Because that would equal more work for the devs. They're already up to their necks in work for Issue 16.
Arc ID: 348998 - Becoming a villain
Arc ID: 373341 - To Save a Hero
Got Inf?
Well, the OP has a valid point. We've all been kinda spoiled by mids, so not having it is like going through a crack withdrawl...
But Smash has a point too...The Devs have enough on their plate, and they've also never shown any desire to provide a program.
So that leaves us with A) Somebody else to take over mids, since the new guy is clearly having issues, or B) just sit here dealing with our withdrawl until the new guy gets the hang of it.
Unfortunately, it looks like we're going to have to deal with B. Though honestly, picking up someone else's work might not be the best idea...Maybe the better course of action would be for someone to write an entirely new program from the ground up. That way there's no confusion.
Naturally, I have no freakin' clue how to program, so I'm probably grossly underestimating it. The most we can really do is just wait. Considdering we're getting someone else's hard work for free, we have no right to make demands or complain. Until then, the current Mids at least functions as a relative framework for planning, as long as you bear in mind that it's not 100% accurate. It may not suit someone who plans everything to the finest detail, but to a more casual gamer it's still good enough.
The off-beat space pirate...Capt. Stormrider (50+3 Elec/Storm Science Corruptor)
The mysterious Djinn...Emerald Dervish (50+1 DB/DA Magic Stalker)
The psychotic inventor...Dollmaster (50 Bot/FF Tech Mastermind)
Virtue Forever.
Mids needs to go open source.
Dark Bard, Zoobait, Debacle
jmsb
Por vezes d� vontade...
chucknorriss
speak american godamnit
Why does everyone keep saying we don't have Mids Planner any more? Didn't someone take over that?
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Steiner has taken over the work mids retrired from. No offense to him even though I'm sure he's working hard at it especially since no one is paying him to do this, but so far all we've gotten is reasons on why its not out. Now before anyone says I'm underestimating the workload involved in updating this extensive program i'm not. I know i sure as hell couldn't program it or bring it up to date, but my biggest concern as a mids brand cocaine addict is that with i16 coming out sooner or later not having an up to date build planner for the proliferations and pvp sets as well as the power changes on doms is gonna make maximizing my characters more difficult.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Why does everyone keep saying we don't have Mids Planner any more? Didn't someone take over that?
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As a software engineer specializing in data integration I can definitely say that the coding of the interface is the least of the problem here. Acquiring accurate and up-to-date source data from a proprietary organization and getting that data to integrate with a third-party system is the real trick.
That's not to say the interface is simple. I'm just saying it's the tip of the iceberg. It's a twenty-ton tip, but the tip nonetheless.
What we need is a web-based tool. They're easier to publish, update and maintain and much easier to access for the customer and that way it would be cross-platform; one application usable by both PCs and Macs. If someone could point me to where I could find the source data, I could build something. A web application wouldn't have some of the bells and whistles that a forms app would have, but it would much more dynamic. If the source data where available through a web service (WSDL w/ SOAP) it could even be self-updating.
I seriously doubt the real-numbers are available through a web service, however, and I won't have the time to go get them. If someone else wanted to make those numbers available, I'd be happy to grab them.
Robin
--If we can have huge sig images, why can we have only five lines of text?
--...faceplanting like a Defender pulling an AV (Nalrok_AthZim)
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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
...I have the patience of a coffee-fueled flea...
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One reason it would be beneficial for the devs to have an official build planner which they could update would be it would allow the better builders quicker access to identify potential problems.
On the con side, it would be yet one more thing to support.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
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RedTomax is fairly up to date for source data, at least for power information. I don't know if they have enhancements.
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Originally Posted by CoyoteShaman
As a software engineer specializing in data integration I can definitely say that the coding of the interface is the least of the problem here. Acquiring accurate and up-to-date source data from a proprietary organization and getting that data to integrate with a third-party system is the real trick.
That's not to say the interface is simple. I'm just saying it's the tip of the iceberg. It's a twenty-ton tip, but the tip nonetheless. What we need is a web-based tool. They're easier to publish, update and maintain and much easier to access for the customer and that way it would be cross-platform; one application usable by both PCs and Macs. If someone could point me to where I could find the source data, I could build something. A web application wouldn't have some of the bells and whistles that a forms app would have, but it would much more dynamic. If the source data where available through a web service (WSDL w/ SOAP) it could even be self-updating. I seriously doubt the real-numbers are available through a web service, however, and I won't have the time to go get them. If someone else wanted to make those numbers available, I'd be happy to grab them. Robin |
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ok reality check people mids dropped this a long while back I know this because he emailed me telling me he was doing it.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Why does everyone keep saying we don't have Mids Planner any more? Didn't someone take over that?
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someone may have picked it up but that someone lacks the drive or opportunity to get it done and share it in a timely manner, more than likely they have blown it off all together.
no sense whining about it mids was wonderful for bringing it to us all these years
a cov web based tool would be nice however I don't see their money bags allowing for the project. it would take dev time and web admin time they prolly would not want to pay for.
although that would be the easiest sollution as the data already resides on their server and it would be easy for them to link to data that would update on the fly.
I miss mids too but it is what it is.
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You're right on the first point, but every web-based app I've seen for this is too klunky. Mids is just too good a starting point to throw out. It has a huge number of great features and is user-adaptable to boot.|
Originally Posted by CoyoteShaman
As a software engineer specializing in data integration I can definitely say that the coding of the interface is the least of the problem here. Acquiring accurate and up-to-date source data from a proprietary organization and getting that data to integrate with a third-party system is the real trick.
That's not to say the interface is simple. I'm just saying it's the tip of the iceberg. It's a twenty-ton tip, but the tip nonetheless. What we need is a web-based tool. |
As others have suggested, though, it should be open source. The nature of a computer game is that people come and go. Having one person responsible for it just doesn't make sense -- it's just too much work for one person to have to collect all that data, write the code to support it, and then maintain it when the game changes.
It's the perfect sort of app for open source. The person who took it over should seriously consider placing it under open source at the same place HeroStats is hosted -- as long as Mids is okay with that.
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I can tell you this will never happen
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Originally Posted by Necromatic
Mids needs to go open source.
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Mids is not okay with it. He does not want the hours and hours he worked to get forked. Also it was something Steiner had to agree to on taking over that he would not release the code.
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Originally Posted by Rodion
You're right on the first point, but every web-based app I've seen for this is just too klunky. Mids is just too good a starting point to just throw out. It has a huge number of great features and is user-adaptable to boot.
As others have suggested, though, it should be open source. The nature of a computer game is that people come and go. Having one person responsible for it just doesn't make sense -- it's just too much work for one person to have to collect all that data, write the code to support it, and then maintain it when the game changes. It's the perfect sort of app for open source. The person who took it over should seriously consider placing it under open source at the same place HeroStats is hosted -- as long as Mids is okay with that. |
Keeping in mind that I am a free-market anarchist, I do not believe in IP. If you can't touch it or feel it, it isn't property. Regardless, I do believe in courtesy. Whoever made mids did a ton of work (which I have never used, by the way) which s/he made available to the public at no cost and doesn't wish his creativity to be put into the hands of others and so be it.
That doesn't mean an open source CoX builder wouldn't be a reasonable project. The project team could even use feature concepts from Mids or from Mids users. Building it from scratch wouldn't be nearly as easy as adapting the current model, but it would be easier as open source and that way it would be much more likely to be kept up to date.
I would recommend .net, mono and objective C for portability and the selfish reason that getting an iPhone version is high on my list of pie-in-the-sky desires. I've never started an open source project, however, so I wouldn't be able to take point on that. I would be happy to participate, though.
Robin
--If we can have huge sig images, why can we have only five lines of text?
--...faceplanting like a Defender pulling an AV (Nalrok_AthZim)
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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
...I have the patience of a coffee-fueled flea...
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I know that it would be more work for the devs but its something that once it was in place they woudln't have to constantly work at it, again I'm not software engineer but if they made it in a way where all they had to do was upload any power changes they made for the game whenever they happened it wouldn't be high maintenance unless they made it as an in-game interface. Despite whatever changes may have happened in the game I feel the devs have been pretty good at listening to what the fans would like to see to enhance their experience of the "City of" franchise, so I feel that if enough people tell the devs "Hey we really would like a character builder." it would stand a descent chance of happening.
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Originally Posted by Necromatic
Mids needs to go open source.
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Originally Posted by Rodion
It's the perfect sort of app for open source. The person who took it over should seriously consider placing it under open source at the same place HeroStats is hosted -- as long as Mids is okay with that.
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Originally Posted by CoyoteShaman
That doesn't mean an open source CoX builder wouldn't be a reasonable project. The project team could even use feature concepts from Mids or from Mids users. Building it from scratch wouldn't be nearly as easy as adapting the current model, but it would be easier as open source and that way it would be much more likely to be kept up to date.
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Steiner and I are also reworking the Data Chunk/Data Link specification for the cross-platform version (at the moment, it's little more than the text of the build in ZIP format). After which, it'll be integrated into the normal Mids' so that both programs can read the same data. I'm sure it would be in the interests of all of us to have that specification public, so that any future programs created can also read the same data.
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Originally Posted by Kahlan_
RedTomax is fairly up to date for source data, at least for power information. I don't know if they have enhancements.
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Originally Posted by MsMisery
someone may have picked it up but that someone lacks the drive or opportunity to get it done and share it in a timely manner, more than likely they have blown it off all together.
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http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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So what?
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Originally Posted by Smash_Zone
Because that would equal more work for the devs. They're already up to their necks in work for Issue 16.
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Its good to hear that, I wanted to be careful that this thread didn't turn into "Steiner sucks because he hasn't gotten anything out." I just wanted to put this idea out to the fanbase since i'm sure the work must be hard to try and update and change things in the existing program and if we can sucker the devs into doing it crack addicts like me dont have to worry where their next fix is coming from XD.
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Originally Posted by Fleeting Whisper
Mids' will not be going open source.
While Mids' will not be going open source, there's nothing stopping a group of players creating their own planner which is. While it would have to be from scratch, "from scratch" is what I'm doing for cross-platform Mids'. Steiner and I are also reworking the Data Chunk/Data Link specification for the cross-platform version (at the moment, it's little more than the text of the build in ZIP format). After which, it'll be integrated into the normal Mids' so that both programs can read the same data. I'm sure it would be in the interests of all of us to have that specification public, so that any future programs created can also read the same data. It does This is incorrect, and insulting. I can assure you that Steiner continues to work on Mids'. He has already released one version with some broken features, and he continues to work on it to fix those problems. Saying that he's probably blown it off all togehter is flat out wrong. |
I've got an idea: Instead of talking crap about someone due to lack of info, why not just offer polite suggestions or help if you have some expertise in the area?
This whole "whoever took over Mids is a slaker" or whatever is getting irritating! IT WAS AND IS FREE!!! They are trying to help us!
Fleeting Wisper, I would love to be able to help you guys with this... but as I am not a progammer, (just an avid gamer and CoX addict: 3 accounts w/ over 200 alts I think) I don't have any idea how I could be of any assistance.
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Why? What magical force do you think "open source" is exactly?|
Originally Posted by Necromatic
Mids needs to go open source.
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Besides, as another poster already said, the biggest issue really isn't with the GUI/presentation, but with keeping the data up to date. A website based tool would really the better way to go since it is very data heavy. You rule out the biggest long term problem, keeping users up to date. Since they do not have to update a piece of software on their computer it makes updates much, much easier and you end up with less confusion and user complaints...(usually).
~ Infinity Heroes ~
Dark Voltage - 50 NRG/NRG/EM Blaster
Shure Shot - 50 Arch/NRG/MM Blaster
Silent Shadow Blade - 50 Katana/SR/BM Scrapper
Uphir - 50 Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster
But CJ... if you Sourceforge it, they will come! 
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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Ha!
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Originally Posted by Fleeting Whisper
But CJ... if you Sourceforge it, they will come!
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~ Infinity Heroes ~
Dark Voltage - 50 NRG/NRG/EM Blaster
Shure Shot - 50 Arch/NRG/MM Blaster
Silent Shadow Blade - 50 Katana/SR/BM Scrapper
Uphir - 50 Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster
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Hopefully *they* (whoever *they* are) will use prophylactics to avoid a nasty mess and lawsuits charging assault with a deadly weapon...|
Originally Posted by Fleeting Whisper
But CJ... if you Sourceforge it, they will come!
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Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
Hopefully *they* (whoever *they* are) will use prophylactics to avoid a nasty mess and lawsuits charging assault with a deadly weapon...
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pshaw, I say!
I think it would be a great asset to players if the devs would either a ingame build planner for characters with an interface similar to the AE mission creator, or a seperate program that the players could download and utilize. With I16 on the horizon the fan base has been left without an up to date build planner since mids retired and even though I dont fault him since he's doing the work for free but stiener has yet to produce anything we can use. having constantly up to date numbers and correct pvp stats would be fantastic.