Issue 16 AE Changes


Blpup

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by EternalDominion View Post
Exactly my point. I have yet to have one of the "anti-farming" group provide me any answer other than "nobody groups with me". Hate to break it to them, but the people that are farming likely wouldn't group with you anyway.

Also, eveything I say is coming from someone that doesn't do a lot of farming. Was never a big fan as I enjoy the story content. But, when the light finally went off that farming through 20 or 30 levels in a short time is a fantastic way to feel out AT's I realized there was a benefit.

So again, I reiterate my challenge. Please provide any evidence of how farming "breaks" the game.
Who cares if it's "breaking the game?" Seriously. The AE was being used for farming when the Devs warned and even threatened players NOT to use it for farming.

What did you think would happen?

No, answer my question. What did you think would happen to AE when all people did was use it to farm when that's NOT the reason it was created?

Did you seriously think the devs would just allow it? Did you think they would just sit by and watch their new technology and inovation just be farmed to death?

Get some common sense bro. It doesn't have to break the game...it just has to go against the intended purpose of it's creation.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clouded View Post
Who cares if it's "breaking the game?" Seriously. The AE was being used for farming when the Devs warned and even threatened players NOT to use it for farming.

What did you think would happen?

No, answer my question. What did you think would happen to AE when all people did was use it to farm when that's NOT the reason it was created?

Did you seriously think the devs would just allow it? Did you think they would just sit by and watch their new technology and inovation just be farmed to death?

Get some common sense bro. It doesn't have to break the game...it just has to go against the intended purpose of it's creation.
Why do the devs have to tell you how to play the game? Why does it matter if users created content in AE for farming and farmed? At the end of the day, why does it matter so much...and what's the critical factor that made the nerf a must for i16?

It's stupid to both ask and answer a question about "What did you think would happen?" as you've posted..."Get some common sense, bro." If we don't play the game like we're "supposed" to play, they'll take it away from us and make us play their way? That's a little offputting.

NCSoft/Paragon/Whomever = You've made money off of AE from me, b/c I was able to quickly level multiple characters in the past few months and enjoyed playing on Freedom so much that I actually bought 5 extra character slots for $20. I know others who've done the same thing, and even have alt accounts for that very purpose. I think at the end of the day revenue/income will be lost due to the change, despite how cool my green imps are.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clouded View Post
Who cares if it's "breaking the game?" Seriously. The AE was being used for farming when the Devs warned and even threatened players NOT to use it for farming.

What did you think would happen?

No, answer my question. What did you think would happen to AE when all people did was use it to farm when that's NOT the reason it was created?

Did you seriously think the devs would just allow it? Did you think they would just sit by and watch their new technology and inovation just be farmed to death?

Get some common sense bro. It doesn't have to break the game...it just has to go against the intended purpose of it's creation.
Again, a complete lack of a response other than "the devs told you they didn't want you to do that". This isn't paying some site to level up my character. This isn't buying influence online. It is how some people choose to play the game (again, I have only farmed within AE for a week at most).

I just don't understand how people playing the game in a way that has yet to be shown to me to be in any way detrimental to the game as a whole should be precluded from playing that way.

So it was created to allow players to create magnificent new works of MMO fiction to amaze and impress all comers and some people chose to use it to aid in leveling their toons. Of course when the devs say they don't want you to use it like that I would expect them to back it up. It doesn't mean I agree with it.

My arguement isn't "how could they do this? They never said it was bad". I have (quite clearly I think) asked 1 simple question.

Why is using the AE system any way you choose a problem? You gave an answer and I appreciate you opinion and your feedback, but my question has still yet to be answered.


Try my AE Arc: Out of Place, Out of Time ID#304340.
Leave your Arc title in the feedback and I will check yours out as well.

 

Posted

Ultimately, it is the Devs' game, that you are paying to play. They can change it however they like, including to discourage certain types of play they don't like. Based on my reading of the terms of service, your only right or option at that point is to stop giving them money.

It is my guess that the Devs have, as part of their game design, a certain rate at which they would like characters to advance. There is probably some margin of tolerance in this. Hitting 50 inside of a day is probably outside that margin.

In the end, it really does come down to "because the Devs say so." Whether you find that a satisfying answer is not relevant. They don't have to give you a reason. They don't have to listen to your arguments. If you don't like that, stop giving them money.


My characters at Virtueverse
Faces of the City

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clave_Dark_5 View Post
For those of you who haven't been paying attention, the devs have stated that this current XP situation was not the end-all, be-all of their options, just something they could put into place for now to stop the exploits and that the real solutions would come later once they can get them coded. All you need is the patience to wait it out, as ridiculous and enraging a concept as that may be to you...
People have been playing attention, but they also know that the Devs have an annoying tendency to measure "temporary" in terms of months, if not years.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazarus View Post
People have been playing attention, but they also know that the Devs have an annoying tendency to measure "temporary" in terms of months, if not years.
This is true. But does anyone honestly believe that forum threads or even threats to unsubscribe will induce them to hurry their pace (if that's even possible)?


My characters at Virtueverse
Faces of the City

 

Posted

Ulitmately it is the Dev's decision to change the game how they want. But it is our decision to pay for there content changes. I just like others are giving them a little time to change it. I like to run my TF's alot but also like to grind out in AE to get some tickets and earn prestige and help friends lvl. Just for convenience and less travel. I myself came back to COH because they brought the ability to lvl through AE quicker and also can run TF and badge hunt too. Which works out great for everyone.. But these changes in my opinion "Devalued" the game to me and others. Which makes COH no different from other games when they think they can pull a good thing away from people...


 

Posted

[complain]

I recently received the 42 month vet badge. I have a horrible case of alt-itis, and I've had many alts that I got bored of simply because they didn't progress to the reported level of awesomeness quickly enough. Also, due to starting so many characters over the years, I've gotten quite bored with the beginning content.

AE seemed to be a fix for all of this. I now have many alts which are entering the higher levels (for me, this means over lvl 16, which rarely happened to me pre-AE), and I thoroughly enjoy them, as well as skipping the inevitable standard content every time I make a new character (although I still had to do some of this Villainside, it was tolerable because I knew that I would eventually get to a populated AE building).

Much of the beginning content, especially heroside, seems rather inane, as you spend quite a bit of time running around talking to various people, and telling your contact what they said (couldn't they have just e-mailed it to the contact? It would've been much easier...). Villainside is a little better, but I'm still tired of it. What do I do when a character ends up sucking after a few levels due to lack of endurance/being to squishy/not having a decent attack chain/whatever else may go wrong?

Before i16, it was easy; I'd just go to the AE building and farm a bit until I got to a decent level where said character was much more playable. The big question for me now is this; what do I do if I'm in a similar situation? Before, I would just delete the character and roll a new one, but that was before I was completely bored with the beginning content, too.

I can't help but think that this is the beginning of the end for me, which is unfortunate. Hopefully, Going Rogue will add some new beginning content which will keep me here for a while. In the meantime, I'll just cross my fingers that this is "a temporary fix" and keep logging in occasionally.

[/complain]

I also agree that there should be a reasonable amount of flexibility when it comes to playing this game the way you want to play it (as long as your playstyle isn't harmful to others in any way).

As for the OP's issue with actual MA stories, I agree that the farmers will just tweak their farms a bit and keep on going, where as the actual stories will get burned out completely due to not being able to make custom critters as weak as you want them to be without xp penalties (believe it or not, sometimes a custom character is supposed to be wimpy for story reasons). So, in other words, the changes that come with i16 will actually do the opposite of what the devs intended, if my prediction comes true.

Either way, I might not be around much longer. I recently paid for another year, so I've got a ways to go before I'm completely gone. Hopefully, "a ways" means a longer time than I think.

*yes, i know; another long post. as always, feel free to disintegrate my opinions at your leisure.*


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clave_Dark_5
For those of you who haven't been paying attention, the devs have stated that this current XP situation was not the end-all, be-all of their options, just something they could put into place for now to stop the exploits and that the real solutions would come later once they can get them coded. All you need is the patience to wait it out, as ridiculous and enraging a concept as that may be to you...
Where does it say this? I've been hunting through the forums and have yet to see any type of statement to that effect...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazarus
People have been playing attention, but they also know that the Devs have an annoying tendency to measure "temporary" in terms of months, if not years.
Very true, sad to say!

[complain:]
Issue 16 hurts legitimate users (the kind that NCSoft have supposedly tried to encourage) of the AE TOO MUCH!!!
[/complain]


 

Posted

everyone listen up, since im gone within days.

im known as the "bad guy".

im the french hero with 49 lvl 50's.

ok, some just stpped reading, and counter offence from that point, fair enough, have fun.

Now, to the OP, and the general question.

Either you all BEHAVE like anti farmers, OR YOU ARE THE NEXT HIPOCRITS.

What do you need to farm?
AN OPEN SPACE

So, submit the open maps to some badges, or moneys, or simply supress them, and you will get firkins all over the game cryin out for help.

The open map issue is so obvious, that i believe you guys are cogs in the big clockwork.

or maybe there should be less "leakin the devs"' USA players in here, so we could talk hardcore.

This is why i leave.

No guts ranters, fat mc Do eaters, this is not what i want for a world.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Megajoule View Post
Ultimately, it is the Devs' game, that you are paying to play. They can change it however they like, including to discourage certain types of play they don't like. Based on my reading of the terms of service, your only right or option at that point is to stop giving them money.

It is my guess that the Devs have, as part of their game design, a certain rate at which they would like characters to advance. There is probably some margin of tolerance in this. Hitting 50 inside of a day is probably outside that margin.

In the end, it really does come down to "because the Devs say so." Whether you find that a satisfying answer is not relevant. They don't have to give you a reason. They don't have to listen to your arguments. If you don't like that, stop giving them money.
Megajoule, I understand and agree with everything you have said. I know that it is the Dev's game and they can do with it as they choose. I just prefer that there is a certain level of accountability. If the game had changed in a way you did not agree with and the only answer given was "because we wanted to" you would just happily accept that?

I would hope you would raise your questions and try to get a certain level of conversation going to seriously look at the issue that was concerning you. I am not suggesting that they Devs have some obligation to change the game to anything other that what they "intended" the game to become. That being said, I would think the developers would look at the issue and say "Well, this isn't exactly what we had intended, but there is a good portion of the player-base that enjoys this and it doesn't really affect anything anyone else is doing, so I guess we can just let the game mature organically and let the players guide its development."


Try my AE Arc: Out of Place, Out of Time ID#304340.
Leave your Arc title in the feedback and I will check yours out as well.

 

Posted

and dont blame on my english, iblame it myself enough.

Just read.


 

Posted

AE farm issues... thats blahhhh , tell me the name of the Ferries.

as we say in french, the answer was under ur nose.

we azlso say, size of ur nose....


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by eltonio View Post
and dont blame on my english, iblame it myself enough.

Just read.
The second part is harder to do because of the first


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
The second part is harder to do because fo the first
not like i mind, since im about off, but, seriously , are you paid by the game? i was just wondering.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by eltonio View Post
not like i mind, since im about off, but, seriously , are you paid by the game? i was just wondering.
i mean, takin the attention away from the core point, that is so special...

No one would do it for his own sake, so, who do you play for? some azn dudes, NC, paragon blah blah?

no biggie, since the game is dead.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by eltonio View Post
not like i mind, since im about off, but, seriously , are you paid by the game? i was just wondering.
You officially make no sense. Seriously.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by eltonio View Post
not like i mind, since im about off, but, seriously , are you paid by the game? i was just wondering.
No, I just really enjoy playing it


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by eltonio View Post
i mean, takin the attention away from the core point, that is so special...

No one would do it for his own sake
Someone might do it for her own sake though


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

An online game company wants you to play the game as long as possible. It is generally a consensus that speeding to the cap will either cause players to be burned out along the way or get bored when they reach the cap and there's nothing to do. Boredom and burnout can lead to cancellations. The key argument is finding out how many people who it actually applies to. Some players will be fine when they hit the cap and keep playing but it really depends on the player.

Inexperienced 50s do have an affect on the game. Many are entering TFs/SFs with no clue what is going on which can hurt the team. Granted, many don't know any better and will improve with guidance but most players would rather not go through the hastle. An AE specific powerleveling problem is that 50s were wanting to get things from the market (mainly purples and specific types of salvage) but not actually producing it so prices skyrocketed.

One final problem with AE farms is clutter. Everyone wants to make their own farm map instead of playing another one that is exactly the same but published by someone else. This makes searching through available arcs in the AE more difficult than it should be. With less clutter and the true exploits being removed, I could actually see a Farm search tag making sense so that things could be better filtered for both farmers and people who are in it for the story.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zamuel View Post
An online game company wants you to play the game as long as possible. It is generally a consensus that speeding to the cap will either cause players to be burned out along the way or get bored when they reach the cap and there's nothing to do. Boredom and burnout can lead to cancellations.
As a 57 month player of CoH I agree with you about the boredom aspect. That's why I found the AE so appealing. There are some amazing stories out there!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zamuel View Post
One final problem with AE farms is clutter. Everyone wants to make their own farm map instead of playing another one that is exactly the same but published by someone else. This makes searching through available arcs in the AE more difficult than it should be.
Yeah, they really do need to work on the filter system for the AE. It's quite hard to find the really good stories with so much flotsam out there at the moment.

[complain:]
Issue 16 hurts legitimate users (the kind that NCSoft have supposedly tried to encourage) of the AE TOO MUCH!!!
[/complain]


 

Posted

im actualy glad of the fact AE is gone makes those noobs learn to play my favorite AE noob 50 quote is "how do i get to steel canyon?" lmao good times i mainly used AE for 1 purpose and it was cause when i first hit 50 i thought "wow that took awhile... time to make a new toon and take the same amount of time" with AE it made it easier to get 50 again cause my first 50 bubbler took awhile to hit 50 with it was fun through the trip but dang that took awhile with only 60 days on my account but now i can enjoy COH with some pros that KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING unlike the noobs that boosted to 50 without learning the frikken basics of COX


so yes i love these changes since i dont even use the AE anymore now ! neither does anybody else on virtue :3


 

Posted

I am a person who hates when something good gets taken away.. As I said before I would stick around a little to see what happens well unfortunately the rest of the server did not... AE was a blast. I played pre and post AE and enjoyed them both. AE is what kept alot of the people around apparently.. Nothing sells now. Groups are impossible to get and literally my enjoyment factor of the game is lost since there is barely anyone to play with. Account Canceled... Been fun teaming w\ everyone who played Guardian.. Good luck those who stick around.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by KDAWG View Post
I am a person who hates when something good gets taken away.. As I said before I would stick around a little to see what happens well unfortunately the rest of the server did not... AE was a blast. I played pre and post AE and enjoyed them both. AE is what kept alot of the people around apparently.. Nothing sells now. Groups are impossible to get and literally my enjoyment factor of the game is lost since there is barely anyone to play with. Account Canceled... Been fun teaming w\ everyone who played Guardian.. Good luck those who stick around.

As far as I can tell, there are about the same number of people playing as there were a month ago, they've just spread out.

Certainly no justification for this kind of doomcrying.


Wavicle, Energy/Energy Blaster, dinged 50 in Issue 4, summer of 2005.
@Wavicle, mostly on the Justice server.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeroicGamer2 View Post
Where does it say this? I've been hunting through the forums and have yet to see any type of statement to that effect...
I don't have massive search fu and couldn't find the exact post this came from, but this was quoted from Horatio (a red name) in another thread; it was apparently posted on the beta board for i16:

"Architect is a feature that we knew even before we launched was going to be tweaked well after it was in the hands of the players. It’s such a big, daunting system, there’s just no way around that. I bring this up to say that the adjustments we’re making to the rewards in Architect are on going. You can expect to see more refinement in both our methods and our numbers in the coming months. Right now, we wanted to address some of our as well as your major concerns with the system as soon as possible. Architect is a feature we have big plans for and we’re committed to seeing it grow into its rightful place within both the game and the community of City of Heroes."

I've added bold font to the pertinent section and also italicized with that one for extra emphasis another. On top of this I'm pretty sure I've seen about the same wording from another dev elsewhere.

Really, how much in this game hasn't changed at one time or another? Things always change, just adjust and get over it.