Force Feedback procs: How many and where should they go?
By
Blue_Centurion,
Posted on: 2010-10-26 06:32 in Brutes
Quote:
1 in footstomp, because it is an AOE and it will be fired off every 10 seconds or so (which is also the time the PROC causes a Surpress effect on itself once it has been tested for in a power).
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Originally Posted by Doctor_Xaxan
The build is SS/SR. How do I maximize my uptime on this thing? I took a look at the wiki page but it caused me to make this face: @_o
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So if my footstomp goes off every 10 seconds (10.1 actually, in this build I'm working on in Mids) and assuming favorable results, it would be a waste to slot more procs in other single target attacks?
Quote:
Yep, the suppression period from firing it off in Footstomp would blanket them out
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Originally Posted by Doctor_Xaxan
So if my footstomp goes off every 10 seconds (10.1 actually, in this build I'm working on in Mids) and assuming favorable results, it would be a waste to slot more procs in other single target attacks?
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Coolness.
Thanks for the info. 
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This isn't quite true. The suppress effect affects toggles and psuedo pets. The proc will check against every single target that Footstomp hits every single time it is activated, regardless of when the proc was last checked or last activated.|
Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA
1 in footstomp, because it is an AOE and it will be fired off every 10 seconds or so (which is also the time the PROC causes a Surpress effect on itself once it has been tested for in a power).
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http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=120808
http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Proc#Procs
The proc won't stack with itself, however.
OP:
I did a test with an Energy/ Blaster, with this proc in every attack. The end result was the same as if I had just added a recharge SO to each of them. At least, as far as the attacks were concerned. The little extra oomf on Nova and Aim/Build Up was nice. Dropping the proc from the ST attacks, but not the AoEs, did not cause much of a drop in my effective recharge. With 100% global recharge and FS fully slotted, you could actually chain several FSs at 5 seconds apart, if you have a large enough group to hit. The most I've done, I believe, was 4. Either way, the proc was definitely not suppressed. If you maintain 10 hit targets each attack, there's about a 27% chance that will happen.
Unless you have some very high recharge powers floating around that might benefit from an occasional boost, I would not put a FF Proc in any single target attacks.
@Gilia1
I play heroes on Champion.
I play villains on Virtue.
http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Force_Fe...or_%2BRecharge
There is supression on the FF proc.
"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
Quote:
does anyone/everyone understand that chart but me? I kind of get what they are saying graphically. But it makes no sense intellectually. The thing should be up, then down, with a time when you cannot use it again (or if you do does little good). Does anybody know what these actual times are? Why do all the official and semi-official data areas for this game have to be written by people with ADD and no editors? I swear, do you know how many adjectives for damage they give that all mean exactly the same number? conversely, i have seen them use the exact same adjective for damage, to mean wildly different numbers. Do they have an random adjective generator they are forced to use when writing descriptions of all powers?
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Originally Posted by ultrawatt
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Actually reading that there isn't, which supports what Gilia says in his testing|
Originally Posted by ultrawatt
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Quote:
| ((The following information regarding Suppression is no longer current)) |
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Well the chart has what we know is 5 seconds (the duration of FF) as 3 dots. The suppression according to it is 5 dots, so theoretically it's 7.5 seconds. It's saying that for 7.5 seconds after the effect ends it won't activate again.|
Originally Posted by Blue_Centurion
does anyone/everyone understand that chart but me? I kind of get what they are saying graphically. But it makes no sense intellectually. The thing should be up, then down, with a time when you cannot use it again (or if you do does little good). Does anybody know what these actual times are? Why do all the official and semi-official data areas for this game have to be written by people with ADD and no editors? I swear, do you know how many adjectives for damage they give that all mean exactly the same number? conversely, i have seen them use the exact same adjective for damage, to mean wildly different numbers. Do they have an random adjective generator they are forced to use when writing descriptions of all powers?
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That chart is dated about 2 years. It's been a while since I ran any tests myself, though not quite that long.
Now I'm kind of curious how it actually works. I'm having trouble getting Herostats to run properly in Windows 7 so testing it is a quite a bit more work now.
Perhaps I was wrong.
Can anyone say with certainty I wonder?
Edit: Plus the chart suggests the proc can fire off, but not actually have an effect. That might complicate testing it...
@Gilia1
I play heroes on Champion.
I play villains on Virtue.
I'm so confused.
The info there is not what is hapening in game. The only suppression is to prevent it from stacking more than once. I got lucky and got quick reflexes on a mutaiton and ended up with 176.25 global recharge. This would mean when the proc fires I would have 276.25 global recharge plus the 89.9 recharge on footstomp for 366.15%. Someone that knows how to figure that out can tell you how fast that gets footstomp to recharge. All I know is it is sligtly faster than 4.483 seconds.
I hopped in a ambush farm so I would be more likley to get the proc. Due to the high recharge, there was at most 1 second of down time on the proc when it fired 2 times in a row. I had my recharge on monitor and when it hit 2 times in a row I would see the time go from 276.25, drop to 176.25 then quckly back up to 276.25. I got up to 4 times in a row using footstomp.
Also even without watching the numbers, it was easy to tell when it did not proc. Just watching the footstomp icon recharge, there was a noticable difference in its speed when the proc missed.
Ok edit to add up to 5 in a row now a few times after more testing and once got 8 in a row.
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Fantastic! I was running some tests and came to the same conclusion. It would occasionally tick down for a second (like when you double up hasten), but as far as I could tell if it suppressed it was only for a second.|
Originally Posted by HelinCarnate
The info there is not what is hapening in game. The only suppression is to prevent it from stacking more than once. I got lucky and got quick reflexes on a mutaiton and ended up with 176.25 global recharge. This would mean when the proc fires I would have 276.25 global recharge plus the 89.9 recharge on footstomp for 366.15%. Someone that knows how to figure that out can tell you how fast that gets footstomp to recharge. All I know is it is sligtly faster than 4.483 seconds.
I hopped in a ambush farm so I would be more likley to get the proc. Due to the high recharge, there was at most 1 second of down time on the proc when it fired 2 times in a row. I had my recharge on monitor and when it hit 2 times in a row I would see the time go from 276.25, drop to 176.25 then quckly back up to 276.25. I got up to 4 times in a row using footstomp. Also even without watching the numbers, it was easy to tell when it did not proc. Just watching the footstomp icon recharge, there was a noticable difference in its speed when the proc missed. Ok edit to add up to 5 in a row now a few times after more testing and once got 8 in a row. |
Thanks for the follow up, HelinCarnate.
Perhaps we should updated the wiki...
@Gilia1
I play heroes on Champion.
I play villains on Virtue.
I'm considering putting two on my tanker, one in Tremor and one in Fault. I admit, the wiki really confused me. Now it looks like it doesn't suppress, is that correct?
Wrath smash good.
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That is what we're concluding. I have not tested it on a character who has it slotted twice, but I should be able to very soon. I believe what you will run into if it's in Tremor and Fault is that if it has proc'd, there's no sense in immediately following up with the other attack, as it won't stack.|
Originally Posted by Ebon_Wrath
I'm considering putting two on my tanker, one in Tremor and one in Fault. I admit, the wiki really confused me. Now it looks like it doesn't suppress, is that correct?
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However, as both Tremor and Fault do knockdown, I would assume you're spacing them accordingly anyhow.
I would just monitor your recharge with the combat attributes and when Tremor procs (I would assume that's your lead), wait till the proc has expired before you use Fault (5 seconds). I believe the proc fires when the accuracy check happens, at the beginning of the animation, so it should only be about a 2 second wait between attacks. That's probably close to how long it takes them to stand up, anyway.
I would say this is a really good idea.
@Gilia1
I play heroes on Champion.
I play villains on Virtue.
Monitoring global +rech on my SD/SS tanker led me to that same conclusion months ago: the wiki is outdated. There is currently no artifical suppression of the FF proc.
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This is how it has always been from my experience, except for when the proc was broken. I was always confused when people were talking about suppression as that wasn't happening to me in game.
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Originally Posted by HelinCarnate
The info there is not what is hapening in game. The only suppression is to prevent it from stacking more than once. I got lucky and got quick reflexes on a mutaiton and ended up with 176.25 global recharge. This would mean when the proc fires I would have 276.25 global recharge plus the 89.9 recharge on footstomp for 366.15%. Someone that knows how to figure that out can tell you how fast that gets footstomp to recharge. All I know is it is sligtly faster than 4.483 seconds.
I hopped in a ambush farm so I would be more likley to get the proc. Due to the high recharge, there was at most 1 second of down time on the proc when it fired 2 times in a row. I had my recharge on monitor and when it hit 2 times in a row I would see the time go from 276.25, drop to 176.25 then quckly back up to 276.25. I got up to 4 times in a row using footstomp. Also even without watching the numbers, it was easy to tell when it did not proc. Just watching the footstomp icon recharge, there was a noticable difference in its speed when the proc missed. Ok edit to add up to 5 in a row now a few times after more testing and once got 8 in a row. |
[U][URL="http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=251594"][/URL][/U]
The build is SS/SR. How do I maximize my uptime on this thing? I took a look at the wiki page but it caused me to make this face: @_o