Quote:
Opps, I forgot how long DS cast times were. Oh well?|
Originally Posted by MisterD
Hard to understand the fact that release pets does not always work huh? I use it..it does nothing. AKA..it is NOT a fix, bro. Hardly a big deal when each time you zone you have to resummon. Also, you need to check your terms. This is not a quick fix. Since you know..a fix would..FIX said bug from happening?
Also, let's look at your 'only 10 seconds wasted' a bit closer hmm. Demon Summoning. Summon demonlings, 4 seconds Summon demons, 4 seconds Summon demon prince, 4 seconds Upgrades, 2.17 and 2.07 seconds Need a calculator? Or are you just rounding down? Hey look..now my post is constructive! |
You're still a goober for not knowing what /releasepets is. >_> And... yeah. The fact I've been playing MMs since CoV went live and had SO MUCH FUN resummoning on each zone in? That bug is really nothing to whine about.
Quote:
Is it bad that I wish we still had to upgrade henchmen one at a time?
|
Originally Posted by Reppu
The fact I've been playing MMs since CoV went live and had SO MUCH FUN resummoning on each zone in? That bug is really nothing to whine about.
|
Murphys Military Law
#23. Teamwork is essential; it gives the enemy other people to shoot at.
#46. If you can't remember, the Claymore is pointed towards you.
#54. Killing for peace is like screwing for virginity.
I love we can upgrade all at once I just wish they would all do the upgrade animation
The M.A.D. Files - Me talking about games, films, games, life, games, internet and games
I'm not good at giving advice, can I interest you in a sarcastic comment?
@Lyrik
Quote:
If you want to do so for gameplay reasons (ie: not giving one of your Lts. their second upgrade, you can still get around it by manually moving them away from your other pets before upgrading, as it applies the upgrade as an AOE and can "miss" pets outside its radius.|
Originally Posted by William_Valence
Is it bad that I wish we still had to upgrade henchmen one at a time?
|
If you wanted it for concept reasons... yeah, I kind of miss it too sometimes. It would at least be nice if they all animated, as per the above post's suggestion.
Quote:
It would cull the population, which would be hysterical!
|
Originally Posted by William_Valence
Is it bad that I wish we still had to upgrade henchmen one at a time?
|
Quote:
All they need to do is load up the live build on the internal test server and play around with MM's. I'm currently getting this bug every 2 - 3 map changes. So a couple of hours playtime would give them plenty of information from the debugger.
|
Originally Posted by Lady_of_Ysgard
The reason it hasn't been fixed yet? It's hard to reproduce reliably since it happens at random! |
Keid of Freedom
Quote:
I am confused... when was a "Pay2Win" option added?
|
Originally Posted by Warlocc2
Have they done ANYTHING to fix this game besides add Pay2Win?
Damn. |
well enhancement boosters could be seen as pay2win items
http://www.scene-and-heard.com/cov/covsig.jpg
Quote:
Not really. "Pay2Win" is when a game has an item or ability which can only be gained through spending money, and then turn around and require that same ability in order to have the slightest chance in Hades of actually winning. At the very minimum, it is something that offers a clear advantage and significantly increases the odds of victory. Both IOs and Incarnate Abilities could be seen as providing such a "clear advantage", but both of these can be earned in game without spending cash. The Incarnate abilities could possibly be argued as pay to win since you need to own Going Rogue AND have an active VIP subscription to access them. IOs can't because you can earn those in game and earn the ability to permanently access them through the rewards program. |
Originally Posted by Scene_EU
well enhancement boosters could be seen as pay2win items
|
The Enhancement Boosters simply don't offer enough of an advantage, in my eyes, to be classified as "Pay2Win". Even the Premium powersets are not any more powerful than the existing powersets. They may offer some advantages in some areas, but they are still balanced with what is already there.
- Garielle
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Frosty_Femme
I said "ur" which is not a word. It's a sound dumb people make when you ask them to spell out "you are".
|
It seems as though pets only move in when there is a gap in their ranged attacks. so shouldnt the easy fix be to adjust their power recharge times so that there is no gap? why is this so hard to fix? why do i never hear this mentioned at interviews with the devs?
The big reason I don't play Masterminds anymore is that other than Robotics, the pet AI's are just awful. Robotics > every other primary, in terms of control over your pets. Some pets refuse to stay where you tell them to stay, the pets you want in melee have to be manually moved in melee range and sometimes they don't go right away... it is just the control. Control. At Times there is none. It would actually be nice to apply some strategy with your pets other than 'Defensive' and 'Attack this target'. There are some other annoyances like how when pets step on a Caltrop they run for the hills.
Better pet AI control would be nice (more like a massive hoverhaul really...), but doubt the devs ever get around to it.
Quote:
They also have the ability to give us special powers that allow us to revoke powers that they pets can use (i.e. brawl). It would be nice if ranged pets did not spawn with brawl as one of their powers by default, and we had to activate a power or something to grant/revoke that power to them. I would love love love to see this happen on my ranged masterminds. |
Originally Posted by Price_NA
It seems as though pets only move in when there is a gap in their ranged attacks. so shouldnt the easy fix be to adjust their power recharge times so that there is no gap? why is this so hard to fix? why do i never hear this mentioned at interviews with the devs?
|
Unfortunately, I don't think it wouldn't stop the ranged pets from running into melee range of targets.
Has anyone EVER seen a Dev reply to this question? I haven't, not saying it hasn't happened, but I haven't seen it happen yet. Do they know it's broken? Is it mentioned at comicon? I wouldnt mind hearing it being asked at interviews. I mean come on, Pet AI needs some serious work, how is this a minor concern? If tanks damage resistance or blasters damage output was malfunctioning the Devs would be all over that crap. Our set is Broken. If you have ever played a MM you know that, and if you haven't keep you flames to yourself please. But seriously this needs to be yelled out at every meet and greet. Squeaky wheel gets the grease! FIX THE PET A.I.!!!
While I agree that there are some issues that need to be addressed with henchmen, I think that, based on my experiences, the vast majority of problems are caused by the player trying to do things without taking into account how the AI works.
Let me give you an example...
Recently, I was on an outdoor mission. For about 5 minutes I seemed to be "warring" with my pets. It seemed to me that they would not stay with me but kept running off to a point on the map I had already been through. I did everything I could think of, including dismissing and resummoning. Error in the AI I thought. Right?
Well, it wasn't until I decided to follow them that I discovered the problem. There was an enemy still alive that had drawn their attention. And, it wasn't until the enemy died that my pets would ignore it.
Perhaps there is/was still a problem with the AI. But, my point is that, it wasn't until *I* adapted that the problem was solved.
It is also apparent to me that many people who play Masterminds still fail to understand how best to utilize their henchmen. People try to play Masterminds as nothing more than a Controller with "controlable" pets. They don't seem to understand that those henchmen are designed with a "personality" all their own (at least as much as the AI can give them).
Sure, I agree that improvements could be made. But, as far as I have seen, the AI does seem to do a good job of cycling through the attacks in a manner that is the most efficient. Your henchmen are designed to engage the enemy as best as the AI can utilize their skills.
So, before people go crying about what needs to be fixed, perhaps you need to look into the way you play your mastermind and make the adjustments you can make. There are legitimate issues needing attention. But, I think there are far more issues that can be fixed just by changing the way you play.
@ Dr Gemini
Quote:
| �If we would come together and be great role models, it would be amazing to see how the next generation turns out.� |
Um I dont care if my Arsonist has father abandonment issues, I just want him to stop running into melee range and hugging the creature, as he brawls them to death. The main issues to do with Pets are because im not understanding them emotionally?
0.o o.0 0.0 o.o
Really?
Wow, no im gonna go with programming issues for the win, Alex!
Of course there's always l2play issues, but the run in bug and the zoning issues (which is what we are focusing on here) are the main issues. These have been repeated alot in many threads through out the years but we are still being ignored. We understand that they are powerful and thats the main reason we catch so much flak from the community at large, and possibly why nothing has been fixed as of yet. We have suffered for being so strong for the properly alotted amount of time, and even have tolerated Buying our set back from the market now that its a VIP or Purchased set.
But enough is enough. The issues (emotional pets not withstanding) have been clearly stated and need to be fixed.
Quote:
It didn't. If memory serves it was tried with soldiers in either CoV beta or early release.
|
Originally Posted by SimonSayz
They also have the ability to give us special powers that allow us to revoke powers that they pets can use (i.e. brawl). It would be nice if ranged pets did not spawn with brawl as one of their powers by default, and we had to activate a power or something to grant/revoke that power to them. I would love love love to see this happen on my ranged masterminds.
Unfortunately, I don't think it wouldn't stop the ranged pets from running into melee range of targets. |
MA Arc:
Overload (Arc ID #405822) | Status: Final | Last Edited: 5th Nov 2010 for text fixes.
Quote:
I'm pretty sure at one point the mercs behaved themselves, then a later patch broke them somehow.
|
Originally Posted by Peppercat
It didn't. If memory serves it was tried with soldiers in either CoV beta or early release.
|
Culex's resistance guide
Quote:
Pets entering melee when they are designed to be ranged is not exactly exclusive to pets. Just think about all the other types of ranged mobs that will stupidly run into melee when they have little (if any) melee attacks. The Cimeroran healers do it. Those Malta Sappers do it.|
Originally Posted by Price_NA
Um I dont care if my Arsonist has father abandonment issues, I just want him to stop running into melee range and hugging the creature, as he brawls them to death. The main issues to do with Pets are because im not understanding them emotionally?
0.o o.0 0.0 o.o Really? Wow, no im gonna go with programming issues for the win, Alex! Of course there's always l2play issues, but the run in bug and the zoning issues (which is what we are focusing on here) are the main issues. These have been repeated alot in many threads through out the years but we are still being ignored. We understand that they are powerful and thats the main reason we catch so much flak from the community at large, and possibly why nothing has been fixed as of yet. We have suffered for being so strong for the properly alotted amount of time, and even have tolerated Buying our set back from the market now that its a VIP or Purchased set. But enough is enough. The issues (emotional pets not withstanding) have been clearly stated and need to be fixed. |
Therefore, solving this "problem" would require a much broader fix than people realize. I'd be willing to bet that this "problem" wouldn't be such an issue if people just learned to adapt to those pets that have a tendency to run into melee.
Also, by personality, I don't literally mean that they have abandonment issues, though you are certainly able to develop your own interpretations. I mean that (to me) the way the AI runs them there seems to be a variety of stupid and/or smart things I have seen my henchmen do. I know that a lot of it is just a result of coincidence, but I can't help but laugh when they do wacky things.
Anyways, I'd be willing to bet that, now that Masterminds have become more popular for raiding and large groups, we will probably see the devs start to see all of the pet-related bugs become more prominent and fix them.
@ Dr Gemini
Quote:
| �If we would come together and be great role models, it would be amazing to see how the next generation turns out.� |
Quote:
With regards to Bots, all 6 of them do this randomly, adapting to it is basically spamming "goto defensive" every 15 seconds, which gets really irritating if you're in long fights. If it wasn't for the fact that you have to target the location, I'd have had it on auto fire.|
Originally Posted by DrGemini
I'd be willing to bet that this "problem" wouldn't be such an issue if people just learned to adapt to those pets that have a tendency to run into melee.
|
My alternative way of adapting to it has been to play another non-MM character, so that I can keep my sanity.
http://www.scene-and-heard.com/cov/covsig.jpg
Quote:
I suppose to be fair that it would be more prominent and irritating with bots considering they are primarily ranged. Ninjas, on the other hand, seem to be good at a variety of attacks.
|
Originally Posted by Scene_EU
With regards to Bots, all 6 of them do this randomly, adapting to it is basically spamming "goto defensive" every 15 seconds, which gets really irritating if you're in long fights. If it wasn't for the fact that you have to target the location, I'd have had it on auto fire.
My alternative way of adapting to it has been to play another non-MM character, so that I can keep my sanity. |
@ Dr Gemini
Quote:
| �If we would come together and be great role models, it would be amazing to see how the next generation turns out.� |
Sorry bout the smarty pantsedness. yer right, an option that designates Ranged/Melee for each pet is something i have suggested before. The ranged setting would cause the old pet A.I. to kick in. In the beginning all pets stayed at range and used only ranged attacks. My Thugs Bruiser would "sling rocks" all day with Rock Throw without ever running into range. Same with the rest of them. It could also remove all melee attacks said pet may posess, like Brawl for the Arsonist/Medic and various others.
Then they changed the A.I. and this run into melee thing started. So that would be the A.I. for the Melee pets. They fire their one ranged attack (usually) then charge into the fray.
This pet bug like most of the other bugs has been addressed several times but the very next patch usually rescinds any fixes for some derned reason.
Also, let's look at your 'only 10 seconds wasted' a bit closer hmm.
Demon Summoning.
Summon demonlings, 4 seconds
Summon demons, 4 seconds
Summon demon prince, 4 seconds
Upgrades, 2.17 and 2.07 seconds
Need a calculator? Or are you just rounding down? Hey look..now my post is constructive!
As for the time it takes to resummon the pets, up until relatively recently, that's the way pets worked period. Every time an MM entered (or exited) a mission or crossed zones, if they wanted their pets, they needed to resummon and rebuff them. In fact, it was, once upon a time, even worse because you had to put both pet buffs on each pet individually, so multiply your buffing time by six and you have a general idea of how painful it was to try to keep up with a team who was speed running everything.
When they added the change to allow pets to zone with their owners, it introduced some bugs. One is the elevator bug which I (and someone else) mentioned already. Another was that when you zoned you could lose control of your pets. Your pets would still be there. They would still follow you around (in defensive mode), but you had absolutely no control over them and couldn't resummon replacements.
They fixed that, and when they did, we got the current bug. So, yes, it has been a painful process, however, at the end of the day, we're really not any worse off than how pets used to work in the first place. Somehow, I get images of Maxwell Smart and the "Cone of Silence", which always had some new bug in it every time he insisted on using it.
- Garielle