What to duo with a Fire/Shield Scrapper?


AnElfCalledMack

 

Posted

I recently came back to the game after about a year away, and have restarted playing along with my wife.

She's played Blasters and Corruptors previously, but until now not played any melee sets. She started a Fire/Shield scrapper today. At the time I started a Ice/Thermal Radiation Controller to go with her scrapper, although we stopped for the night at level 4.

My question is what might be a better match. I'm wondering if a more dedicated support, like a Kinetics/ or Empath/ Defender, meshed with something with half decent AOEs like /Archery or /Electric might work out better.

Thanks for any advice.


 

Posted

My personal favorite way to Duo with a scrapper is with a defender. A corruptor would probably be just as fun and powerful to pair with.

Scrappers will gain the most survival by pairing with someone that fills in the void in their defense. Shields, by this logic, will want resistance and healing.

Kinetics and Thermal both fill this role well. Although both sets are not as self-supportive if you ever plan on soloing. Rad and Dark also would work by simulating resist with debuffs.

If you choose any defender, you pretty much cannot go wrong, but sets which focus on +def like Forcefields or Cold Dom might work very well at the lower levels because you would feed into the strength of Shields, but certainly could seem redundant at the end-game.

Kinetics or Thermal if you like buffing, Rad or Dark if you like De-buffing would be my vote.


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Posted

I'd go with a Trick Arrow/Archery defender or (cue insane laugh) another Fire/Shield scrapper.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Resolve View Post
(cue insane laugh) another Fire/Shield scrapper.
Do eet! I leveled my Fire/Shield Scrapper with a couple Dual Pistols something or others. Both sometimes asked why they were there at all, since I had all the aggro, wouldn't die, and did probably half the damage. And two Fire/Shields will feed off each other defensively and put out a lot of damage. Greens should be sufficient for heals if you build them right, and in I19, Aid Self becomes a more viable option.


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Posted

Fire/kin corr.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiery-Enforcer View Post
Fire/kin corr.
That was the one that I almost said, but wanted to provide a more expansive look for the OP.


Fire/Kin plus Fire/Shield ::Shiver:: they would probably be racing each other to see who could decimate a spawn first.


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Posted

The responses have gotten me thinking at the very least. Thanks.

I hadn't considered another Scrapper to the pair, but you're right that Shield uniquely reinforces another shield scrapper, although the range on Phalanx Fighting and Grant Cover is rather small. In the middle game, close coordination would allow some impressive defensive stats. I'd just be concerned about being within that 15' range all the time.

I guess I was looking for something other than a scrapper, as I probably have too many scrappers and brutes as it is. Yeah, yeah I know, you can't have too many scrappers.

The fire/kin corrupter sounds quite good actually. It still provides good mitigation in the form of a strong and fast heal from level 1 and late game can hit damage cap and extra recharge on Shield Charge and Fire Circle Sword.


 

Posted

A Kin or a Cold would work best with a Fire/shield. I'd prefer a kin though. SPeed boost for added recovery and recharge, a good quick heal if needed and Fulcrum shift is the icing on the cake.

I want to try and Duo an ITF with a Fire/Shield + Kin combo one day.


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Posted

A Rad or Dark is also an option. The -ToHit in DN or RI should combine with the scrapper's +def to hit the softcap quite easily, while in the late-game, these toggles still give another useful debuff effect (-Def or -Dam).

Frankly, the main thing Fire/Shield lacks is any form of debuffing. Seems to me a debuff specialist (like a Fire/Dark or Fire/Rad Corr) would complement them nicely.


 

Posted

I vote for a 2nd scrapper... I don't see any buffers/debuffers able to double the damage output of a team. If it was a bigger team, the buffs/debfuffs would multiply out to more then 1 scrapper, but in a duo... 2 scrappers is going to be hard to beat.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey View Post
I vote for a 2nd scrapper... I don't see any buffers/debuffers able to double the damage output of a team. If it was a bigger team, the buffs/debfuffs would multiply out to more then 1 scrapper, but in a duo... 2 scrappers is going to be hard to beat.
Fire/Thermal Corr (or Controller) or Demons/Thermal Mastermind.

Scrapper AoE DPS isn't particularly sky high over time. Even on a Fire/. When combined with the damage from their primary, a second toon stacking Thermal Buffs on the Scrapper will beat out a second Scrapper in terms of damage as well as buff their survivability considerably versus enemies with major +ToHit such as Rularuu, Nemesis, DE and the new Preatorians.

As a bonus, you could take on AVs (faster) and GMs due to all Thermal's -Resistance and -Regen.

Personally, I'd probably go for the MM for "Easy Mode" - it'll also leave more power slots free for the support toon to take Leadership powers, which would transfer across to the Scrapper as well as the MM pets. And you'd gain extra -resistance debuffs from the whip attacks.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaelwysAlts View Post
Fire/Thermal Corr (or Controller) or Demons/Thermal Mastermind.

Scrapper AoE DPS isn't particularly sky high over time. Even on a Fire/. When combined with the damage from their primary, a second toon stacking Thermal Buffs on the Scrapper will beat out a second Scrapper in terms of damage as well as buff their survivability considerably versus enemies with major +ToHit such as Rularuu, Nemesis, DE and the new Preatorians.

As a bonus, you could take on AVs (faster) and GMs due to all Thermal's -Resistance and -Regen.

Personally, I'd probably go for the MM for "Easy Mode" - it'll also leave more power slots free for the support toon to take Leadership powers, which would transfer across to the Scrapper as well as the MM pets. And you'd gain extra -resistance debuffs from the whip attacks.
Being knocked around and stuck inbetween all that seething, mooing demonic flesh is going to give the Scrapper nightmares though (unless they like that sort of thing, who am I to judge ). I speak from experience playing a Widow when City of Demoos first came out about 6 months ago. I was mighty relieved to make it to Fort and be able to play a ranged character instead.

Thugs/Thermal might be a nice alternative. Decent AOE but mostly ranged henchies with smaller, quieter models. Only downside might be the sporadic knockback of the pistols (and the lack of extra -resistance attacks in the MM attacks). Bruiser would benefit from Grant Cover and add to Phalanx Fighting without overly cluttering up the Scrappers screen.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA View Post
Thugs/Thermal might be a nice alternative. Decent AOE but mostly ranged henchies with smaller, quieter models. Only downside might be the sporadic knockback of the pistols (and the lack of extra -resistance attacks in the MM attacks). Bruiser would benefit from Grant Cover and add to Phalanx Fighting without overly cluttering up the Scrappers screen.
True that.

I've been playing a Demon/FF recently and the darn ugly things just don't shaddup.

Sadly Pet AI is currently borked meaning Thugs (and other ranged sets like Bots, Mercs, etc) all tend to run into Melee no matter what you do.

I had thought that (assuming AI is functioning properly) Bots might be a nice alternative, as they're good at AoE and bring some extra -Regen to the table... but then you've all that Knockback to consider until you can grab a Patron Immobilise. Thugs are a pretty nice balance between ST and AoE, Melee and Ranged, but a large part of thugs' AoE damage is inflicted by a -2 minion pet which IIRC doesn't scale very well against higher level foes due to the purple patch. Demons inflict no knockback and do good all-round spike damage and have good resistances to stack with Thermal Shields. If only they'd be cuter and quieter... >.<

Of course, you could eliminate the AI component and just go Troller or Corr instead for Hotfeety or Firebally Goodness. Means a bit more button mashing though.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnElfCalledMack View Post
A Rad or Dark is also an option. The -ToHit in DN or RI should combine with the scrapper's +def to hit the softcap quite easily, while in the late-game, these toggles still give another useful debuff effect (-Def or -Dam).

Frankly, the main thing Fire/Shield lacks is any form of debuffing. Seems to me a debuff specialist (like a Fire/Dark or Fire/Rad Corr) would complement them nicely.
The Kinetics powers are actually minor debuff powers. Not as strong as a Rad or Dark, but noticeable. Transfusion is -50% regen for 20 seconds. Siphon Power is -20% Damage, Siphon Speed is -20% recharge, etc. Admittedly most of them won't do much against level 50 AVs, but at low levels against bosses they work pretty well.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey View Post
I vote for a 2nd scrapper... I don't see any buffers/debuffers able to double the damage output of a team. If it was a bigger team, the buffs/debfuffs would multiply out to more then 1 scrapper, but in a duo... 2 scrappers is going to be hard to beat.
At high levels and given large groups of 10+, a Fire/Kinetics Corruptor will more than double the damage output of a team. Simply from Fulcrum shift providing a crazy damage bonus.

Assuming you keep up Fulcrum Shift with 10 targets on just the scrapper, thats a +200% damage bonus. Assuming AOO saturated and fully slotted powers, the Scrapper is at about 100 (base)+100(slot)+60ish = 260% damage. Fulcrum shift pushes this up to 460% in that case. 460/260 = 1.769. So as long as the Corruptor is at least worth a quarter scrapper damage wise, you've doubled the damage of the team.

Admittedly, this is situational, and doesn't apply to taking down big single targets like an AV. Although the fully slotted 1.17 second cast, 4 second recharge, 40% heal the Corruptor can throw out does nice things for survivability.

As for the Master Mind suggestions, I don't think the scrapper needs the distractions. I'm pretty sure she'd be trying to attack the minions half the time. Especially if its demon summoning...

I guess it comes down wanting to take single hard targets easier or wanting to take groups of enemies easier.

Thermal, Radiation, or Cold Domination all provide -Regen and -Resistance for AV killing.
Kinetics probably provides the most consistent offensive punch against large mobs. And Dark has its usual bag of tricks plus a pet. All of them increase survivability but in different ways.

I'm still leaning towards Kinetics because it makes the scrapper character feel more scrapper-ish. More damage on a faster recharge with enough end to not have to stop. And scrappers are all about style.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hiruma View Post
I recently came back to the game after about a year away, and have restarted playing along with my wife.

She's played Blasters and Corruptors previously, but until now not played any melee sets. She started a Fire/Shield scrapper today. At the time I started a Ice/Thermal Radiation Controller to go with her scrapper, although we stopped for the night at level 4.

My question is what might be a better match. I'm wondering if a more dedicated support, like a Kinetics/ or Empath/ Defender, meshed with something with half decent AOEs like /Archery or /Electric might work out better.

Thanks for any advice.
Fire/sonic corruptor or sonic/sonic defender


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hiruma View Post
The Kinetics powers are actually minor debuff powers. Not as strong as a Rad or Dark, but noticeable. Transfusion is -50% regen for 20 seconds. Siphon Power is -20% Damage, Siphon Speed is -20% recharge, etc. Admittedly most of them won't do much against level 50 AVs, but at low levels against bosses they work pretty well.
Personally, I also like Kins, preferably Defenders, as support in duos.

In addition to the above debuffs, if you take Rad Blast as a secondary, you can debuff Def and I believe just about every attack will accept the Achilles Heel proc, which debuffs 20% Res.


 

Posted

A kin def.

Claws/sr scrapper

They have my vote.

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Posted

And to the OP, I personally think an Ice/Thermal would work very well with a shields scrapper. The resistances and heals will work perfectly to keep it alive. You can keep a permanent forge on the scrapper for more damage/to hit.

I've always liked Ice on the back end for its consistent soft controls, not so much it's hard ones.

If you IO it enough for perma AB, an Ice/emp is nice too (I hate emps too, but perma AB on a fire/shield scrap, with the 100% recharge and regeneration is a big nod as a duo, of course fort too, which benefits much earlier on for the combo as well)

Likewise though, sonic is a solid choice as well.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Werner View Post
Fitness will be inherent, which frees up a power pool. That makes it easier to take Aid Self if you want it.
I just read OMGOMGOMGOMGOMOMG this is INSANE do you know this? I'm LOVING this. I'd hope we get more slots as well for the new powers, but even if not this is going to free up so much, like actually taking up a travel power and some auto's and self rez's, and heck, even recall friend!!!

And helloooooooooo VENGEANCE


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Santorican View Post
Fire/Cold Corruptor!
If you don't mind the look of the /Cold shields, I'd go with this as well.


 

Posted

nope... i've thought about it some more and I'm still going to say a 2nd scrapper is best. If for no other reason then because this way the other player won't quit the duo because he's not having as much fun.


I gotta make pain. I gotta make things right. I gotta stop what's comin'. 'Least I gotta try.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey View Post
nope... i've thought about it some more and I'm still going to say a 2nd scrapper is best. If for no other reason then because this way the other player won't quit the duo because he's not having as much fun.
The OP said nothing about them not enjoying playing more support oriented characters, who says they'll enjoy a Scrapper more?


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