Add more damage to Cobra Strike
By
Adeon Hawkwood,
Posted on: 2009-11-20 11:22 in Suggestions and Ideas
Simple Answer:
No.
Quote:
Could you elaborate on why not?
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Originally Posted by brophog02
Simple Answer:
No. |
Quote:
Could you elaborate on why?
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Originally Posted by Vitality
Could you elaborate on why not?
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Cobra Strike is designed to be a high powered, single target stun. Used in concert with Thunder Kick and Eagle's Claw, it works just beautifully in keeping a target perma-stunned. It works just fine as is. It doesn't need a damage boost IMO.
Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
Quote:
I believe the power should do more than just one thing (the one thing being just stun).|
Originally Posted by brophog02
Could you elaborate on why?
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It has damage...but the damage is extremely too low to be worth it.
To compare...Siphon Life does damage and heals you...Touch of Fear terrorizes and gives -tohit...Slash does damage and lowers defense...Follow Up and Blinding Feint do damage and adds +dam and +tohit...
There are no other scrapper primary powers like Cobra Strike. Nearly all the powers have two effects; damage and a secondary effect. Some powers do just damage but the damage is so high that its worth it.
Cobra Strike's damage is far too low to be equal with other similiar powers.
Quote:
Sure...you can stun a boss if Thunder Kicks stun fires...but...you shouldn't have to use another power to affect a foe.|
Originally Posted by Shard_Warrior
Cobra Strike is designed to be a high powered, single target stun. Used in concert with Thunder Kick and Eagle's Claw, it works just beautifully in keeping a target perma-stunned. It works just fine as is. It doesn't need a damage boost IMO.
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Cobra Strike alone on a boss is worthless.
Another comparison example: Touch of Fear on a boss...it won't make them cower in terror but it will give them that -tohit.
Cobra Strike needs another aspect to it...whether you raise its damage or its stun mag...something needs to be done to bring it up to par.
Quote:
Which is exactly what Cobra Strike has; Minor Damage and Stun. |
Originally Posted by Vitality
Nearly all the powers have two effects; damage and a secondary effect.
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Quote:
| Cobra Strike's damage is far too low to be equal with other similiar powers. |
If you're attempting to use this as part of a high damage attack chain, you're using it wrong.
Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
Quote:
You're comparing apples to oranges here. These are two different powers from two entirely differnt sets.|
Originally Posted by Vitality
Sure...you can stun a boss if Thunder Kicks stun fires...but...you shouldn't have to use another power to affect a foe.
Cobra Strike alone on a boss is worthless. Another comparison example: Touch of Fear on a boss...it won't make them cower in terror but it will give them that -tohit. Cobra Strike needs another aspect to it...whether you raise its damage or its stun mag...something needs to be done to bring it up to par. |
The logic of your argument also fails here (again). Cobra Strike used on a boss will do minor damage and lay down a stun, therefore it is doing more than 1 thing. Stacking the stuns from Thunder Kick or Eagle's Claw onto a boss provides the effect, just as stacking the fear from ToF or any of the DB combos.
These powers are meant to be used in concert with each other. This is why there are more than one power in each set.
Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
Quote:
I know it also does damage...but what I'm saying is the damage is extremely too low...hence the name of the thread "Add more damage to Cobra Strike.|
Originally Posted by Shard_Warrior
You're comparing apples to oranges here. These are two different powers from two entirely differnt sets.
The logic of your argument also fails here (again). Cobra Strike used on a boss will do minor damage and lay down a stun, therefore it is doing more than 1 thing. Stacking the stuns from Thunder Kick or Eagle's Claw onto a boss provides the effect, just as stacking the fear from ToF or any of the DB combos. |
Again...you shouldn't need other powers to make one power worthwhile. That's why I suggest either giving Cobra Strike more damage or raise the stun mag.
Quote:
You really do not understand how powersets work, do you? Should all powersets have 1 power that does a ton of damage, stuns, immobs, holds etc. all in one shot?|
Originally Posted by Vitality
Again...you shouldn't need other powers to make one power worthwhile. That's why I suggest either giving Cobra Strike more damage or raise the stun mag.
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Only bosses and above require stacking of stuns in MA. Lts and minions are completely incapacitated in 1 application of Cobra Strike. I would also argue that the benefit Cobra Strike provides is better than the -Defense or -ToHit of other sets.
A reduced defense target can still attack and hit you. So can one that has a marginal -ToHit applied to it. Cobra Strike will stun an NPC into the drunken monkey walk where they are totally helpless and do not attack you at all.
Pretty much every powerset for every AT in the game needs other powers from the set to make the others worthwhile and more effective.
Quote:
In your opinion. Paruse the scrapper forums sometime and look at the comparison of DPS numbers between the sets. MA is on par with the others and doesn't require any further damage boosts.|
Originally Posted by Vitality
...but what I'm saying is the damage is extremely too low...
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Quote:
| Again...you shouldn't need other powers to make one power worthwhile. |
Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
Quote:
You really do not understand my arguement, do you?|
Originally Posted by Miss_Freeze_NA
You really do not understand how powersets work, do you? Should all powersets have 1 power that does a ton of damage, stuns, immobs, holds etc. all in one shot?
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I'm suggesting that one power that currently stuns (only Minions and Lts) and does trivial damage, be given a damage boost so that at the very least it also does moderate damage.
There is not one primary scrapper power, besides Cobra Strike, that needs the assistance of other powers to affect a boss.
And your kidding yourself if you think Cobra Strikes damage is good enough as is.
Total Focus nerf, anyone? It was done for a reason.
((This is why you think through suggestions BEFORE they enter this board, not after you're baited into doing so. If you think it is a simple suggestion, you haven't thought through it enough to actually put it down.))
Quote:
Ok...if adding damage is absolutely out of the question...then you it needs its stun mag raised so that it will work on a boss by itself.|
Originally Posted by Shard_Warrior
In your opinion. Paruse the scrapper forums sometime and look at the comparison of DPS numbers between the sets. MA is on par with the others and doesn't require any further damage boosts.
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Maybe something like: mag-3 stun with a duration of 11.9s with an extra mag-1 stun for 5.9s.
Then it would be able to stun a boss with one hit for 5.9s.
Cobra Strike is a control power, and it is exactly the same as Stun and Screech. To increase the damage the stun duration would have to be lowered, the same as it was changed with Clobber. If the stun duration was lowered it would be harder to perma-stun a boss, which would lower MA's survivability versus them.
Quote:
Your joking, right?|
Originally Posted by brophog02
Total Focus nerf, anyone? It was done for a reason.
((This is why you think through suggestions BEFORE they enter this board, not after you're baited into doing so. If you think it is a simple suggestion, you haven't thought through it enough to actually put it down.)) |
Total Focus did extreme damage and had a mag-3 stun on a very short cast time.
Cobra Strike does extremely minor damage and has a mag-3 stun.
Also, scrappers do not have energy melee.
Cobra strike does 17.2, unenhanced at level 50, damage.
I'm not suggesting you make it extreme damage...I'm suggesting some along the line of at least 50.2, unenhanced at level 50, damage.
Quote:
You also have to factor in the now added damage your doing to those bosses with Cobra Strike.
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Originally Posted by LordSquigie
Cobra Strike is a control power, and it is exactly the same as Stun and Screech. To increase the damage the stun duration would have to be lowered, the same as it was changed with Clobber. If the stun duration was lowered it would be harder to perma-stun a boss, which would lower MA's survivability versus them.
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Quote:
Totally false. Again, you aren't understanding what this power is for and what it is meant to do or how to use it.|
Originally Posted by Vitality
(only Minions and Lts)
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Quote:
| There is not one primary scrapper power, besides Cobra Strike, that needs the assistance of other powers to affect a boss. |
Quote:
| And your kidding yourself if you think Cobra Strikes damage is good enough as is. |
Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
Quote:
Don't tell me I'm not understanding. Your not understanding.|
Originally Posted by Shard_Warrior
Totally false. Again, you aren't understanding what this power is for and what it is meant to do or how to use it.
Also false. The -Def in Katana and BS stack with each attack. So does the -ToHit from DM. -Speed and -Rech stacks from each attack in Spines. One hit from any of those sets really isn't going to do much. Stack them together through the appropriate attack chains and they become effective. |
What I said is not false.
I know you can stack those powers (-def attack in Kat and BS, -tohit from DM)....but if you use them alone on a boss, they will work.
If you use Cobra Strike on a boss...it will not work.
Quote:
Most Controllers need more than 1 application of a hold to lockdown a boss. Why should Cobra Strike be any different?|
Originally Posted by Vitality
Ok...if adding damage is absolutely out of the question...then you it needs its stun mag raised so that it will work on a boss by itself.
. |
It is a minor damage, control power that is used in conjunction with other powers within the set to stun an opponent.
Quote:
Sure it will. It will land a Mag 3 stun and do some minor damage. Your expectations are not reasonable if you would like it to do anything beyond that.
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Originally Posted by Vitality
If you use Cobra Strike on a boss...it will not work.
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Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
Quote:
Cobra Strike should be different because it does not do anything else other than stun (it has the very minor damage, which is the whole point of this thread).|
Originally Posted by Miss_Freeze_NA
Most Controllers need more than 1 application of a hold to lockdown a boss. Why should Cobra Strike be any different?
It is a minor damage, control power that is used in conjunction with other powers within the set to stun an opponent. |
Controller holds have more effects than just the hold.
Quote:
That mag-3 stun on a boss does nothing by itself...and the 17.2 damage, unenhanced at level 50, will not do much either.
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Originally Posted by Shard_Warrior
Sure it will. It will land a Mag 3 stun and do some minor damage. Your expectations are not reasonable if you would like it to do anything beyond that.
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Quote:
That depends on the situation. Did you already land Eagle's Claw? If so... stunned Boss.|
Originally Posted by Vitality
That mag-3 stun on a boss does nothing by itself...and the 17.2 damage, unenhanced at level 50, will not do much either.
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17.2 damage is better than 0.
Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
Simple suggestion.
Raise the damage of Cobra Strike to give it the same DPA as Siphon Life.