I just alpha my Kin/Dark and my impression of Kin at high level is that my ST damage isn't high enough (the -damage debuff is nice though). I haven't really tried to solo a real AV yet but I had trouble killing Trapdoor with his regen. I was embarrassed. Maybe it wasn't meant to be soloed but I couldn't beat his regen and running back and forth to kill his "copies" is just annoying.
I think I need some damage procs to counter regen....
Even if Kin's ST damage isn't that great, it still has one awesome Burst.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
I soloed Trapdoor on my Spines/Nin, and I can guarantee that Kinetic has more single target DPS than Spines. Were you not killing the bifurcations to shut down his regen?
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No. lol I was trying to beat his regen... and then after he summoned 3 of them, I just got fed up with him and he regen back.|
Originally Posted by JuliusSeizure
I soloed Trapdoor on my Spines/Nin, and I can guarantee that Kinetic has more single target DPS than Spines. Were you not killing the bifurcations to shut down his regen?
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I actually didn't know those bifurcations help him regen because I've been doing alpha stuff with a friend and we normally kill him under 10s or so.
Edit: Another problem is I've been playing my alpha Bane a lot and his damage just feels so much higher. I feel my Kin's damage is kind of lacking until I see more critical hits.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
I found that with Trapdoor I could overpower his regen until he pulled the third bif, then I didn't have enough. When I figured that out it was easy, keep hitting him until the third bif, then run around and quickly kill all three before heading back to take him down... (the mission briefing stated that his bifs help him heal...)
With Kin I can take down anything up to an Elite Boss faster than on any other toon I have, but getting to AVs I find that I lack the sustained damage capability and survivability that is needed to take them out...
I wish you could give Concentrated Strike the Assassin's Strike animation. I want to HADOUKEN! And it should be given to Focus Burst as well!
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Had the sustained end recovery for BB - BS - FB - BB - BS - CS - Repeat on my Kin/WP, I found the DPS to just...well I solo'ed a few AVs, but my scrappers do so much better.|
Originally Posted by Beelzy
I found that with Trapdoor I could overpower his regen until he pulled the third bif, then I didn't have enough. When I figured that out it was easy, keep hitting him until the third bif, then run around and quickly kill all three before heading back to take him down... (the mission briefing stated that his bifs help him heal...)
With Kin I can take down anything up to an Elite Boss faster than on any other toon I have, but getting to AVs I find that I lack the sustained damage capability and survivability that is needed to take them out... |
Nvm the lower survival (and I felt the lower survival on my Stalker vs my Scrapper...however, I found I could usually run away, recover and get back at them before they regened enough to make it a HUGE problem), the damage was just less :/
Nightstar I couldn't dent, but she has pretty great resistances. Chimera I soloed (it took awhile to figure out how to go about it...ie runaway), and one other, I don't recall, but for most I couldn't get the DPS up there. :/
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
I've only solo'd Numina on my KM stalker, and that was only with the help of Envenomed Dagger. My experience being the same as others: ST damage for this set is lacking, making most fights either impossible even with Musculature or a very slow crawl.
TPN trial guide video / MoM trial guide video / DD trial guide video / BAF trial guide video
/ Lambda trial guide video / Keyes trial guide video / Magisterium trial guide video / Underground trial guide
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I honestly think the current Assassin Strike sucks in PvE even after the change. It should improve our dps/dpa against "hard" target like AV and not hurt it. If they can just reduce activation time a bit, AV fight could be a bit better as you get a few seconds of "no-aggro" too.|
Originally Posted by BrandX
Had the sustained end recovery for BB - BS - FB - BB - BS - CS - Repeat on my Kin/WP, I found the DPS to just...well I solo'ed a few AVs, but my scrappers do so much better.
Nvm the lower survival (and I felt the lower survival on my Stalker vs my Scrapper...however, I found I could usually run away, recover and get back at them before they regened enough to make it a HUGE problem), the damage was just less :/ Nightstar I couldn't dent, but she has pretty great resistances. Chimera I soloed (it took awhile to figure out how to go about it...ie runaway), and one other, I don't recall, but for most I couldn't get the DPS up there. :/ |
It still bothers me that Stalker isn't even the best at taking down one tough target.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
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I think that's more of a Stalker problem, and less of a Kinetic Melee problem, really. :/
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Originally Posted by Blood Red Arachnid
I've only solo'd Numina on my KM stalker, and that was only with the help of Envenomed Dagger. My experience being the same as others: ST damage for this set is lacking, making most fights either impossible even with Musculature or a very slow crawl.
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BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
I do not think that KM is low on ST damage. In fact I have heard many claim that it may be the best ST damage set for stalkers, and second best for other melee toons.
The problem it seems is that while Stalkers can take down everything up to EBs faster than any other AT, they lack the survivability and sustained damage output for AVs. There are some AVs out there that I can take, but it is so much easier with a scrapper, and that shouldn't be the case.
Since we sacrifice survivability and AoEs for Burst damage, shouldn't we at least be able to have equal sustained damage output to scrappers and brutes?
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I would think so |
Originally Posted by Beelzy
I do not think that KM is low on ST damage. In fact I have heard many claim that it may be the best ST damage set for stalkers, and second best for other melee toons.
The problem it seems is that while Stalkers can take down everything up to EBs faster than any other AT, they lack the survivability and sustained damage output for AVs. There are some AVs out there that I can take, but it is so much easier with a scrapper, and that shouldn't be the case. Since we sacrifice survivability and AoEs for Burst damage, shouldn't we at least be able to have equal sustained damage output to scrappers and brutes? |
And hope one day, that's how it is.
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
unless there was a way to slow an AVs regen or maybe hit alot more.....i dont think this will be a very viable option much.
Thats one big problem with stalkers....they are too much of a one trick pony....you would think their attacks would do more things....like reduce regen or have some other secondary effects more....but instead....they seam to not be able to hit as much...use more energy and sometimes can do an attack that does alot of damage...but still alot less then most other character types.
They practicaly made the hidden thing become obsolete and un-usable for alot of the higher end game...and they wont give stalkers a boost at all.....go figure...
I use this as an example of no testing....but instead they wrote things on paper and thought wow thats how its going to be.....or maybe did do some testing but failed to test correctly....like pitting a stalker against Skulls as a battle determinent...instead of facing them against carnival of shadows or knive of artemis or rikti with drones or even just rularuu
by the way if you want to beat trap door.....just get about 10 of the red damage inspirations....a coupel of accuracy ones...a number of purple ones and beat him up....of course it wont go as smooth as using a blaster or scrapper or tank or brute or controller....but go figure.
Trap door should be the developers red flag that there is something wrong...their system of numbers should show the issues.
Also the number of posts for this section of the forums should be another red flag.
I suggested a -regen attached to AS or just crits and was shot down. It seems that the -regen proc would cover one of the biggest holes in an underpowered AT...
One of SG mates took his Nin/Nin Stalker to Apex last week. It was pretty bad. It's bad enough to deal with so many "sword" ambushes. He has almost no time to set up Assassin Strike because of all the blue flames (and he doesn't want to risk it). Basically, a Stalker without Assassin Strike is an inferior Scrapper and using AS in attack chain actually hurts your dps especially when you try to solo an AV.
The irony is that the hardest boss is something that Stalkers can't eliminate efficiently. If you ask me, Stalker should be the best one at taking down an AV or at least contribute the most to an AV fight. The current Stalker is neither.
I just find Stalker's damage a bit low. Either that or Bane and Night Widow's damage are too high? hehe
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
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Well of course our post count is low we are hiding, thats what stalkers do |
Originally Posted by PsychicKitty
Also the number of posts for this section of the forums should be another red flag.
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This touches on why I am very disappointed with the AT for now. It's not a lack of damage or 'extras' so much - its that the core mechanics (AS/Hide/Placate) are extremely clunky, slow and comparatively ineffective/inefficient in the game as it exists today.
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Originally Posted by PsychicKitty
Thats one big problem with stalkers....they are too much of a one trick pony....you would think their attacks would do more things....like reduce regen or have some other secondary effects more....but instead....they seam to not be able to hit as much...use more energy and sometimes can do an attack that does alot of damage...but still alot less then most other character types.
They practicaly made the hidden thing become obsolete and un-usable for alot of the higher end game...and they wont give stalkers a boost at all.....go figure... |
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I think Assassin Strike doesn't scale well with higher difficulties IMO. When you first got it, you feel like "Oh yeah!!! Big damage!" You can one-shot a boss with build up and you feel like this is what Stalker is really about. It also helps that other ATs don't do this "big" damage (yet) so you feel like you have a purpose on a larger team. |
Originally Posted by Greyhame
This touches on why I am very disappointed with the AT for now. It's not a lack of damage or 'extras' so much - its that the core mechanics (AS/Hide/Placate) are extremely clunky, slow and comparatively ineffective/inefficient in the game as it exists today.
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But as you level higher and past lvl 38, your assassin strike doesn't have that big impact anymore and you feel like it's dragging you down by setting it up. Your Stalker is supposed to be the "threat removal" for the team but other ATs also have tools to "remove threat" just as efficiently (brutes can tank better, dominator controls better, MMs have two upgrades and more buffs/debuffs).
I haven't used my stalker in either Apex or Tin Mage. I guess I should try and see how effective Assassin Strike is. I know it won't be too effective against those pylon/hydras and possibly not too effective against all those elite bosses.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
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You can't really regulate the AT's performance in these two TFs. These two TFs were devised specifically to push team-work to a new high as opposed to existing TFs. Of course it's going to be harder, the pre-requirement alone (if you don't have it) sets you back as an empty seat. |
Originally Posted by Jibikao
I haven't used my stalker in either Apex or Tin Mage. I guess I should try and see how effective Assassin Strike is. I know it won't be too effective against those pylon/hydras and possibly not too effective against all those elite bosses.
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AS works well still but the mobs are 53s. Which treats Lieutenants like Rikti Headhunters during mothership raids.
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what if AS was auto hit in PvE?
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Originally Posted by Greyhame
This touches on why I am very disappointed with the AT for now. It's not a lack of damage or 'extras' so much - its that the core mechanics (AS/Hide/Placate) are extremely clunky, slow and comparatively ineffective/inefficient in the game as it exists today.
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Even if AS was Autohit from stealth in PVE, we still can't placate AVs...
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You can't placate EBs (because it's mag 4). You can placate AVs - PToD don't help them and they only have Boss level protections otherwise.
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Originally Posted by Beelzy
Even if AS was Autohit from stealth in PVE, we still can't placate AVs...
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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Sorry, I don't think AS works "well". I think it starts out "well" (when mobs can be eliminated easily and when other ATs don't have heavy attacks) but it drops its importance as you level up higher and higher. It is very slow and it has interruption.|
Originally Posted by Stryph
AS works well still but the mobs are 53s. Which treats Lieutenants like Rikti Headhunters during mothership raids.
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Elimination doesn't just mean "big damage". You also need the damage to come out "fast". Assassin Strike only achieves the first goal. The second portion is hindered by 4s casting (or sometimes longer if you somehow move) and interruption.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
I was just wondering if it was possible to make an AV killer build for a kinetic melee stalker with ninjitsu for defense. Currently I am playing one at level fifty, and unlike my other fifties I can't seem to take down those pesky AVs. Any suggestions or builds that you have found useful would be of great help.