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If it's going to be as a hard dichotomy to team content, yes. And in fact, truly solo, should mean solo, not solo optional, in most peoples' lexicon. I don't exactly get why you'd even phrase this question as such. I'm not saying I *want* truly solo content, like we have in a few cases in Praetoria, but yes, that's the real polar opposite of team-only content. I'd far prefer that most of the content be available to both teams and solo players. This is the norm for this game, thankfully. And it's one of the reasons I like this game so much. I just hope that this isn't likely to change (*note* I'm not predicting that it is going to change. I honestly have no clue. I'm just sympathetic to the poster that fears it may become so.)
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Originally Posted by Tyger42
So, to truly be solo content in your books, it has to bar teams from doing it completely?
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Then MMOs just aren't for you. Period. Because that's an utterly absurd standard to hold them to. Look, MMOs are going to be designed with MULTIPLAYER in mind. They can be made solo-friendly, yes, but locking out the multiplayer aspect is just plain stupid. Making team content that's not soloable in a multiplayer game makes a LOT more sense than making solo content that's not teamable. There are a few things that you can get away with doing this on, but not many.
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Originally Posted by Madadh
If it's going to be as a hard dichotomy to team content, yes.
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Originally Posted by Tyger42
God, imagine that. Creating team-oriented content in a multiplayer game........ There's still plenty you can do solo, and hardly "everything" released lately has required teaming. Put the hyperbole away, it only weakens your argument severely.
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I'm not sure if your are failing to understand his complaint intentionally, or not. It's not the 'oriented' that he's commenting about, but the 'exclusive'.
But, gotta agree with your comment about hyperbole. It's a very common practice, and although it's hardly as big a deal as you seem to make it, since most native English speakers understand it just fine, it does make things less clear, and should probably be avoided. That said, it doesn't in any way invalidate his point. I just wouldn't have used it myself.
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Originally Posted by Tyger42
Then MMOs just aren't for you. Period. Because that's an utterly absurd standard to hold them to. Look, MMOs are going to be designed with MULTIPLAYER in mind. They can be made solo-friendly, yes, but locking out the multiplayer aspect is just plain stupid. Making team content that's not soloable in a multiplayer game makes a LOT more sense than making solo content that's not teamable. There are a few things that you can get away with doing this on, but not many.
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First, nice of you to decide what is for me, and what isn't..
Second, did you even read what I posted? I specifically stated, "'I'm not saying I *want* truly solo content, like we have in a few cases in Praetoria, but yes, that's the real polar opposite of team-only content."
I don't want, and never said I wanted, solo only content. I said I was in favour of as much content as possible being open to both solo and team play.
Lastly, obviously you can have solo only content in an MMO, so if I were (which I'm not) advocating it, it's not as if I were advocating the impossible, as you try to paint it. The fact is that solo only content already exists, so the MMO world won't implode if solo only missions are created (again, for clarity, I'm not advocating this, merely pointing out that is is possible).
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So primary Tier 9s are available but secondaries only go to tier 7 I assume. It's a nice sweet spot for Defenders (unless you happen to be a Trapper but its not the Trials fault that Timebomb sucks so much).
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Originally Posted by Blackleviathan
ALL I wanna know is WHY LEVEL 29?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
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never gotten the 99 zombies. I am running a StJ/elec brute, so, I don't get beaten too bad (especially if I drop a purple), but every time I've done this, I get between 85-95 zombies.
Any suggestions?
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When you start, it takes a few seconds before the counter to actually pop up. Make sure and don't kill any during this time, but still run around trying to spawn them.
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Originally Posted by BeornAgain
never gotten the 99 zombies. I am running a StJ/elec brute, so, I don't get beaten too bad (especially if I drop a purple), but every time I've done this, I get between 85-95 zombies.
Any suggestions? |
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Ran it again the other night, ended up in a team with 3 masterminds and a scrapper (I was one of the MMs).
I can definitely see the reasoning against making it for too many players. The map is small and the hallways pretty cramped, especially with so many minions running around. Needless to say we literally steamrolled through *everything*.
It is a bit of a shame the trial is *exactly* 4 players, I wouldn't have minded running it with just a friend. I'd love to see some more 1-4 player trials in the future. I can kind of understand why this wasn't solo optional, given all the huge bosses and the unique badge challenge. Though I don't see why they couldn't scale the bosses to match the team level. I've only had a couple successful badge runs, it seems somewhat dependent on time make up, I kind of agree that the abomination at least resists psionic, my first run through was all Illusionists and we were all wailing on it and it was just slow going even with debuffs in place. my fastest time was easily with the mastermind crowd, we racked up zombie kills with 5 minutes to spare and steamrolled him in 2 minutes flat.
Still, I think it's a good trial overall. Very fun design, quick fun gameplay and good ambiance. It's kind of a shame it's going away in a week.
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And I granted there were cases where, yeah, it was workable. But, those are few and far between. An MMO, by nature of being designed as a multiplayer game, is going to heavily favor multiplayer aspects. Which does, like it or not, mean making some content team-only. Don't like that? Then, again, you're playing the wrong genre. That doesn't mean the game isn't solo-friendly, though. Thing is, "solo-friendly" does ***NOT*** mean "can solo everything".
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Originally Posted by Madadh
Lastly, obviously you can have solo only content in an MMO
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And Madadh never said s/he wanted to solo everything.
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Originally Posted by Tyger42
And I granted there were cases where, yeah, it was workable. But, those are few and far between. An MMO, by nature of being designed as a multiplayer game, is going to heavily favor multiplayer aspects. Which does, like it or not, mean making some content team-only. Don't like that? Then, again, you're playing the wrong genre. That doesn't mean the game isn't solo-friendly, though. Thing is, "solo-friendly" does ***NOT*** mean "can solo everything".
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Originally Posted by Dispari
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.
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No, just that the fact that it CAN be teamed means it's not solo content... I was pretty much just responding to the utter absurdity of that comment, but also to the general point of the post that started this tangent complaining about the team-only content that has been released...
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Originally Posted by Aggelakis
And Madadh never said s/he wanted to solo everything.
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I thought about this myself. My guess is, with the extra 5 levels of powers - they didn't want us to use our powers from the epic power pool, which is now available at 35. |
Originally Posted by Blackleviathan
ALL I wanna know is WHY LEVEL 29?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
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The chose 4 because they wanted the trial to be challenging to vets - but still easy enough for newer players.
The LFG was actually a good idea. Get your 3 other buddies, and off you go. If you were a solo player, you just enter the queue and check the market or dance under Atlas until you get zoned in.
The choice of 4 players was mulled over quite a bit - I won't look it up now, but there was a post about how they came up with the whole thing - somewhere in News and Announcements, if I recall.
"Most people that have no idea what they are doing have no idea that they don't know what they are doing." - John Cleese
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Ironic that you get the absurdity of the reverse of what I was hinting at, but not the absurdity of what I was trying to illustrate. Just because it can be soloed, doesn't mean it's not team content, since I guess I need to spell that out. That was my point. |
Originally Posted by Tyger42
No, just that the fact that it CAN be teamed means it's not solo content... I was pretty much just responding to the utter absurdity of that comment, but also to the general point of the post that started this tangent complaining about the team-only content that has been released...
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The game is going to have team only content, yes. However, it doesn't have to make team only content. TFs can (and have) been made for minimum size of 1. I think everyone (I know I am) is OK with some content being gated to teams only, but the ratio is what concerns me.
I'm wondering if you play on a high population server or maybe only during high activity times, which leads you to not see the problem with disallowing solo as an option. I'd like to play the new holiday trial more, but often can't. I'd like to team many of these things, but wish, when a team can't be found, that I had the option to run it solo. Same holds true for other content.
I guess a potential solution would be to have some things be soloable during certain hours only, or when the total population of a server falls below a given threshold, but then the debate would be if the hours selected were optimal, or if the threshold number was too high or too low.
Lastly, I know most all the tricks for finding teams. I'm not asking for a list of things that make finding teams easier. I'm wishing that there were more options when these tricks fail.
PS: Thanks Aggelakis
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And mine is that doesn't bar it from being solo content. The thing is, if it's not designed as team content, I don't think it should count as team content in a "team content vs solo content" listing.
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Originally Posted by Madadh
Ironic that you get the absurdity of the reverse of what I was hinting at, but not the absurdity of what I was trying to illustrate. Just because it can be soloed, doesn't mean it's not team content, since I guess I need to spell that out. That was my point.
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Originally Posted by Tyger42
And I granted there were cases where, yeah, it was workable. But, those are few and far between. An MMO, by nature of being designed as a multiplayer game, is going to heavily favor multiplayer aspects. Which does, like it or not, mean making some content team-only. Don't like that? Then, again, you're playing the wrong genre. That doesn't mean the game isn't solo-friendly, though. Thing is, "solo-friendly" does ***NOT*** mean "can solo everything".
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Sorta this.
A multiplayer game being solo friendly does not (and should not) mean that 100% of the game can be soloed. That would defeat the purpose of it being billed as a multiplayer game.
If it were designed so that you could solo 100% of it, it would be billed as a single player game with optional teaming.
Team-exclusive content in a multiplayer game should be expected, and it does not make up as much of the game content as some would have you believe.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
See, thats where the LFG needs to be fine tuned. When you queue, you should be clicking the style of play you plan on doing (Tank, Support, Control, Melee, Range) so it adequately builds your team.
The reason I find 4 controllers weird is that I was under the assumption that it was already forming teams in a very basic manner this way, because every time I've done the trial, I've gotten a nice mix of players. (Tank, Dmg, Support/Control). Guess I was just lucky.
The most humorous one was on Union. My KM stalker ended up grouped with three Controllers. I've been giggling about Adammas being a tank ever since.
(He did, in fact, successfully tank the Abomination.
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