Open Frameworks Question.
By
Blue Rabbit,
Posted on: 2009-05-29 24:12 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Err, free power pick you mean?
I dont think there will be that much game-breaking sets, such as a MM with /kin (doesnt work anymore). Maybe tankers and brutes with a ranged powerset, or a controller with tanker defence sets.
So in that line:
Any uber range spanker with Tanker stone defence.
50)Sinergy X/(50)Mika.
(50)MaceX/(50)Encore
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Err, free power pick you mean?
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Yup, pretty much.
More than free power pick, I was thinking about DnD 4 style multi-classing sometime ago.
Something like:
For example as a Controller you can get any melee attack instead of one same pier control power. Like swapping Mesmerize with Hack.
Then came the MA and I saw how some sets can be dangerous when combined with other on custom critters. So I gave up this idea and enjoy the game as it is. Also with Going Rogue coming we will have more options (especially strictly one side players like me) to challange ourselves.
Illusion/Illusion!
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EU, Union mostly.
Super Strength/Shield or Super Strength/Willpower Scrapper anyone?
It could get rather messy.
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Super Strength/Shield or Super Strength/Willpower Scrapper anyone?
It could get rather messy.
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What more messy than the SS/Shield and SS/will brutes that are on the loose at the moment?
I believe the original CoH was very much a open framework you picked your powers as you wanted them with no AT or power set restrictions (there was also more sets) but at some point it was decided in the devs (and reportedly one in particular) infinite wisdom to implement the current system.
would it brake the game?
No i don't think so there would need to be a lot of balancing added and few limitations.
The thing I've often thought of is keep the ATs, these would give you your base line stats HP ext and would also come packaged with a number of inherent abilities that would be used to rain in the more extreme combinations.
So you could pick stone armour/earth control as power sets but depending on your AT they would function differently as a controller your armour values would cap out much lower but you would have superior control while as a tank your armour values would be high but your control ability would be low.
Further each set would work more like the epic/patron/pool powers in that you would need to unlock the next power in the set by having a previous one so you could roll up a duel blades/broad sword/assault rifle/willpower scrapper but you mite only have 2 powers from each set.
Firey Assault/Icy Assault. Hello Fire/Ice blasts, hello fire/ice swords.
If you could pick free powers? People would use it to game break, some would gimp themselves too, but... look at it this way:
No one but a /Dev Blaster can use Cloaking Device. Doesn't make much sense. I'd love to use my 24 power picks to make someone with a few martial arts movies, a couple of the Arachnos Soldier gun attacks, cloaking device, combat jumping, quickness, hurdle, y'know, create a high-kicking, gun toting special forces type.
It'll never happen in this game, a total customization system will never work because people will always game-break/gimp themselves and then the devs will have to step in because some complained and then others complain that the devs stepped in and it all goes pete tong.
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Further each set would work more like the epic/patron/pool powers in that you would need to unlock the next power in the set by having a previous one so you could roll up a duel blades/broad sword/assault rifle/willpower scrapper but you mite only have 2 powers from each set.
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Interesting!, So more like a wide-ranging branching tree with crossover points that enabled other powers from other sets as long as you took a pre-requisite tier power that they both had in-common.?
More diversity = less specialisation tradeoff?
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Further each set would work more like the epic/patron/pool powers in that you would need to unlock the next power in the set by having a previous one so you could roll up a duel blades/broad sword/assault rifle/willpower scrapper but you mite only have 2 powers from each set.
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Interesting!, So more like a wide-ranging branching tree with crossover points that enabled other powers from other sets as long as you took a pre-requisite tier power that they both had in-common.?
More diversity = less specialisation tradeoff?
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pretty much as i said it would take a hell of a lot of balancing and a hell of a load of work to implement.
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Firey Assault/Icy Assault. Hello Fire/Ice blasts, hello fire/ice swords.
If you could pick free powers? People would use it to game break, some would gimp themselves too, but... look at it this way:
No one but a /Dev Blaster can use Cloaking Device. Doesn't make much sense. I'd love to use my 24 power picks to make someone with a few martial arts movies, a couple of the Arachnos Soldier gun attacks, cloaking device, combat jumping, quickness, hurdle, y'know, create a high-kicking, gun toting special forces type.
It'll never happen in this game, a total customization system will never work because people will always game-break/gimp themselves and then the devs will have to step in because some complained and then others complain that the devs stepped in and it all goes pete tong.
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never say never tho it is very unlikely.
As to the gimping/game-brake that's always going to happen just look at CoH even with the supposedly well balanced AT system and power sets there are sets and ATs that rise above the others at the same time there are those that go out of there way to seemingly gimp them selves all in the name of character theme.
It wouldn't break the game because to implement such a system with CoH you'd pretty much have to re-write the game from scratch.
You mean like it was back in Alpha?
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I couldn't comment on how the game played in its Alpha/Beta (although I've seen the early videos and powers-lists) - I joined a couple of weeks after the game hit retail.
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You mean like it was back in Alpha?
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When the Devs all made Tank Mages. Apart from the ones that took all support powers...
However, it turned out that Smith was not a time-travelling Terminator
If I were to try and recreate the original Champions PnP version of Thyristor then I'd need to have access to the Illusion and Electrical blast sets.
I suppose if you had a free choice of sets, then perhaps you would have no 'inherent' power that comes with being a standard AT. Though some inherents are so feeble they wouldn't be missed. 'Vigilance' anyone?
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More diversity = less specialisation tradeoff?
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That's a good concept - adds a certain amount of control I guess, which I would imagine would be needed - otherwise you could end up seeing certain power combinations that become a 'must have' - something the current framework does a good job of keeping under control.
Having said that, if Champions has managed to implement an open framework, I guess it's not entirely impossible. Of course, if I had been invited to the beta, then I'd probably be in a better position to comment 
I'd be open (no pun intended) to a more flexible framework though - if it could be done.
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Well, I'd love to go for an all buffer/debuffer alt or an all out AoE spammer. Would be totally impossible to solo with, but amazingly fun in teams.
...and would be a total nightmare for n00bers. As a veteran reward it might be kinda cool though, or expansion thingy, unlocked once you have a level 50... They could call them... Incarnate!
I suspect I already know the answer to this, but just for a talking point;
Say your traditional Archetypes are locked down but you were able to pick and choose from different powersets a'la Champion-Online's open framework's.....err, framework. Possible?, or game-breaker?
*ding-ding... Round 1.