I refuse to play a Blaster without Hover nor soft-capped ranged defense, except as a leveling build. The world is just too dangerous!
Quote:
It really depends.|
Originally Posted by SuperT
Hi guys,
I'm usually a tank/scrapper guy but I want to start getting in to some blasters... I wanted to know if people generally try to soft cap their ranged defense for blasters these days or is that not really much of a focus? Talking straight PVE only. Any thoughts are appreciated. Thanks! |
Soft capped is great if you're soloing most of the time and joining the occasional PuG where you don't know what the quality of your teammates are going to be. On a SG-centered or on a team where you have good/competent players, it's generally better to build other things like +recharge.
I've built a soft capped ice/ice and she's fun to play, but I've also been focusing on other forms of mitigation (knockdowns, knockbacks and -rech, -movement) on my other blaster projects.
If you're used to the durability of tankers/scrappers then soft capping range may be the way to go.
Quote:
QFT.|
Originally Posted by Ahmon
I refuse to play a Blaster without Hover nor soft-capped ranged defense, except as a leveling build. The world is just too dangerous!
|
The way I see it, a soft capped blaster is the only blaster that is balanced vs. other ATs. A max DPS build is just smoke and mirrors. It requires optimal circumstances to actually make good on its damage potential. In most circumstances a soft capped blaster will outlive and outdamage a purely offensive build. By a large margin.
Quote:
There are two different approaches you can take. |
Originally Posted by SuperT
Hi guys,
I'm usually a tank/scrapper guy but I want to start getting in to some blasters... I wanted to know if people generally try to soft cap their ranged defense for blasters these days or is that not really much of a focus? Talking straight PVE only. Any thoughts are appreciated. Thanks! |
One is to go for the more exemp-friendly, more consistently survivable, ranged DEF + Hover approach. There really isn't much downside to this, except that you will likely be sacrificing (voluntarily) some of your damage potential in the form of melee-range attacks.
Occasionally, you will get pwnt by AoE damage. Case in point are the maniac slammer missions in the AE which seem to be all the rage now; the slammers all use shotguns, so as far as I can tell (and admittedly, I'm far from expert on the subject of AE farms) ranged DEF is pointless, there.
On the whole, though, for general purpose play -- across all types of game content -- the ranged+hover approach is probably the safest overall.
The second approach is to pick up the Cold APP and soft cap S/L DEF. This is actually somewhat easier to do than ranged DEF (IMO), because you pretty much start halfway to your goal just by taking Frozen Armor. Since you're using fewer slots to reach your DEF goals, you also will likely have more space to fill up on +recharge bonuses elsewhere.
The other, perhaps most important, upside of the S/L DEF approach is that you can more confidently enter melee range against most critters. The downsides are as noted earlier: Exemping is painful, and when you do encounter foes that don't deal S/L damage, you're more likely to get your backside handed to you.
Issue 16's changes to sidekicking and exemping may very well eliminate or at least mitigate the former issue -- and of course, some people prefer not to exemp very often. Personally, when I'm IOing out a toon, I like to make sure that the bulk of its bonuses are still good down to about level 30 or so.
That said, the ranged DEF approach, on average, is probably going to be far more expensive, and will likely require far more patience in finding the IOs required. The specific IO sets which offer the best ranged DEF bonuses aren't terribly expensive themselves -- but in order to get a comparable amount of +recharge to the S/L build, you may have to start dipping into extremely expensive sets (like LotGs).
All of this depends very much on the specific build, but having messed around more than I care to admit with different Blaster builds, I feel pretty confident in saying that you're never going to be able to plug all or even most of the holes in your survivability. The name of the game is mitigation through offense, killing stuff before it kills you, and the addition of soft-cap DEF to one position or a couple of types doesn't really change that much of the time.
The more (targeted) AoEs you have, the harder it will be to get meaningful amounts of DEF without using mule powers or slots. That appears to be an intentional design on the part of the developers.
I've wracked my brain trying to come up with a way to soft-cap ranged DEF and also achieve significant amounts of AoE DEF, for example, but I just can't do it on a Blaster without gimping other areas way too much. My Controller, by contrast, soft caps ranged and very nearly soft caps AoE (43%) fairly easily, though not inexpensively. If you want to have your cake and eat it too, a Scrapper or a Brute or even a Tanker is still the way to go.
In any case, this is a long ramble without any particular point. If you've a specific powerset combination in mind, I'm sure many people here would be happy to offer advice on your build.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Iggy_Kamakaze
Nice build
 |
My name keeper is a Ice/Energy/Elec Blaster, and my IOs on him are just the cheapest things. I didn't exactly plan ahead about what I wanted, I just picked the cheapest level 50 IOs and went with it.
My build ended up with +Recovery and +Acc as the main bounuses, but it's really just a slew of things all thrown together. I ended with a little ranged def (had 3 or so Thunderstrike sets. Had 1 in each blast.)
He solos fine, of course Ice/ helps with being able to hold 2 people while you wail on the others. My build however this point is mainly Powerboost, Aim, BU, Boost Range, and then unload Frost Breath and Static Shock and pick off the rest, firing off my cones when they recharge. I can kill a large mob fairly quick, with little damage to me. (Death is the greatest form of mitigation after all 
)
So is ranged def necessary? I don't think so. Is is nice? It sure is for my Def based toons.
Its all in how you want to roll. And any specific build might help. Not everyone is an Ice/Energy/Elec blaster like me 
Quote:
Pfft tell that to my fire blaster who is built around recharge. Start giving blaster soft capped ranged def and this game becomes even more of a cakewalk then it already is. I can solo EB's just fine and with great speed I may add. And my blaster can throw of 3 attacks before any melee toons even get in melee range. |
Originally Posted by Seraphael
QFT.
The way I see it, a soft capped blaster is the only blaster that is balanced vs. other ATs. A max DPS build is just smoke and mirrors. It requires optimal circumstances to actually make good on its damage potential. In most circumstances a soft capped blaster will outlive and outdamage a purely offensive build. By a large margin. |
Smoke and mirrors my ***.
Maybe you should just learn to play blasters better
Quote:
QF(Even more)T|
Originally Posted by Lucky666
Pfft tell that to my fire blaster who is built around recharge. Start giving blaster soft capped ranged def and this game becomes even more of a cakewalk then it already is. I can solo EB's just fine and with great speed I may add. And my blaster can throw of 3 attacks before any melee toons even get in melee range.
Smoke and mirrors my ***. Maybe you should just learn to play blasters better |
I have a Fire/MM (34% global dmg and 80% glogal rech (150 w/hasten)) and a Fire/EM (Ranged Def capped) I can honestly say that I like the way the Fire/MM plays better and they can both handle the same things. Maybe having near perma Drain Psyche skews my view, but I still find myself needing to use aidself on the Fire/EM from time to time while fighting high lvl things, meanwhile my Fire/MM just tears em up, so YMMV. Blaster durability is in the player more then the build.
Active 50s:
Zero Defex: DP/MM//Mace Blaster
Mutant X-7: Fire/MM//Mace Blaster
Running my Kin/EA gloriously
Come on I21!!!
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Sure, the devs are supposed to listen to their customers, mister business 101 out there. And if I decide to start suggesting that the devs change the game from being about superheroes and supervillains to being about clowns that is my right as well, and technically Paragon Studios is supposed to pay attention to me. But I hope strongly that they assume a meth-head somehow managed to hack into my forum account and make paper airplanes out of my posts, because I hope they recognize stupid when they see it. I assume they will recognize futile just as accurately.
|
Quote:
And I have 72.5% global recharge and 45% S/L DEF on my Fire/Mental. It isn't that totally offensive builds are bad; it's just that there comes a point after which more recharge is almost superfluous -- and you really can, with a little thought and a lot of influence (lol) get a good mix of both.|
Originally Posted by MutantX_7
QF(Even more)T
I have a Fire/MM (34% global dmg and 80% glogal rech (150 w/hasten)) and a Fire/EM (Ranged Def capped) I can honestly say that I like the way the Fire/MM plays better and they can both handle the same things. Maybe having near perma Drain Psyche skews my view, but I still find myself needing to use aidself on the Fire/EM from time to time while fighting high lvl things, meanwhile my Fire/MM just tears em up, so YMMV. |
(With purples, I could get my recharge and global damage a bit higher, but I don't think it's worth spending ~2 billion more for such trivial gains.)
The downside is that you can't, on a Blaster, cover all or even most defensive bases. Whether you go the S/L route or the ranged route, there will still be encounters that can tear you a new one, and in that sense the DEF is almost a disadvantage; it can encourage a false sense of complacency at times.
It isn't my intention to criticize your build or anyone else's. I'm sure it's very good, and all that really matters is that you're happy with it. Part of the appeal of Blasters is the low margin for error, the feeling of flying by the seat of your pants.
The big difference, in my mind, between a soft-capped ranged DEF (presumably +Hover) build and a purely offensive build doesn't even have a whole lot to do with set bonuses; it has more to do with the fact that the pure offensive build will be more comfortable with using his melee powers, which in many cases are more powerful than their ranged analogues.
Otherwise, from a pure cost/benefit perspective, there'd be no reason not to go for ranged DEF, and as many offensive bonuses as you can muster besides.
Quote:
| Blaster durability is in the player more then the build. |
A great melee build almost allows you to sleep through most any normal content, even what others might consider extreme content -- all the while dealing damage that is comparable, if not exactly on par with, Blaster-level damage.
A great Blaster build, even one with high ranged or S/L DEF, will still require a much greater degree of attention and positioning to succeed. The question, then, isn't really whether high-damage melee builds have the better end of the stick; clearly they do, by the numbers. The question is whether it's really even desirable to turn Blasters into a similar play experience.
Personally, I say no.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Iggy_Kamakaze
Nice build
|
I was responding more to this
Quote:
Which was a very one sided statement, while your points are very well articulated and well thought out without saying either side of the same coin is better.| The way I see it, a soft capped blaster is the only blaster that is balanced vs. other ATs. A max DPS build is just smoke and mirrors. It requires optimal circumstances to actually make good on its damage potential. In most circumstances a soft capped blaster will outlive and outdamage a purely offensive build. By a large margin. |
I merely wanted to point out that having both (the defense build and the "smoke and mirrors" build (as it was called)) really didn't impact me as much as how I played my blaster. Which you agree with, how you play your blaster has much greater of an impact then on a melee toon. Toggle up and go to town doesn't work on a blaster, for a multitude of reasons, lacking a significant amount of defensive toggles being the biggest.
To the OP: Pick a blaster combo that looks like it may be something you think you will enjoy (powerset wise). Then after playing with it for a bit, look to see where you feel you are lacking and come back and check on what you can do to help yourself out.
Active 50s:
Zero Defex: DP/MM//Mace Blaster
Mutant X-7: Fire/MM//Mace Blaster
Running my Kin/EA gloriously
Come on I21!!!
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Sure, the devs are supposed to listen to their customers, mister business 101 out there. And if I decide to start suggesting that the devs change the game from being about superheroes and supervillains to being about clowns that is my right as well, and technically Paragon Studios is supposed to pay attention to me. But I hope strongly that they assume a meth-head somehow managed to hack into my forum account and make paper airplanes out of my posts, because I hope they recognize stupid when they see it. I assume they will recognize futile just as accurately.
|
I've never been that impressed with soft capped pure ranger blasters. Most of them sacrifice their damage output for safety and any good blapper will outshine them on a team.
Blasters are about mastering movement and exploiting the weak enemy AI. When you can achieve that, which isn't all that hard, you don't need ranged defense.
Sure not getting hit helps, but saying that's the only way that blasters can be on par tells me that people have not seen really good blasters in action.
Having said that, I did dip into experimenting with defense on a blaster. Currently I have a Ice/Eng with soft capped smashing/lethal defense and an Arch/Eng with soft capped ranged defense. I have more fun with the Ice/Eng because he's built to be in melee. I took the melee attacks on my Arch/Eng and with combat jumping I can hop in and out and get my quick hits in before hovering away and blasting from the air again.
But by far my favorite and most powerful blaster is my recharge intensive Fire/Elec. She hits hard and fast and I play her to the limits. Intelligent movement, some insp popping plus hibernate does wonders for survivability when I can't depend on anyone on the team to throw me any buffs.
Quote:
Mako's Bite is a great set. Regardless of how you build a pure offense Blaster, he won't be able to choose between offense and defense so well as one who's defensive can. The beauty of soft-capping is that you can Hover or stand out of the way when it's dangerous and drop (no activation penalty) or charge to melee whenever you want.
|
Originally Posted by Nemu_
I've never been that impressed with soft capped pure ranger blasters. Most of them sacrifice their damage output for safety and any good blapper will outshine them on a team.
|
To eaches own, I say. Some folks solo better with more damage, some solo better with more mitigation, some solo better with defenses. You have to try what works for you by asking yourself a couple of questions.
Do you like to play based on kill first before being hit?
Do you like to debuff or make it so the enemy has a hard time fighting?
Do you like to shoot and not worry about being shot back?
Some say you give up damage to soft cap, but my Fire/Dev blaster can solo AVs no trouble, so in my mind he does enough damage for me while soft capping range and AoE. Honestly on most of my Blasters I sometimes refuse to take melee powers, personally if I want to be a juggernaut in melee I would roll a scrapper at least they get mez protection for it.
Since you are used to the Scrapper life style, I would suggest building for Ranged and AoE defenses, that way you can play like a ranged scrapper.
edited for incorrect content.
"Yes, winning all the time can be boring."
-Knight_Chill
"It's amazing how well you can put up with endurance issues if you hide them under a large enough pile of bodies."
-Spiritchaser speaking on Dom Revamp
Quote:
While it used to say this the current description is:| even the description for the hero says "This hero does a ton of damage from a distance |
The Blaster is an offensive juggernaut. Whether up close or afar, he can deal out tremendous amounts of damage.
In comparison to the other Archetypes, the Blaster is by far the most damaging to the enemy. But the Blaster is quite fragile; this Archetype has relatively few hit points.
Blaster heroes must be on their guard before getting into combat; while their immense power can overcome most foes, alone they are quite vulnerable. The Blaster can turn the tide of a conflict, but they need their friends to help them succeed.
Active 50s:
Zero Defex: DP/MM//Mace Blaster
Mutant X-7: Fire/MM//Mace Blaster
Running my Kin/EA gloriously
Come on I21!!!
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Sure, the devs are supposed to listen to their customers, mister business 101 out there. And if I decide to start suggesting that the devs change the game from being about superheroes and supervillains to being about clowns that is my right as well, and technically Paragon Studios is supposed to pay attention to me. But I hope strongly that they assume a meth-head somehow managed to hack into my forum account and make paper airplanes out of my posts, because I hope they recognize stupid when they see it. I assume they will recognize futile just as accurately.
|
I will worry about soft cap defense when they come out with a Blaster with SR...
till then im gonna go break some ****!!!
EDIT: added the smiley so people dont really think I believe an SR Blaster is coming...
No one goes there anymore, it's too crowded...
"The potato goes in the FRONT."
Player skill will do more on a blaster than soft capping ever will. Blappers did what they did way before IOs and they made it work. Soft capping makes some things easier but by no means is it required to bring blasters on par with other ATs.
I sincerely believe if one were to master a balls-to-the-walls blaster playstyle on a blaster with little to no means of mitigation, everything else in this game will present absolutely no challenge.
Soft capping is good for AV soloing, RWZ challeges, and other rediculous trials. You're better off getting a mixture of ranged defense and recharge or if you're cool like me you'll have dual builds and have a soft capped ranged defense build and retardedly high recharge build.
Virtue: @Santorican
Dark/Shield Build Thread
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MutantX_7
While it used to say this the current description is:
The Blaster is an offensive juggernaut. Whether up close or afar, he can deal out tremendous amounts of damage. In comparison to the other Archetypes, the Blaster is by far the most damaging to the enemy. But the Blaster is quite fragile; this Archetype has relatively few hit points. Blaster heroes must be on their guard before getting into combat; while their immense power can overcome most foes, alone they are quite vulnerable. The Blaster can turn the tide of a conflict, but they need their friends to help them succeed. |
I apologize that is the current description, mine was old.
"Yes, winning all the time can be boring."
-Knight_Chill
"It's amazing how well you can put up with endurance issues if you hide them under a large enough pile of bodies."
-Spiritchaser speaking on Dom Revamp
Quote:
A lot depends on exactly what you are wanting to fight. Soloing AVs or 6 to 8 person spawns requires high defenses... positioning won't really help much (unless you beat the 6-man spawn by pulling a handful at a time, but that kind of defeats the purpose since it is less efficient than steamrolling smaller spawns). Hit and run on an AV and you'll be giving it time to heal up. On the other hand, high damage builds can tear through mid-sized spawns and can flatten EBs quickly if they pop a couple of inspirations. If you're doing something crazy like soloing the ITF you'll need a softcapped build (plus every temp power and inspiration you can get), but if you just want to stay alive on a bad PUG there are other options.
|
Originally Posted by Nemu_
Sure not getting hit helps, but saying that's the only way that blasters can be on par tells me that people have not seen really good blasters in action.
|
Cascade, level 50 Blaster (NRG/NRG since before it was cool)
Mechmeister, level 50 Bots / Traps MM
FAR too many non-50 alts to name
[u]Arcs[u]
The Scavenger Hunt: 187076
The Instant Lair Delivery Service: 206636
Quote:
I agree, my AR/Dev runs at about 26% ranged defense which I find adequate to my needs allowing me to focus my other set bonuses on recharge and damage. Although admittedly having the extra To Hit debuff from Smoke Grenade available when I need it doesn't hurt.
|
Originally Posted by Santorican
Soft capping is good for AV soloing, RWZ challeges, and other rediculous trials. You're better off getting a mixture of ranged defense and recharge or if you're cool like me you'll have dual builds and have a soft capped ranged defense build and retardedly high recharge build.
|
Hi guys,
I'm usually a tank/scrapper guy but I want to start getting in to some blasters... I wanted to know if people generally try to soft cap their ranged defense for blasters these days or is that not really much of a focus? Talking straight PVE only. Any thoughts are appreciated. Thanks!