Well, not really. Defenses work best when stacked with other defenses, and so having just Tough or Weave by themselves isn't that helpful. On the other hand, when stacked with some IO defenses, plus Combat Jumping and some defenses from the Epic pools, they can really start to do some good.
What you are probably wanting to know is that Tough is 10.5% Resistance to Smashing and Lethal, and Weave is 3.5% Defense to all. That's about the lowest it gets, even a Corruptor gets more benefit out of those powers, at 11.25% for Tough's Resistance.
Also since Tough is only good against Smashing or Lethal damage, it's really only useful against melee attacks, so it's really only useful if you're planning on being a Blapper.
Finally, I would say that if you are going to pick up Tough and Weave, you won't want to bother with it until after 22, when you can slot it with some End reduction. In the lower levels you will probably find it impossible to keep either up all the time, much less both of them. Honestly, Combat Jumping is probably better for the early levels, it's only half of Weave's Defense, but costs almost no End, and will enable you to get in and out of melee faster.
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+ if your planning on pvp with it weave wont do much at all, tough on the other hand will have a noticable affect in pvp, however it max's out quickly if you get an epic with +resist you will probably hit the cap and tough will be a waste of a power and endurance.|
Originally Posted by Jade_Dragon
Well, not really. Defenses work best when stacked with other defenses, and so having just Tough or Weave by themselves isn't that helpful. On the other hand, when stacked with some IO defenses, plus Combat Jumping and some defenses from the Epic pools, they can really start to do some good.
What you are probably wanting to know is that Tough is 10.5% Resistance to Smashing and Lethal, and Weave is 3.5% Defense to all. That's about the lowest it gets, even a Corruptor gets more benefit out of those powers, at 11.25% for Tough's Resistance. Also since Tough is only good against Smashing or Lethal damage, it's really only useful against melee attacks, so it's really only useful if you're planning on being a Blapper. Finally, I would say that if you are going to pick up Tough and Weave, you won't want to bother with it until after 22, when you can slot it with some End reduction. In the lower levels you will probably find it impossible to keep either up all the time, much less both of them. Honestly, Combat Jumping is probably better for the early levels, it's only half of Weave's Defense, but costs almost no End, and will enable you to get in and out of melee faster. |
Food for thought incase your considering a lil pvp
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Why? The fitness pool is inherent with i19 so Stamina kicks in at level 2. Tough isn't available until 14 and Weave until 20. Slot end redx first. Although that will probably make weave not worth the bother until later.|
Originally Posted by Jade_Dragon
Finally, I would say that if you are going to pick up Tough and Weave, you won't want to bother with it until after 22, when you can slot it with some End reduction. In the lower levels you will probably find it impossible to keep either up all the time, much less both of them.
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To the OP:
A lot will depend on your playstyle. Any nuke that zeros your endurance is going to drop your toggles. So will it annoy you having to turn tough/weave/cj/epic shield back on? Do you mainly run in teams where you aren't nuking (EG Mo, CoP)?
My blaster runs Tough and a Patron shield which gets here 47% s/l res and 30% neg res. That's without any IO bonuses. I have taken her on successful Mo runs. (She was my blue badger.)
Personally I like defence but it's much easier to get resistance. Weave/CJ is ok but - for me - it wasn't worth it.
I went the "play smart" not softcap route. But elec/fire is a different to my psy/mental. YMMV.
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Another thing to remember is, in order to take Tough and Weave you also have to take either Boxing or Kick. So that's three power picks in order to get a very modest defense bonus and a decent damage resistance.
If you insist on going for defense, I'd leave the Fighting pool alone and go for Maneuvers and Stealth. Running Tough and Weave together costs 0.325 end /sec to give you 3.5% (unenhanced) Defense to all, plus 10.5% damage resistance but only to the "basic" damage types (smashing and lethal). Whereas running Maneuvers and Stealth together costs 0.3575 end /sec to give you 4.025% (unenhanced) Defense to all, plus another 1.75% from Stealth when not in combat. In addition Maneuvers grants a little Defense to nearby teammates, and you have Stealth now (not to mention a third power left to choose).
But in my personal opinion, I find it better to forego defense on blasters since generally you can't build up enough to survive on. If you squeeze out every available set bonus, some builds can manage around 30% defense to certain positional attacks like ranged. That's plenty helpful for a few stray shots that escape the aggro magnet, but not enough to protect you if you have constant enemy attention. A couple good mezzes or debuffs break through and the whole thing collapses.
On the other hand, if instead you aim for boosts like accuracy, recharge rate and boosting secondary effects you can be much more effective by taking down the enemy before they get off enough attacks to hurt you.
That's my thoughts on it
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This is pretty much completely false. All guns deal lethal damage. Many blast attacks deal a mix of energy and smashing, and most cold attacks do some as well.|
Originally Posted by Jade_Dragon
Also since Tough is only good against Smashing or Lethal damage, it's really only useful against melee attacks, so it's really only useful if you're planning on being a Blapper.
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Tough applies against an enormous number of attacks. Now, I do agree with the statement that it is not particularly enough all by itself.
"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
I can be found, outside of paragon city here.
Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
Well! Thanks everyone for the replies. Much appreciated.
I do play the blapper style quite a bit, running in and out of melee range. But still, after seeing the actual numbers that T&W give, I'll be respecing out of them and into something else.
Any suggestions which powers do a blaster best? I'm an Arrow/MM blaster.
Cheers,
GF
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Not sure if I'd really agree with this. Depending on what you're up against, ranged and AoE smashing/lethal attacks aren't that unusual, and such attacks that have smashing or lethal components are very common.|
Originally Posted by Jade_Dragon
Also since Tough is only good against Smashing or Lethal damage, it's really only useful against melee attacks, so it's really only useful if you're planning on being a Blapper.
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For example:
Arachnos - Crab Spider Slicers, Bane Spider Commandoes, Bane Spider Scouts, Bane Spider Executioners, Tarantula Mistresses, and Tarantula Queens (found at level 50) all have smashing or lethal components in at least some of their ranged attacks.
Council - Zenith Hoverbots, Zenith Mechmen, Mk I and Mk II Zenith Warcry, Galaxy Archons, Vortex Cor Leonis Assault, Vortex Cor Leonis Marksmen, Vortex Cor Leonis Adjutant, Vortex Cor Leonis Archon and all War Wolves have Smashing or Lethal components in their ranged attacks
Now, that said, 16.64% resistance (ie, Tough 3-slotted with level 50 IOs) would mean that if it takes 20 hits to defeat you without it, you've increased the number to about 24 (not accounting for Regen - if you have significant regeneration, that changes a lot), assuming that the attacks are entirely smashing and/or lethal. When attacks are mixed, it might be a matter of 22 hits to defeat you. That can be enough to pop an extra green before kissing the floor, but Tough by itself isn't going to net you invulnerability in any case. If the attacks don't use smashing or lethal components (say, Mu Striker's electrical blasts), then Tough isn't going to help you at all.
EDIT: Now, mentioning that you're an /MM blaster - if you've got Drain Psyche providing a near-permanent buff, Tough + loads of Regen can make quite a noticeable difference, as Tough can carry you past that threshold of being downed before you regen and instead give you enough survivability to wipe out everything before dying. That said, if you're not dying anyway, then maybe Tough isn't a requirement. It still depends on what you're facing and in what sort of numbers.
Great! Thanks Korith.
I think I'll just keep Tough, but skip Weave.
I landed a -4 KB protect last night and slotted it into Tough, so, with that, I'll hold onto it in my power selelctions.
Again, thanks for all the feed back folks. Much appreciated.
GF 
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Okay, okay, lethal attacks from guns are definately common enough for Tough to be useful against them. However, in my experience it's not the lethal attacks from guns that were ever any threat to my Blaster, it's the exotic types like Fire and Electric. Those packed enough punch that I had to be concerned about them taking me out, AND they didn't come with a Smashing component.
It might make those *#$&%# Council Marksmen a bit less irritating, though.
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That alone may make it worth your while (though you can get KB protect via defense powers or Blessing of the Zephyr, too - if you're willing to dump a load of inf on the market or save up a couple of alignment merits to get them)
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Originally Posted by Genetic Freak
I landed a -4 KB protect last night and slotted it into Tough
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The PvP PBAoE set gives 3 points of -KB, and they have been affordable (as in Dam/End/Rech recipe going for less than 5m) as recently as a month ago.
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Originally Posted by Korith
That alone may make it worth your while (though you can get KB protect via defense powers or Blessing of the Zephyr, too - if you're willing to dump a load of inf on the market or save up a couple of alignment merits to get them)
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"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
I can be found, outside of paragon city here.
Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
Tough and Weave are both excellent choices for Blasters IF you're stacking Tough with your (resistance) Epic/Patron Shield AND Weave with defensive set bonuses.
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My Sonic/Devices hover-blaster has around 34% to ranged (that I got to without gimping him). Between defense, intelligent play, and Aid Self he is extremely survivable. |
Originally Posted by Triplash
choose).
But in my personal opinion, I find it better to forego defense on blasters since generally you can't build up enough to survive on. If you squeeze out every available set bonus, some builds can manage around 30% defense to certain positional attacks like ranged. That's plenty helpful for a few stray shots that escape the aggro magnet, but not enough to protect you if you have constant enemy attention. A couple good mezzes or debuffs break through and the whole thing collapses. |
He doesn't have Weave at the moment, but I'm planning on respeccing him to take it now that Fitness is inherent, which should be good for another 4.5% defense or so.
If you're planning on stacking mitigation, then Tough and Weave are very much worth it. If Tough and Weave are all you're taking, then they aren't worth the end it costs to run them.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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I noticed the difference on my Blaster survivability when doing this.|
Originally Posted by Silverado
Tough and Weave are both excellent choices for Blasters IF you're stacking Tough with your (resistance) Epic/Patron Shield AND Weave with defensive set bonuses.
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But yes, that included stacking additional defense through set bonuses and Steadfast IO.
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He's at 21 right now and at 32, I will be starting to slot IO sets to maximize def against all. I usually do a little frankenslotting to get the max def I can against all types of damage (or a full set to get say, def against psi). I like to try to balance the char as best as I can.
I really do appreciate all the advice I've been given in this thread. Thanks very much.
This is the first blaster that I've ever got past lvl 12 or so, and am really enjoying it, so don't want to gimp it.
Cheers all!
GF
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I've been following this thread with interest, as I have an enrg/enrg blaster that needs respecing as well. I was also considering getting tough/weave, especially since any defense/resist I get is going to be coming from the power pools. I have the option of power boost... but I need something for it to boost in the first place (75% boost of 0 is still 0).
Thing is, I love cj, I have it on my kin def, and it is a fantastic IO mule. BUT my blaster is a pixie, and is therefore predisposed to take hover/fly. Now hover is still a decent IO mule, but I can't just leave it at that. The rest of my options come down to maneuvers, tough, weave, and...?
Oh yes, and I absolutely *must* have hasten.
*sigh*
My poor punchy pixie is a mess right now (lvl 40).
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Don�t say things. What you are stands over you the while, and thunders so that I cannot hear what you say to the contrary. - R.W. Emerson |
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So, is Tough and Weave good for blasters? I presume it is, but would just like some advice and confirmation.
Thanks.
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