Masterminds on Apex TF

So, I did the Apex TF on my Blaster for the first time last night and while I found it a lot of fun I couldn't help thinking how annoying the Battle Maiden fight would be on my Mastermind.

So, I am wondering have any Masterminds done he Apex TF and if so do they have any advice to offer on effective use of pets when fighting Battle Maiden?

I too have the fear about this one.

After reading about how the last encounter works I have the same concern for MM's, sounds like pets are going to just die a lot and not be worth summoning, I've got a alternate petless build that I'll be fine tuning for that encounter, going to snag Team TP and just be a Defendermind

Well, I tried it. I'll tell you now, your henchmen are mostly worthless.

In general, melee henchmen always have problems on these sorts of things, but it's about doubly bad in the case of the insta-death AoEs that rain down everywhere. The henchmen do too little and the effort of ringing them around constantly is too much. Keeping the boss out might be viable for a bit.

In general, I simply didn't enjoy it. While a break from the usual tank and spank can be appreciated, the only thing this breaks is half the viability of the MM.

On another note, managing henchmen while rushing through TFs has always been a pain for me too. I picked up group fly with i19 though, and it's saved me alot of trouble.

After reading the info on the TF I prety much concluded with the current sad sate of henchman AI this TF would be impossible.

Maybe I should roll a fire/traps corruptor and save myself the head ache. Or find a team so l33t I can be a petless m through it.

I'm not going to say "Don't try it". In fact, I'd prefer if other MM players made at least one attempt at it. I'm a Necro/Dark, so I'm faced with two very serious problems (low pet defense and melee pets).

I kept my Lich out for a while during the fight against Maiden. Still lost him a few times, but he got a fair share of shots in. The Commando and Assault Bot might be viable provided they stay out of Melee.

Twilight Grasp is a little tricky to pull with it's low radius and how close you have to get.

This too was my first thought when I ran Apex, that I simply wouldn't be able to do it with any of my MMs. Maybe when the playerbase gets solid tactics down, I can bring my MMs along for pity spots.

Resummon.

A lot.

It's a viable strategy that some MMs refuse to consider since they think they have to keep their pets alive.

It's like the MM role at a redside Hami Raid.

Or, play like a Tankermind and Team TP your pets around with you.

Made an moApex attempt last night on my bots/traps. Kind of a rough way to run the TF for the first time...

The first mish was fine. You have to be paying attention when fighting +4 enemies but we had a good team and everyone did their job. The initial ambush of swords was a breeze.

The Battle Maiden fight was chaotic, we couldn't kill her fast enough and failed the mo. But we did complete the TF.

I need more practice on that mish, I was so busy dodging that I wasn't doing a good job of attacking or resummoning my pets. I did nail BM a few good ones with the PGT, which is why I was invited to the team in the first place.

I expect brutes and tanks also get nerfed hard on this mish, i.e. they're used to standing in 1 spot and spamming out an attack chain.

I was not my normal AV murdering self but I'm pretty sure that's the point of the nanite thing :P

Give it a try, but you're going to need a decent team.

I think the ideal mix for this one might be an all defender/corr/dom/controller/blaster team, they'd suffer the least from having to constantly move around.

I hope to try it again a few times and get better at staying alive and throwings attacks/summons between aoes.

I've made my thug/dark incarnate so I'll take him and only use my lt's on her.

Is it the current state of the pet AI ? or is it how the TF is set up that is not MM friendly ?

What if MM's used pets for mob control while acting as a buffer/debuffer on BM during second half of fight?

It really isnt hard to do.

I didn't excessively resummon, I died only once, and that was cause 6 other team mates were dead being it was their first time, I did not feel like I was contributing less than anyone else, and yes we got masters.

This is what I did on my Ninja/Dark MM:

1) Send pets into attack

2) Blue light appears under battle maiden and myself

3) Set Pets to follow

4) Move away from current position

5) use debuffs and any ranged attacks while waiting until blue patch under battle maiden clears

6) send pets back into attack

repeat this until she dies.

As for 'resummoning' it isn't a strategy it is playing your AT. lol.

I'm guessing the biggest problem would be the bugged (again) pet AI that insists on using melee on all pets, even those with only one melee attack.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zwillinger GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain_Photon NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

Sounds like the perfect case for Team TP, only using it when the BRoD is impending - plus noone can complain if they're being pulled out of certain death, surely - just warn the team you'll be doing it.

I've prepped a second build with Team Teleport for this purpose (plus my wife is always nagging me about teleporting her toons around!)

Gave it a try last night with my Ninja/Storm. Was the first time I'd even been on the thing, so it was all new.

First thing I found out is that Ninja ARE fast enough on their feet to get out of the area of effect in time. I set 'em all to passive so that orders would take effect immediately or as soon as an animation finished. I was able to successfully dart them in and out to wail on Battle Maiden without losing any....

...so long as I could see the effects. First thing I'm doing next time I load that character is make an "Apex TF" costume with power coloration that won't obscure the little blue swirlies that show up before a sword comes down. Between the default-color storm effects plus other effects from the team, I missed the flames plenty of times, losing pets in the process. (The whole team noticed this, and a bunch of the SG are making non-obscuring "Apex TF" power colorations now)

All of those deaths were my own fault, though, so it didn't really bother me. I just had to pay better attention and not screw my own chances of seeing the things.

I'm fully expecting my Bots/TA and Mercs/Traps to fare a little better, being ranged, though I am expecting the animation times on the bots to result in their deaths sometimes.

All in all, I was a little unhappy that I lost so many pets this first run, but I saw how it all worked and having that info should make the next runs easier to do. I'll gladly take any of my other MMs into the fight in the future.

Just finished an apex on bots/traps and have to say, I wasn't able to pull my share. Pets, while they can be kept alive to some extent, contribute almost nothing. The most productive thing I could do was time mortars and gas traps near BM.

It wasn't just the final fight though, the pets were of little use the entire TF. They're simply too weak to matter more than gnats flying around the enemies.

As of right now, I'd say if incarnate-level content is going to be more of this, then Masterminds are going to be charity cases and loads for teams.