It gives a 21.8% damage buff from defiance. My Energy/Energy/Force blapper uses it as part of my nuke chain.
Aim + Build up + TF + BS + EP > nuke.
that leaves about a second of Aim left when the nuke goes off. Including my +damage set bonuses Nova deals roughly 1220 damage as opposed to the 1106 that
Aim + Build up > nuke
would do on it's own.
Other than that, and what Demo said, no its not worth it if you have a seemless attack chain without it. It needed it's animation time reduced to about 2 seconds post nerf to make it worthwhile.
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
Other things to consider about Total Focus:
- Even though it is now a Mag 3 stun, it is a guaranteed stun. Bone Smasher's Mag 3 stun only has a 60% of taking effect and Energy Punch's Mag 2 stun only has a 30% chance to take effect. There will be times when you will not be able to stun anything by just using BS and EP. So even though you can't stun a boss in one hit, you will at least have a better success rate with TF + BS than you would with BS + EP.
- It still does a ton of damage at 197.97 (base). As Miladys pointed out... it gives a great defiance buff and when chained it can be quite effective and deadly.
I had skipped it on my blaster and opted for Stun instead so I could have the guaranteed Mag 3 stun with only 1.8s of cast. But I later respecced out of it and took TF instead... my rationale is, as a blaster, if I'm going to throw an "attack" at a foe, I prefer to do damage--even if the cast time is longer.
My /energy is an AR so i don't get Aim, but my attack chain to kill the target = BU + BS + EP + TF + EP + BS. Usually, nothing survives that, but in the rare times it does, I'll use Power Trust for funsies and then shoot it.
But if I'm more concerned about stunning the target, I'll open with BS and follow up with TF, then EP if needed, and if it's still not stunned, BS is recharged and I can use that again.
Being a Blaster is usually more about burst damage than DPS as well. If you're solo, leaping past (or knocking back a target) and landing one big hit is better and safer for you: I do this all the time on bosses and EBs. In fact, I find myself missing it on the EM Blasters I have that did not take it.
The faster attacks are nice and I would recommend them (and use them more often), but Total Focus has plenty of use for me.
Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc: Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory
I'm afraid my Eng/Eng would have to hang up his boss killer routine without TF.
I can't imagine rolling him without it really...
Maestro Mavius - Infinity
Capt. Biohazrd - PCSAR
Talsor Tech - Talsorian Guard
Keep Calm & Chive On!
Total Focus? Attack Chain Staple. Never leave home without it.
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That's an interesting attack chain for a guy who has repeatedly and vociferously argued that hail of bullets is terrible because it keeps the poor squishy blaster in melee for so long that it's a guaranteed death sentence.|
Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
It gives a 21.8% damage buff from defiance. My Energy/Energy/Force blapper uses it as part of my nuke chain.
Aim + Build up + TF + BS + EP > nuke. |
Anyway, on topic, has total focus ever actually been worth taking? If you like how it looks, the answer is surely yes. Otherwise, you might as well just use energy punch. Total focus does 46% of its dpa, comes late in the build, roots you, et cetera. If you are a melee fiend, then presumably you can get by with bone smasher and a ranged attack to fill in the gaps between energy punching things.
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You are posting under the false premise that HoB and Nova are comparible powers, they aren't anymore comparible than (the also false premise) apples = oranges. If you have paid attention to my posts I have made my case quite clear on HoB and how the ills of DP could be remedied. You simply can't clear a spawn with HoB.|
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
That's an interesting attack chain for a guy who has repeatedly and vociferously argued that hail of bullets is terrible because it keeps the poor squishy blaster in melee for so long that it's a guaranteed death sentence.
Anyway, on topic, has total focus ever actually been worth taking? If you like how it looks, the answer is surely yes. Otherwise, you might as well just use energy punch. Total focus does 46% of its dpa, comes late in the build, roots you, et cetera. If you are a melee fiend, then presumably you can get by with bone smasher and a ranged attack to fill in the gaps between energy punching things. |
My blapper's Nova attack chain is indeed an interesting attack chain and since I can alternate Eye of the Magus and Force of Nature with judicious use of Geas of the Kind Ones and PFF I can make it work just about every time Nova is up, definately on those occasions when I need a spawn clearing attack.
DP hasn't got a snowballs chance in comparison and will never clear a spawn with HoB.
Anyway back on topic. When TF was mag 4 stun you could eliminate the threat of a non stun resistant boss in 3.3 seconds, 3.2 of which could be done outside of melee range by kiting.
For equivalent safety (provided all attacks hit), post nerf, it takes 7.1 seconds of animation (not including the animation time of Aim and Build up since you can do those before aggro) plus any travel time needed (Power Thrust, Stun, Power Thrust, Total Focus) to half kill and stun the boss.
You can kill that same even level boss in 6 seconds (again excluding the animation times of Aim and Build up) using Bone Smasher, Energy Punch, Power Thrust, Power Bolt and Power Blast.
The thing that I find most puzzling about the TF nerf (and the acrobatics nerf) is that it came on the heels of the defiance change, which was put into place because blasters were, without exception, the one class in the entire game that received rewards at a rate far below the next least rewarding class. So they made it easier to survive (or at least gain rewards) on one hand and then turned around and made it harder again.
In my opinion (and experience) the no toggle drop on mez and the inspiration combining mechanism did more to increase blaster reward speed than any of the changes that were actually made to defiance.
In the case of my AR and Archery blasters the reduction in animation times did more to increase reward gain than anything else.
Watching the field on PuG (and even several experienced teams) blasters are, almost without exception, the first to be defeated and those most often defeated on any team I run on.
I wonder if the defiance changes actually achieved the desired result. I would venture to say that blasters are still the lowest rewarding AT even post defiance change. I just wonder if the devs have data mined to find out if they have been raised up enough in comparison to the other ATs.
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
My Blasters are definitely the characters I faceplant most on teams with, but they also are the characters I do the most damage on. I'd agree that solo they underperform a bit compared to some other classes if you look at fully IOed builds and how high you can crank the difficulty, but they can obliterate spawns on standard difficulty faster than just about anyone (possibly even Scrappers or Brutes due to the fact that they don't have to chase runners) when using SOs and that's what the game is balanced around.
As far as Total Focus goes, it still has uses. Total Focus + Stun = a disabled boss, and Total Focus + Bone Smasher has a decent chance of doing it. That can be handy, especially if you joust with the initial TF and then run up and Stun him. And of course Total Focus hits extremely hard... it may not have the DPA of some other attacks but it's great for clobbering someone while Bone Smasher and your tier 3 blast are recharging.
It's actually least useful on a more Blapper-ish build that takes Energy Punch, especially if it has good recharge. If you have a continuous high DPA attack chain then Total Focus slows down your damage and is really just a hard hitting stun, but if you only have Bone Smasher and your ranged blasts then a third heavy hitter can really crank up your burst damage and let you flatten bosses quicker (especially if you lack global recharge). And if you are going with a ranged build and just grabbing one melee attack for the times someone reaches you... well, why not a really powerful one?
Cascade, level 50 Blaster (NRG/NRG since before it was cool)
Mechmeister, level 50 Bots / Traps MM
FAR too many non-50 alts to name
[u]Arcs[u]
The Scavenger Hunt: 187076
The Instant Lair Delivery Service: 206636
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ho ho ho
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You simply can't clear a spawn with HoB. DP hasn't got a snowballs chance in comparison and will never clear a spawn with HoB. |
@Dysc, on virtue:
Virtue blues: Overnight (DP/MM), Kid Ridiculous (FC/rad), Panorama (Ill/time)
Virtue reds: Block Party (SS/SD), Goldcrush (earth/fire), Deadwire (claws/elec), Snowcrush (ice/kin)
Blap on my brother!
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I used to think that way as well. Heck, I once made a post with almost those exact words, and using many of the same DPS arguments posted in this thread.|
Originally Posted by Test_Rat
I can use Nrg Punch, and Bone Smasher in the time this power animates.
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But as I continued down the road to blapping, I became more and more disenfranchised with the idea of using random ranged attacks as filler. And I eventually came to the realization that Energy Punch and Bone Smasher simply do not recharge fast enough. No matter now many recharge bonuses I slot, my attack chain will never be Energy Punch -> Bone Smasher -> repeat. But I can toss in a Total Focus while those two are recharging, lessening the need to resort to scrubby ranged attacks.
I'm sure our friendly math heroes will disagree, and they are perfectly within their rights to. But it's a blapper thing.
The Bacon Compels You.
KO blow is amazing. Wish it recharged faster
Quote:
It's been long enough since defiance 2.0 was introduced that I don't remember, but has anyone done any math on cost effectiveness of various defiance powers? Long animating powers generally give higher numbers, but they obviously take longer, and usually also have lower DPAs. Are you better off firing off that TF or just a pair of quicker animating attacks instead, even if prepping for a nuke? Just ottomh calcs show a 24% defiance from a Blast + Burst chain, which should take roughly the same time as TF, though TF's buff lasts a bit longer--that might be the key as TF's defiance will last through all of the Aim+BU phase, but then there's no reason you have to wait til the absolute last second of Aim to fire off Nova either. |
Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
It gives a 21.8% damage buff from defiance. My Energy/Energy/Force blapper uses it as part of my nuke chain.
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Oh, and yeah, set mule for Mako's for my En/En. Hardly ever use it though in my attack chain unless I want to stun an Lt or lower, which is to say almost never.
Code:
Attack Name Dam Act DPA Energy Punch 109.00 0.83 103.22 Bone Smasher 144.59 1.5 84.26 Total Focus 197.97 3.3 57.68 Power Bolt 62.56 1 52.66 Power Blast 102.60 1.67 55.52 Power Burst 132.63 2 59.10
Naturally, Fire, Ice, Arch & Psy, all with superior T3 blasts, would all fare even better w/o TF in their ST chains.
An Offensive Guide to Ice Melee
Quote:
Oddly enough I can give you an answer to that question. I tested it on my Arch/Dev. Devices has the longest and most egregious animation times in the game.|
Originally Posted by dave_p
It's been long enough since defiance 2.0 was introduced that I don't remember, but has anyone done any math on cost effectiveness of various defiance powers? Long animating powers generally give higher numbers, but they obviously take longer, and usually also have lower DPAs. Are you better off firing off that TF or just a pair of quicker animating attacks instead, even if prepping for a nuke? Just ottomh calcs show a 24% defiance from a Blast + Burst chain, which should take roughly the same time as TF, though TF's buff lasts a bit longer--that might be the key as TF's defiance will last through all of the Aim+BU phase, but then there's no reason you have to wait til the absolute last second of Aim to fire off Nova either.
Oh, and yeah, set mule for Mako's for my En/En. Hardly ever use it though in my attack chain unless I want to stun an Lt or lower, which is to say almost never. Code:
Attack Name Dam Act DPA Energy Punch 109.00 0.83 103.22 Bone Smasher 144.59 1.5 84.26 Total Focus 197.97 3.3 57.68 Power Bolt 62.56 1 52.66 Power Blast 102.60 1.67 55.52 Power Burst 132.63 2 59.10 Naturally, Fire, Ice, Arch & Psy, all with superior T3 blasts, would all fare even better w/o TF in their ST chains. |
Time Bomb gives a 52.8% defiance buff that lasts for 15.5 seconds.
Trip Mine gives 26.4% defiance buff that lasts 11.5 seconds.
Caltrops gives a 7.1% defiance buff that lasts 8.57 seconds.
You can set a Time Bomb at your feet (Defiance 52.8%, 15.5 seconds remaining)
Drop a trip mine at your feet (Defiance buff 79.2%, 6.5 seconds remaining)
Drop Caltrops at your feet (Defiance buff 86.3%, 5.43 seconds remaining)
Aim (Defiance buff 86.3% + 62.5% damage buff, 4.26 seconds remaining)
Roa (784.17 damage, .26 seconds left)
Fistfull (171.11 damage, defiance + Aim damage bonus now at 101.6 from losing Time bomb but gaining RoA)
Explosive (171.11 damage, defiance + Aim damage bonus now at 104.8)
Total damage at this point is 1126.39 and even level minions and lieutenants should be gone. Time bomb won't actually hit anything as it will detonate when RoA hits and none of the mobs will have had time to approach you.
Any bosses that are upright and not running will run afoul of your trip mine and take another 387.4 (497.4 with a crit) total damage at this point will be 1513.79 which should kill of the bosses discounting ticks of regen which caltrops should be able to account for.
The problem is that any blaster secondary that has build up can deal 1233 damage (RoA + Fistfull + Explosive) 26 seconds faster and can do so every 45 seconds instead of every 180 (using level 50 common IOs for ED capped slotting and excluding hasten).
From having tried the defiance buffing Arch/Dev I don't reccomend it because in 4ish seconds with the Arch/Nrg you can add in about the same amount of total damage that the trip mine cap, that took you 9 seconds to set out, adds up to.
You can start with Caltrops farther away and drop the time bomb in the spawn to try to take advantage of it's damage but 23 seconds with the mobs potentially wandering into caltrops or out of time bomb radius is not something I would reccomend.
As far as my nuke chain goes:
I don't have burst in my build and the defiance duration of TF is one of the keys in the chain. Nova is in the last second of Aim to take full advantage of the chain.
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
I probably shouldn't do this, but just as you seem compelled to slam Pistols every chance you get, I guess I am compelled to scratch my head occasionally and point out where I think you are having a disconnect.
If it is so hard to live through HoB's 5 second animation (if we throw in Build Up, call it 6 seconds), how in gods name do you even get to the nuke in your chain before you are dead? And you have to be in melee from the very beginning, because if you add movement the nuke will come too late to benefit from at least Aim, as you state it comes in the very last second.
Even if you discount the animation time of Aim and Build Up (hey, you are likely invisible), you are still in melee with very angry enemies for over 6 seconds before you start to activate the Nova, which takes another 3 seconds before it goes off (I hate dying in the middle of Nova on my Nrg/Devices blaster, thankfully it is very rare).
Of course we both know the answer is that it is not hard to survive that long in melee on a blaster, so you should stop using that as a strike against HoB, especially since they buffed it to add defense to make it even easier to survive.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
Aim + Build up + TF + BS + EP > nuke.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
As far as my nuke chain goes:
I don't have burst in my build and the defiance duration of TF is one of the keys in the chain. Nova is in the last second of Aim to take full advantage of the chain. |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
I would call these quantitative and quite accurate. 6 minions can defeat a blaster in 5 seconds with their Alpha and follow up especially since they can use their ranged and melee attacks. The other crashless nukes can be used from outside of mob perception range and only the ranged alpha has a chance to hit you before you can respond with something else.
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Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.
I skipped TF in my latest build because I found that I simply never used it. I don't miss it. I can definitely do more damage in those 3-4 seconds by cycling other attacks. I was worried it would hurt me against bosses, but it really hasn't.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by StratoNexus
I probably shouldn't do this, but just as you seem compelled to slam Pistols every chance you get, I guess I am compelled to scratch my head occasionally and point out where I think you are having a disconnect.
If it is so hard to live through HoB's 5 second animation (if we throw in Build Up, call it 6 seconds), how in gods name do you even get to the nuke in your chain before you are dead? And you have to be in melee from the very beginning, because if you add movement the nuke will come too late to benefit from at least Aim, as you state it comes in the very last second. Even if you discount the animation time of Aim and Build Up (hey, you are likely invisible), you are still in melee with very angry enemies for over 6 seconds before you start to activate the Nova, which takes another 3 seconds before it goes off (I hate dying in the middle of Nova on my Nrg/Devices blaster, thankfully it is very rare). |
You are right you shouldn't since your comparison is a series of non-sequitors.
Since you have I'll once again address the issue in the (most likely forlorn) hope that it will finally stike a cord.
First lets eliminate the non-sequitors:
* The 10% defense in HoB on a brand new, totally nekkid, Dual Pistoleer is = to a fully IO'd, been played as a blapper since I4 (man do I miss old defiance with this toon), been my main since I9, loaded for bear on accolades, Energy/Energy/Force blapper.
When I'm talking about the suckage that is HoB I'm talking about an SO'd toon (since that is what they are "supposedly" balanced around [not that I find that to be a completely true statement anymore either]) especially when solo. In this case the former Dual Pistoleer.
When I'm talking about the awesome that is my attack chain with my Energy/Energy/Force. I'm referring to a player with lots of blapper experience, (me in this case), running Force of Nature, Perma Hasten, Slotted Alpha Incarnate, and 50% defense from the 2 medium purple insps I consumed 5 seconds ago, with Geas of the Kind Ones, a catch a breath, PFF and Phase shift, the Wedding Band, and Eye of the Magus as back ups. In this case the later blapper.
Winner the ancient Blapper, Loser the newbie Pistoleer
* HoB = Nova. These are not even close to comparable powers. The only thing that is similar (and most likely leads to this mistaken conclusion) is that both powers are tier 9 PBAoEs.
If used wisely the Nova will eliminate the entire spawn (and incidentally fill your insp tray in a fraction of a second). This renders the end crash moot since there is nothing left to attack you.
Even with high insp consumption the best that HoB can hope for is to clear all minions in the spawn (and get a few miserly inspirations over the course of the animation).
Spawn clearing attack - Winner Nova (and all other crashing nukes), Loser Dual Pistols.
* HoB = Full Auto, Rain of Arrows, or any other crashless nuke.
HoB suffers due to the way it ticks and the RNG. We all know that the blaster's real Arch nemesis in this game is a bad roll from the RNG.
Dual Pistols Lacks Aim (as does Assault Rifle) - 2 ticks less than average won't eliminate minions. A perfect, all ticks hit, roll won't eliminate lieutenants. The best you can do (and there's no guarantee) is eliminate minions roughly 3/4s the time.
Assault Rifle does slightly less damage than an average HoB except 10% of the time when FA crits. How ever Assault Rifle does so from 80 feet away. An AR user can start behind an object, leap up and trigger FA, and then fall down behind the object eliminating 100% of the mob's Alpha Strike. Afterwards you still have time to use M30 Grenade and perhaps Buckshot before they are on you. You can increase that safety margin by slotting range into FA and/or using boost range and Alpha Cardiac. FA does have a fairly narrow cone and a 10 target cap but this can be compensated to a degree by slotting for range and the extra safety from distance limits the mobs to ranged attacks until other sources of damage can be applied, especially when using a PPP with a ranged AoE immob.
Rain of Arrows will always do more damage than either HoB or FA as it has Aim in the set. RoA can also be fired from outside of Line of Sight so it is safer than either FA or HoB. It starts out with more range than either FA or HoB and can be further enhanced and/or coupled with Boost Range and Alpha Cardiac. It's 16 target cap makes it the crashless nuke of choice.
The Pistoleer MUST be in close/melee range where objects provide no benefit (and can in fact be a hinderance). The Pistoleer suffers an immediate ranged Alpha and will suffer a melee follow up attack immediately after. Slotting range does nothing for the attack and it's only benefit is being able to switch secondary effects that come pre-nerfed because they CAN be switched and a 10% defense buff (actually 9.25%) that lasts 5 seconds (and is instantly nullified by a single mob that uses a rifle with the burst power).
Winner - RoA, close second - FA, Loser by a wide margin - HoB
Are we on the same page now? Good, now divide by 2 because the base recharge for HoB is twice that of RoA and Full Auto.
(by the way, I too hate dying in the middle of my Nova and thankfully it is also a rare occurance for me.)
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| Of course we both know the answer is that it is not hard to survive that long in melee on a blaster, so you should stop using that as a strike against HoB, especially since they buffed it to add defense to make it even easier to survive. |
The amount of damage my blasters deal has never really been an issue. Surviving long enough to bring that damage to bear has always been, and continues to be the real issue.
10% defense for 5 seconds is merely spitting in the wind. My issues with HoB and Dual Pistols will be eliminated when the devs actually eliminate the problems or at the very least when the powers approach parity when all factors are considered.
- 30 -
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
I am sorry for the derail Test_Rat, but I figure you got the answers you needed anyway, so I do not feel too bad.
Quote:
Indeed. I am glad all your comparisons are not that unfair and ridiculous. You act like a Pistols user cannot have those things (and they really do not need all those things anyway). And I never even hinted that the orange statement you made was true. Are you arguing with yourself? Making up points you can easily counter that I never hinted or intended? I NEVER said or even implied, "* The 10% defense in HoB on a brand new, totally nekkid, Dual Pistoleer is = to a fully IO'd, been played as a blapper since I4 (man do I miss old defiance with this toon), been my main since I9, loaded for bear on accolades, Energy/Energy/Force blapper."|
Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
When I'm talking about the awesome that is my attack chain with my Energy/Energy/Force. I'm referring to a player with lots of blapper experience, (me in this case), running Force of Nature, Perma Hasten, Slotted Alpha Incarnate, and 50% defense from the 2 medium purple insps I consumed 5 seconds ago, with Geas of the Kind Ones, a catch a breath, PFF and Phase shift, the Wedding Band, and Eye of the Magus as back ups. In this case the later blapper.
Winner the ancient Blapper, Loser the newbie Pistoleer |
What I was implying was that if you can get your Nrg/Nrg "nuke chain" off, then it is very reasonable to believe that utilizing HoB can also be done and done well. That is all, nothing more.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
* HoB = Nova. These are not even close to comparable powers. The only thing that is similar (and most likely leads to this mistaken conclusion) is that both powers are tier 9 PBAoEs.
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DO NOT make up an argument I never posited, please. It is annoying and I believe you are better than that.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
* HoB = Full Auto, Rain of Arrows, or any other crashless nuke.
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I fully understand the advantages and drawbacks of all 3 of the tier 9s you post about. I firmly believe you do not. You have great difficulty seeing the drawbacks of RoA and Full Auto. You seem unable to see any of the advantages of HoB.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
The Pistoleer MUST be in close/melee range where objects provide no benefit (and can in fact be a hinderance). The Pistoleer suffers an immediate ranged Alpha and will suffer a melee follow up attack immediately after. Slotting range does nothing for the attack and it's only benefit is being able to switch secondary effects that come pre-nerfed because they CAN be switched and a 10% defense buff (actually 9.25%) that lasts 5 seconds (and is instantly nullified by a single mob that uses a rifle with the burst power).
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In addition, it is not a clear drawback that one must be in/near melee range. Blasters are designed to function in/near melee. There are clear times where being in/near melee range is quite advantageous. Archery can, of course, choose to RoA from just about anywhere, including in/near melee, but Rifle is not so accommodating.
I generally consider the PBAoE nature of HoB to be an advantage, although I freely admit the choice to use RoA as a PBAoE or ranged death is very nice.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
No my friend, what we actually both know is that it is extremely hard to survive in melee range as a blaster, but that you can compensate for it with several years of practice and skill, lots of IO set bonuses, lots of Accolade and temp powers, a boatload of inspirations (colloquially known as blaster candy for good reason), and a good team. All these things will bring you up to somewhat less survivable than an SO'd scrapper accounting for the same amount of skill.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
10% defense for 5 seconds is merely spitting in the wind.
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I guess I just get annoyed when you feel the need to post for no reason and spew the hate. I can understand not liking the set. I can understand you feel it under-performs (OK, I don't actually get that part, but I can sort of see it if I look a bit askew). I can even understand you posting when someone asks. But just posting to slam Pistols after you had already stated your preference? Nah, I have trouble getting it. Now, I understand power-hate, but Pistols is just not worthy of the level of venom you toss at it, especially when you do it uninvited.
Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.
Quote:
It's not hate. I'm not angry. There is no nerdrage or /ragequit. When I post I have a reason and since this is the internet, and a public forum, if someone posts then clearly replies are invited. I dislike the animations therefore there is no shiney that blinds me to the gaps, inconsistancies, and lacks in the performance of the set. I always give a power set a complete try before I make a decision and my posts draw entirely on that experience. It's not simply an unsupported opinion.|
Originally Posted by StratoNexus
I guess I just get annoyed when you feel the need to post for no reason and spew the hate. I can understand not liking the set. I can understand you feel it under-performs (OK, I don't actually get that part, but I can sort of see it if I look a bit askew). I can even understand you posting when someone asks. But just posting to slam Pistols after you had already stated your preference? Nah, I have trouble getting it. Now, I understand power-hate, but Pistols is just not worthy of the level of venom you toss at it, especially when you do it uninvited.
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I do not wish to give someone who has a question about the set's performance any false hope as far as performance goes. The times I jump in are when another poster is touting the animations of the set when performance was the question. If you want to sacrifice performance for animations that's fine by me. If what you are really after is performance, I'll be steering you in another direction. I have said many times that there is nothing DP does that another set does not do better with the exception of the sheer number of procs you can pack into it. I've shown numerically, to the best of my ability where I come from with that.
I've shown where the set is weak, where it needs improved, how it can be improved and I can't recall anyone disagreeing with those posts.
It is below my personal standards for a power set of it's type. For me personally it is ahead of the Elec primary and far ahead of the Psi primary but that doesn't really mean anything since they all fall below my personal performance threshold. That means that beyond the initial testing of that power set it gets 0 play time after that.
If I want, or my concept call for slows, Ice is better. If I want KB/KD Energy is better. If I want extra Damage Fire is better, if I'm serious about -damage I'm playing a defender. If I want animations that look cool to me I'm still not playing DP.
When DP was first announced I came up with several concepts for DP toons. When I got in Beta I realized that not a single one of my concepts would fit with the animations of DP.
The only concept that I have left is a -Damage performance build for a defender and honestly that's pretty far out in left field even for me. The idea of -damage from shooting stuff with bullets is right up there conceptwise with my TA toons healing someone by shooting them with an arrow. in any case that particular concept toon will remain on the drawing board gathering dust until we get some Malta or Wild West animations for DP.
Squeaky wheel gets the grease, if you don't file a complaint with customer service you'll never get satisfaction, if you are in an election and you don't campaign you'll not be holding public office, if you fail to point out ommisions no one will do anything to correct them, etc, etc, etc. yadda, yadda, yadda. The members of the market forum were continually on about merging the markets even after we were told by Posi market merger = d00m, won't happen. We got WW, and oh look, boom, instant market merger and no d00m. I will continue to post to remind the devs that DP needs work just like I continue to remind the devs that /devices needs work. (Edit - I notice that you never seem to have any issue when I point out the problems with /devices but you do when I point out the issues with DP. Why is that do you suppose?)
One final point before I move on. Yes 10% defense for 5 seconds is, in the grand scheme of things, spitting in the wind. No one that seriously builds for defense builds with it in mind because you'll only have it 5 seconds out of every 45ish seconds in the best of conditions. People building for the defense cap are going to build all the way to 45 and ignore this minor buff.
People that are popping purple inspirations are still going to pop 4 because they are still going to want to be over the magic 45% mark after the 5 seconds of animation end. If you are being honest with yourself and everyone else reading this post you know that the only real and reliable use for this buff in the world of sets and set bonuses is as a defense debuff pad during the alpha and even then it's not all that good because most defense debuffs last longer than 5 seconds.
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
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I was using 'hate' colloquially.|
Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
It's not hate. I'm not angry.
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Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
The times I jump in are when another poster is touting the animations of the set when performance was the question.
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You jump in and slam pistols outside of just performance discussions. You slam it when people are asking for a pistols build. People asking for how to build a pistols blaster are not looking for advice to roll a different blaster or a defender or corruptor instead, but you have jumped into threads and done just that. The very post I linked to, that you quoted, was a totally unnecessary post by you in a thread about preference, not performance.
It feels like you look for excuses to point out its flaws (and gloss over its advantages). That is my perspective, maybe I am just reading more into your posts because I disagree and I want everyone to love pistols (I do not think so, I generally prefer my Fire/Fire over my Pistols/Fire, but bias can be hard to see, especially when it is your own) or maybe I am seeing something you are not.
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Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
I will continue to post to remind the devs that DP needs work just like I continue to remind the devs that /devices needs work. (Edit - I notice that you never seem to have any issue when I point out the problems with /devices but you do when I point out the issues with DP. Why is that do you suppose?)
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Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.
So, is Total Focus worth arguing about Pistols? No. I'm going to respec out of TF so I don't have to hear about Pistols. It's too bad because I love Total Focus.
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Why, pistols, what have you done to total focus? *shouts loud enough to be heard off planet* PISTOOOOOOOOOOLS!"|
Originally Posted by DanZero
So, is Total Focus worth arguing about Pistols? No. I'm going to respec out of TF so I don't have to hear about Pistols. It's too bad because I love Total Focus.
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To be fair, though, Miladys does this all the time, and I've said pretty much the same thing Strato is here, only in other threads. I was going to comment on his statement that HoB can't clear spawns, as my Pistols Blaster is able to do that with Fiery Ammo and Build Up. Yes, sometimes it misses, or there is a lieutenant (or even minion) still standing with some health. It does have those random ticks. It quite often clears spawns, however, so I'm not sure where he is getting his comment from.
And if it needs another attack to clear out a lieutenant, oh well. My archer and assault rifle blasters need more attacks as well: even when using build up or aim.
Sorry to derail further after joking about it, but it has been happening a lot.
Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc: Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory
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Then you would be wrong. My wife and I play this game to have fun. If there is something annoying about a power set or an arch type then after the first run through to see if it's the power set/AT and what I might do to playstyle to compensate and it still comes up lacking that particular power set/AT no longer sees any play time. That's not a good thing (at least in a customer/customer service sense) as it decreases the potential for me and people like me to continue playing (ie: renewing subscription) if I'm out of new stuff to try AND the old stuff no longer holds my attention because it's annoying instead of fun.|
Originally Posted by StratoNexus
I disagree with your assessment of your behavior, and I think you may want to consider my view at least, because I am not the only one who has brought this to your attention now.
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Right now DP is in the catagory of annoying rather than fun. It's a combination of both the animations and the shortcomings where the power set is concerned.
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| It feels like you look for excuses to point out its flaws (and gloss over its advantages). That is my perspective, maybe I am just reading more into your posts because I disagree and I want everyone to love pistols (I do not think so, I generally prefer my Fire/Fire over my Pistols/Fire, but bias can be hard to see, especially when it is your own) or maybe I am seeing something you are not. |
My blasters are many and vaired (Arch/Dev/Munitions, Fire/Fire/Fire, Ice/Fire/Force, Rad/Fire/Mace, Energy/Energy/Force, Fire/EM/Force, AR/EM/Ice, Arch/Ice/Ice, Sonic/Ice/Elec, Energy/Elec/Fire, Ice/Elec/Mace just to name the ones high enough level to have epic powers) but (until today) I couldn't see a good use for DP.
My wife and I were talking about DP and this thread. She is pretty much of the same opinion I am on both the animations and powers. (I think that may have more to do with our age and generation than anything else). In any case we decided to play to both the strengths and weaknesses of DP at the same time. We both believe that the animations look ridiculous so our theme in this case is one of silliness.
Both of us are wearing jesters outfits. She thought that amunition and Electricity don't mix so she rolled a DP/Elec Blaster. I went with Dark/DP defender and the whole idea that shooting stuff = - damage so I'll be using mainly Chem rounds. I'm also going 3 or 4 procs in each DP power the rest of the slots will be franken slotted for Acc, Rech, and End. I even went so far as putting boxing gloves my my toon and making that the RP reason that the pistols are always spinning around and flying into the air, but that was just a bit too silly and I went back to Jester's gloves.
My wife has a rule of 3. 3 defeats and that's it for that play session. She signs out after she finishes the mission. If she's really frustrated she exits the mission, auto completes, and then logs out. We are extending the rule of 3 to both characters for this. We got to level 7 today before we died a total of 3 times. I doubt that we'll get the toons much past 20 before she shelves it or deletes it (judging from past experience) but what the heck, we both should get some laughs out of it, so if you play on Justice and see Super Sillyous and Super Silly Yes (a play on Supercilious for both of us) you'll know who it is.
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| I am perfectly fine with occasional posts suggesting improvements to Pistols, just like I am fine with suggesting improvements to /Devices. Frankly, /Devices is in much worse shape than Pistols. Pistols falls right in the middle of the blaster pack, with advantages and disadvantages. /Devices advantages are meaningful, but only in a very small subset of play. Some of the Pistols disadvantages you list, while meaningful, are really only meaningful in a very small subset of play. That is a difference to me and that is why I'll champion buffing /devices, but I am meh on Pistols improvements. |
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
To completely threadjack the threadjack back to the original topic...
Energy Punch + Bone Smasher may do more damage than Total Focus in the same timeframe, but they do not pack a guaranteed stun along with that damage. To be more thorough, you should compare (Stun + Energy Punch + Bone Smasher) to Total Focus. Total Focus may not be the best DPA around, but it always packs a mag 3 stun with the damage, and does a higher percentage of energy damage than anything else in the set (which makes a major damage difference against things with high s/l resistance). It also does it in a single packet, which makes a serious difference when dealing with things like Paragon Protectors that might pop Moment of Glory if you don't drop them from >25% hp to 0 in one blow. You can joust Total Focus, so that you are not in melee range for the duration of the animation, while chaining Bonesmasher + Energy Punch requires melee range for longer. It stacks with other stuns (from other teammates, from Bonesmasher 60% of the time, or from a stun in your blast set 100% of the time) to mez bosses, it serves as another Mako set mule for those chasing the ranged defense softcap, and it looks cool to boot.
Yes, there are alternatives to Total Focus, but for a single power to do so much, it definitely has its uses.
Rule number six of an empathy defender is NEVER underestimate a blaster's ability to die. I don't care if he has CM, Fort, both RAs, bubbles (both FF and Sonic), and is fighting next to a Storm defender with hurricane on. If there is a way to die in that situation, the blaster will find it.
With the loss of the Mag 4 stun, this power now lowers your DPS, without providing any real benefit.
I can use Nrg Punch, and Bone Smasher in the time this power animates.
Can anyone give me a compelling reason to keep this in my High recharge blaster build (175% recharge)?
When something good happens to me, I can never enjoy it....
I am always too busy looking for the inevitable punchline...
BEHOLD THE POWER OF CHEESE!