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Originally Posted by Ebon_Wrath
I'm usually fine with longbow, but every once in a while, they completely faceplant me, almost instantly.
My theory is that it's certain wardens, but I can't figure out which ones. I'm shield/stone level 50, running +0/x8 |
A couple of the Wardens have some nasty debuffs. One has two Rad debuffs (lingering radiation, enervating field) and he is the most likely candidate. All his attacks also have -Def.
Nullifier Lts. (40+) drop that hideous AoE (wubba-wubba-wubba noise) Sonic resistance debuff. One is huge, two is crippling to Resists.
Several of the minions have -Def attacks, and so a few lucky hits could cause a cascade failure.
Longbow is one of those groups that becomes really dangerous when all the various parts work together. They've got a pretty good variation of damage types and special tricks as opposed to a single threatening enemy (Master Illusionists, Paragon Protectors, etc.)
Defense based characters tend to struggle against Longbow because just about all their attacks carry Defense debuffs. Combine that with the odd Radiation Warden and you've got cascade failure before long. Pay careful attention to the mobs in a spawn before you jump in. Also, monitoring your Defense numbers will help a lot. I suspect it's the debuffs that are getting to you.
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They also have an AOE -resist debuff that doesn't require you to be hit by it. It emanated from wherever it lands. It also stacks. Stand amongst 3 or 4 of them and you'll die in a heartbeat.
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Originally Posted by Timeshadow
Defense based characters tend to struggle against Longbow because just about all their attacks carry Defense debuffs. Combine that with the odd Radiation Warden and you've got cascade failure before long. Pay careful attention to the mobs in a spawn before you jump in. Also, monitoring your Defense numbers will help a lot. I suspect it's the debuffs that are getting to you.
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its prolly the nullifiers with those sonic grenades . They are stacking the - Def & Res on you . In large longbow mobs always kill the nullifiers first .
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If I recall correctly the Sonic Grenade the Nullifiers use actually emanates from a target as opposed to a location. You can confuse said Nullifiers and they'll apply the debuff to themselves but it ceases as soon as they die. That would also explain why the effects persist even if you get well away from the graphic that indicates the area of effect.|
Originally Posted by BunnyAnomaly
They also have an AOE -resist debuff that doesn't require you to be hit by it. It emanated from wherever it lands. It also stacks. Stand amongst 3 or 4 of them and you'll die in a heartbeat.
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Either way it's still a nasty little power that can really sting. Especially when, like you said, a few of 'em stack and leave you with worse than 0% Resistance. Still, Longbow's not nearly as tricky as Arachnos can be
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Their sonic grenades are location based, not target based. If you see the debuff on you (or are standing in the debuff field) you can escape it by moving out of it.|
Originally Posted by Timeshadow
If I recall correctly the Sonic Grenade the Nullifiers use actually emanates from a target as opposed to a location. You can confuse said Nullifiers and they'll apply the debuff to themselves but it ceases as soon as they die. That would also explain why the effects persist even if you get well away from the graphic that indicates the area of effect.
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While nasty, they did reduce the potency of the debuff. It used to be an unresistible res debuff, but not it is resistible.
[edit: You still don't want to stand in it, though.]
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I don't believe that resistance actually resists debuffs.|
Originally Posted by Sarrate
While nasty, they did reduce the potency of the debuff. It used to be an unresistible res debuff, but not it is resistible.
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Reason: I get the same debuff amount on my resistance based toons as I do on my defence based toons.
I think it got repeated until it became truth, or that every time I look I just so happen to be facing an unresistable debuff.
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I think you're very unlucky when you look at your combat numbers, then. |
Originally Posted by BunnyAnomaly
I don't believe that resistance actually resists debuffs.
Reason: I get the same debuff amount on my resistance based toons as I do on my defence based toons. I think it got repeated until it became truth, or that every time I look I just so happen to be facing an unresistable debuff. |
Proof Res resists Res debuffs
Lethal Res: 66.79%
Lethal Res Debuffs: -183%
Final Res: 6.03%
Numberz: -183 * 0.3321 = -60.7743
66.79 - 60.7743 = 6.0157
Compare that to my energy resist (8.29% before, -159.53% after) under the same strength of res debuffs.
(Note: The debuffs in Combat Attributes are shown before resists.)
[edit: Compare that to what unresistible debuffs look like.]
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Tested this just then.|
Originally Posted by BunnyAnomaly
I don't believe that resistance actually resists debuffs.
Reason: I get the same debuff amount on my resistance based toons as I do on my defence based toons. I think it got repeated until it became truth, or that every time I look I just so happen to be facing an unresistable debuff. |
Real numbers show full values of 40% debuff however the combat attributes are inconsistent in their displaying.
For instance:
Smashing Resistance: 32.91%
Tough: 16.62%
Fire Shied: 35.46%
Sonic Grenade: -40%
So it displays -40% on both the power icon and the combat attributes but the actual effect is reduced by the resistance. That's how every time I clicked the power I was wondering why it stated the full amount when I should have been resisting it.
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I seem to recall that defence debuffs are shown at their reduced amount?
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Originally Posted by Sarrate
(Note: The debuffs in Combat Attributes are shown before resists.)
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Nope, they're reduced too.|
Originally Posted by BunnyAnomaly
I seem to recall that defence debuffs are shown at their reduced amount?
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[edit: Hmm, well, it's shown as full strength for Base Defense, but then the debuffed amount is listed for others. So, kinda.]
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Pretty sure you just confirmed what I just wrote? Hence why I looked and saw the -40% and wondered why I wasn't resisting it?
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Originally Posted by Sarrate
Nope, they're reduced too.
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That screenshot doesn't show it well because there's only one debuff, but what is going on is it lists the debuffs at full strength under "Base Defense", then propagates the result to all other defenses.|
Originally Posted by BunnyAnomaly
Pretty sure you just confirmed what I just wrote? Hence why I looked and saw the -40% and wondered why I wasn't resisting it?
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Example
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Longbow are easy, as soon as you realize one basic fact:|
Originally Posted by Ebon_Wrath
I'm usually fine with longbow, but every once in a while, they completely faceplant me, almost instantly.
My theory is that it's certain wardens, but I can't figure out which ones. I'm shield/stone level 50, running +0/x8 |
The lovely person that designed the faction forced you to kite them.
Once you finish gnashing your teeth in annoyance at being forced to run around like a badly-coded flying ranged attacker (I hate those flippin' Eagles with a fiery passion), they're easy.
Joust in and out, popping Nullifiers and Bosses all while scampering out of 'wubba-wubba' fields. Cake, if you like your tank dancing like a pretty-pretty ballerina. Wear a pink tutu to complete the effect.
In my opinion, they're the stupidest faction in the damn game. But not hard.
Another Warden that can drop a Stone tank with a quickness is the Sonic, who drops a Liquefy patch. Liquefy + Disruption Fields = pain.
Global = Hedgefund (or some derivation thereof)
I'm usually fine with longbow, but every once in a while, they completely faceplant me, almost instantly.
My theory is that it's certain wardens, but I can't figure out which ones.
I'm shield/stone level 50, running +0/x8
Wrath smash good.