Run-In Bug Fix

Easy fix for this horribly annoying bug: Ranged/Normal/Melee Option.

A quick addition to individual MM pets that would remove certain powers from their line up without rewriting the entire A.I..

If set to Ranged, melee attacks will not fall into the line up for that pet i.e.: Thugs Arsonist, Mercs Medic, etc.
If set to normal Pet attack chain is as it always was.
If set to Melee, ranged attacks will not fall into the line up for pets like Thugs Bruiser.

This could be done without a complete rewrite to the pet A.I. and without major changes in pet behavior or powersets. Please consider this as this is a MAJOR issue for MM playability.

Thank you.

What, you don't like all your mercs or bots charging Siege and dying 3 seconds later when you acidentally hit your attack button?

People have ben asking for this change forever.... I would love to see it as well, but devs don't particularly seem to care these days (at least not enough to eve say it's being looked at). Sigh.

Sorry, but this won't fix the Run-In bug

You'll notice that Protector Bots have no melee attack (so clearly it won't come up in their attack chain), but they still run into Melee.

A true fix? For whatever reason, when a MM tells its pets to attack a Vault Door (mayhem or prison cells), they won't close into melee. A fix for pet run-in would probably come from looking at why pets don't close in on Vault Doors and applying that to the appropriate pets for all targets.

Um. That won't change anything.

My protector bot runs into melee, and he doesn't even have any melee attacks.

and don't forget it also effects other pet summoners too not just MMs

oh and the Devs from every MMO I've played hate the pet classes they created - pet AI is just not Dev friendly

My search-fu is weak on these boards, so if someone can find it great. But I am pretty sure one of the rednames commented on this a while back about why the pets were coded this way. Short explanation, it was a balance issue. If the pets were to remain at ranged they'd be overpowered.

I too hate the AI the pets use, I sometimes find myself fighting to keep them at ranged. When I play my MM it definitely improves my APM, that's for sure.

Well, thats a first. No "Your idea sux!" posts... Thank you all. So basicly we're back to the Devs don't care. Seriously this "rush the new without fixing the old" crap is why i left the game for a couple of years. Well, at least it was a good idea... Thanx again, Yall. yeh Im Southern.

But the fact that everyone can have pets, be it lore, profession or patron based, sort of nullifies that no?

I believe the AI fix that was done a year or so ago was to cause all critters to cycle through their powers better; for example, until then Lord Recluse in the STF almost never used his End draining ranged attack, now he does. Unfortunately, pets use the same AI as critters, so now they are trying to use every possible attack, which includes running into melee if necessary. I think the statement from Castle was in regards to "spawn AI", which is another thing, and causes the members of a spawn to do different things to make them less vulnerable to our AoEs and make combat more interesting. Thus, some foes will stay at range, some will run into melee, based on their "preferences" for ranged or melee combat. This also tends to force one or two of our ranged pets to charge in.

I'd be happy if they just set it up so that Stay meant, well, Stay. Not "Stay for the next 5 seconds, then do whatever you want".

October 2010 I sent a PM to Castle:

Ahhh hope! So its something they know about AND are planning on fixing. Maybe they will look at my suggestion as an easy out then. maybe they can put the old stay-at-range a.i. back in for the ranged option. there are lots of options, both easy and hard, that could be utilized. In any event it is a ray of light for we MM's.

Many moons ago - I think it was even before the forum merge - some suggested a few things to help the pets to stay at range. Nothing ever materialised, so no one cared to bring up the issue since. And I stopped thinking about it anymore.

Anyway, while we are on the subject, I think some suggested something along the line of a 'Forced-Goto' or 'Forced-Stay'; as in the pets' little feet will glue to the spot the MM wanted them to. So melee pets would stay within the crowd and stop running around chasing runners off the map (ahem, ninjas); and ranged pets would away at some distance. They might get some leeway so they can move within a, say, 15ft radius - but that's all.

I have been away for some time. But I think once in a while, someone would suggest taking away the melee skills from ranged-pets all together. I think that suggestion mainly target bots, some thugs and mercs. To be honest, I think it is a good suggestion given the current AI. Perhaps replacing the basic Brawl with a ranged power of similar DPS. This may just be the best quick fix for the ranged pets.

One other suggestion was made along the line of pet movement in relation to the MM. Pets are all over the place when the MM moves. The 100ft auto-summon is ok but having the option to reduce the range would been much better. MMs are having a hard time catching up in a fast pace team. I remember someone suggested something like a 'Formation March' or something like that where the pets are moving in a fixed formation (perhaps have certain degree of flexibility along an irregular map) trailing behind for no more than, say, 10ft to 20ft. Other games can do it, albeit with fewer pets (like White Lion and Squig Herder in WAR). I do not know how hard it is to code it but pets AI is so long over due.

I hate to see ranged pets running in. I have to use 'Goto' to move them back BUT still rather often their line up the Goto command after their attack chain. Similar problem with melee pets too when they decide to go after a runner. You saw it; click 'Goto' as fast as you can; the pets merrily ignore you and do their business; then they respond. Luckily, they might not be that dead by then.

well, so long as the pets are near their MM they get a bonus too. I thinki its like a +Dam, +Res, +Acc. but only as long as the pets are nearby. This is another symptom of the run-in bug, because they immediately leave that range when they run in, reducing their survivability also. I know we are low on the list to be fixed, but this problem affects EVERY primary in our class. They brought back Fire Aura, and someone said yesterday Energy Melee is being fixed to return to PVP. So maybe the bottom of the list is getting looked at soon.

Supremacy, the bonus pets get for being near their master, is only 10% tohit and 25% damage. While these things aren't bad at all, they unfortunately don't help with survival.

Its the incarnate stuff thats hard on most mm's really, so why not make the alpha slot buff pets with similar stuff that Lore pets get, that wont change the way most content played and help mm's keep their pets alive when they need them most.

The fact that Lore pets get a aoe defense buff at all means the devs are at least somewhat aware of the problem. Its just to bad that they have some weird hate on for the whole archetype.

Adding def/res to pets, particularly the melee ones, only solves part of the problem. Run-In it might seem the case, running loose is the other part of the problem.

I have a pain/ninja and a zombie/dark, and I think my demons/therm counts too. When I can keep them close, they do fine most of the time until bosses' strongest ST or AoE kicks in. Still they are within my heal/defence range and the fight can go on. The real problem starts when they start to reposition themselves and, as I mentioned before, they don't respond to 'Go To' very well once their attack chains are in place. Ranged pets have the same problem too.

To solve the problem, there are but three things to do: 1) increase the def/res of certain pets (mostly the lower tier ones because they die too easily and don't do enough before then - particularly those melee-focused); 2) replacing brawl from ranged-focused pets with some kind of ranged power of similar level dps - ranged pets do not need (just the one melee power?) brawl anyway: it is far too weak and do more harm to them than good; 3) finally, shorten the auto-summon range and have an 'Go To' command which override everything and the pets must stay at the chosen location.