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Originally Posted by DaveMebs
Thats actually pretty amazing to be able to double your dmg every minute and a half. Especially if you want to use IO sets and go for recharge.
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Originally Posted by Desitre
Whats your build on your fire powers? (what I mean is what are all the powers you are using with the firey aura) The reason I ask that is because ever since ED Fire tanks all have to play with strategy, you can't run in there guns a-blazin'. Also since you only ran one mission I find your test invalid because some enemies are more resistant to fire than others.
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The build is an SO build for both. The Ice powers are slotted the same for both toons. 3 recharge in FE, 3 rech and 3 Dam in burn. BA 1 acc, 3 dam, two end reduc, armors are 3 resist 1 end reduc. It had Tough and Weave but could not run Weave do to End issues.
This was a direct comparison of Fire Armor to Shield Defense. SHield wins as most offensive. Shield Charge affects 16 at a time. Fiery Embrace only increases damage on maximum ten enemies, with Burning Aura, Frost, and Frozen Aura. Burn only affects five enemies at once.
Shield Wins. Fire is not the most offensive tank. Though, it is offensive, kinda like farting really loud in religious ceremony.
YMMV---IMO
Ice Ember
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okay great but what are the powers you are using with fire armor?
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Originally Posted by Ice_Ember
I used several missions and several enemy types. Five missions which are all identical. With the AE it is easy to switch around. Coucil, Freaks, Nems, Carnies, and Family. I timed each map with hero stats. I had to use Heroic setting because bosses would take too long with Ice Melee.
The build is an SO build for both. The Ice powers are slotted the same for both toons. 3 recharge in FE, 3 rech and 3 Dam in burn. BA 1 acc, 3 dam, two end reduc, armors are 3 resist 1 end reduc. It had Tough and Weave but could not run Weave do to End issues. This was a direct comparison of Fire Armor to Shield Defense. SHield wins as most offensive. Shield Charge affects 16 at a time. Fiery Embrace only increases damage on maximum ten enemies, with Burning Aura, Frost, and Frozen Aura. Burn only affects five enemies at once. Shield Wins. Fire is not the most offensive tank. Though, it is offensive, kinda like farting really loud in religious ceremony. |
Pinnacle - The Drunk Server!
MAIN: Desi Boy> Level 51 Fire/Fire Tank
Super Group: C.O.R.E.
Tanking since 05'
Vigilante
MAIN: Desi Boy> Level 51 Fire/Fire Tank
Super Group: C.O.R.E.
Tanking since 05'
Vigilante
Quote:
I'd of been interested in a Shield/Fire versus a Fire/Fire because maybe then we can see if Fiery Embrace needs to go on 10 more secs.
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Originally Posted by Ice_Ember
Shield Wins. Fire is not the most offensive tank. Though, it is offensive, kinda like farting really loud in religious ceremony.
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He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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Originally Posted by Desitre
okay great but what are the powers you are using with fire armor?
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....
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| 3 recharge in FE, 3 rech and 3 Dam in burn. BA 1 acc, 3 dam, two end reduc, armors are 3 resist 1 end reduc. It had Tough and Weave but could not run Weave do to End issues |
all except RotP and temp protection... it really does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that the armors are taken. The only variable is temp protection, which still does not offer enough to take it except as a spot for IO's. I should have taken consume instead of Weave, but when I respec it will be to slot it up with IO's.
SO's on Fire armor is painful.
Also... the fire/ice has all the accolades and the shield/ice has none. The fire/ice should have been able to take a bit more on higher setting, but that did not happen. The shield, again with just SO's, was at 40% defense. (want me to list each armor again...)
YMMV---IMOIce Ember
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I have a 50 shield/fire as well, so the next time a free weekend opens up I will get a friend to run his fire/fire and see. It will be faster than the fire/ice on time, but it will not be as fast as the shield/ice from the experience I have seen. I am not going to PL up a fire/fire to test it. The shield/ice, though fun, will not be played anymore after this. No point when I have a Stone/fire, ice/stone, shield/fire, and a fire/ice already.
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Originally Posted by New Dawn
I'd of been interested in a Shield/Fire versus a Fire/Fire because maybe then we can see if Fiery Embrace needs to go on 10 more secs.
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YMMV---IMOIce Ember
I like how you reply. Like an ***.
+1 rep for you.
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okay so fire and ice isn't the best for damage but what about a pure fire tank against the ice shield, have you tried that because when using fire together you are more effective.|
Originally Posted by Ice_Ember
........ form the post you quoted....
all except RotP and temp protection... it really does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that the armors are taken. The only variable is temp protection, which still does not offer enough to take it except as a spot for IO's. I should have taken consume instead of Weave, but when I respec it will be to slot it up with IO's. SO's on Fire armor is painful. Also... the fire/ice has all the accolades and the shield/ice has none. The fire/ice should have been able to take a bit more on higher setting, but that did not happen. The shield, again with just SO's, was at 40% defense. (want me to list each armor again...) |
also i apologize for not see what your buld was when i first read it it sounded like you only had three powers.
edit: man this thread has gone on for a long time.
Pinnacle - The Drunk Server!
MAIN: Desi Boy> Level 51 Fire/Fire Tank
Super Group: C.O.R.E.
Tanking since 05'
Vigilante
MAIN: Desi Boy> Level 51 Fire/Fire Tank
Super Group: C.O.R.E.
Tanking since 05'
Vigilante
Quote:
Against All Odds is a constant damage buff. Shield Charge is up every 45 seconds or so. Shield/fire will also out damage Fire/Fire sense Fiery Embrace with 3 rechareges is up every 90seconds. |
Originally Posted by Desitre
okay so fire and ice isn't the best for damage but what about a pure fire tank against the ice shield, have you tried that because when using fire together you are more effective.
also i apologize for not see what your buld was when i first read it it sounded like you only had three powers. edit: man this thread has gone on for a long time. |
The damage issue is based on the number of targets an attack can hit. Tank AoE attacks only hit 10 targets max. Shield Charge hits 16.
My two shield tanks out perform my fire/ice tank. My stone/fire tank out performs my fire/ice tank as well. My ice/stone is a better tank, though doesnt do as much damage. I have not compared the survivability of ice to shield.
YMMV---IMOIce Ember
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This. But I wonder what the numbers on EAs aura will be with the perfect zinger 20% psi.
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Originally Posted by DSorrow
And what adds to Blazing Aura's superiority, is the quite rare resistance against fire damage.
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You cannot slot taunt IO sets into a taunt aura. It is from a bug that was easier to remove the slotting than to fix the bug.|
Originally Posted by Tank_Washington
This. But I wonder what the numbers on EAs aura will be with the perfect zinger 20% psi.
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Dont forget, Mud Pots also does fire damage. Not as much as Blazing Aura, but it also does fire.
YMMV---IMOIce Ember
Blaster's Hot Feet is the strongest damage aura.
Tanker's damage aura is... Blazing Aura.
Is it the most useful? No, but it hits the hardest.
Whining about everything since 2006.
Ammo switching for Dual Pistols was my idea:
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=135484
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You can with Invincibility, but not in any others to the best of my knowledge.
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Originally Posted by Ice_Ember
You cannot slot taunt IO sets into a taunt aura. It is from a bug that was easier to remove the slotting than to fix the bug.
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They ALL float down here. When you're down here with us, you'll float too!
@Starflier
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Not for long. I16 is fixing that.
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Originally Posted by Starflier
You can with Invincibility, but not in any others to the best of my knowledge.
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this new change spells DOOM! for invulns.... not really but I like saying DOOM!
Whining about everything since 2006.
Ammo switching for Dual Pistols was my idea:
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=135484
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Not that it'll cramp anyone's style. The only person I've heard of using the PZ proc is me. And that was simply to check/prove that it could be slotted. The damage was anemic at best.
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Originally Posted by Wine_Mistress
Not for long. I16 is fixing that.
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They ALL float down here. When you're down here with us, you'll float too!
@Starflier
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Originally Posted by Ice_Ember
Against All Odds is a constant damage buff. Shield Charge is up every 45 seconds or so. Shield/fire will also out damage Fire/Fire sense Fiery Embrace with 3 rechareges is up every 90seconds.
The damage issue is based on the number of targets an attack can hit. Tank AoE attacks only hit 10 targets max. Shield Charge hits 16. My two shield tanks out perform my fire/ice tank. My stone/fire tank out performs my fire/ice tank as well. My ice/stone is a better tank, though doesnt do as much damage. I have not compared the survivability of ice to shield. |
Your Stone/Fire tank outperforms your Fire/Ice tank?????
I can understand how a Shield/Fire or Fire/Fire tank could/would but a Stone/Fire, with the debuffs to Granite - or are you talking about out of Granite?
I've always found my Fire/Ice to be very good in the damage department - with the Ice patch/Burn combo supplementing the click attacks.
Taunt is needed though to keep pulling the mobs onto the Ice patch/Burn.
I've never timed missions but playing alongside various Tank combos I havent't found the damage to be anemic - it clears maps quicker than some of my scrappers.
Single target damage is c*** though.
L50s: Tanks: Cryofission - Ice/EM - Dr Celsius - Fire/Ice - Saint George - SD/SS | Controllers: Psichosis - Ill/Kin - Major Chaos - Ill/Stm | Scrappers - Neutron Crusader - DM/SR
Currently Levelling: Angelic Blade - BS/WP Scrapper | Seeds of Destruction - Plant/Kin Controller
The various set p[ieces that do things like "Chance to do smashing damage", If i slot one of those into my Icecicles will it have a chance to proc every time the icicles tick?
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No. It will check to proc once every 10 seconds from anything that's a toggle.
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Originally Posted by Plusone
The various set p[ieces that do things like "Chance to do smashing damage", If i slot one of those into my Icecicles will it have a chance to proc every time the icicles tick?
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I run my stone out of granite quite a bit, unless it is on large teams or AV/EB's. It has the defense with weave to not need granite all the time. Plus, the movement penalty and recharge penalty are gone with IO's. The damage penalty is not overcome, but fire makes up for that.|
Originally Posted by Psiphon_EU
Your Stone/Fire tank outperforms your Fire/Ice tank?????
I can understand how a Shield/Fire or Fire/Fire tank could/would but a Stone/Fire, with the debuffs to Granite - or are you talking about out of Granite? I've always found my Fire/Ice to be very good in the damage department - with the Ice patch/Burn combo supplementing the click attacks. Taunt is needed though to keep pulling the mobs onto the Ice patch/Burn. I've never timed missions but playing alongside various Tank combos I havent't found the damage to be anemic - it clears maps quicker than some of my scrappers. Single target damage is c*** though. |
after I finish specing out my fire/ice, it will have 41% S/L defense, that will help its survivability. I am hoping quicksand will help with getting more out of burn.
My shield/fire... will be better than both for damage. I have not started slotting IO's in it yet. I am having too much fun with my fire/shield scrapper which is a beast.
YMMV---IMOIce Ember
I wondered why this thread has had so many posts. Assault also has res to taunt and placate, it maybe that very few people will see the power as worth it but there is possibly some tanker somewhere with a reason for taking it, likely in pvp I'd imagine. Some scrappers can benefit from the damage buff component of Assault during the fight duration mainly as their DPE remains the same. Both a Scrapper and Tanker having Assault in a team PvP environment could probably prove useful. I also think that Assault is possibly better over time than melt armour depending on your intentions.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.