I don't know what to make of this!

More recent example, over the exp weekend I was trying to level one of my older characters I haven't played in forever because my friend had resubbed. So we both get our Thugs/Trap/Mace MMs and start forming a team. We get a few extras, including another MM, a kin corruptor, and a couple Brutes. I see a broadcast by a high level Stone Brute and figure that'd be a great addition. I invite him, and he immediately says "Sorry, no MMs" and leaves team.

I shrug, invite someone else, and we go on to totally decimate all the enemies without effort because of all the buffs/debuffs, pets, and explosives. Whoever he was, he missed out. We also didn't need him. But undoubtedly, had he come along, he would've thought himself the most important player.

Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obsidian_Farmer "well, do you have a 50 dark/poison controller on the team?"

Aww thanks! Now I want one!

I would have declined that team as well. Not because there were MMs on it. My wife plays one, and between here and my stalker we murder whole maps rather quickly, so I have no problem with MMs.

I would have declined because of the number of MMs on the team. If there are too many pets running around my FPS drops to less than 10 a second. If I'm playing a brute it's frustrating to attempt to attack something only to find out it was defeated before your system caught up to the action.

I've had the most important powerset on a team before (depending on the situation), but I've never felt I was the most important player on a team.

An example of a "most important powerset" situation would be times when my sonic blaster has the only debuffs on the team and we're taking on AVs. I'm sure it would have been possible without the debuffs, but the debuffs made it a little smoother and faster. And usually that situation doesn't last long because the leader (even if the leader is me) quickly acts to rectify that if able.

On other occasions I've found that a powerset I was playing was more of a liability than a help to the team, so it goes both ways.

I would be willing to bet that every single player in the game has found themselves in both situations at one time or another, so I'm not just trying to make myself sound awesome here.

Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.

a-HAH!

Happened to me last night when i ran an ITF. One guy PMed me asking if it was a speedrun. I told him I had no idea because I didnt know what we had coming. He decided to come anyhow on his Rad.

So, turns out, we end up with 4 lvl 35-38 people (but all controllers or dominators, and all players I know). He up and quits saying "sorry, i dont do PL ITFs"

Pity he didnt notice the powersets of the team. We had a plant controller, TWO kins (including a competent fire/kin), My ill/sonic, and a few other people. WE DECIMATED THAT DAMNED TF. We had quite a few laughs at the espense of mr rad who wanted a specific team setup or else it was a "PL" TF

The problem is that a lot of MMs don't control their pets very well, and allow them to block other players. When brutes can't do their job because pets are blocking a corridor, they have a legitimate complaint.

I have the same kind of problem when I play a dominator/corruptor. I usually trail behind the brute a decent amount, and then close the distance once the brute has locked aggro. But if there's a MM on the team, often the pets also hang back, completely clogging a corridor and preventing me from getting by. This will sometimes prevent me from using useful powers like Fulcrum Shift to their full effect.

If you're playing on open map, it's not a big deal, but playing with a MM in the narrow caves or Oranbega can be a real drag.

I have had the same issues with controller pets, but since there's a maximum of three per controller it's not as bad.

Add to that the long startup time most MMs have upon mission entry, and the frequent aggroing of nearby mobs by out of control pets, and you can see why a brute wouldn't be interested in playing with a bad MM. And when you get an unsolicited invite you have no idea how good the MM is.

However, if I was looking for a team, I'd accept the invite and just live with the hassles. I'm not saying that brute was right for declining you, just that I can certainly see his point. Also, in certain ways brutes and MMs compete for the "tanking" position on the team, and a self-centered brute might not be enjoy being out of the limelight.

There's also an inherent design flaw in the villain ATs with regard to teaming. Certain ATs (brutes and dominators) have to be played in a steamrolling never-stop fashion. Others (stalkers and Masterminds) force frequent stops in the action to allow Hide to reactivate, set up an assassination attempt or resummon pets. The same kind of issue exists with /Device blasters who insist on using Trip Mines everywhere.

The idiosyncratic demands of the playstyles for each villain AT are part of the reason I favor CoH over CoV. The CoH ATs don't really dictate a particular playstyle: you can steam-roll everything, or you can take your time. With villains, brutes really have no choice but to go nuts, otherwise they miss out on two-thirds of their damage potential.

By the same token, you cant restrict MMs either. If they arent going with full guns ablaze and with their secondaries being thrown out like mad their damage potential suffers greatly. Plus I tend to assume brutes will be incompetent just as, if not more often than MMs

In other words, he has some specific criterium/criteria for teaming. Gee.

9.9

I've been noticing an increase of this kind of behavior lately. It's certainly not epidemic in proportion, but disturbing nonetheless.

I'm not much for PuGs, and I have yet to try my hand at a Brute, so I can't speak about them, but I know that MMs have a, for this game, purely relatively speaking, a steeper learning curve.

I think the worst part is the three macros an MM gets upon creation. When I rolled my first MM, I assumed those three macros were obviously sufficient because, hey, the devs gave you them, so they can't be bad. Well, I have yet to set up binds or macros of my own for maximum control, but I started having a greater control over my pets when I removed those three starter macros from my tray and set the pet menu controls to advanced.

I guess I should elaborate on my problems with the default macros, though. For starters, there's the fact that they all effect all pets. That alone is bad simply because it means two of three macros will put all your pets out of bodyguard mode, meaning that any stray bullet could end you.

Then, one of the macros will set all your pets to passive/follow. I can see some merit behind not wanting your pets to shoot stuff in some situations, but most of the time? Not having them in bodyguard mode is, as I said, foolish.

Then there's the aggressive/attack macro, which seems to be the cause of most of the grief players have with MM toons: Once on aggressive, your pets stop caring what they're hurting, and aggro everything. You are actively abandoning your control over pets that way. Hell, I really see no reason to set your pets to aggressive, ever. I'm a Mastermind! I should tell my henchmen what to do, not just tell them to do as they please!

The Defensive/Follow Me macro is the only one I actually like, if only it sets all your henchmen into bodyguard mode, which should, for all intends and purposes, be your henchmen's default state. I could see myself still using this if I didn't already got rid of it.


Do note that I *love* Masterminds. But the thing with them is, daddy just put some extremely wobbly training wheels on them, and you'll actually be safer if you get rid of them. Hell, one of these days, I ought to set up some keybinds myself. That's gotta make being a Mastermind even more awesome, right?


And because I cannot ranting: I guess the problem with 'incompetent brutes' is that they have no idea when to actually stop attacking? That they actually aggro as much as a bad MM's henchies do, except on purpose, and then end up surprised they face-plant, or even blame the Corruptor or Mastermind for not supporting him when they were in fact too busy to take care of the rest of the team? Is that correct?