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Nope, didn't miss the point at all. Let's see...|
Originally Posted by Mariel_Martog
Than you miss the point of my post, there are lots of valid reasons to portray a 'jerkwad' especially if you are an actor. Also for the purpose of a RP event in game I can see someone playing such a roll.
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| My point being that if you are doing a staged production where you are playing a Racist ******* no problem. If you play a racist ******* as a main you have issues. |
Because as we all know, there's a HUGE difference in motivation between actors and RPers. Actors try to get inside a character, to find out how the person really ticks, how he or she would behave in certain circumstances and not in others, and what experiences it took to get him/her there. RPers... well, I guess they do the same thing! But since they don't do it on a stage, it doesn't count! Also, since RPers create their *own* unlovable characters, they're more like playwrights than actors, and we all know playwrights are just horrible people who have issues, since they keep writing characters who have moral flaws.
Yes, I'm being snarky as hell, but I thought (hoped, anyway) the community had gotten over this issue back when CoV came out, years ago.
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Originally Posted by Electric-Knight
Just going with that absolute, regardless if it is true or not, that issue couldn't be wanting to explore and reveal the depths of racism and how people cling to it and why it is a bad thing?
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Not everyone RPs to be a more perfect version of themselves, and not everyone RPs to be the good guy. Yes, someone who plays a "racist *******" just to have the excuse of being an *** to other people does have issues (and those players do exist). But RPers who portray complex and morally ambiguous or even repellent characters shouldn't all be lumped into that category automatically. I get that some people just can't play bad guys that do terrible things they could never dream of doing themselves, and that's totally fine. But some of us can, and it doesn't mean we harbor secret ebil dreams of taking candy from babies. We're just better at separating.
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Originally Posted by Mariel_Martog
Also I have to point out My Character Tiburon Hates Mutants, Aliens and Magic Users. He is also a Main Character. He is not racist against any real population group.
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You know, I had entirely skipped over this bit earlier. But now that I read it more thoroughly, your entire post is basically a defense of your personal reasons for playing a bad guy, and why it's okay if YOU do so. As opposed to the rest of us, since we couldn't possibly have good enough reasons to play bad guys because they don't match your carefully selected criteria.
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Originally Posted by Mariel_Martog
Caios has a character Named Karnage who was a very special kind of 'Jerkwad'. however, three things about Karnage which makes my point.
1. Not even close to a main Character. 2. Was not a racists but an equal opportunity mass murderer. 3. was only really played for the purpose of RP events. |
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Originally Posted by Selina_H
You know, I had entirely skipped over this bit earlier. But now that I read it more thoroughly, your entire post is basically a defense of your personal reasons for playing a bad guy, and why it's okay if YOU do so. As opposed to the rest of us, since we couldn't possibly have good enough reasons to play bad guys because they don't match your carefully selected criteria.
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Actually you didn't read that right. Me I play lots of characters who have lots of issues, but the example was given of a character not of my creation, because I wanted to make a point about good RP concepts. My only issue here is when people create negative personas which are clearly reflections of the dark parts of their psych.
When looking at a 'Bio' or at how they create the RP persona it can become clear that the character is an extension of the player.
Someone earlier said RP players are similar to writers, I do agree with that statement. Because, we are all authors when playing the RP side of this game.
Look at he classic writers of history and you will see the main protagonist is usually an extension of the author or a representation of the out look of the writer.
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They might be authors, but they're more the worst of fanfiction.net than Shakespeare.
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Originally Posted by Mariel_Martog
Someone earlier said RP players are similar to writers, I do agree with that statement. Because, we are all authors when playing the RP side of this game.
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I would like to issue a plea on behalf of Paragon's diminutive protectors, please watch where you step. We're four feet tall in a six foot tall world, we've been cast adrift in a sea of butts. -Pillbug
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I was going to compare with Stephenie Meyer than realized that she wasn't emo enough to be compared with some of the RP I have seen here.
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Originally Posted by Magpie_Mouse
They might be authors, but they're more the worst of fanfiction.net than Shakespeare.
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My bad. Your reasons, your friend's reasons - my point still stands. You're putting forth your own personal criteria for "acceptable bad guys" and expecting that everyone else use the same ruler.|
Originally Posted by Mariel_Martog
Actually you didn't read that right. Me I play lots of characters who have lots of issues, but the example was given of a character not of my creation, because I wanted to make a point about good RP concepts.
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My only issue here is when people create negative personas which are clearly reflections of the dark parts of their psych. When looking at a 'Bio' or at how they create the RP persona it can become clear that the character is an extension of the player. |
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| Look at he classic writers of history and you will see the main protagonist is usually an extension of the author or a representation of the out look of the writer. |
Part of me wants to be shocked that this arguement is -still- going on...but then the other part of me remembers this -is- Virtue ..the place where everyone is right and everyone is wrong at the same time. Seriously people..to some extent everyone here has made a valid point, but at the same time..those same people have come across as idiots who sit at their computer with a thesarus, breaking a sweat while trying to "out smart" the rest of the thread.
Let...It...Go. Take five RP'ers and line'em up. Chances are..you will find five different ways of RP'ing. Folks like different things for different reasons..accept it and move on. Come across something you don't like..avoid it, but don't spend 7 pages on a thread ******** about it, it only makes you look like a elitest ******* who thinks you're a notch or two above the rest of the community.
Whether its CoH or CoV..its Just...A...Game, I don't care if you did spend four days beating out the perfect character with the perfect plot and backstory..its still nothing more than pixels and words for people to see and identify however they deem fit.
With that said..I think its a good time to throw my newest character idea out there. Which btw was inspired by this thread. First off..its the dark-skinned (black), jewish, love child of Hitler and Statesman who has fallen in love with a demon-cat futa from Mexico and plans on marrying her. Before he can do that though..he has to eradicate all the white people from Paragon so he can move there. LOVE IT!
Selina_H: You're putting forth your own personal criteria for "acceptable bad guys" and expecting that everyone else use the same ruler.
Not at all, I could careless how you play your characters, but as a Psychology Major it is hard not to psycho-analyze someone who plays a serial rapist Neo-Nazi esp. if they are on the blue side.
Are you looking for Mary Sue markers?
Not at all, I figure if you RP in this game you are going to be a Mary Sue, unless proven otherwise.
How do you determine the difference?
Playing with or RPing with. you have to interact to know for sure.
All my characters have little bits of me in there somewhere...
My whole point
...but they're not extensions of me.
If its something you created its an extension of something about you.
If you don't know me personally, you're not going to be able to do anything but guess which pieces are the player and which ones are additives.
I wouldn't try, and if you play a Character I find offensive I will just ignore you.
I'd say "usually" is stretching it. Sometimes, perhaps even often. I don't think it's so normative, though, that you can automatically assume that protagonist = author in the majority of cases.
Every writer pulls the ideas from somewhere and they always add a personal touch. Not always does the protagonist represent the writer, but the whole package comes from internal sources.
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That's your added qualifier, not mine. A semantic stretch almost worthy of a politician!|
Originally Posted by Mariel_Martog
If its something you created its an extension of something about you.
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| Not at all, I figure if you RP in this game you are going to be a Mary Sue, unless proven otherwise. |
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Wobegon Virtue... where all the women are futanari, all the men are playing women, and all of the RPers are above average!
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Originally Posted by OmniSurge
it only makes you look like a elitest ******* who thinks you're a notch or two above the rest of the community.
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People always think I'm the diplomatic type...Odd you should too. |
Originally Posted by Selina_H
That's your added qualifier, not mine. A semantic stretch almost worthy of a politician!
Do you psychoanalyze all the Mary Sues as well, or just the neo-Nazi rapist ones? |
Generally the typical Mary/Marty Sues are no big, since it comes with the fan fiction territory. Funny thing is when player A says 'player B has a Mary sue' when Player A also has a Mary sue.
One reason why I play so many humor based characters is to avoid the Mary Sue quality at all costs.
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Originally Posted by Magpie_Mouse
They might be authors, but they're more the worst of fanfiction.net than Shakespeare.
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Originally Posted by Mariel_Martog
I was going to compare with Stephenie Meyer than realized that she wasn't emo enough to be compared with some of the RP I have seen here.
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Just sayin'
Ice/Ice Blaster. Dedication to concept is an ugly thing.
Claws/WP Brute. Sex without the angst.
Every CoX character lies somewhere on this spectrum.
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I don't hate roleplaying. I just hate 99% of the roleplayers out there.
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Originally Posted by Tramontane
If you hate roleplaying that much you could always not participate rather than being ********.
Just sayin' |
I would like to issue a plea on behalf of Paragon's diminutive protectors, please watch where you step. We're four feet tall in a six foot tall world, we've been cast adrift in a sea of butts. -Pillbug
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Yeah, really not winning any points on the "Not-an-*******" scale here.
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Originally Posted by Magpie_Mouse
I don't hate roleplaying. I just hate 99% of the roleplayers out there.
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Ice/Ice Blaster. Dedication to concept is an ugly thing.
Claws/WP Brute. Sex without the angst.
Every CoX character lies somewhere on this spectrum.
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That's your problem, not mine.
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Originally Posted by Tramontane
Yeah, really not winning any points on the "Not-an-*******" scale here.
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I would like to issue a plea on behalf of Paragon's diminutive protectors, please watch where you step. We're four feet tall in a six foot tall world, we've been cast adrift in a sea of butts. -Pillbug
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You are playing a game where you use the impersonal magic of the Internets to pretend to be superheroes or fantasy characters or characters on a television show or goofy anime movie. YOU CANNOT TAKE THIS SERIOUSLY.| INTERNET ARGUMENT |
No matter how upset you get, no matter how irrational the initial reaction to getting your nose a little out of joint is, you are not allowed to lose sight of the fact that there is no possible way anything that happens in pretendy fun time games can actually be important. It is not, nor will it ever be, a big deal.
The moment you put a 'but' after 'pretendy fun time games,' you've missed the point.
"I know it's pretendy fun-time games, but - "
But Nothing.
That's all it is.
Control your emotions, or wait until they're under control before you start debates or discussions. Hurt feelings can happen, but you have to realize what they're hurting over. It may help to say the things you're upset about out loud.
"I am angry because the guy pretending to be Snapper Carr on the Internet is being too flippant."
"I am angry because the girl pretending to be Rocket Tits told me I **** dogs."
"I am hurt because the person pretending to be Snatchella The Fetching thinks I don't pretend to be The Galloping Gremlin correctly."
You cannot take things on a pretendy fun time game seriously if you actually say them aloud.
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Originally Posted by MondoCool
"I know it's pretendy fun-time games, but - "
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A good sane voice of reason.
I have been playing COH for some time now, I usually sit with rum when I play, a lot of my friends are RPers, and I have seen all kinds, I would rather not have my 'pretendy fun-time' ruined by a serial rapist nazi who can't be arrested or killed because he has (OMFG) power.
Its not that I hate RPers, its I have delt with them all and choose not to deal with ____'s
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By and large, I find that those types of RPers are easily avoided by simply avoiding demon characters.|
Originally Posted by Mariel_Martog
I have been playing COH for some time now, I usually sit with rum when I play, a lot of my friends are RPers, and I have seen all kinds, I would rather not have my 'pretendy fun-time' ruined by a serial rapist nazi who can't be arrested or killed because he has (OMFG) power.
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You think I'm kidding, but I'm not.
Ice/Ice Blaster. Dedication to concept is an ugly thing.
Claws/WP Brute. Sex without the angst.
Every CoX character lies somewhere on this spectrum.
Wow..for once I have to agree completely with Mondo on something...must be a cold day in hell, lol. Seriously though..some of the people out there really need a reality check. Is there really anything in this game..dealing with RP that is worth getting upset about? Let me answer that for you...NO. Have fun your own little way, and let others do the same..if you can't do that, well you might have a entirely different set of issues to deal with.
Now before any of the "intelligent" crowd out there even think about mentioning trolls, and how they go against the above statement...trolls have fun by pestering/bothering other people..let'em do it. Who really cares? Unless they are trolling you from your living room..it doesn't -really- affect you. Ignore them and move on. As for some of you and your "RP'ing skills"..lets think about this for a moment. Is there some kind of overall measure.or world wide scale that is used to judge someone's skill at RP'ing? Last I checked..no such thing existed, so how about -not- judging the skills of another person in a FAKE environment.
Its all made up folks..NONE of it is true..so who are any of us to say that another person's RP is right/wrong/good or bad? Yeah..I know I'm probably wasting my "breathe" typing this..but oh well..no different than wasting my time RP'ing when there are more constructive things I could be doing in RL.
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To be a racist against your own real population group. Hmmm...not many racists are racist against their own populations group.|
Originally Posted by Mariel_Martog
Than you miss the point of my post, there are lots of valid reasons to portray a 'jerkwad' especially if you are an actor. Also for the purpose of a RP event in game I can see someone playing such a roll.
i.e. Caios has a character Named Karnage who was a very special kind of 'Jerkwad'. however, three things about Karnage which makes my point. 1. Not even close to a main Character. 2. Was not a racists but an equal opportunity mass murderer. 3. was only really played for the purpose of RP events. *Caios was the Cowgirl Vampire Character in the Original Guardian Angels. *Karnage was the Arch-Villain for said Caios. *the person who played Caios is a very close friend of mine, and the reason why I play COH. My point being that if you are doing a staged production where you are playing a Racist ******* no problem. If you play a racist ******* as a main you have issues. Also I have to point out My Character Tiburon Hates Mutants, Aliens and Magic Users. He is also a Main Character. He is not racist against any real population group. |
Also, hating mutants, aliens and magic users wouldn't be racists, as those are not races.
Now reasons to RP such a character, and have it be your main...because no one else is!
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
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You make a valid point. But then I think, if that's their main, why would they want them to be arrested/killed? If that happens, their main character (maybe only) becomes unplayable.|
Originally Posted by Mariel_Martog
A good sane voice of reason.
I have been playing COH for some time now, I usually sit with rum when I play, a lot of my friends are RPers, and I have seen all kinds, I would rather not have my 'pretendy fun-time' ruined by a serial rapist nazi who can't be arrested or killed because he has (OMFG) power. Its not that I hate RPers, its I have delt with them all and choose not to deal with ____'s |
A person's main character is usually a lot like the big named main characters of comics. You know how people complain when comic book companies do the whole "Batman DIES" storylines, but everyone knows that's not true.
Yeeeaaah. They complain about it then, no reason to complain about someone not doing that whole hookey storyline in their RP.
Of course, this is also why I prefere not to RP villains. You know you're destined to lose. No matter how hard you try, you can not RP your villain taking over the world. Your villains can not take over Arachnos, kill any signature character, ect...ect...at most, they can be a successful thief, and maaaybe mass murderer of innocent people if they want to stretch it
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
No Dev luv for tentacles?
@SCyberTaz / Champion & Exalted: Home of my anthology characters.
Virtue: Where my anthology characters get all freakynaughty...
http://www.facebook.com/SCyberTaz (I'd kiss your rear, butt I don't have time to cover the acreage!)
Cyber you meant to post here I think: http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showpost.php?p=3588732 (CTRL+F twisted)
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"... you are not allowed to lose sight of the fact that there is no possible way anything that happens in pretendy fun time games can actually be important. It is not, nor will it ever be, a big deal."
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Originally Posted by Mariel_Martog
A good sane voice of reason.
I have been playing COH for some time now, I usually sit with rum when I play, a lot of my friends are RPers, and I have seen all kinds, I would rather not have my 'pretendy fun-time' ruined by a serial rapist nazi who can't be arrested or killed because he has (OMFG) power. Its not that I hate RPers, its I have delt with them all and choose not to deal with ____'s |
Wow, I clearly should be institutionalized.
Ice/Ice Blaster. Dedication to concept is an ugly thing.
Claws/WP Brute. Sex without the angst.
Every CoX character lies somewhere on this spectrum.