You just had to make it your ma/sr.... I'll be back in a few hours. Off the cuff, I always ended up with 6 of the +accuracy bonuses (as in the one you get from LotG and something else) on my BZB builds.
Be well, people of CoH.
I can't open the build using the data link can you post the data chunk please?
Virtue: @Santorican
Dark/Shield Build Thread
Heh. It's not like I have a lot of characters that I IO out, but it's nice to know, for the ones I do, that I'm not over obsessing about watching out for the Rule of 5. It apparently trips up everyone. 
Hey arcanaville, Your data link isn't working for me, i can't pull your build up. any chance you could post the data chunk?
Quote:
Ask and ye shall receive. Note that I built this in v1.8 with Leandro's patch. It *seems* to import correctly into 1.8.1 except the inherent powers don't display. The totals seem correct, you just literally can't see the inherent fitness powers in the slotting screen (they seem to show up in the active sets display when showing active invention sets). |
Originally Posted by Arbegla
Hey arcanaville, Your data link isn't working for me, i can't pull your build up. any chance you could post the data chunk?
|
Code:
| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1480;747;1494;HEX;| |78DA8D535B53525114DE878B887215114509F08637407BEA32D55466616208E443A| |9CC11B772EA04CC014BEBA51FD053CD644DF998FD86A61F47EBB2C1667AE98CAE6F| |AFB5BFB5BEBD167BE74F563D42BCBF2334DF7D536FB52AA5AAA5379BD2726DEAED6| |34B37BDDB46C394ED44F1F8D5BE295D4288F12EA59297A69499BC6EB50DDDACDCB5| |DAAD786F6F551ECA7A4B664AC7E815E5A1294F642B98ABD7A425EBED4C77E129341| |A666643EA4DA37EE425272F0F8CAA5197ECAD1947B536ECF9BBC40369B56A4633F8| |A0695433F71A07A795BCDE6A4BEB74140E370FFF9FF194F4759CE2106045D88E186| |A040E83E10541DF4B823C666994E510EB760C0DAD110CE7181E122C3D26D804BAC6| |74BBC6F451A68F323DCAF433E0D9D561ECCF0052A2EF3941FF0EC32EC1C01E4385E| |0096439B9BACD69D33094E8D04E4223EF0B10B8CD8ECDF5D3864A9E1F0C170405D8| |757305E15EA40EBF4268501D6590E7E2E381F87812019E44E011404C0CE5084620C| |BAB8EE2ED27F16927C16C5843FA1610FC8AE067C288838109DF801054BA41D69D65| |C159964FB16E8A7553AC1B81AC106789D01C118A100AAB9EC2690AC520146196167| |94A72D912C177D81953AA63AF891C7D433071C2F096E0CA3B865B34B612648DAB66| |C687A9D0952041829B890321A60831165C60C18532C13910E24A37CEDD26B9DB247| |79BE46EA7B9DB69EEB60C5993EA3A4D06A8D014CB4F8518585E03DE8C9ACA4C940A| |D92134A752E74634AC369FA5BB371F61EF2A790EE02DAA932F72ED2556CA72ED32D| |032AA762649B52FBC422CAB9C65EE76658B819B9E70F4DE1AFCC12736FE89141CEA| |614144A348DCD17B6B1D77A0F740FEE7735E3E5321F80EF4FD1DE29BE2BA0C3985F| |A956ED330D27CEEF43ADDD06C8E60659B82FD975936F191EEC3D22782F419C0B0F8| |E5E912DCC501B065340530DA36AE76D0ECA2BB872B1D57FB68AAE8767E7BBA93F15| |FC3015C477303CD4D34611884F8804C17BED241341E345E343E347E340134213451| |34E7683A7F00AF5FE7DA| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
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Okay I made a few changes, you're not nearly as far passed the soft cap but I figure with having capped DDR a few decimals of loss of defense won't kill your character. You have a little less hp and regen but more recovery and lower endurance usage and more recharge.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.81
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Violet Rumble: Level 50 Natural Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Martial Arts
Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Medicine
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Storm Kick -- Hectmb-Dmg/Rchg(A), Hectmb-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), Hectmb-Acc/Rchg(3), Hectmb-Dmg/EndRdx(5), Hectmb-Dam%(5)
Level 1: Focused Fighting -- SW-Def/EndRdx(A), SW-Def/Rchg(11), SW-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(19), SW-Def(21), SW-ResDam/Re TP(21)
Level 2: Focused Senses -- SW-Def/EndRdx(A), SW-Def/Rchg(11), SW-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(25), SW-Def(25), Ksmt-ToHit+(27)
Level 4: Cobra Strike -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(7), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(7), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(9), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(9)
Level 6: Agile -- S'dpty-Def(A), S'dpty-Def/Rchg(33), S'dpty-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(33)
Level 8: Focus Chi -- GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx(A), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg(13), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx(13)
Level 10: Practiced Brawler -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 12: Crane Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(15), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(15), Mako-Dam%(17), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(17), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(19)
Level 14: Combat Jumping -- GftotA-Def(A), GftotA-Def/Rchg(37), LkGmblr-Rchg+(39)
Level 16: Dodge -- GftotA-Def(A), GftotA-Def/EndRdx(23), LkGmblr-Rchg+(23)
Level 18: Crippling Axe Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(39), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(39), Mako-Dam%(40), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(40), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(40)
Level 20: Super Jump -- Jump-I(A)
Level 22: Quickness -- Run-I(A)
Level 24: Aid Other -- Numna-Heal/EndRdx(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(42), Numna-Heal(48)
Level 26: Dragon's Tail -- Armgdn-Dmg/Rchg(A), Armgdn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(27), Armgdn-Acc/Rchg(29), Armgdn-Dmg/EndRdx(29), Armgdn-Dam%(31)
Level 28: Lucky -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(31), LkGmblr-Rchg+(33)
Level 30: Aid Self -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(43), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 32: Eagles Claw -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(34), Mako-Dam%(34), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(37), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(37)
Level 35: Evasion -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(36), LkGmblr-Def(36), LkGmblr-Rchg+(36)
Level 38: Boxing -- Acc-I(A)
Level 41: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/EndRdx(A), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(42), GA-End/Res(42), GA-3defTpProc(48)
Level 44: Weave -- HO:Enzym(A), HO:Enzym(45), LkGmblr-Rchg+(45)
Level 47: Focused Accuracy -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 49: Physical Perfection -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(50), Numna-Heal/Rchg(50), P'Shift-End%(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 1: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 1: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 1: Health -- RgnTis-Regen+(A), Mrcl-Heal(31), Mrcl-Rcvry+(43), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(46), Numna-Heal(46), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(48)
Level 1: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), P'Shift-EndMod(45), P'Shift-End%(46)
Code:
| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1482;744;1488;HEX;| |78DA8D935B53525114C7F781838882808828A680376E82D24BA95DA6320B1343209| |F2A3AC2564E11308033FAD607E8A987AC291FB3CFD0F4D91A5A970DD6F412A3EB77| |F63AFFBDD6FEAF393B77BAE514E2DD5DA18D3DA81B9D4EB958691BAD966CDBF78CE| |E49DBA8BB0ECC665D76C38593B78775691742CCF425E59CAC4B99CE19EDAE69D4CB| |F7DADD4E68F06E4B1EC94647A68B27B82AC8A3BA3C951D6FB651936DD9E8A6FB0FC| |E7CB3594FEF4AA365368E5DB4C8C9AA59311B9257DBE671AD0BEFDC7D6155B63B35| |B3E57DD8322BE9FBCDEA59396774BAB27D3605878BC3FF473C25FD7ABA885A84C80| |84B8C1127E80946929043B9A6E4DB564C8D3C228C6709133B8C27843D906B4AAEFD| |259F62F914CB83BF40322BCE416E5587B1BE0244C590C1A81086AB0C49780A721B5| |7B7D82C1AA6C23D7A13D668F50904ECAF67B17F2703CE6F8C4B421EDE3AB8827024| |05A63E436A94F7D8468F28355663BC2678DE301ED391C7B38449D8E55247710D53F| |3451B61D9AFA17C1F046E2570B3605267B0E00B08BCAAAF97FB2E73C3656E1FE5BE| |51EE1BE5BE01D8E5E35DC217234101527EE5C99FA2D42CA4026A0E817D6A172F125| |69F11BE82605A0D7E7A9D4613DC205CDB64DC22CCDD2614413EA3CCCC4C5085392F| |21CC664220985582596E91E0868912E1020421E536C46E23EC36C26E23EC7691DD2| |EB2DB12EC9AE7B2D6790F155AF031F8140BDC5E03DD929ACA52900A592115535B63| |931A568B071819FA0457AF1374D025D5C9933700BA102B7D72F51208D3AA7A3A42D| |52F5D42ACA9EA6BEC37C373CEB0EDCC398F511FDC36F8839FD8FD2793D7D50D838C| |4699903EB8743D87677045FEE767BBBAAF42F0C730F4678A3F19FB55CA26EED054E| |6B2F471267608293693626BAB0784E1AB5D1611A6422B1FC8660ADD4E881FCEBEC0| |51188158C29087A01DE0D3730C2F70F9129F0C7C3AC450C165EFA7B33F19F74D1CC| |03A860D0C9B18FC3008F11E9576BCAEA3189C185C18C630B8317830F83004315C60| |E8FD069B68E5EF| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|
Virtue: @Santorican
Dark/Shield Build Thread
Alrighty, got the build (before you posted, i was inputting it in by hand)
Now, when you say 'better' do you mean 'maintain everything exactly + some' or better performing?
Depending on what you mean, depends on what could be done. 48% is massive overkill on defense for an SR, with 95% DDR (which your build has) so did you want that much of a cushion, or could those numbers be lowered?
You slotted alot of +hps, and +regen, which on an SR i can see being really useful, especially with MA not having much in the form of AoE to take down mass mobs before they can take you down. Is there a ball park you want, or just 'more of the same' of what you have now?
Quote:
Good question. I know you can make radically different builds that would be much better, particularly offensively. I don't have a hard and fast rule here, but I'm looking for a build that is a zero-compromise defensive build that *also* has good if not the absolute best offense.|
Originally Posted by Arbegla
Alrighty, got the build (before you posted, i was inputting it in by hand)
Now, when you say 'better' do you mean 'maintain everything exactly + some' or better performing? Depending on what you mean, depends on what could be done. 48% is massive overkill on defense for an SR, with 95% DDR (which your build has) so did you want that much of a cushion, or could those numbers be lowered? You slotted alot of +hps, and +regen, which on an SR i can see being really useful, especially with MA not having much in the form of AoE to take down mass mobs before they can take you down. Is there a ball park you want, or just 'more of the same' of what you have now? |
Let me switch to Santorican's build for an example. Defensively it has slightly less regen (378% vs 388%) and slightly less health (142.5% vs 145.5%). I'd consider that in the ball park for comparison purposes if I get something worthwhile out of it. What I get is primarily slightly higher recovery (3.88/s vs 3.49/s) and somewhat lower toggle burn rate (1.01/s vs 1.12/s). The net result is higher net endurance for offense: 2.87/s vs 2.37/s. So from a marathon perspective, this is definitely a better build.
However, it also really skirts the line on defense: 45.2/45.0/45.3 (m/r/a). that's low enough that any significant amount of debuff will bring this build off the soft cap, particularly for ranged which makes it a significantly weaker build in terms of +DEF. It also has less damage buff (+11.5% vs +17%) and slightly lower damage slotting for three attacks (Storm Kick, Cobra Strike, and Dragon's tail although its negligable in the case of CS). It does have significantly higher recharge - 82.5% vs 57.5% but I don't know at a glance if that will make up for the damage loss (which would require an attack chain analysis).
Overall, I'm going to have to say that in terms of endurance management, its a superior build, but its also defensively weaker and probably not offensively stronger (the recharge edge probably washes against the lower damage strengths although that's a guess). I personally wouldn't consider it a better build overall, although that's a qualitative judgment.
What I'm looking for is something with at least some defensive cushion against debuffs (say, 46% to all or better, although if someone finds a 45.93% build I'm not going to quibble if it delivers in other areas), has a lot of health and regen (but that's negotiable) has at least the normal nominal bells and whistles you'd expect from an MA/SR build (meaning: at least *some* recharge buff), and doesn't sacrifice too much offense from the build I posted.
Bonus points if you can do it while keeping most or all of the primary and secondary powers I took, although again that's somewhat negotiable. Losing Dragon's tail or several single target attacks completely would have to be justified with something extraordinary in my opinion, though, because part of the intent of this build was to see if I could build a less laser-focused build that only took like three attacks and had a ton of recharge to compensate, which is how a lot of offensively focused builds are constructed. This is something you could actually level up, gaining performance with every level of play.
It also was intended to demonstrate what inherent fitness will buy you, although that's a secondary issue to whether the build can be improved upon. Plus, I'm genuinely curious to know what the Scrapper, err, min/max community can do here. I think I did a pretty good job on this build, but there's a lot of min/maxers out there that are at least as good as I am in optimizing builds, and I want to see if there are tricks that can be played here that I just haven't thought of yet.
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
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Quote:
Just to elaborate on this point, the DDR cap is 95%. Which means basically slotted highly enough (which both our builds are) incoming debuffs get reduced by a factor of 20. But with defense debuffs generally being in the -7.5% to -20% range, that means through DDR those debuffs would be between -0.375% and -1% defense. So I think an SR build that really wants to go for soft-cap based high-level survivability should have at least 1% insurance against debuffs. By going all the way up to 48% I have a build that can tolerate a bit more than -60% resistable defense debuffs. That puts me into Cim and Vanguard territory.|
Originally Posted by Santorican
Okay I made a few changes, you're not nearly as far passed the soft cap but I figure with having capped DDR a few decimals of loss of defense won't kill your character.
|
Now, granted these builds both don't rely purely on defense: both have basically perma-dull Pain (the old school version that wasn't enhanceable for +health) and almost as much regen as a regen scrapper, but I still think the debuff buffer is important especially for a build that specifically builds for survivability, which these do.
Having said that, recovery is, as high as my version goes, a definite weakness of both builds. Not just because of the burn rate, but also because the attacks themselves are not highly slotted for endurance reduction. And where my build might close the gap with yours a little is with Storm Kick. Most MA builds will be cycling Storm Kick about as often as possible. Yours burns 5.3 end per cast, mine burns 4.21 per cast (the burn rate for the other attacks are not too different from each other). Because yours has higher recharge, its hard to compare straight across but if we assume Storm Kick is used about once every five seconds or so, mine ends up burning about 0.2 eps less than yours. That's 40% of the 0.5eps edge your build has on mine in a straight up recovery/toggle burn comparison.
The only thing that will take more time than I have at the moment to analyze are the attack chain differences which could be significant because your build has +25% more recharge. That may or may not create a material offensive gap. Maybe some other number cruncher with a bit more time will answer that question for us.
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
In one little corner of the universe, there's nothing more irritating than a misfile...
(Please support the best webcomic about a cosmic universal realignment by impaired angelic interference resulting in identity crisis angst. Or I release the pigmy water thieves.)
This is as far as I can build without knowing what attack chain to shoot for. I likely would not have gotten aid self, and instead picked up hasten (and probably dropped crane kick for energy torrent, but that's just me).
I also never realized how good Shield Wall sets are for /sr scrappers until now. that regen and hp? hell yeah.
Anyway, the damage bonus is considerably less, but other than that:
72.5% rech,
46-48% def m/r/a,
3.82 end gain
1.04 end use
133.7% hp (yay coincidences)
3.17% regen (23.7hp/sec)
Also, 50% accuracy, and 60% rech resist
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.707
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Level 50 Natural Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Martial Arts
Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Medicine
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Storm Kick -- Hectmb-Dmg/Rchg(A), Hectmb-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(13), Hectmb-Acc/Rchg(13), Hectmb-Dmg/EndRdx(37), Hectmb-Dam%(37)
Level 1: Focused Fighting -- S'dpty-Def/EndRdx(A), S'dpty-Def(5), S'dpty-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(15), S'dpty-Def/Rchg(17), S'dpty-EndRdx(23), Ksmt-ToHit+(43)
Level 2: Cobra Strike -- C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(5), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(15), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(25), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(37)
Level 4: Agile -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), SW-ResDam/Re TP(11), SW-Def(11), SW-Def/EndRdx(45)
Level 6: Focused Senses -- S'dpty-Def/EndRdx(A), S'dpty-Def/Rchg(7), S'dpty-Def(7), S'dpty-EndRdx(43), S'dpty-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(45)
Level 8: Crane Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Dmg/EndRdx(9), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(9), Mako-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(25), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Mako-Dam%(45)
Level 10: Practiced Brawler -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 12: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
Level 14: Super Jump -- Winter-ResSlow(A)
Level 16: Dodge -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), SW-Def(17), SW-Def/EndRdx(21), SW-Def/Rchg(39)
Level 18: Crippling Axe Kick -- T'Death-Acc/Dmg(A), T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx(19), T'Death-Dmg/Rchg(19), T'Death-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(21), T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), T'Death-Dam%(43)
Level 20: Quickness -- Run-I(A)
Level 22: Focus Chi -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(23)
Level 24: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 26: Dragon's Tail -- Armgdn-Dmg/Rchg(A), Armgdn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(27), Armgdn-Acc/Rchg(27), Armgdn-Dmg/EndRdx(31), Armgdn-Dam%(42)
Level 28: Lucky -- SW-Def(A), SW-Def/EndRdx(29), SW-Def/Rchg(29), LkGmblr-Rchg+(46)
Level 30: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), S'fstPrt-ResDam/EndRdx(31), S'fstPrt-ResKB(31), GA-ResDam(42), GA-3defTpProc(42)
Level 32: Eagles Claw -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(33), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(33), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), RechRdx-I(36)
Level 35: Evasion -- GftotA-Def/EndRdx(A), GftotA-Def/Rchg(36), GftotA-Def(36), GftotA-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 38: Weave -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), HO:Enzym(39)
Level 41: Conserve Power -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 44: Aid Other -- Empty(A)
Level 47: Aid Self -- Dct'dW-Heal(A), Dct'dW-Rchg(48), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx(48), Dct'dW-Heal/Rchg(48), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 49: Physical Perfection -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(50), Numna-Heal/Rchg(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
Level 2: Ninja Run
Level 1: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 1: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 1: Health -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A), Mrcl-Heal(39), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(40), Numna-Heal(40), RgnTis-Regen+(40)
Level 1: Stamina -- P'Shift-End%(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(3), P'Shift-EndMod(3), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(46)
Code:
please stop distracting me, I have physics homework :O
| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1468;742;1484;HEX;| |78DA85935953134110C767B31B42C82D8400218470E522017C51C0A354C4E258080| |4795020B58401565321952C16BCF9017CD22AD0525EFD0E969F4DD73E36C12A1FDC| |4AFAB7DDD333F3EFE959FD62C92FC4FBC742093EAB19AD56A55C6D1A8D866C7A360| |CEBBC69D4844708116F472BBAAC4959D48DA6651AB5CA93A6D54A76C696E4B1ACB7| |64B17C8EDEB63CAEC90BD98AACD44F6553D6AD62FBC55F3A3BAB15D7A5D130EB270| |17296CD9353ABE3E9F2C8AC9A7519216FA5FECE6C998766CDB42E23CF1B66B5F8F4| |ECE8B2A21B2D4B362F07405E16FE57A8931E5B1369971073C29F6164091339469EA| |063BA42E96EF11B90169A4B41041542D8A660BF4A5EEE17780971ED7126C1268A21| |7021ED90109484812A61E288B009E92A6FA2AA5105433D6B2A619530BD4CD8803C3| |7E7696E16D3C5DB77B1A61CAB9866695F209DABB5DD9E63DAA9FB8471CA2A4C42EA| |0D61FA2DA10453BCBC89F0A628D40F219F13F2B1BE188402BCB608C449DD1684424| |E1521CE0AB3FC3E963FF582F015F2228EACC82B927FE735638FD0B74F481D107215| |C236CCEA7534F41648D66708457921259A67A50C0546628EBA980D8FF8069141A72| |383F3D4DAA105C62261E40121FB905086F4B8534B9C8B18E62286B9880217A8425E| |C2E94822A660EF47FA190384EC0CA567EF126E203DE9949EE4DE8FF2F518E5EB31C| |AF722C5B7649CABD98159638E98318D5A3BEE6674130A1E820679939CA74CB2BEA9| |7BE069AA28C3F619E74032BC6A02B2F34E284F67948448D139A3E226CD9F2931D61| |83A616E83F01DFA3FCBDBB9665FF2C816A34C18D63A9F1AFC7087F57F2225ADF3A5| |088555689D2FCEF6863BA370853B7121F80274FD1DCA50C8731BD2C42A1DCBD40A2| |1BD4BA2D2AC34FD88DAD37D9BAE8A6B6ABDEB8AF19150F844B0FFFFFCF0B797F26E| |F780DD415302A3ECE2DB1E9A7D740FF0CD4073886E15DFEC9FFEF6C984EEE301CCA| |35940B388260A07213E60A6C707C687C68F268026882684268CA617CD109A1B34F6| |1F8E5DEA67| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Iggy_Kamakaze
I hate to be the bringer of bad news... but Willpower sucks!!! you're better off rolling a regen
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^Professional Katana/regen build thread
Quote:
Just FYI, I have no requirement to keep all of the power choices identical. I already know there are hyperfast builds with better offense that discard a lot of the attacks, but I'm not rejecting such builds out of hand. I'm looking for new tricks using this build as a benchmark.|
Originally Posted by Elegost
This is as far as I can build without knowing what attack chain to shoot for. I likely would not have gotten aid self, and instead picked up hasten (and probably dropped crane kick for energy torrent, but that's just me).
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Quote:
| I also never realized how good Shield Wall sets are for /sr scrappers until now. that regen and hp? hell yeah. |
Anyway, this build has some interesting things going for it. Its even more generous with endurance: net endurance with all toggles running 3.0eps, which is a lot more than my piddly 2.37eps. And it has even more recharge than Santorican's build: +92.5%. It has less defense, but that's not a deal breaker since every position is still comfortably above the soft cap (46.8% or better). Its main weakness is that it has significantly lower +health and recharge: 133.7% to 145.5% +health and 317% regen to my 388% regen. That translates to a difference of 23.72 h/s vs 31.5 h/s, which is actually 25% less total health recovery. Given that both sets have Aid self, maybe that isn't a problem.
It probably comes down to offense. If this build can put out substantially more offense, then you could rightly argue it has an edge on my build. Right now, I can't say.
That's two in a row going for more recharge and more endurance and sacrificing regen and health. I wonder if I've basically dinged the bell at the top of regen and health, and all other credible builds are really going to have to spend some of that to get anything else. Given the fact that if it wasn't for the rule of 5 I would have even more regen, that seems like a distinct possibility.
I'm wondering if anyone will take up the meta challenge of trying to beat my build *without* inherent fitness. A question right now is what's the real net benefit of inherent fitness. This would be an interesting data point: how much better is a build with inherent fitness than one without. This build is noticeably stronger than any build I've put together without inherent fitness, because it can leverage the fighting pool more effectively, which means it doesn't have to scramble for set bonuses to get to and past the soft cap, which actually puts options back into the build, which actually returns slots to me that I can put into, among other things, ironically, fitness.
Quote:
| please stop distracting me, I have physics homework :O |
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
In one little corner of the universe, there's nothing more irritating than a misfile...
(Please support the best webcomic about a cosmic universal realignment by impaired angelic interference resulting in identity crisis angst. Or I release the pigmy water thieves.)
Couple of easy changes:
Switch a set of 3 Serendipity for the 3 LoTG for a net gain in regen and a minimal loss in HP.
Stick a stealth celerity or unbounded leap in sprint for stealth on demand.
Consider putting a microfilament (for better endurance) or a Winter's Gift (for slow resistance) in Super Jump.
50s: Inv/SS PB Emp/Dark Grav/FF DM/Regen TA/A Sonic/Elec MA/Regen Fire/Kin Sonic/Rad Ice/Kin Crab Fire/Cold NW Merc/Dark Emp/Sonic Rad/Psy Emp/Ice WP/DB FA/SM
Overlord of Dream Team and Nightmare Squad
I just remembered that I took CP in that build, so it really doesn't even need that much recovery. I'd flip the GotA in evasion over for 3 more shield walls. That can free up a slot for CJ for more regen, or aid self for an interrupt (more effective use in combat, effectively more regen?)
That puts him up to 136%hp without TFC, and 25.6 hp/s. (if put in CJ)
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Iggy_Kamakaze
I hate to be the bringer of bad news... but Willpower sucks!!! you're better off rolling a regen
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^Professional Katana/regen build thread
one thing i notice about a number of these i19 builds is the assumption (or available information not available to all*?*) that fitness will remain the same value as it is right now.
can that be said with any certainty that stamina will stay the same and that new i19 builds should not focus more heavily on end management to continue being able to solo the gm's/pylons of co*?
from my limited perspective here as a viewer, there is a case to be made for stamina/health being reduced in total value while still allowing the slotting of special io's, especially with the continued mods of incarnate abilities and the e.d. interactions.
/devils advocate.
Kittens give Morbo gas.
from what I've heard, they're not being changed at all, other than availability (squids and lobsters actually get to use fitness post i19, yay).
Castle said nothing about their values being diminished, and I see no reason for them to do so.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Iggy_Kamakaze
I hate to be the bringer of bad news... but Willpower sucks!!! you're better off rolling a regen
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^Professional Katana/regen build thread
Quote:
No Hasten.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
I just posted a build for fun in the I19 discussion thread as an example of inherent fitness leveraging. Since I don't often post builds, I wouldn't want to cheat the number-crunching community of a chance to tear apart one of my min/max attempts. So I'm reposting here, so the I19 thread doesn't become a scrapper-dominated bloodfest.
My question to you all is: what's wrong with this build? How could it be improved? Is it really something that benefits from inherent fitness, or is there a way to replicate it that I haven't found. And here's a real conundrum: there's actually a redundant set bonus in there, something over the rule of 5. Oddly, whenever I try to shuffle things around to get rid of that redundant bonus, I tend to make the build *worse* in some way. Very curious. Repost follows: Just for giggles, I tried to see what I could come up with in terms of an inherent fitness rebuild of my MA/SR scrapper. This is just for fun, and I'm not saying the results are going to be typical. On the other hand, I don't think this is necessarily the best anyone's going to be able to do either under inherent fitness. This build takes every MA/SR power except thunder kick, challenge, and elude, burns a power choice on travel (as opposed to just Ninja Running everywhere) and still ends up pretty tough. More importantly, its not trivial to replicate without inherent fitness due to the power choice requirements: losing three power choices means losing fighting, or losing MA attacks. You could eliminate EC, DT, and maybe Super Jump and then rebuild as a more recharge-heavy build (you'd need more recharge to make consistently full attack chains and also to boost single target to compensate for the lack of the crit-enhanced combo of EC->DT). But I think this build is a product of inherent fitness in large part. Reading off the totals: >48% defense to melee/ranged/AoE ~16.5% defense to s/l/f/c/e/n ~14.5% defense to psi 19.9% resistance smash/lethal 3% resistance f/c/t/p 6.8% resistance energy 9.9% resistance negative 388% regen (31.5 h/s at level 50) 145.5% health (1948 at level 50) [with accolades] 190% recovery (3.49eps) end use: 1.12eps (with FF, FS, Ev, CJ, Tough, and Weave all running) Not bad. It has some PvPIOs in it (in Focused Fighting and Focused Senses of all places, but also a couple in Tough) but that's mostly extravagance for the +3% procs and a few more +health and +dmg bonuses. They could be replaced with LotG without seriously altering the build (without the Glad +3% I would shift the slot to Weave for some extra defense insurance, although I would still be above 45% to all positions either way - honestly, that's the one I would use merits to buy above all others if I was going to implement this build; the others are entirely optional). Interestingly, the strategy of this build is not to steal slots from fitness, but rather to steal slots from elsewhere to leverage the additional power choices. Which I think will happen as often as, if not more often than, people pull slots from stamina or health themselves. It still means that extra pool choice and four more power choices are still very meaningful. I'm curious to know if anyone can recreate this build more or less without inherent fitness. I couldn't, but then again I'm not the worlds most experienced Mids jockey. Also, I rarely post builds, so now's everyone's chance to rip my min/max skillz a new one by posting a far superior build that does more or less the same things. Hit me with your best shot, people. (Note: the build uses version 1.8 with the inherent fitness database hacks if you want to load it) Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.803 http://www.cohplanner.com/ Click this DataLink to open the build! Violet Rumble: Level 50 Natural Scrapper Primary Power Set: Martial Arts Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes Power Pool: Leaping Power Pool: Medicine Power Pool: Fighting Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery Hero Profile: Level 1: Storm Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Dmg/EndRdx(3), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(3), Mako-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(5), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), Mako-Dam%(7) Level 1: Focused Fighting -- SW-Def(A), SW-Def/EndRdx(19), SW-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(21), SW-Def/Rchg(21), SW-ResDam/Re TP(45) Level 2: Focused Senses -- SW-Def(A), SW-Def/EndRdx(25), SW-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(25), SW-Def/Rchg(27) Level 4: Cobra Strike -- T'Death-Acc/Dmg(A), T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx(7), T'Death-Dmg/Rchg(9), T'Death-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(9), T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(11), T'Death-Dam%(11) Level 6: Agile -- S'dpty-Def(A), S'dpty-Def/Rchg(33), S'dpty-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(33) Level 8: Focus Chi -- GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx(A), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg(13), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx(13) Level 10: Practiced Brawler -- RechRdx-I(A) Level 12: Crane Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(15), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(15), Mako-Dam%(17), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(17), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(19) Level 14: Combat Jumping -- GftotA-Def(A), GftotA-Def/Rchg(37), LkGmblr-Rchg+(39) Level 16: Dodge -- GftotA-Def(A), GftotA-Def/EndRdx(23), LkGmblr-Rchg+(23) Level 18: Crippling Axe Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(39), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(39), Mako-Dam%(40), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(40), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(40) Level 20: Super Jump -- Jump-I(A) Level 22: Quickness -- Run-I(A) Level 24: Aid Other -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(48) Level 26: Dragon's Tail -- Sciroc-Acc/Dmg(A), Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx(27), Sciroc-Dmg/Rchg(29), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(29), Sciroc-Dam%(31), Armgdn-Dam%(31) Level 28: Lucky -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(31), LkGmblr-Rchg+(33) Level 30: Aid Self -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(43), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(43) Level 32: Eagles Claw -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(34), Mako-Dam%(34), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(37), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(37) Level 35: Evasion -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def(36), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(36), LkGmblr-Rchg+(36) Level 38: Boxing -- Acc-I(A) Level 41: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/EndRdx(A), GA-ResDam(42), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(42), GA-3defTpProc(42) Level 44: Weave -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(45), LkGmblr-Rchg+(48) Level 47: Focused Accuracy -- EndRdx-I(A) Level 49: Physical Perfection -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(50), Numna-Heal/Rchg(50) ------------ Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A) Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A) Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A) Level 1: Critical Hit Level 4: Ninja Run Level 1: Swift -- Run-I(A) Level 1: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A) Level 1: Health -- Numna-Heal(A), RgnTis-Regen+(43), Numna-Heal/Rchg(46), Mrcl-Rcvry+(46), Mrcl-Heal(48), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(50) Level 1: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(45), P'Shift-End%(46) |
Makes no assumptions about any attack-chain specific build requirements, and I did take Aid Self on my Claws/SR build.
This one gives up 3% damage bonus to get the following:
+62.5% rech - 82.5% total
Defense
M: 47.6%
R: 47.4%
A: 47.1%
3.69 recovery
1.03 end use
142.5% HP - 1907hp
388% regen
55% accuracy
Cheers
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.803
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Violet Rumble: Level 50 Natural Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Martial Arts
Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Medicine
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Storm Kick -- C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(A), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(3), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(5), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5)
Level 1: Focused Fighting -- SW-Def/EndRdx(A), SW-Def/Rchg(11), SW-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(19), SW-Def(21), SW-ResDam/Re TP(21)
Level 2: Focused Senses -- SW-Def/EndRdx(A), SW-Def/Rchg(11), SW-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(25), SW-Def(25)
Level 4: Cobra Strike -- Hectmb-Dmg/Rchg(A), Hectmb-Dam%(7), Hectmb-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(7), Hectmb-Acc/Rchg(9), Hectmb-Dmg/EndRdx(9)
Level 6: Agile -- S'dpty-Def(A), S'dpty-Def/Rchg(33), S'dpty-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(33)
Level 8: Focus Chi -- GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx(A), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg(13), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx(13), GSFC-ToHit(27), GSFC-ToHit/EndRdx(33), GSFC-Build%(48)
Level 10: Practiced Brawler -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 12: Crane Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(15), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(15), Mako-Dam%(17), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(17), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(19)
Level 14: Combat Jumping -- GftotA-Def(A), GftotA-Def/Rchg(37), LkGmblr-Rchg+(39)
Level 16: Dodge -- GftotA-Def(A), GftotA-Def/EndRdx(23), LkGmblr-Rchg+(23)
Level 18: Crippling Axe Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(39), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(39), Mako-Dam%(40), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(40), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(40)
Level 20: Super Jump -- Jump-I(A)
Level 22: Quickness -- Run-I(A)
Level 24: Aid Other -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(42)
Level 26: Dragon's Tail -- Armgdn-Dmg/Rchg(A), Armgdn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(27), Armgdn-Acc/Rchg(29), Armgdn-Dmg/EndRdx(29), Armgdn-Dam%(31)
Level 28: Lucky -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+(31)
Level 30: Aid Self -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(43), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 32: Eagles Claw -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(34), Mako-Dam%(34), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(37), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(37)
Level 35: Evasion -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(36), LkGmblr-Def(36), LkGmblr-Rchg+(36)
Level 38: Boxing -- Acc-I(A)
Level 41: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/EndRdx(A), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(42), GA-End/Res(42), GA-3defTpProc(48)
Level 44: Weave -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(45), LkGmblr-Rchg+(45), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 47: Focused Accuracy -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 49: Physical Perfection -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(50), Numna-Heal/Rchg(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 1: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Numna-Heal(45), Numna-Heal/Rchg(46), Mrcl-Heal(46), Mrcl-Rcvry+(46), RgnTis-Regen+(48)
Level 1: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(31), P'Shift-End%(43)
Code:
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[B] GUARDIAN 50s:[/B] [B]Tank[/B]: Ice/Fire, Fire/Fire, DA/SS, Inv/WM, SD/Elec...[B]Scrap[/B]: BS/Reg, Spin/DA, DM/SD, Fire/WP, Claws/SR....[B]Troller[/B]: Ill/Rad, Fire/Kin...[B]Blaster[/B]: Fire/EM....[B]Defender[/B]: D3...[B]Brute[/B]: Elm/ElA...[B]EPIC[/B]: Widow, PB, Crab...CURRENTLY: 45 Stone/Stone Tank...38 AR/Rad Corr...21 Ice^3 Dom
Quote:
Don't . Need . Hasten ...
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Originally Posted by Silverado
No Hasten.
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It's the end. But the moment has been prepared for ...
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Good question. I know you can make radically different builds that would be much better, particularly offensively. I don't have a hard and fast rule here, but I'm looking for a build that is a zero-compromise defensive build that *also* has good if not the absolute best offense.
Let me switch to Santorican's build for an example. Defensively it has slightly less regen (378% vs 388%) and slightly less health (142.5% vs 145.5%). I'd consider that in the ball park for comparison purposes if I get something worthwhile out of it. What I get is primarily slightly higher recovery (3.88/s vs 3.49/s) and somewhat lower toggle burn rate (1.01/s vs 1.12/s). The net result is higher net endurance for offense: 2.87/s vs 2.37/s. So from a marathon perspective, this is definitely a better build. However, it also really skirts the line on defense: 45.2/45.0/45.3 (m/r/a). that's low enough that any significant amount of debuff will bring this build off the soft cap, particularly for ranged which makes it a significantly weaker build in terms of +DEF. It also has less damage buff (+11.5% vs +17%) and slightly lower damage slotting for three attacks (Storm Kick, Cobra Strike, and Dragon's tail although its negligable in the case of CS). It does have significantly higher recharge - 82.5% vs 57.5% but I don't know at a glance if that will make up for the damage loss (which would require an attack chain analysis). Overall, I'm going to have to say that in terms of endurance management, its a superior build, but its also defensively weaker and probably not offensively stronger (the recharge edge probably washes against the lower damage strengths although that's a guess). I personally wouldn't consider it a better build overall, although that's a qualitative judgment. What I'm looking for is something with at least some defensive cushion against debuffs (say, 46% to all or better, although if someone finds a 45.93% build I'm not going to quibble if it delivers in other areas), has a lot of health and regen (but that's negotiable) has at least the normal nominal bells and whistles you'd expect from an MA/SR build (meaning: at least *some* recharge buff), and doesn't sacrifice too much offense from the build I posted. Bonus points if you can do it while keeping most or all of the primary and secondary powers I took, although again that's somewhat negotiable. Losing Dragon's tail or several single target attacks completely would have to be justified with something extraordinary in my opinion, though, because part of the intent of this build was to see if I could build a less laser-focused build that only took like three attacks and had a ton of recharge to compensate, which is how a lot of offensively focused builds are constructed. This is something you could actually level up, gaining performance with every level of play. It also was intended to demonstrate what inherent fitness will buy you, although that's a secondary issue to whether the build can be improved upon. Plus, I'm genuinely curious to know what the Scrapper, err, min/max community can do here. I think I did a pretty good job on this build, but there's a lot of min/maxers out there that are at least as good as I am in optimizing builds, and I want to see if there are tricks that can be played here that I just haven't thought of yet. |
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Just to elaborate on this point, the DDR cap is 95%. Which means basically slotted highly enough (which both our builds are) incoming debuffs get reduced by a factor of 20. But with defense debuffs generally being in the -7.5% to -20% range, that means through DDR those debuffs would be between -0.375% and -1% defense. So I think an SR build that really wants to go for soft-cap based high-level survivability should have at least 1% insurance against debuffs. By going all the way up to 48% I have a build that can tolerate a bit more than -60% resistable defense debuffs. That puts me into Cim and Vanguard territory.
Now, granted these builds both don't rely purely on defense: both have basically perma-dull Pain (the old school version that wasn't enhanceable for +health) and almost as much regen as a regen scrapper, but I still think the debuff buffer is important especially for a build that specifically builds for survivability, which these do. Having said that, recovery is, as high as my version goes, a definite weakness of both builds. Not just because of the burn rate, but also because the attacks themselves are not highly slotted for endurance reduction. And where my build might close the gap with yours a little is with Storm Kick. Most MA builds will be cycling Storm Kick about as often as possible. Yours burns 5.3 end per cast, mine burns 4.21 per cast (the burn rate for the other attacks are not too different from each other). Because yours has higher recharge, its hard to compare straight across but if we assume Storm Kick is used about once every five seconds or so, mine ends up burning about 0.2 eps less than yours. That's 40% of the 0.5eps edge your build has on mine in a straight up recovery/toggle burn comparison. The only thing that will take more time than I have at the moment to analyze are the attack chain differences which could be significant because your build has +25% more recharge. That may or may not create a material offensive gap. Maybe some other number cruncher with a bit more time will answer that question for us. |
Virtue: @Santorican
Dark/Shield Build Thread
Quote:
Its very strongly implied that the Fitness powers themselves are being made inherent (or rather, inherent copies of them are being made) without other modification.
|
Originally Posted by spice_weasel
one thing i notice about a number of these i19 builds is the assumption (or available information not available to all*?*) that fitness will remain the same value as it is right now.
can that be said with any certainty that stamina will stay the same and that new i19 builds should not focus more heavily on end management to continue being able to solo the gm's/pylons of co*? from my limited perspective here as a viewer, there is a case to be made for stamina/health being reduced in total value while still allowing the slotting of special io's, especially with the continued mods of incarnate abilities and the e.d. interactions. /devils advocate. |
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
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Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.81
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Violet Rumble: Level 50 Natural Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Martial Arts
Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Medicine
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Storm Kick -- Hectmb-Dmg/Rchg(A), Hectmb-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), Hectmb-Acc/Rchg(3), Hectmb-Dmg/EndRdx(5), Hectmb-Dam%(5)
Level 1: Focused Fighting -- SW-Def/EndRdx(A), SW-Def/Rchg(7), SW-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(19), SW-Def(21), SW-ResDam/Re TP(21)
Level 2: Focused Senses -- SW-Def/EndRdx(A), SW-Def/Rchg(25), SW-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(25), SW-Def(27)
Level 4: Cobra Strike -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(7), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(9), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(9), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(11)
Level 6: Agile -- S'dpty-Def(A), S'dpty-Def/Rchg(33), S'dpty-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(33)
Level 8: Focus Chi -- GSFC-ToHit(A), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg(11), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx(13), GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx(13), GSFC-ToHit/EndRdx(36), GSFC-Build%(45)
Level 10: Practiced Brawler -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 12: Crane Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(15), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(15), Mako-Dam%(17), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(17), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(19)
Level 14: Combat Jumping -- GftotA-Def(A), GftotA-Def/Rchg(37), LkGmblr-Rchg+(39)
Level 16: Dodge -- GftotA-Def(A), GftotA-Def/EndRdx(23), LkGmblr-Rchg+(23)
Level 18: Crippling Axe Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(39), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(39), Mako-Dam%(40), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(40), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(40)
Level 20: Super Jump -- Jump-I(A)
Level 22: Quickness -- Run-I(A)
Level 24: Aid Other -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(48)
Level 26: Dragon's Tail -- Armgdn-Dmg/Rchg(A), Armgdn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(27), Armgdn-Acc/Rchg(29), Armgdn-Dmg/EndRdx(29), Armgdn-Dam%(31)
Level 28: Lucky -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(31), LkGmblr-Rchg+(33)
Level 30: Aid Self -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(43), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 32: Eagles Claw -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(34), Mako-Dam%(34), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(37), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(37)
Level 35: Evasion -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def(36), LkGmblr-Rchg+(36)
Level 38: Boxing -- Acc-I(A)
Level 41: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/EndRdx(A), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(42), GA-End/Res(42), GA-3defTpProc(42)
Level 44: Weave -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(45), LkGmblr-Rchg+(48)
Level 47: Focused Accuracy -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 49: Physical Perfection -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(50), Numna-Heal/Rchg(50), P'Shift-End%(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 1: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 1: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 1: Health -- RgnTis-Regen+(A), Mrcl-Heal(31), Mrcl-Rcvry+(43), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(46), Numna-Heal(46), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(48)
Level 1: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(45), P'Shift-End%(46)
Code:
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Virtue: @Santorican
Dark/Shield Build Thread
Quote:
Hasten means more use of buildup and more use of better dpa attacks and/or aoe's.|
Originally Posted by Redlynne
Don't . Need . Hasten ...
|
In this case the OP has a ~39 sec rech on build up. Hasten would knock that down to ~29. In terms of min/maxing a build you can't lay claim to the 'maxing' aspect without hasten if your build has any powers that improve performance and are recharge based (which is pretty much every toon in the game I imagine).
Or when in a situation killing multiple enemies (ie most of the game) hasten will have DT recharging every ~5.5 sec as opposed to every ~7.5. That is a notable improvement in performance. One that is likely more substantial than any additional IO tweaks that can be done to an already heavily IO'd build.
If you have a 'good' build, it will always be 'better' with hasten.
With specific regard to the OP's build it looks like a ton of inf resulting in a very survivable /sr, but not a particularly offensive /sr. I'd probably take a minor hit in survivability and add a ton more offense by picking up hasten (as mentioned by Silverado) and energy torrent, or take a little larger hitby picking up hasten and fireball.
Unless you are specifically looking to play on /x1 settings then AoE starts to become more and powerful. Or you are looking for a single target killer (maybe AV's) in which case unless you are determined to use a ma/sr I'd suggest about 50 or so builds better suited to it that will do it faster, safer, and for a lot less inf.
I'm just waiting for Castle to come out and say April fools regarding this fitness thing
K here's my crack at it...
365% Regen (30.5 hp/sec) Aidself is slotted up better
149.6% HP (2003 HP)
46.2/46/45.4 defense
20.4 s/l resists
3.72 end/rec with .99 usage
Runs SK-EC-SK-CS-CAK
A lot less +damage
Code:
A lot of ways to go with 3 extra power picks...
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I just posted a build for fun in the I19 discussion thread as an example of inherent fitness leveraging. Since I don't often post builds, I wouldn't want to cheat the number-crunching community of a chance to tear apart one of my min/max attempts. So I'm reposting here, so the I19 thread doesn't become a scrapper-dominated bloodfest.
My question to you all is: what's wrong with this build? How could it be improved? Is it really something that benefits from inherent fitness, or is there a way to replicate it that I haven't found. And here's a real conundrum: there's actually a redundant set bonus in there, something over the rule of 5. Oddly, whenever I try to shuffle things around to get rid of that redundant bonus, I tend to make the build *worse* in some way. Very curious.
Repost follows:
Just for giggles, I tried to see what I could come up with in terms of an inherent fitness rebuild of my MA/SR scrapper. This is just for fun, and I'm not saying the results are going to be typical. On the other hand, I don't think this is necessarily the best anyone's going to be able to do either under inherent fitness. This build takes every MA/SR power except thunder kick, challenge, and elude, burns a power choice on travel (as opposed to just Ninja Running everywhere) and still ends up pretty tough. More importantly, its not trivial to replicate without inherent fitness due to the power choice requirements: losing three power choices means losing fighting, or losing MA attacks. You could eliminate EC, DT, and maybe Super Jump and then rebuild as a more recharge-heavy build (you'd need more recharge to make consistently full attack chains and also to boost single target to compensate for the lack of the crit-enhanced combo of EC->DT). But I think this build is a product of inherent fitness in large part.
Reading off the totals:
>48% defense to melee/ranged/AoE
~16.5% defense to s/l/f/c/e/n
~14.5% defense to psi
19.9% resistance smash/lethal
3% resistance f/c/t/p
6.8% resistance energy
9.9% resistance negative
388% regen (31.5 h/s at level 50)
145.5% health (1948 at level 50) [with accolades]
190% recovery (3.49eps)
end use: 1.12eps (with FF, FS, Ev, CJ, Tough, and Weave all running)
Not bad. It has some PvPIOs in it (in Focused Fighting and Focused Senses of all places, but also a couple in Tough) but that's mostly extravagance for the +3% procs and a few more +health and +dmg bonuses. They could be replaced with LotG without seriously altering the build (without the Glad +3% I would shift the slot to Weave for some extra defense insurance, although I would still be above 45% to all positions either way - honestly, that's the one I would use merits to buy above all others if I was going to implement this build; the others are entirely optional).
Interestingly, the strategy of this build is not to steal slots from fitness, but rather to steal slots from elsewhere to leverage the additional power choices. Which I think will happen as often as, if not more often than, people pull slots from stamina or health themselves. It still means that extra pool choice and four more power choices are still very meaningful.
I'm curious to know if anyone can recreate this build more or less without inherent fitness. I couldn't, but then again I'm not the worlds most experienced Mids jockey.
Also, I rarely post builds, so now's everyone's chance to rip my min/max skillz a new one by posting a far superior build that does more or less the same things. Hit me with your best shot, people.
(Note: the build uses version 1.8 with the inherent fitness database hacks if you want to load it)
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.803
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Violet Rumble: Level 50 Natural Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Martial Arts
Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Medicine
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Storm Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Dmg/EndRdx(3), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(3), Mako-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(5), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), Mako-Dam%(7)
Level 1: Focused Fighting -- SW-Def(A), SW-Def/EndRdx(19), SW-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(21), SW-Def/Rchg(21), SW-ResDam/Re TP(45)
Level 2: Focused Senses -- SW-Def(A), SW-Def/EndRdx(25), SW-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(25), SW-Def/Rchg(27)
Level 4: Cobra Strike -- T'Death-Acc/Dmg(A), T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx(7), T'Death-Dmg/Rchg(9), T'Death-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(9), T'Death-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(11), T'Death-Dam%(11)
Level 6: Agile -- S'dpty-Def(A), S'dpty-Def/Rchg(33), S'dpty-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(33)
Level 8: Focus Chi -- GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx(A), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg(13), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx(13)
Level 10: Practiced Brawler -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 12: Crane Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(15), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(15), Mako-Dam%(17), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(17), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(19)
Level 14: Combat Jumping -- GftotA-Def(A), GftotA-Def/Rchg(37), LkGmblr-Rchg+(39)
Level 16: Dodge -- GftotA-Def(A), GftotA-Def/EndRdx(23), LkGmblr-Rchg+(23)
Level 18: Crippling Axe Kick -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(39), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(39), Mako-Dam%(40), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(40), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(40)
Level 20: Super Jump -- Jump-I(A)
Level 22: Quickness -- Run-I(A)
Level 24: Aid Other -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(48)
Level 26: Dragon's Tail -- Sciroc-Acc/Dmg(A), Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx(27), Sciroc-Dmg/Rchg(29), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(29), Sciroc-Dam%(31), Armgdn-Dam%(31)
Level 28: Lucky -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(31), LkGmblr-Rchg+(33)
Level 30: Aid Self -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(43), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 32: Eagles Claw -- Mako-Acc/Dmg(A), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Mako-Dmg/Rchg(34), Mako-Dam%(34), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(37), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(37)
Level 35: Evasion -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def(36), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(36), LkGmblr-Rchg+(36)
Level 38: Boxing -- Acc-I(A)
Level 41: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/EndRdx(A), GA-ResDam(42), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(42), GA-3defTpProc(42)
Level 44: Weave -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(45), LkGmblr-Rchg+(48)
Level 47: Focused Accuracy -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 49: Physical Perfection -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(50), Numna-Heal/Rchg(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 1: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 1: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 1: Health -- Numna-Heal(A), RgnTis-Regen+(43), Numna-Heal/Rchg(46), Mrcl-Rcvry+(46), Mrcl-Heal(48), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(50)
Level 1: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(45), P'Shift-End%(46)[/QUOTE]
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
In one little corner of the universe, there's nothing more irritating than a misfile...
(Please support the best webcomic about a cosmic universal realignment by impaired angelic interference resulting in identity crisis angst. Or I release the pigmy water thieves.)