitely recommend rerolling as /shield. While it takes a little more work, once fully IO'd it plays like a SR - capped defenses, and capped DDR. However, on top of that, it gets 4 things SR does not offer...
1. The strongest taunt aura in the game. Mobs will stick to you like glue. 2. More Resistance. Not much, but every bit helps. 3. More Max HP. This one's rather nice. And then... 4. Shield Charge. Glorious, glorious Shield Charge. Trust me when I say that Build Up + Shield Charge + Lightning Rod is just plain godly. I still cackle madly when I fire it - nothing survives it; it's like judgement, only better. Did I mention you get to do it every 25 seconds? :3 |
I keep seeing this claim that Spring Attack is just so weak, but I'm not really seeing it. I already want Combat Jumping on most builds, and SJ is fine for a travel power if I want one so it's not like I'm blowing extra powers really.
Mids tells me that the base damage of Spring Attack on a scrapper is 108.2, and that Shield Charge is 127.8. After IOs, I'm seeing 228.8 damage on Spring Attack and 274.9 on SC. Yeah, SC is more, but it's not so overwhelmingly more that Spring Attack isn't still good enough. Especially since if you're going Elec/Shield you're clearly in love with TELESMASH. Or SMASHPORT. Whichever you like. Shield Charge is just more of the same.
Doubling up LR+SC means there's like 25 whole seconds where you're not teleporting in to crush your enemies, and on a team that can feel like ages!
Anyway, I'm working on an Elec/Shield/Soul scrapper. 48%ish to all positionals, with Shadow Meld adding another 30% for 15 out of every 30 seconds just to really push over the edge created by how accurate stuff in Incarnate trials is.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.952
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Cat A. Clysm: Level 50 Magic Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Electrical Melee
Secondary Power Set: Shield Defense
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Medicine
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Soul Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Havoc Punch -- T'Death-Dam%(A), T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(37), T'Death-Acc/Dmg(40), T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx(42), T'Death-Dmg/Rchg(42), T'Death-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(42)
Level 1: Deflection -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(3), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(3)
Level 2: Battle Agility -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(5), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(5)
Level 4: True Grit -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(7), Numna-Heal/Rchg(7)
Level 6: Build Up -- GSFC-Build%(A), GSFC-ToHit/EndRdx(25), GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx(27), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx(27), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg(29), GSFC-ToHit(29)
Level 8: Thunder Strike -- Sciroc-Dam%(A), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(9), Sciroc-Dmg/Rchg(9), Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx(13), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg(13), FrcFbk-Rechg%(15)
Level 10: Active Defense -- HO:Membr(A), HO:Membr(11), HO:Membr(11)
Level 12: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 14: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A)
Level 16: Against All Odds -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 18: Weave -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(19), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(19)
Level 20: Chain Induction -- Mako-Dam%(A), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(21), Mako-Acc/Dmg(21), Mako-Dmg/EndRdx(23), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(23), Mako-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(25)
Level 22: Phalanx Fighting -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
Level 24: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), Zephyr-ResKB(46), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(48), Zephyr-Travel(50)
Level 26: Aid Other -- Empty(A)
Level 28: Grant Cover -- DefBuff-I(A)
Level 30: Aid Self -- Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(31), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(31), Dct'dW-Heal/Rchg(31), IntRdx-I(34)
Level 32: Lightning Rod -- Oblit-%Dam(A), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(33), Oblit-Dmg(33), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(33), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(34), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(34)
Level 35: Shield Charge -- Oblit-%Dam(A), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(36), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(36), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(37), Oblit-Dmg(37)
Level 38: Dark Blast -- Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(A), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(39), Thundr-Acc/Dmg(39), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(39), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(40), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(40)
Level 41: Super Jump -- Winter-ResSlow(A), Zephyr-Travel(43), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(43), Zephyr-ResKB(43)
Level 44: Spring Attack -- Sciroc-Dam%(A), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(45), Sciroc-Dmg/Rchg(45), Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx(45), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg(46), FrcFbk-Rechg%(46)
Level 47: Shadow Meld -- HO:Membr(A), HO:Membr(48), HO:Membr(48)
Level 49: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(50), RechRdx-I(50)
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Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(17)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- P'Shift-End%(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(15), P'Shift-EndMod(17)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
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I keep seeing this claim that Spring Attack is just so weak, but I'm not really seeing it. I already want Combat Jumping on most builds, and SJ is fine for a travel power if I want one so it's not like I'm blowing extra powers really.
Mids tells me that the base damage of Spring Attack on a scrapper is 108.2, and that Shield Charge is 127.8. After IOs, I'm seeing 228.8 damage on Spring Attack and 274.9 on SC. Yeah, SC is more, but it's not so overwhelmingly more that Spring Attack isn't still good enough. Especially since if you're going Elec/Shield you're clearly in love with TELESMASH. Or SMASHPORT. Whichever you like. Shield Charge is just more of the same. Doubling up LR+SC means there's like 25 whole seconds where you're not teleporting in to crush your enemies, and on a team that can feel like ages! |
Recharge: 120 seconds (30 seconds more than both LR and SC)
Compare with...
Lightning Ball base damage: 109
Fire Ball base damage: 142
Recharge: 32 seconds
It's true that SA's damage isn't godawful by any means...it's just made not worth it by the insanely long recharge time. Apart from being overkill, you can't even reliable triple-chain it with LR and SC since the recharge time is longer. The epic AOEs fill that 25 second downtime much better, seeing how they're up for every downtime, twice (My Mu Lightning is up every 10 seconds) Yes, it doesn't have the thrill of TELESMASH, but it is delicious red numbers, and most importantly, consistent damage output. While, if I had slots to spare, I might pick up SA, as it is, the slots are better spent on an epic AOE.
Speaking of, using Shadow Meld is an interesting idea... however, there are so many buffs flying around in incarnate trials, sometimes to the point of hardcapping defense, that I would not give up the damage from the Mu pool for it.
And AAO damage bonus too.... properly IO'd SD Scrappers are like SR scrappers on crack. |
I was about to dispute this as I was under the impression that there weren't any damage buffs that affected Judgment powers. Then I logged in my dom who has t4 musculature and t4 pyronic only to find out that Musculature does indeed increase Judgment damage (by about 220 damage to a -1 minion).
Is this a bug or working as intended? |
They just don't benefit from Spiritual (or any other alpha's) Rech reduction benefit.
Oh, no, I know exactly. I have an incarnated elec/elec that I love to pieces.
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Clearly, the Brute is not better in this case.
I don't get it, are you just nerfherding in disguise or do you really believe it helps people like the OP by giving them bad advice?
They don't run from my WP Scrapper, I see no reason they should be running from an EA Scrapper.
However, if you want to stop runners, which seemed to be the OP's main concern, a brute is your hot ticket. EA's taunt aura on a scrapper is quite weak, or so I am given to believe.
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It's true that SA's damage isn't godawful by any means...it's just made not worth it by the insanely long recharge time.
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Of course my KM/Shield Scrapper prefers to Power Siphon before going in and hit a few things first before using Shield Charge.
All the negative talk on the forums about Spring Attack nearly caused me to skip it. Thankfully, figuring I was going to respec anyway, I took it just to see how poorly it performed and I absolutely don't regret it.
Under construction
Really!
Hmmmm. May I ask your primary and main attacks? Because if EA can reliably stop fleeing, I may have some alts to roll.... |
To the thread as a whole: thank you! I decided to go with Elec/EA scrapper, and I just (re)rolled him up. Should be a blast!
For what it's worth, my Stone/EA brute never really has runners either.
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To the thread as a whole: thank you! I decided to go with Elec/EA scrapper, and I just (re)rolled him up. Should be a blast! |
Good luck!
Under construction
Brutes operate differently in regards to Scrappers as goes damage taunting mobs, don't they?
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One final question: I've heard people say Musculature (Masculation?) would be the alpha of choice. But I'm not sure if I should go that or Spiritual. Spiritual would increase the availability of both Energy Drain and Energize, which would both increase my sustainability and survivability. Any thoughts from people who know the game a lot better than I do?
Hello Scrapper forums! I'm in a bit of a quandary.
I have an Elec/SR scrapper whose character and back story I'm extremely proud of, and I love him to death. On paper, he's a monster, softcapped, Aid Self, etc etc.
However, I cannot bring myself to play him for more than one mission as it stands currently, because without a taunt aura (why is Scrapper /SR the only one without one?) mobs are running all yakety-sax over the map due to all the AoE's I'm flinging around.
Thereby comes my quandary: what do to do fix this? I've come up with a few solutions that would fit with his character, but I cannot decide which would be the 'best' option. I've listed them in order of my preference (as of this moment, it keeps changing...).
1) Reroll him as an Elec/Energy scrapper. I've got one toon fairly high with the new /EA, and I'm loving it. It would work with his existing powers without too much explanation, and I'm entirely willing to reroll my scrapper with this combo (the time investment isn't a big deterrent for me, as I love mindlessly plowing through missions on nights off of work).
2) Reroll him as an Elec/SR Brute. I'm not sure about this, as I can't always keep up the "Go! Go! Go!" needed for Fury. It would, however, be nearly exact with his current build, with the addition of actually having a taunt aura in Evasion to keep mobs from running to the hills.
3) Keep him as-is, but pick up Provoke, Caltrops or Web Grenade to "fix" the running. This is my least-favorite option. While taunting foes is definitely in-character for him, he's not supposed to have any "tools" or "gadgets" he relies on (I'm currently having to pretend his aid-self device... thingy is a taser he uses on himself to heal up). I suppose both of these would work, but again, I have the disposable time that I'd prefer rerolling unless it's just plain a Very Bad Idea, in which case I don't want to make that mistake.
I think I can manage a build on my own (or at least cobble one together for further review!), so I don't need one unless you're exceptionally bored. Any input at all would be appreciated, and sorry for the wall of text. Thank you!