Martial Arts Manipulation is probably the most requested new blaster secondary. If you do a search of the suggestions forum you'll find a few write ups people have done with power suggestions (of... variable quality). If you want to go ahead and start your own thread detailing your suggested power selection and post it there feel free, if nothing else it'll keep remainding the devs that we want it.
In case you're curious I would say the second and third spots for desired blasters secondaries are something based on Trick Arrow and Dark Manipulation.
Energy melee is pretty awesome for blasters as is. If they do make Martial Arts for blasters, they'll probably nerf it to balance with the rest of the AT's. Are you looking for style? Or functionality? Because whatever you want for style, e.g. DP/Martial Arts, the devs will only look at it from a functionality point of view.
But truthfully, if you want to kick and punch the crap out of baddies, make a SR/martial arts scrapper, they are pretty ****ing lethal and fun. And they're non-dairy. 
I can't feel my legs..!
@LaughingDan,
I'm not really looking for something for "kick/punch crap out of baddies" in a DPS sort of way. My mains are all scrappers and tankers. ;-)
What I'm looking for is a "non-super" blaster secondary that is an alternative to Devices. (I refuse to open the can of worms that is "What's up with Devices?")
A nerf of MA for blaster secondary would be totally fine. I just think that there are plenty of blastery types in comic book canon that shoot a mean weapon, then punch the snot out of anyone who gets that close.
And sorry, I have a hard time justifying using pistols when I can make a sword of ice out of thin air, encase my hands in raw energy, or summon rings of fire around my foes. LOL
Just think we should have a "non-super" secondary for those of us who want to play characters that can shoot a pistol, but wouldn't have a clue how to build an anti-gravity laser guidance system.
Happy gaming!
-SunderX
Sset - 50 DM/Regen Scrapper - 8 years of out-tanking any tank but Granite, with 5x the DPS.
**Making Altaholism a socially acceptable disorder**
"Scrappers are just like chainsaws. Somewhat hard to handle, EXTREMELY dangerous, and by far the most fun when wielded by the slightly insane." -Alissara
I'd go for Energy Melee.
The glow around your fists isn't much different from the numbers that appear above your enemy's heads when you take damage, ie its easy to think of them as just an artefact of being in a game environment.
You can probably make them less visible now using power customisation.
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Yep, Exactly what I did Dr.Mike. |
Originally Posted by DrMike2000
I'd go for Energy Melee.
The glow around your fists isn't much different from the numbers that appear above your enemy's heads when you take damage, ie its easy to think of them as just an artefact of being in a game environment. You can probably make them less visible now using power customisation. |
Used "Dark" choice in the customization and made them a very deep midnight blue. Its much more understated this way and intrudes less on the Pistol Primary.
BIOSPARK :: DARKTHORN :: SKYGUARD :: WILDMAGE
HEATSINK :: FASTHAND :: POWERCELL :: RUNESTAFF
As an idle question, presuming such a powerset existed, if it didn't have Build Up, but instead had a toggle akin to, say, rage; would you tolerate it?
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Tolerate it? I would probably make dirty love to it. |
Originally Posted by Talen_Lee
As an idle question, presuming such a powerset existed, if it didn't have Build Up, but instead had a toggle akin to, say, rage; would you tolerate it?
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I would very much like a 'martial' secondary. I'd probably want both kicking, punching, and katana-ing (not necessarily in the same powerset).
It just occurred to me that most of the 'natural' powersets have powers that generate redraw.
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Didn't Castle (or BaB maybe) say not long ago that they had a potential fix that would eliminate redraw? Just curious, really. I remember reading it, then nothing more about it since.
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Originally Posted by Talen_Lee
It just occurred to me that most of the 'natural' powersets have powers that generate redraw.
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BIOSPARK :: DARKTHORN :: SKYGUARD :: WILDMAGE
HEATSINK :: FASTHAND :: POWERCELL :: RUNESTAFF
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I'd love to see that happen, but unfortunately, I have no memory of this. Anyone else able to comment?
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Originally Posted by Biospark
Didn't Castle (or BaB maybe) say not long ago that they had a potential fix that would eliminate redraw? Just curious, really. I remember reading it, then nothing more about it since.
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AFAIK, he found something that he thought would work to help with redraw, but then hit another snag with whatever the solution was, so it's back to the drawing board for that (whenever he has time). As best as I can remember, anyway.
It wasn't that long ago... maybe 2-3 months. You might be able to find the post still.
Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc: Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory
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... actually, the attacks they left in would probably get cranked up considerably to balance it with the rest of the Blaster melee attacks. The number I used to give was that Charged Brawl + Havoc Punch did 1.6 times the damage of Headsplitter in the same activation time. (Before that it was "5/3 the damage of headsplitter in 3/5 the time", but they sped up Headsplitter.) I haven't checked activation times lately; I don't know if that's still correct.
| If they do make Martial Arts for blasters, they'll probably nerf it to balance with the rest of the AT's. |
Mini-guides: Force Field Defenders, Blasters, Market Self-Defense, Frankenslotting.
So you think you're a hero, huh.
@Boltcutter in game.
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That was never entirely correct. Activation time is not a part of the equation used for damage, it's based on recharge time, area and AT. Blaster melee attacks use the same equation as the melee attacks for other classes but universally have higher recharge times.
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Originally Posted by Fulmens
... actually, the attacks they left in would probably get cranked up considerably to balance it with the rest of the Blaster melee attacks. The number I used to give was that Charged Brawl + Havoc Punch did 1.6 times the damage of Headsplitter in the same activation time. (Before that it was "5/3 the damage of headsplitter in 3/5 the time", but they sped up Headsplitter.) I haven't checked activation times lately; I don't know if that's still correct.
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I would love this.
I never took riffle or archery due to lack of options for secundaries...
You only can take devices, energy and elemental powers.
Whats the difference between fire melee set and martial melee set with some tweaks?
If devs do this I will have serious problems of altitis, and I dont feel that in such a long time.
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ok sounds good, i want AR blast as a secondary for brute tho |
Originally Posted by SunderX
Hey gang. Forum lurker here. However, after due consideration, I think it should be mentioned (probably for the umpteenth time) that Blasters are begging for a knock off of the Martial Arts scrapper set as a blaster secondary. Some decent punches, good kicks, a stun or 3, a chance for knockdown or disorient on some attacks, and build up would be all it needed to make a viable set that would go well with the "non-super" powers, like Archery, Dual Pistols, or Assault Rifle.
Thoughts? Feedback? Constructive criticism? I thought it would work well if for Damage Mitigation most of the attacks had a chance for knockdown or disorient, as well as the animations for something like that would be very nice to go with some of the really sweet power sets that are coming into the game. Thanks in advance. |
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I can't tell if you're serious.
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Originally Posted by Hard Kisses
ok sounds good, i want AR blast as a secondary for brute tho
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Winner of Players' Choice Best Villainous Arc 2010: Fear and Loathing on Striga; ID #350522
Seems like it would just be /Energy with different animations and no glowy effects. The devs would have to retool it a bit, including some new random power which there is no analogue to and likely taking out attacks. they might even cut out the attacks you LIKE to make room for something like Exploding Shuriken.
Too many alts to list.
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Yeah, exactly like Dual Pistols is just like Assault Rifle with different animations and glowy effects.|
Originally Posted by Mr_Grumpums
Seems like it would just be /Energy with different animations and no glowy effects.
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| The devs would have to retool it a bit, including some new random power which there is no analogue to and likely taking out attacks. they might even cut out the attacks you LIKE to make room for something like Exploding Shuriken. |
They don't need to retool anything, remove attacks, add "random" powers or anything else. All they have to do is make sure the numbers are correct and it'll be good to go. They might decide to change things anyway but it's not really necessary.
Winner of Players' Choice Best Villainous Arc 2010: Fear and Loathing on Striga; ID #350522
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Ummm.... yes it is necessary. Martial Arts is a Melee Set. Blaster secondaries (mostly) include melee abilities but they are not melee sets. They are a mix of melee and control powers with some self buffs or weak debuffs and maybe a damage aura. They don't have 6 melee attacks and they certainly don't have Confront.|
Originally Posted by FredrikSvanberg
They don't need to retool anything, remove attacks, add "random" powers or anything else. All they have to do is make sure the numbers are correct and it'll be good to go. They might decide to change things anyway but it's not really necessary.
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Additionally you'll notice that the Tier 1 is always a power to keep enemies out of melee range (generally a single target ranged immobilize) this is deliberate to help Blasters solo (especially at low levels).
Realistically making a Martial Arts based Blaster secondary would require putting in at least two new powers. Assume that Crane Kick is changed to the same stats as Power Thrust and made the T1 (i.e. lower damage and recharge than the scrapper version). Then add Cobra Strike, Focus Chi and 3-4 of the damaging melee attacks from MA. That still leaves 2-3 new powers required and a set that, frankly, looks like a weaker version of Energy Manipulation.
And since someone will bring it up, Blasters were Ranged/Melee in the original alpha version of the game. This was changed because they just didn't have the survivability.
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Fine, you pointed out something we've discussed a few dozen times over the last year already. I forgot about Confront, I admit it. It's pretty much the only power that needs to be changed. You know why? Because every blaster secondary doesn't have to be identical to every other blaster secondary. Devices is not anything like what you describe. Martial Arts for blasters (or "Self Defense" as we dubbed it last time we talked about it) could be the very offensive option with more melee attacks than any of the other secondaries.|
Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
Ummm.... yes it is necessary. Martial Arts is a Melee Set. Blaster secondaries (mostly) include melee abilities but they are not melee sets. They are a mix of melee and control powers with some self buffs or weak debuffs and maybe a damage aura. They don't have 6 melee attacks and they certainly don't have Confront.
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Things that can replace Confront at the drop of a hat: Stealth, Caltrops, a Placate-like power, Power Thrust, an always-on power that grants low Resistance to Smashing/Lethal, an always-on power that grants +recharge and bonus jump and running speed. Some of these have been suggested before as replacements for Confront, some of them I just came up with in five minutes. The only difficult part is to figure out which one to pick since they are all thematically appropriate and good things for Blasters to have.
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| Additionally you'll notice that the Tier 1 is always a power to keep enemies out of melee range (generally a single target ranged immobilize) this is deliberate to help Blasters solo (especially at low levels). |
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| Realistically making a Martial Arts based Blaster secondary would require putting in at least two new powers. |
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| Assume that Crane Kick is changed to the same stats as Power Thrust and made the T1 (i.e. lower damage and recharge than the scrapper version). |
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| Then add Cobra Strike, Focus Chi and 3-4 of the damaging melee attacks from MA. That still leaves 2-3 new powers required and a set that, frankly, looks like a weaker version of Energy Manipulation. |
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| And since someone will bring it up, Blasters were Ranged/Melee in the original alpha version of the game. This was changed because they just didn't have the survivability. |
Winner of Players' Choice Best Villainous Arc 2010: Fear and Loathing on Striga; ID #350522
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Yeah, at this point we might as well give up on it since we obviously aren't going to change our minds. At the end of the day only the devs know what constitutes a manipulation set but I really do not see them making a Blaster manipulation set with 7 melee attacks that are primarily damage based when currently only one set has 4 and most have 3 or fewer.
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Originally Posted by FredrikSvanberg
Fine, you pointed out something we've discussed a few dozen times over the last year already. I forgot about Confront, I admit it. It's pretty much the only power that needs to be changed. You know why? Because every blaster secondary doesn't have to be identical to every other blaster secondary. Devices is not anything like what you describe. Martial Arts for blasters (or "Self Defense" as we dubbed it last time we talked about it) could be the very offensive option with more melee attacks than any of the other secondaries.
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I do agree that Martial Arts would need a few tweaks to be a good blaster secondary, but I disagree with your assessment of current blaster melee prowess.|
Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
At the end of the day only the devs know what constitutes a manipulation set but I really do not see them making a Blaster manipulation set with 7 melee attacks that are primarily damage based when currently only one set has 4 and most have 3 or fewer.
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I'd do Martial Manip as follows:
. 1- Thunder Kick (change damage to 0.8 DS, recharge to 6s, end use to 6.864, add 100% scale 8 KB, remove stun)
. 2- Storm Kick (change damage to 1.96 DS, end use to 10.192, and recharge to 10s)
. 4- Dragon's Tail (I'd change the radius to 10 feet, which will require changes elsewhere (either less damage or more recharge and end use).
10- Crane Kick (change damage to 2.6 DS, end use to 13.52, and recharge to 14s)
16- Focus Chi
20- Quick Recovery
28- Cobra Strike
35- Crippling Axe Kick
38- Eagles Claw (leave the critical chance in this power)
For comparison to current secondaries:
Melee attacks for damage
Fire - 6 (or 7 if you include Consume)
Martial - 5 (or 6 if you include Thunder Kick)
Electricity - 5
Energy - 3 (or 4 if you include Power Thrust)
Ice - 3
Mental - 2 (3 if you include Telekinetic Thrust)
Devices - 0 (although Caltrops, Trip Mine, and Time Bomb might be counted by some)
Melee (or near melee) utility
Martial - 5
Electricity - 4
Ice - 4
Fire - 3
Mental - 3
Energy - 3
Devices - 1 (although Caltrops, Trip Mine, and Time Bomb might be counted by some)
Total Powers that are effective in melee range
Fire - 9
Martial - 9
Electricity - 9
Energy - 8
Ice - 8
Mental - 8
Devices - 6 (8 with full invis)
Total Powers that can be effective out of melee range
Martial - 2
Electricity - 2 (or 3 if you count Lightning Field)
Fire - 2 (or 4 if you count Hot Feet and Consume)
Energy - 4
Ice - 4
Mental - 4 (or 5 if you count Drain Psyche)
Devices - 8 (or 9 if you count Taser)
Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.
I'd love this too. But I doubt it will happen anytime soon. :/
-IF- it did occur it'd be after the next round of power proliferation, where I'd expect to see a darkness manipulation to coincide with dark blast.
That's so far away...
Anyway, I agree that not all sets have to follow the normal layout. It'd certainly be a refresher to have something different.
@Ninth Cloud
Justice
Hey gang. Forum lurker here. However, after due consideration, I think it should be mentioned (probably for the umpteenth time) that Blasters are begging for a knock off of the Martial Arts scrapper set as a blaster secondary. Some decent punches, good kicks, a stun or 3, a chance for knockdown or disorient on some attacks, and build up would be all it needed to make a viable set that would go well with the "non-super" powers, like Archery, Dual Pistols, or Assault Rifle.
Thoughts? Feedback? Constructive criticism?
I thought it would work well if for Damage Mitigation most of the attacks had a chance for knockdown or disorient, as well as the animations for something like that would be very nice to go with some of the really sweet power sets that are coming into the game.
Thanks in advance.
Happy gaming!
-SunderX
Sset - 50 DM/Regen Scrapper - 8 years of out-tanking any tank but Granite, with 5x the DPS.
**Making Altaholism a socially acceptable disorder**
"Scrappers are just like chainsaws. Somewhat hard to handle, EXTREMELY dangerous, and by far the most fun when wielded by the slightly insane." -Alissara