Empathy is still plenty useful. Everyone loves more damage and recharge from your buffs. I'm curious as to why you haven't mentioned the best parts of the set in your quasi-rant?
In fact, the latest trial, Keyes Island, benefits greatly by having a heal-capable player on the team. Just don't forget to buff the blasters.
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Just as a general point, it's only the resistances that are AoE in ID. The mez protection is still single target.
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Originally Posted by scatterpack
Also kin gets mass buff on ID, but no emp CM?
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QR: No.
And the hospital being in the zone does not make the rez useless... unless you LIKE standing around for 20 seconds.
There's more to being an empath than being a "Healzor".
If I ran an empath, even before the iTrials, I wouldn't have res in my build, there's been a temp available for that for many issues now, and wakies before that. I try to carry the temp on all my characters. Yes temps are disabled for the itrials, the whiners will just have to suck it up and use the wakies.
Would I have had Heal other or Absorb Pain in my build ? Absorb pain, definitely not. Heal other, maybe, but likely not.
It would take multiple well timed and staggered Rebirths to completely replace Regeneration Aura.
It would take multiple well timed and staggered Ageless +Recovery to completely replace Recovery Aura.
It would take Multiple well timed and staggered Ageless to completely replace AB.
It would take Multiple well timed and staggered Barriers to competely replace Fortitude.
It would take Multiple ... Clarion ... Clearmind.
It would take Multiple ... Barrier ... Res.
You can only have 8 destinies per team, you'll never have all of them you'd like to have, nor will they ever be used in anything like a coordianted intelligent manner. How many BAFs do you see everyone firing Multiple overlapping Barriers a good 90 seconds before the AVs even arrive, thus wasting 90% of the strength of the power. If the same Barriers were used for the Alpha, and then staggered one at a time, you could likely have insanely better results.
Do people still do stupid stuff and get themselves killed ? Yeap, or you wouldn't be complaining about the hospital being too close by. Therefore, "healzoring" is still just as useful as ever to crutch up bad players that get themselves killed. So none of your powers are useless, they simply may be less "exclusive" and it might be harder to extort someone to pay you 20 million to grace the team with your presence.
My experience is that people pick the incarnate abilities that are best for them and not for their teams - people rarely buff anyone but themselves (except by accident) with the destiny abilities, for example; I've never heard "gather for clarion" or anything.
So, no, I don't think emp is useless. In fact I think it's one of the few must-have sets in Keyes. The emp buffs are still needed because generally teams don't coordinate their incarnate buffs so you can fill in the holes.
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Why would they yell "Gather" when everyone is already gathered?|
Originally Posted by Melancholia
My experience is that people pick the incarnate abilities that are best for them and not for their teams - people rarely buff anyone but themselves (except by accident) with the destiny abilities, for example; I've never heard "gather for clarion" or anything.
So, no, I don't think emp is useless. In fact I think it's one of the few must-have sets in Keyes. The emp buffs are still needed because generally teams don't coordinate their incarnate buffs so you can fill in the holes. |
Not to mention, on any AOE buff power I'e used, I jumped into the middle of the team and let it loose, instead of saying "Gather"
Maybe right before dogpiling on an AV or GM, I might have said "Gather" but normally, no.
Also, using Clear Mind on everyone is just silly. And imo, this is the one power I find the least useful for most of any content.
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Just because people don't call it, that doesn't mean they aren't focusing on using it to buff their teammates. I've never been a fan of "gather for buffs" in most situations and the AoEs on the destiny buffs are large enough that it's reasonably easy to hit the entire team without needing to make everyone else stop.
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Originally Posted by Melancholia
My experience is that people pick the incarnate abilities that are best for them and not for their teams - people rarely buff anyone but themselves (except by accident) with the destiny abilities, for example; I've never heard "gather for clarion" or anything.
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I don't think I've ever been on a team and thought "Wow, these incarnate powers make it so we don't want any Empathy buffs." It takes a planned and well-coordinated team to properly chain incarnate abilities to even attempt some sort of Regeneration or Recovery Aura copy, and I don't remember the last time I was on a team that could be called 'well-coordinated'.
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Originally Posted by scatterpack
Just wondering if anyone was feeling kinda "blah" about their emp with the new incarnate stuff. It seems emps are one of the sets that really took a beating on being useful due to the various Rebirths, Clarion, etc. Also with the hospital right in zone it makes rez pretty useless as well. Also kin gets mass buff on ID, but no emp CM? Just was kinda bugging me as my emp is also a taxibot which of course died once temp travel powers flowed like water.
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I actually thing emp is more useful than it has ever been with the increasing amount of unresited dmg.
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No, but that was just an example - the point of my post is that people are more concerned with buffing themselves than their teammates with the destiny abilities. I still think emps are valuable in teams, every powerset and AT got a bit shafted by the incarnate system but none of them are flat out useless.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
Just because people don't call it, that doesn't mean they aren't focusing on using it to buff their teammates. I've never been a fan of "gather for buffs" in most situations and the AoEs on the destiny buffs are large enough that it's reasonably easy to hit the entire team without needing to make everyone else stop.
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Empathy is still lackluster compared to the powerhouse buff/debuff sets (the likes of rad, dark, cold, traps etc - all versatile powersets that protect the team, significantly increase the damage it does, and benefit you more when solo). That said, I think it gained back some ground with the iTrials, since the prevalence of autohit/unresistable damage means that def and res are not as superior to healing as they are in older content. Your empath will like Keyes a lot - mine did.
One power that has been made almost completely redundant in I-Trials due to incarnate powers is Recovery Aura. Ageless gives more than enough endurance, gives +recharge, and can be made perma. I would like it if Recovery Aura was given a nice +recharge component to compensate.
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Empathy is not lackluster in ANYWAY. Ageless is amazing but you will not always run into someone who will try to buff everyone. Empathy is always a good compliment to any Trial, TF, SF or whatever that you want to take on. Plus, outside of kin and empathy the others sets never get any praise from players on live if you really think about it.
Think about it really though:
Thanks man for using Darkest Night buddy! Good job dude on using Benumb on the AV, Cold defender guy! Nope. I think Emp and Kin will always get the most popular broadcast love of all the defender sets.
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Just because dumb people praise it doesn't mean it's living up to the adoration.
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Originally Posted by Negate
Thanks man for using Darkest Night buddy! Good job dude on using Benumb on the AV, Cold defender guy! Nope. I think Emp and Kin will always get the most popular broadcast love of all the defender sets.
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Heh, Either way an Emp, Kin, Rad, sometimes Dark will still be taken before any other primary. I think /TA needs love first before emp gets any hand outs. I feel that in some way this brings Cold, thermal and FF closer to Emps level...all the while emp, kin still remains at the top. +Regen is a godsend to the trials.
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I use Rebirth myself. I've used it when I've seen a team member about to die, and Ive used it as a self heal when I needed too.|
Originally Posted by Melancholia
No, but that was just an example - the point of my post is that people are more concerned with buffing themselves than their teammates with the destiny abilities. I still think emps are valuable in teams, every powerset and AT got a bit shafted by the incarnate system but none of them are flat out useless.
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When I had Barrier, I just clicked it when it recharged (or wait for AVs to be pulled over) and just kept it up.
Of course, I do like that Rebirth gives my WP a self heal
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I agree that TA needs attention before anything else, but the idea that emp is somehow better than cold is alien to me. At best, I would say that emp and sonic are battling it out for second worst after TA.
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Originally Posted by Negate
Heh, Either way an Emp, Kin, Rad, sometimes Dark will still be taken before any other primary. I think /TA needs love first before emp gets any hand outs. I feel that in some way this brings Cold, thermal and FF closer to Emps level...all the while emp, kin still remains at the top. +Regen is a godsend to the trials.
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Empathy is always the most useful power set in the game to have around. Yes, the other sets may offer things that an Empath would like to have or makes direct healing less important. But, there is no replacing the consistency that Empathy has.
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Empathy is not always the most useful buff/debuff set to have around. It has a lot of tools to keep characters on their feet but relatively little ability to make teams kill faster (unlike most debuff powersets, which do both equally well). The better other characters can handle incoming damage and manage their endurance, the less it has to contribute. Like forcefields and tauntbots, it belongs to this weird class of heroes whose usefulness is directly proportional to how badly other characters suck.|
Originally Posted by DrGemini
Empathy is always the most useful power set in the game to have around. Yes, the other sets may offer things that an Empath would like to have or makes direct healing less important. But, there is no replacing the consistency that Empathy has.
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It's not consistent, either. It's somewhat better on small teams (where you can keep everyone under Fort) than big ones. It's a lot better on any team than when solo.
Don't get me wrong. I like playing empathy, to the tune of 150 levels of it, and recent changes have, as discussed, added some luster to a powerset that modern IO builds have little use for. It's just that liking a powerset doesn't mean I have to pretend it's the best.
Just wondering if anyone was feeling kinda "blah" about their emp with the new incarnate stuff. It seems emps are one of the sets that really took a beating on being useful due to the various Rebirths, Clarion, etc. Also with the hospital right in zone it makes rez pretty useless as well. Also kin gets mass buff on ID, but no emp CM? Just was kinda bugging me as my emp is also a taxibot which of course died once temp travel powers flowed like water.
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