AE Zone

Seeing as how the focus is shifting to GR pretty soon, yeah I don't see them doing any major AE changes.

Abjects get moved all the time in the game, just look at the sg portal in Talos. it has moved behind the trainer. and it happens to be between the train and AE and Wents is right behind the train. I do believe this was an attempt to make a super lag hole of galatic purportions. One that would create a force strong enought that the more lag it generated the more lag it attracted until all lag would be drawn in the this ever spanning casim of doom. I am sorry I digress. must have ran one too missions with a grav troller.

but more on point the vangard buildings are in atlas and have been for some time. they lead to the rwz, why not have the AE buildings all lead to the ae zone. no major rewrite needed, just a simplification of the code to port everyone to one zone instead of allocating a portion of every server to AE and its an active connection to the ae database. one server, one connection. you would have simplicity and greater throughput. resulting in faster response times and higher player satisfaction and an over all decrease in lag even with ae itself. it would in fact be a win win. I believe that the current configuration was done of of the desire to reduce the initial cost of resources and to reduce cost as well. and a Rezoning of ae might have been planned all along as it progressed. It would have been logical. Could you imagine if they had spent the resources and funds on an entirely new zone/servers routers and so forth and ae was used only a much as pocket D in the off season? That would have been a huge loss. But as it turned out it is in huge demand for what ever reason and moving it to its own zone like the rwz are only makes too much sense now.

for could you imagine if instead of just one zone for the rikti they had crashed ships in every zone? and were running amuck constantly within a certain range? and to have sucha ship near the train wents/black market or trainers? yes, now that would pose some serious issues indeed. no giving the rikti their own zone was prudent and establishing ae initially as they did was so as well. but it it time for ae to grow to the next step. Change is good, at least thats what the politicians say.

The central goals for MA were: facilitating player-created content and providing a leveling alternative. That's fairly well obvious just by looking at it. XP didn't have to be in MA at all. But it is. Thus, clearly, having it be a leveling alternative was a goal. Even if it were a secondary goal, it's still a very big goal and a "main intention" of the system.

So, again... MA requires XP rewards to be "as it was intended". It is, by design, a leveling alternative. You can't level without XP. Thus, MA requires XP rewards to be "as it was intended".

Your initial statement, "If there was zero xp earned in AE and no item drops but only tickets earned then AE would be as it was intended," continues to be wrong. Not to mention, in my view, rather thoughtless.

So, please stop re-asserting it or trying to song and dance it into validity. Especially considering that this thread--the thread you started--is more about rezoning MA than removing XP from it.

The latter "suggestion" has already been beaten into a bloody, formless pulp in this forum and, given the design goals of the system, is a thoroughly dead-end idea. Unless the developers decide to write MA off and just walk away from it, it ain't gunna happen. That dog don't hunt. This... is a dead parrot.

And again, figuring out why the developers are vested in MA being a leveling alternative is a no-brainer.

This may come as an enormous shock to you, but some players don't use MA to power-level or farm. Some players use it strictly as it was intended to be used. Right now. As it is.

Our preferences and playstyle are just as valid as your own.

You're basing this on what?

...

I think you're going to have to be more specific here.

*facepalm*

ProTip: Anything that begins with "make the players" or "force the players" is probably a bad idea.

However, I'm all for a complete revamp of the "classic" content.

Being done.

Ah, so anecdotal.

My experience has been rather the opposite of yours. I see more people now than I used to. Several folks on my global list who've been inactive for a good stretch, have returned. My own gameplay hasn't suffered at all.

I think it's important to remember that we, as players, have a very limited perspective. Things change, behaviors change, people come, people go, people shift around to do different things at different times. Not everyone PUGs and not everyone who PUGs uses broadcast and search to do it. When school starts, activity drops across the board. When new content is introduced, people tend to flock to it. When I16 hits, Steel Canyon, Founders Falls, Independence Port, Cap, and St. Martial will no doubt see an upswing of activity, simply because they feature tailors. There will probably be an accompanying lag increase in Steel and Cap. But how many people will continue to blame that on MA? The new difficulty settings will likely bring more people back to regular content (RC). Especially with the impending XP changes to MA. Wouldn't the game then seem more populated to you, even though it's just the same number switching to different activities?

In short, how the game feels to any single one of us is not really a good indicator of anything, because it's influenced by so many factors.

Meanwhile, I've not seen any numbers that indicate subscriptions are dropping. From what I've seen, they seem to have leveled out, and might even be inching up a little right now. Money and resources are being vested into Paragon Studios. Their staff is, as far as I know, still growing. There's a major expansion on deck, and color customization of powers was an ambitious and time intensive project. Not to mention MA itself. I find it unlikely--not impossible, but unlikely--that NCSoft would put so much into a game that was "dying".

This particular suggestion has been discussed at length on multiple threads. There are many issues with it that may not be readily apparent. My suggestion would be to check them out.

Whether they are or aren't isn't really any of our concern.

MA is a different system, with its own particular dynamics. Taking the lack of required travel into account is already part of its design. Right off the bat, all of those design elements would have to be revisited and reworked. I realize the solution you propose looks simple. But it really isn't.

I have no lag issues, blueside. But then, I avoid Atlas as a matter of course, and did so long before MA hit the scene. Redside, Cap is a little more difficult to avoid. But I think Eva's suggestion up-thread is a far more elegant and less disruptive solution to this particular issue.

I don't really consider addressing this problem worth inconveniencing the entirety of the player base. I'm not even sure I'd call it a problem at all.

If a player is comfortable with being clueless and is having fun, I'd just assume leave him or her be. If such an "AE Baby" wants to get out into the wider game, they'll have to expand their horizons. I don't see much benefit in making them do so. I do see a lot of downside.

I don't agree with force-oriented solutions. I especially don't agree with such solutions when they're going to negatively impact my own experience and restrict my own options.

I've been playing this game for 5 years. It's an old game. Consequently, it has a lot of vets; a whole slew of players--very likely the majority--who require no instruction, no introduction to the wider game.

If we want to sit in an AE building from 1 to 50, I don't see why we shouldn't have that option. Personally, I have no desire to do so, but if I really want to skip a section of RC (and take a hit in my leveling speed to do it), MA gives me that option. I appreciate that option. I've used that option. I know of relatively new players who've used that option, because, even in less than a few months, they had already gone through the low-level RC enough times to be a little weary of it.

Any solution that takes that away from us is not, in my opinion, a good one.

...

Uh...

What?

Opinions mean more when they've actually been thought through instead of being based on hyperbole, personal anecdotes and knee-jerk overreaction.

Well, at least you have an opinion. But insulting some oneleses point of view verses giving inteligent counter point does not make your own point but merely become insulting.

I am sorry if you have found the discussions here to be ever so droll and repetitive. However this should allow you tp speed through the articles if you do not wish to read them in their entirity. Although some points do need restating to make their full point. At some point merely quoting the quote of the quote does not get the point accross.

Some people are drastically opposed to change no matter how minor or how much it is needed. I am glad you are enjoying things as is. I would just like to see things made better.

That AE is being used as it was intended, if even only by a few, is good to hear actually. I probably would have if it were not for the horrible lag and the lack of a map editor.

Oh, for heaven's sake.

There is no opinion about it.

MA is intended to be an alternative for leveling.

That isn't a point of view. That is a fact.

Discussions aren't the problem. Misinformation and misconception are the problems.

And some people just don't like horrible ideas.

Which, in my opinion, would not be the result of your suggestions.

Uh huh?

Actually you may not have noticed but no one else seems to hold your point of view of either the litteral or percieved litteral "facts".

What is more important? Protecting the initial concept of AE ( and we do refer to it by AE not MA) or keeping the game actually fluid and playable. I for one will not be here for long after my contract with CoH expires. I prepaid for a year way before AE was even thought of. And now with this lag fest disguised as an improvement will more than likely drive me away. I like the game but I will not endure a laggy esperience and struggle to try to enjoy it and end up hating the game.

The sole purpose in starting this discussion was to try to come up with a concept that would rid COH of the lag and bring back some of the playability of the game.

If this means offending your purist concepts then so be it. I would rather have the game enjoyable that keep it true to the original concepts.

If all you wish to do is keep the game pure to its initial concepts then there is no use discussing anything with you at all. For there is nothing of any intellectual value to be gained by it.

Thanks Eva 8o)

You are a life saver.

Perhaps you are right we did get a bit off topic.

The uses of AE can't be totally controlled by the Dvs as much as we wish they could. if they did then it would not give you much latitude in design.

But, however, what they can do is help us when it comes to lag. Initial concept or not. If Henry Ford had only stuck to his initial concept of the automobile ONLY then progress would have been very lacking. And that is what we really want here is progress.

I remember reading something very simular in the preludes to the AE release. Only the article did not deal with any issues of PLing or Farming. I believe that was a result that was not forseen.

If each AE had its own Zone I think that might be a bit much but what would probably would be feasible is that if you had the zones that are hardly ever used, for instance Boomtown, have an actual AE building and place a link to it in all the other zones for CoH and do the same for the CoV side in a simularly idle zone. (Forgive my ignorance I have not yet played in CoV.)

One could even be placed in one of the PVP zones to allow heroe and Villian join missions. Any of the AE buildings in a PVP zone would link to the master AE building for PVP or Heroe/Villian Coop battles.

You might want to read this forum a little more thoroughly.

Also, let me know when you see the load screen tip that specifically states: you can level from 1 to 50 with Mission Architect.

Excuse me, but who the hell do you think you are? And who the hell do you think you're speaking for aside from yourself?

"We do refer to it"?

Is that supposed to be the royal "we"? You royalty now?

Pro Tip: You don't speak for anyone other than yourself.

And MA = Mission Architect: the game feature. AE = Architect Entertainment: the in-world manifestation of that feature. Both acronyms are routinely used in forum discussions.

Which you'd know if you actually bothered to read any.

Do you even realize that you're ripping on something that, by your own admission, you don't even use?

False dichotomy. Also, a straw man, as I have not made an argument in this thread for "protecting the initial concept of AE."

Okay. I don't have lag issues. So why does my game experience have to be compromised for your sake?

How about you come up with a solution for your problems that doesn't diminish the experience for others. How would that be?

For you.

Which is still the critical point you--in your self-absorbed presumptuousness and conceit--apparently cannot grasp.

You seem to be quite ignorant about this game. You don't actually use the MA system. You haven't played redside. You didn't even know base rent could be paid in Galaxy. And you quite obviously haven't been paying attention to the forums for any significant length of time.

And yet you waltz in here, authoritatively declare a falsehood like, "If there was zero xp earned in AE and no item drops but only tickets earned then AE would be as it was intended," and expect that to stand as a viewpoint?

What?

You conflate RMT farmers with farmers in general, and expect not to be corrected on that? You tag your idea of putting AE in its own zone as "novel", when it was nothing of the sort, and have the nerve to get bent when it's pointed out to you that, no, it's not really all that novel? You blithely disregard counter points, reject and argue factual corrections, make up arguments no one's presented, and presume to instruct, from some delusional position of authority, anyone who appears to disagree with you. And you think that's of intellectual value?

In my estimation, you have consistently demonstrated a complete lack of consideration, and a condescending disdain, for anyone who doesn't play as you do and/or has the gall to point out the flaws in your "ideas" and statements.

There are problems with the idea of removing XP from MA. There are problems with the idea of putting AE in its own zone. If you're just going to brush them off because they don't affect you personally and not give a toss about anyone who might be negatively impacted, why should those people give a toss about your problems?

Got lag? Aw, well, that's too bad. I don't. So please explain to me why I should have to sacrifice so a problem you're having is fixed. Especially when it's a problem you can fix yourself by 1. avoiding Atlas and/or 2. getting a better system.

I mean, this machine I'm on now ain't exactly bleeding-edge. And I play exclusively on one of the most populated servers. If I'm not having lag issues, why're you?


Again, a straw man. And a baseless assumption. I have never advocated "purist concepts". All I have done in this thread is correct your misstatements and misconceptions. Please stop trying to force a viewpoint onto me that I've never expressed. You've attempted it multiple times now. It's getting tired.

Again, false dichotomy.

What I wish for is changes to the game that are improvements to the experience for the broadest possible range of players. What I wish for is negative impact of changes and adjustments to be minimized as much as possible. What I wish for is not undercutting one legitimate playstyle for the sake of another. What I wish for is targeting the root of a problem, not a particular manifestation of it. What I wish for is a broader range of options; more choice, not less.

What I also wish for is clarity, factual accuracy, and intellectual honesty in dialogues about this game.

Thus far, you don't seem particularly inclined to adopt any of those things.

Frankly, at this point, seeing you even use the word "intellectual" borders on being morally offensive to me.

The Load screens are submitted by users. That bit of information is in a loadscreen too.
There for the information contained therein is not the representation of the Devs. but the users

No I have used it and probably would have continued to use it if it were not for the lag generated within AE. I have played others stories and created a few of my own. They still need refining but with the lag there is not much incentive to do so.

If the game were only about you being able to have it your way, I am sure that everything would please you and even the forums would do nothing more than paise you. However it is about everyone not just you.

Coming up with a solution that fits everyone is what we are trying to accomplish here. Not simply insult everyones oppinion merely because you dont like it. Insulting something or some one does not make you or your view point seem any better. It only points out that you are insulting

Ignorant, no, I perhaps lack knowledge of certain areas because I have been attemtping to learn all I can about the areas I have discovered and I have found that I do know more than most I have encountered here. What I have not seen or do not know I freely admit. I ask questions so that I may in fact learn. I do not insult some one for their lack of knowledge. The only true ignorance is the refuting of those that wish to learn.

Your lack of concern of others that play the game is disconcerning. If all those that are experiencing lag and are turned by it leave the game. Will not the the game in general suffer? Will it come to the point that the Devs and/or owners say "Its been a good ride but its time to cut our losses and close CoH/CoV"? No profits, no game. this is a commercial enterprise. But Lag is one of the biggest enemies of a MMORPG. It will Drive players away very quickly. I for one would not like to see that happen.

But by your own admission, you dont care if anyone else has lag or not.
But for the record I generally did not have hardly any lag till the advent of AE.
Since my system and my connection did not change, the cause must be the only other thing that did change. the addition of AE. Ergo, it needs tweeking, repairing. or even a redesign. Chose what ever term you wish, but AE is the cause and it does need to be fixed. If I were to be the only one effected by the AE Lag event horizon, then I would agree with you and just shutup and color and go my merry way. However I am not the only one. For everyone that expresses an issue with a problem there are generally hundreds more. I have been in the IT profession for quite some time now and I know this to be the general rule of thumb. Complainin customers are like the tip of the preverbial iceburg. What you see is only a small portion of the problem at hand. I would like to fix the problem before the ship hits the iceburg.

If you're lagging in the Skyway City AE building then how do you manage to play the rest of the game?