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Grudge isnt the word I would use. I was furious when the set was butchered, ready to rage quit CoH. My name sake was Ma/invul so I stopped playing him for 2 reasons one was how much all the other primaries were better than MA and then the invul changes. As time progress MA got better but not to the point where I will pull my name sake out of retirement.|
Originally Posted by bAss_ackwards
It sounds like he has a preference on what he likes to play and maybe a little bit of a grudge on what they've done to Invulnerability in the past.
I've done a Sara Moore TF on full tilt Scrapperlock on my MA/Inv and nearly went deathless. The final AV got two large hits on me and I was done in, my one single death on an, again, MA/Inv who's build is in the lower hundreds of millions rather the billions that my DM/Inv build is worth. Forget about what it was like in the past, today's Invulnerability is pretty damn awesome in my book. |
Small Edit: For me now its the about having a smooth ride to 50. I pretty much only play sets for that. There is one exception I have lowbie shield scrapper. Normally because the set is rougher to level I would have just got a friend to PL him up by doing a level pact but I need the hero merits to buy the +defense pvp IO. So that pretty much solo play mostly from 1-50 unless its a tf.
Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
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Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator
Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!
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Haha, looks like everybody was right about your response.
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Originally Posted by EvilRyu
I skimmed thru the video you were mostly fighting the drones, they already do piddly damage. Try this against say arachnos or carnies and then we will talk. Rikti are hardly an end game challege. Essentially the main damage type needs to be high hard hitting energy/n.energy/cold/fire damage or even all psi. Rikti are lethal energy and weak energy if you look at the drones. Also pick a map thats not a cave.
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"Pick a map that's not a cave" cracked me up. If anything, caves are harder than any other kind of map as you can't navigate properly and mobs are scattered within each individual group.
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What I want to know is why a character using only SOs should be expected to solo missions at x8 anyway. I'd gladly take a video of myself soloing an Arachnos mission at x8, but I'm not respeccing out of IOs to do it. And I didn't have to solo missions at x8 to get to 50, either.
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Originally Posted by MunkiLord
Haha, looks like everybody was right about your response.
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I should have never doubted you guys. You can tell the future! He did exactly as you guys have said. |
Originally Posted by EvilRyu
I skimmed thru the video you were mostly fighting the drones, they already do piddly damage. Try this against say arachnos or carnies and then we will talk. Rikti are hardly an end game challege. Essentially the main damage type needs to be high hard hitting energy/n.energy/cold/fire damage or even all psi. Rikti are lethal energy and weak energy if you look at the drones. Also pick a map thats not a cave.
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Samuel_Tow: Your avatar is... I think I like it
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Your response is as trite as it is predictable.|
Originally Posted by EvilRyu
I skimmed thru the video you were mostly fighting the drones, they already do piddly damage. Try this against say arachnos or carnies and then we will talk. Rikti are hardly an end game challege. Essentially the main damage type needs to be high hard hitting energy/n.energy/cold/fire damage or even all psi. Rikti are lethal energy and weak energy if you look at the drones. Also pick a map thats not a cave.
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Rikti are "hardly end game"? Really?
Drat, and here I was thinking the LGTF is an endgame taskforce, that we had a zone full of them going all the way to 54, and a massive group-content raid involving them.
Second, don't skim. Watch. The first spawn had quite a few drones. The second spawn had, literally, a couple. The third spawn had none. Watch it fully if you want to avoid making demonstrably nonsensical comments. All spawns had Psi lieutenants. The last one even had two bosses, and their attacks do considerable energy damage (to the tune of 2/3 of their lethal damage).
Third, hm, what should I pick that has no smash/lethal damage? Carnies? Nope, all minions and half the Lts. are smash/lethal. Malta? Lethal guns and rockets galore. Council? Please. Arachnos? Crabs, spiders, maces everywhere, all do mass lethal/smashing damage.
I suppose I should do the Mother Mayhem asylum then to satisfy you?
And you're complaining about the MAP? What exactly should I use? Because I can corner pull even in the smooth caves, if that's what worries you. It's really not a hard skill to learn.
But you see, this is all pointless because it doesn't work that way. Rikti are in fact a veritable mess of everything, including Psi, including the mass energy damage from all the guns and porting lieutenants and swords. At this point, the burden is on you to make a video of your non-/Inv character fighting these in your opinion superior enemy groups at x8 in SOs, with no alpha, inspirations, or T9, and doing it better than /Inv.
We eagerly await your results. We will probably be waiting forever
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He's not interested in common damage types! They're too common! ... wait a minute, having 70% to 75% Resistance to common damage types is actually pretty useful!
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I remember exchanges like this from YEARS ago, and even after all this time he still surpasses mortal levels of wrong. He's systematically wrong, intensely wrong, GLORIOUSLY wrong, and he yet he still denies every pebble from our great mountain of evidence. It's stunning and bizarre and, in a way, beautiful.
EvilRyu, it's nice that you can visit Earth every now and then. Just please, please remember that the way things work in your wondrous world are never ever the way things work on this planet.
's doesn't make things plural.
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Well of course the main damage type of almost every group in the game isn't going to be smashing/lethal. Arachnos has bane maces, widow claws, tarantula claws, guns, darts, etc etc. Carnies have their hammers, knives, super strength, etc etc. So obviously those daily farms on arachnoids and Mother Mayhem are just too hard for pathetic little invuln to handle. And really, caves are soooo much easier than warehouses to fight in, I mean you just have such a clear view of everyone and everything and can maneuver perfectly.|
Originally Posted by EvilRyu
I skimmed thru the video you were mostly fighting the drones, they already do piddly damage. Try this against say arachnos or carnies and then we will talk. Rikti are hardly an end game challege. Essentially the main damage type needs to be high hard hitting energy/n.energy/cold/fire damage or even all psi. Rikti are lethal energy and weak energy if you look at the drones. Also pick a map thats not a cave.
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And I guess rikti aren't end game content afterall, are they? Sorry, I guess I must have read it wrong when it told me that LGTF was an incarnate tf, and clearly their high psi and energy damage that lets /Elecs farm them is non existant.
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Originally Posted by EvilRyu
Grudge isnt the word I would use. I was furious when the set was butchered, ready to rage quit CoH. My name sake was Ma/invul so I stopped playing him for 2 reasons one was how much all the other primaries were better than MA and then the invul changes. As time progress MA got better but not to the point where I will pull my name sake out of retirement.
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Originally Posted by EvilRyu
Small Edit: For me now its the about having a smooth ride to 50. I pretty much only play sets for that. There is one exception I have lowbie shield scrapper. Normally because the set is rougher to level I would have just got a friend to PL him up by doing a level pact but I need the hero merits to buy the +defense pvp IO. So that pretty much solo play mostly from 1-50 unless its a tf.
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"...Normally, because THE SET REQUIRES SOME EFFORT TO PLAY WELL, I would have just got a friend to PL him up..."
Those don't contradict at all, now do they? Especially since those hero merits you claim to need are obviously not available to any of your higher characters, like your MA/Inv.
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Originally Posted by Atomic_Woman
What I want to know is why a character using only SOs should be expected to solo missions at x8 anyway...And I didn't have to solo missions at x8 to get to 50, either.
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Originally Posted by Bonnes
I remember exchanges like this from YEARS ago, and even after all this time he still surpasses mortal levels of wrong. He's systematically wrong, intensely wrong, GLORIOUSLY wrong, and he yet he still denies every pebble from our great mountain of evidence. It's stunning and bizarre and, in a way, beautiful.
EvilRyu, it's nice that you can visit Earth every now and then. Just please, please remember that the way things work in your wondrous world are never ever the way things work on this planet. |
/endsarcasm
EvilRyu, please, please, PLEASE show us your amazing skills and farm some x8 carnies/arachnos/malta with your perfect scrapper. I will pay you 1 billion inf if you show a video of a non invuln scrapper soloing a mish x8 carnies, then a mish of x8 arachnos, and a mish of x8 malta with only SOs, no alpha, no insps, no deaths, and no temps, without having to touch the rest power or waiting more than 5 seconds to move on to find the next group. The video must include you clicking on your enhancements and scrolling through all powers to prove no IOs at all, and monitor all def types/positions. And just for sh!ts and giggles, no
caves.
So as it was said earlier, your move.
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I believe http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5sol...eature=related <-- this sums up the entirety of any conversation anyone on this forum has tried to have with you.
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Originally Posted by EvilRyu
I skimmed thru the video you were mostly fighting the drones, they already do piddly damage. Try this against say arachnos or carnies and then we will talk. Rikti are hardly an end game challege. Essentially the main damage type needs to be high hard hitting energy/n.energy/cold/fire damage or even all psi. Rikti are lethal energy and weak energy if you look at the drones. Also pick a map thats not a cave.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Warning: crazy space limit reached. Please delete some crazy and try again. |
Without reading other posts, I will say that invuln would be my choice. I wouldn't recommend regen to anybody at this point. It's just not that good compared to other choices. WP is good and is really easy to play. But overall, Inv has the most damage mitigation and the fewest weaknesses.
Aye, I'm not going in to the arguments springin up either, my opinion, if anyone wants to use it?
Invuln: A ton of synergistic potential, you have the common damage types covered, you have a good (long rech) self heal and defense and offensively, some +tohit. If you add ANYTHING (another self heal, exotic resist, recharge, a single purple, a couple defense IO's, parry, KD etc...) it becomes very strong. Psychics hurt
Willpower: It's very difficult to enhance this properly, it is very strong on it's own, probably strong enough to do anything you need it to (against any damage type). Givin a bit of mitigation from the primary or a single purple you become very tough. However, there is a point it plateaus out, and fighting single strong enemies (for lack of strong self heal) is not it's forte. Also It's boring as hell. Click and Go If you like not doing anything, this is the set to choose, effortlessly glide to 50 and rot in the monontony of encounters.
Regen: Incredibly dynamic, Recharge is your friend, intelligent use of MoG and timing of heals are dire. Either you're a god and you're at full health or you're dead. Of all these regen can seem ultimately the weakest (eating dirt isn't fun) but on a team setting (all the damage isn't going towards you) or fighting a fewer number of enemies (hard attacks aren't hitting as fast) and you are nigh unkillable. (If you heal faster than the opponent can damage you automatically, than they simply can't kill you) Look up point of invincibilty. Loves insps. Probably the most fun. Probably dies the most.
"Fascinating. I'm not bored at all, I swear." -Kikuchiyo
I must have missed out on the day when EvilRyu became a poster we deemed credible. I remember numerous posts pointing out he was on various posters ignore list before the forum change over.
For my better builds, I'm soloing around x3/x4 with using SO enhancements. I can see going higher with a tank because they are suppose to take alpha from x8.
Kinda like insisting that Ice Armor sucks because unless you can show some one soloing a +4/x5 mob of all fire and psi damage.... >.>
(btw, ice armor doesn't suck)
Your character does not have capped defense. Depending on your AT the cap is between 175% - 225%. Your defense is not teal in the combat window, it can go higher. STOP SAYING IT IS CAPPED! The correct term is Soft Cap.
I enjoy playing in Mids. I specialize in Melee Characters, other AT's usually bore me.
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FOOLS! |
Originally Posted by John_Printemps
I believe http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5sol...eature=related <-- this sums up the entirety of any conversation anyone on this forum has tried to have with you.
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lol, made meh giggle
Your character does not have capped defense. Depending on your AT the cap is between 175% - 225%. Your defense is not teal in the combat window, it can go higher. STOP SAYING IT IS CAPPED! The correct term is Soft Cap.
I enjoy playing in Mids. I specialize in Melee Characters, other AT's usually bore me.
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I'm quoting this so I can find it easier for future reference.
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Originally Posted by EvilRyu
Also pick a map thats not a cave.
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*grumble grumble*|
Originally Posted by _Pine_
(btw, ice armor doesn't suck)
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Still waiting to make my Spines/Ice Scrapper.
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Samuel_Tow: Your avatar is... I think I like it
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I'm gonna have to disagree on single strong enemies. WP is very strong against hard targets(this is assuming an IO build). About the only AV I've tried that I have no confidence against so far is Silver Mantis.
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Originally Posted by Katten
Willpower: It's very difficult to enhance this properly, it is very strong on it's own, probably strong enough to do anything you need it to (against any damage type). Givin a bit of mitigation from the primary or a single purple you become very tough. However, there is a point it plateaus out, and fighting single strong enemies (for lack of strong self heal) is not it's forte. Also It's boring as hell. Click and Go If you like not doing anything, this is the set to choose, effortlessly glide to 50 and rot in the monontony of encounters.
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Bobcat in Tin Mage puts out some ridiculous burst damage, too. But overall, yeah, Willpower is an extremely sturdy set. Especially if you're talking about an IOed character.
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Originally Posted by MunkiLord
I'm gonna have to disagree on single strong enemies. WP is very strong against hard targets(this is assuming an IO build). About the only AV I've tried that I have no confidence against so far is Silver Mantis.
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Silver Mantis also has that wicked long lasting defense debuff and her caltrops means she can effectively bypass the one shot code(caltrops is more a factor on my SR than my WP).
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Originally Posted by Atomic_Woman
Bobcat in Tin Mage puts out some ridiculous burst damage, too. But overall, yeah, Willpower is an extremely sturdy set. Especially if you're talking about an IOed character.
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Seriously? How much Smashing/Lethal Resist do you have for that character? Have you taken Tough?
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Samuel_Tow: Your avatar is... I think I like it
She won't get close to one shotting my WP. I have tough and over 2300 hp. The defense debuffs is what do me in on that character.
My SR doesn't have to worry about defense debuffs. But if she hits build up then a big attack I'm in trouble if I happen to be standing on the caltrops. I don't use tough on that character.
If I had Aid Self on my FM/SD, there is no doubt in my mind I could take her. I have the defense, resist, DDR, and damage. Just no way to quickly recover HP. But that is fine, I don't really care to solo AVs with her.
I probably could take her with my WP if I fine tune my strategy(probably a lot), but I'm burned out on trying to beat her right now. Lord Recluse and Sister Psyche are next on my list. Silver Mantis is gonna have to wait.
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Arachnos would be impressive, given that they have counters to just about every build in the game. If I don't pay enough attention, a single Tarantula Mistress in a spawn can cause my IOed Invuln Tanker to faceplant (heavy psi-based DEF debuffs). Perversely, the Boss-tier Tarantula Mistresses are probably easier, because they don't appear to have that particular power (according to City of Data).|
Originally Posted by Aliana Blue
Arachnos? Crabs, spiders, maces everywhere, all do mass lethal/smashing damage.
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But yeah, you're not going to find an NPC faction that doesn't heavily feature Smash/Lethal damage. You're also not going to find an NPC faction that can't be soloed by a crafty player of almost any build (and especially if we're allowed to use inspirations, which Aliana didn't but which anyone else realistically can and should use when soloing missions). Ryu's original complaint held Invuln to a standard that manages to be both ridiculously high and hopelessly unrevealing at the same time.
But that's Ryu. He's always been the forum mascot to me -- the guy who's always negative, but never leaves. And sometimes there are kernels of truth and insight in his posts. People who put him on ignore are missing out.
All of that said, and to revisit the Arachnos example for a minute, I can sympathize a little bit with complaints about Invuln. The set is so freaking strong most of the time that the few occasions where you run into a natural counter and die can be a huge shock. I think some people are put off by that perceived unevenness in the set's performance, so much so that they might be happier playing a different build that's less powerful in the general case, as long as the alternative has a more level success rate. It's more of a personal, qualitative complaint than it is a mechanical one.
To the extent that any measurement of solo capability is relevant, I think the forum as a whole can give people the wrong impression about appropriate build standards. You'd almost think, reading the forum, that somewhere there's a vast segment of the player base soloing +4/x8 missions as a matter of course, regardless of the enemy faction. I don't think that's true. Every build has at least one weakness, and content is sufficiently varied that if you just take a pot-luck approach to mission selection (doing story arcs or tips or whatever indiscriminately as opposed to cherry picking opponents), then you're going to hit a wall eventually, and probably sooner rather than later.
Soloing at that level can certainly be done, but it's unlikely to be efficient unless you're farming a specific map that plays to your build's strengths.
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Originally Posted by Iggy_Kamakaze
Nice build
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I know you only said invuln, WP, and regen, but I'm going to put my vote in for /fire armor anyways. |
Originally Posted by Redd Rumm
im planning a dark mele scrapper and i was wondering what would be the best second out of the three im thinking about invul ,wp or regen
this scrapper will be used mostly on sf's an av soloing thank you for any help |
With a well made DM/fire/soul scrapper, you have a %50 heal up every 10 seconds, softcapped defenses through Shadow Meld (which is up half the time), moderate resistances, a damage aura, and perma soul drain. You can solo +3/8 mobs due to saturated soul-drained Burn + Shadow Meld for every mob, *and* still lay the smack down on hard targets.
Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator
Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!