There was this thread that I can't find..
By
Amy_Amp,
Posted on: 2011-07-14 16:50 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
If you are set to x8 your spawns will be the same as if you were on a team of 8. If you then run a mish set to x8 with a full team of 8 the spawns do not get any bigger. Your friend is right.
It would be totally sweet if a full team could increase their spawn size higher than its natural position, though. Imagine x10: every spawn contains 16 minions, 7 lieutenants, 3 bosses, and an elite boss. What about groups that don't have elite bosses? They get an elite boss doppelganger of someone on your team. Cmon devs, you aren't too busy to add this right?
Well, I'm wondering why I can clear AE maps on +3/x8 in less than 5 minutes solo when it takes 10+ minutes on teams.
Now, on the flip side, if the setting is at something like x4, and you are running a team of 8 players, the missions will be set for 8 people. The level (+1,2,3, or 4) is not affected by the amount of players on a team, but the amount of mobs generally is. So, for another example, if there are say 4 people on a team, and the mission is set for x5 or higher, then the mobs will account for the mission setting, not the team size. If the team grew beyond the mission setting, the mob size will readjust accordingly, so as to keep balance.
I hope that makes sense.
Otherwise, could you imagine if the team leader had a mission set to x2, only to have a full team of 8 players? That would screw around with balance issues and mob sizes.
Then, that could lead to TF exploits, or who knows what... xD
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Are the other team members helping or are they dead on the floor and only there to be venge bait?|
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Well, I'm wondering why I can clear AE maps on +3/x8 in less than 5 minutes solo when it takes 10+ minutes on teams.
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Solo your getting every single insp drop that comes down the pipe. On a team thats getting watered down from the others getting their share of the drops.
Other people in an AE mish also tend to spread the spawns out and screw up your target saturation unless they know where to die.
All these factors can add a lot of time to an AE run.
Solo I can clear +2x8 in 50 seconds on a team that goes just a bit over 5 min...
Global: @Kelig
Okay, thanks everyone. Your responses and a couple of conversations with friends have lead me to a new question--
Why is it that bosses exist in AE at all..? All they seem to do is slow down the function of AE in the first place. It was pointed out to me that my warshade kills everything without batting an eyelash on +3/x8 very quickly... As long as bosses are turned off.
Now, when I bring low level characters along, I never turn bosses back on. They just sort of... Decide to "LOL I R turn my self back on."
I would like them to NOT turn back on. If the spawn sizes are the same, I would also like to KEEP hitting the ticket cap in 5 minutes max. on the SAME difficulty setting that I use when solo. I would also like my friends to get the XP that I would deliver by clearing farms at the aforementioned rate, very quickly, without me going past the ticket cap or dealing with bosses, EVER.
K, thnx.
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Well, the actual function of AE is to let us make player created missions to tell our own stories. Since some of those stories are going to include planned bosses and many of them include standard enemy groups (which have bosses in normal play) it only stands to reason there would be bosses in AE too.
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Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Why is it that bosses exist in AE at all..? All they seem to do is slow down the function of AE in the first place.
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Cascade, level 50 Blaster (NRG/NRG since before it was cool)
Mechmeister, level 50 Bots / Traps MM
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Please note that the option is to turn bosses off when solo. Not turn bosses off.
If your argument is that they should have an option to turn bosses off period, g'luck mate. Of course if your point of view is that the devs created the AE so that the player base can farm efficiently, then I suppose that you may think that is a reasonable request.
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Originally Posted by SinisterDirge
Please note that the option is to turn bosses off when solo. Not turn bosses off.
If your argument is that they should have an option to turn bosses off period, g'luck mate. Of course if your point of view is that the devs created the AE so that the player base can farm efficiently, then I suppose that you may think that is a reasonable request. |
Bahaha, fair enough. I suppose I should try to make my own AE mission that just does not include bosses, period. Unfortunately I don't know anything about constructing them, et cetera. I guess it's time to acquaint myself with a new section of the boards?
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| Well, the actual function of AE is to let us make player created missions to tell our own stories. Since some of those stories are going to include planned bosses and many of them include standard enemy groups (which have bosses in normal play) it only stands to reason there would be bosses in AE too. |
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Highly recommend against doing that. You want to include all three of the main tiers of mobs in your missions. Otherwise, the xp the mobs give takes a significant hit. Also don't recommend any more than 2 npc buffers if that is something you are considering for your mission.|
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Bahaha, fair enough. I suppose I should try to make my own AE mission that just does not include bosses, period. Unfortunately I don't know anything about constructing them, et cetera. I guess it's time to acquaint myself with a new section of the boards?
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Frankly, I don't see the big deal of having the bosses there, everything gets cut down by the scythe.
If you're at all interested in experience then bosses give the most of it. That's why there used to be boss farms, but not minion farms. ^_^ (In AE at least.)
my lil RWZ Challenge vid
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Self-PL a SS/FA Brute, you can get to 50 in 1 day if you play all day. I took three. Use the damage aura and occasional ST attack to get to Burn in lowbie farms and using lucks.|
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Okay, thanks everyone. Your responses and a couple of conversations with friends have lead me to a new question--
Why is it that bosses exist in AE at all..? All they seem to do is slow down the function of AE in the first place. It was pointed out to me that my warshade kills everything without batting an eyelash on +3/x8 very quickly... As long as bosses are turned off. Now, when I bring low level characters along, I never turn bosses back on. They just sort of... Decide to "LOL I R turn my self back on." I would like them to NOT turn back on. If the spawn sizes are the same, I would also like to KEEP hitting the ticket cap in 5 minutes max. on the SAME difficulty setting that I use when solo. I would also like my friends to get the XP that I would deliver by clearing farms at the aforementioned rate, very quickly, without me going past the ticket cap or dealing with bosses, EVER. K, thnx. |
Slot only acc and endred and some rech when you get FootStomp and Burn and profit! You can go to fire farms at +3/x8 with bosses. By the time you get to your epics it goes faster and you can start IO'ing. My 50 broot has 30% global rech + FF proc in FS and can do +4/x8 with bosses because I just made him, he's far from the planned build.
bosses need to be in AE mishs because of the xp rule on enemy groups
back when AE first came out the most popular non-exploit farms were maps full of LT only baddies
then they instituted the rule that for custom groups you need to have a boss, LT, and minion type baddy in every custom group or you group would take xp loss (the exception for this is bosses set for objectives, but only the boss)
if you have only one of the 3 in a farm, they will only give 25% normal rewards
if you have 2 of the 3 then they will give 75% normal xp
if you have all 3 then they will give normal 100% xp
then you have to factor in the individual baddies for the total xp
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Considering how well I have done against some of my clones, no. :P
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
They get an elite boss doppelganger of someone on your team.
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the reason the clones are so easy is cause they are meant for levels below 30|
Originally Posted by Amy_Amp
Considering how well I have done against some of my clones, no. :P
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doppelgangers actually dont give any xp if used in mishs above lvl 30
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Originally Posted by Necrotech_Master
bosses need to be in AE mishs because of the xp rule on enemy groups
back when AE first came out the most popular non-exploit farms were maps full of LT only baddies then they instituted the rule that for custom groups you need to have a boss, LT, and minion type baddy in every custom group or you group would take xp loss (the exception for this is bosses set for objectives, but only the boss) if you have only one of the 3 in a farm, they will only give 25% normal rewards if you have 2 of the 3 then they will give 75% normal xp if you have all 3 then they will give normal 100% xp then you have to factor in the individual baddies for the total xp |
Ah ok, thanks very much for explaining that Necrotech. I've never attempted to be in on the "Behind the Scenes" of AE, so this was really helpful to me.
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| If you're at all interested in experience then bosses give the most of it. That's why there used to be boss farms, but not minion farms. ^_^ (In AE at least.) |
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| elf-PL a SS/FA Brute, you can get to 50 in 1 day if you play all day. I took three. Use the damage aura and occasional ST attack to get to Burn in lowbie farms and using lucks. |
a farm should be judged by the xp/min or inf/min you are making and the reason why LTs were popular in the early AE era is because they give ~4x more than a minion and have 1/4 the hp of a boss
LTs are the bread and butter for farms, bosses may be worth more but they also slow things down unless you seriously balance your map out to where AoE will kill the minion and LT baddies while you focus on the bosses
most of the maps i make have minion/LT enemies with rez abilities and bosses with no rez abilities, and with 4 bosses per mob you can fight the bosses while your AoEs will kill the minion/LT baddies
if you want more info about AE stuff or the farms i use can send me a PM and we can talk in more detail
You also have aggro cap issues with a group. Solo, I can pull two groups together and let the AoEs fly. Add one person and that just spreads things out as half the group runs to attack him instead. Sure, I'm not hitting everything with the areas, but not having to run and get more is a huge help in speed.
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No, they created Incarnate trials for farming.
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Originally Posted by SinisterDirge
Please note that the option is to turn bosses off when solo. Not turn bosses off.
If your argument is that they should have an option to turn bosses off period, g'luck mate. Of course if your point of view is that the devs created the AE so that the player base can farm efficiently, then I suppose that you may think that is a reasonable request. |
It was very recently. I just can't remember the name.
The point being brought up was..
Spawn sizes of (whatever)/x8 are larger on full teams than they are solo, correct?
I have a friend who seems to think that your x(whatever) setting determines the size of the spawns, regardless of if you have a team or not, or the amount of teammates you have.