*Whimper*

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Oh come on!!!

You seem to forget that PLing is ALSO a form of farming.

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Ehm farming is usually connected to gold/game currency/resource gathering. Tbh the farming boom happened after i9. Before people would just PL. Now there is organised farmign for influence specifically or for salvage ergo there are far more reasons atm to farm than pre i9.

For the record i like farming and have nothing against it since i enjoy it tbh plus i can powerlevel myself while doing it.

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If you want to make people stop farm just remove Inventions.This is the ONLY reason people started farming.

As for the spines/dark farming, show me a spines/dark solo farming for 6 people spawns without dying,without insps,without downtime and at the same speed and damage as a fire/kin on invi then i might consider spines/dark to be as close to a fire/kin.

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Have done it for 2-8 person spawns on my 50 Spines/Dark/Body, mainly on the Carnie Adamastor or Preatorian-CoT-Demon Bobcat maps. 2-person spawns on Tenacious on the Carnie maps is actually the best ratio of speed to salvage, since you still get 10 or so Carnies a mob and can repeat the mission endlessly. In the second week of i9 (I IO'ed the toon at the end of the first week) I was getting about over 20 million an hour in rare magic salvage alone on that Carnie map. It's damn boring to keep it up though... I stopped farming after fully IOing my 3rd level 50 out...

On Carnie maps I need to manage my endurance sometimes... I do this by detoggling Focussed Accuracy whenever Conserve Energy isn't up, my other 9 toggles stay on 24/7! Love IOs...

Without dying on a 6-person spawn? Not 100% all-the-time, but certainly not any more than the self-rez can handle, and that doesn't eat into the downtime. You've also got considerable +resists, Oppressive Gloom and the most powerful self-heal in the game... That Spines/Dark of mine regularly tanks 8-person invincible spawns of PsychicClockwork/Carnies/MotherMayhemsMinions for teams.

Having mainly Lethal damage is the main thing that slows me down... Fire damage is considerably less resisted.

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Ehm farming is usually connected to gold/game currency/resource gathering.

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Yes but thats not the point. By definition it means repeatedly doing and resetting something for profit, either an outside spawning point, or some other spawning mob/thing like RV turrets, or a mission which is repeatedly cleared and resetted. Whether the reward is XP, Inf, prestige, salvage, recipes or a badgecounter is irrelevant to whether the action itself is considered farming.

5 out 6 rewards I mentioned existed before inventions. I agree that inventions sped up farming, but it was done before inventions as well.

Hammie

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5 out 6 rewards I mentioned existed before inventions. I agree that inventions sped up farming, but it was done before inventions as well.

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This i 100% agree.I never said there was no farming pre I9 BUT after I9 there was a farming boom in CoX.

Mael

Well i didnt say you can't do it i am pretty sure you can but is very few people who can play that way and still its nowhere near a fire/kin and especially a fully IOed fire/kin.

I am not saying spines/dark is bad i am just saying that currently nothing comes really close to the way a fire/kin can farm which is kinda the point since the OP is suggesting for people to be original and well i am still waiting to hear what this originality when it comes to farming an be.Farming + originality doesnt really go together its one of the parts of the game that you wanna be efficient so you pick the best.

*waves hand* There is NO uber farmingbuilds in Co*...move along...nothing to see here!

A good team > fire/kin and 7 noobs

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A good team > fire/kin and 7 noobs

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Agreed to that as well .Noone said opposite. 8 fire/kin always better than 1

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...you wanna be efficient so you pick the best.

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Depends on what you farm really. Of course you would just pick what suits you the best. For instance I'd say spines/dark would outperform a fire/kin if you where farming Carnies.

Not realy that contradictory globey If you read my post i acknowledge that fact that Fire kin Pwns and also that i have myself one which i on occasion use for farming.

What i am saying in this post is that its about time someone came up with a new flavour cos every tom dick and harry now have fire kins and its gettin dull.

And as for being the ablsolute bext at farming, i wouldnt go that far, im pretty sure that with a bit of imagination someone could come up with something equally as good. Not me of course cos i lack imagination and all that.

Not to mention Fire/kin sucks against anything with stuns etc etc. Even with IO build yer still gonna get slapped about if you take on freaks.

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Mael

Well i didnt say you can't do it i am pretty sure you can but is very few people who can play that way and still its nowhere near a fire/kin and especially a fully IOed fire/kin.

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The first bit's probably true. I've not seen many Spines/DAs farming even since i9 hit... I only know of 3 across both english EU servers who are built for farming / "Full AoE damage" in fact. Probably something to do with the fact that Spines/DA is a real slog to get to 35... though after that it's quite easy to play.

However I disagree with the second point- if it's not at Fire/Kin/Fire's AoE damage level, it's damn close.
I've raced fire/kins on the Carnie map - I've beaten some and been beaten by some, but the result has never been very far apart (apart from once, when the fire/kin in question died and had no wakies... )

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I am not saying spines/dark is bad i am just saying that currently nothing comes really close to the way a fire/kin can farm which is kinda the point since the OP is suggesting for people to be original and well i am still waiting to hear what this originality when it comes to farming an be.Farming + originality doesnt really go together its one of the parts of the game that you wanna be efficient so you pick the best.

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Spines/DA has always been very good at AoE, but endurance has always been the major limiting factor, because the build guzzles it. With i9 endurance has become a non-issue, so Spines/DA has become much, much more effective. It's an "original" farming build in the sense that it didn't exist pre-i9 because of the endurance factor.

Quick example of the AoE damage I can output, not intended for bragging, but for comparison with a Fire/Kin:

(AoEs/Cones)
Death Shroud: 25.7 damage/tick, 8 ft PBAoE
Quills: 19.3 damage/tick, 8 ft PBAoE
Ripper: melee range 90' cone, 316.1 damage, recharges in 7.2 secs
Spine Burst: 15 ft PBAoE, 154.9 damage, recharges in 10.8 secs
Throw Spines: 30 ft 90' cone, 191.4 damage, recharges in 7.8 secs
Energy Torrent: 40 ft 45' cone, 123.3 damage, recharges in 12.5 secs

(Single target attacks)
Impale: 58 ft ST attack, 262.8 damage, recharges in 4.8 secs
Lunge: melee range ST attack, 169.2 damage, recharges in 2.8 secs

(+Damage buffs)
Build Up: +100% Damage buff, 10 sec duration, recharges in 46.2 secs
Focussed Accuracy is also available for hard-to-hit enemies, and Conserve Energy for End Drainers.

For an alpha strike I can effectively output around 710 damage to everything in a single mob using Build Up --> Energy Torrent, Throw Spines, Spine Burst. Then I can jump in and finish up with a Ripper (478 ish damage in a wide cone, since Build Up is still in effect). By that time Throw spines is recharged again, so I can continue with an AoE chain indefinately or pick off any runners/stragglers with Impale and/or lunge. That's not counting the damage from the twin auras (which would combine for about 68 damage/tick whilst Build up is active) or Criticals (every attack including both damage auras has a 10% chance to deal double damage).

The next mob would fall slightly more slowly since Build Up isn't available (multiply the above numbers by 0.667), but I still have a full AoE chain and usually just after the 3rd mob Build Up will be recharged again.

Now maybe that's not quite up to Fire/Kin standards, but it's what a Spines/DA is capable of outputting consistently, without insps or any external buffs.

For a farming duo, a Spines/DA plus a Fire/Kin will virtually always beat two Fire/Kins. Perma-Fulcrum on top of a Spines/DA's damage output is just plain silly, like a Fire/Fire Blaster (but without the faceplanting!) it completely blows Fire/Kins damage output away. I've tried this several times now, and the carnage is bl**dy hilarious!

I'm not saying it's necessarily as good as an IO'ed Fire/Kin, but it certainly qualifies as a good farming toon. It has higher AoE damage output than any other toon I've played, including a Bot/Dark Mastermind with a Patron AoE Immobilise (stacked Burn patches- on outdoor Nemesis missions my Bot/Dark/Mace can consistently wipe out a +3 Warhulk in a little under two seconds if there is a cluster of minions around it).

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Not to mention Fire/kin sucks against anything with stuns etc etc. Even with IO build yer still gonna get slapped about if you take on freaks.

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False. Every heard of perma- Indom will? Means no stuns/sleeps? I could easily farm freaks with no difficulty at all.

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Not realy that contradictory globey If you read my post i acknowledge that fact that Fire kin Pwns and also that i have myself one which i on occasion use for farming.

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Believe it or not.. you have contradicted yourself If it annoys you that much, delete your fire/kin and roll ice/ff, farm with that.

I really have no problem with what people choose to level and what they choose to do with their time in game as long as they don't bother me, I don't bother them

sigh....

Never said it annyoed me, nor did i say anyone was wrong for making a fire kin.....

what i said wasa someone please come up with a new idea for a farm toon as fire kins are getting boring...

im not attacking anyone for having fire kins, so theres no real need to jump on the defensive.

I never said i disagreed with farming, powerlevelling or anything else.

Maybe I should have written my OP like this instead so as to avoid upsetting people who obviously took offense...

Hey Arent fire kins Awesome I love mine sooo much i dont play anything else now. But wouldnt it be great if someoone thought of a new build to farm with so i could choose between two farmers when i PL everyone..

Hope thats better

You don't have to farm with a fire/kin. I don't have a fire/kin and do just fine for inf, I've fully kitted out 3 50s with IOs in 4 weeks. You can farm with whatever you want. No one is forcing you to play your fire/kin.

Mael, just to add: I have a damage proc (chance of psionic) in cloak of fear for even more AoE damage

I would imagine you could also add a damage proc in quills (the slow set, chance of smashing damage) to make things even more unpleasant.

Throw spines could also accept one, or two damage procs (slow and ranged AOE?)


As regards to the whole Fire/Kin vs Spines / Dark debate - IMO both do extremely well and its a bit moot arguing about it. Spines / Dark does require significantly more investment in terms of IO to make it functional.

As with the rest of CoX it all depends who you team with and what you face. Im almost certain a Spines / Dark with a Fire / Kin would do more dps than two Fire / Kins, for instance.

Lol, according to nofuture the scrapper primary is called "quills"

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sigh....

Never said it annyoed me, nor did i say anyone was wrong for making a fire kin.....

what i said wasa someone please come up with a new idea for a farm toon as fire kins are getting boring...

im not attacking anyone for having fire kins, so theres no real need to jump on the defensive.

I never said i disagreed with farming, powerlevelling or anything else.

Maybe I should have written my OP like this instead so as to avoid upsetting people who obviously took offense...

Hey Arent fire kins Awesome I love mine sooo much i dont play anything else now. But wouldnt it be great if someoone thought of a new build to farm with so i could choose between two farmers when i PL everyone..

Hope thats better

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So how does what other people play affect how you play at all? I'm confused here.

As Death Badger says you can farm happily with a lot of builds. It mightn't be quite as quick but it works.

I use Carni for earning Inf myself, just by focusing on Magical Groups. Don't want to get into a willy waving contest about who's more Uber but she does fine and earns at a nice rate. Since its mostly solo she gets a lot of Recipe Drops too which tend to go for 90k a pop in the stores. Plus all that nice Magical Salvage.

Farming is just a term used when a player kills mobs quickly am i correct?
Therefore any decent player with any decent solo built AoE toon could therefore be classed as a "farmer".
Plus a team of fire/kins imo wouldnt match up to a team of fire/fire blasters or a team of Warshades (yus i know thundorn said solo )
And as has already been mentioned to make one toon awesome at one aspect of the game leaves them a bit low on the other aspects of the game (pvp for example or some 1 on 1 AV fights) I have faced most toon combos in pvp fights and i would much rather fight a fire/kin than say an ill/rad, mind/TA because i know i have a much higher chance of winning. (btw i know this doesnt reflect on player skill, im just basing it on my own experiences )
Ummm so to finish this pointless reply off i wanna say i dont mind the farmers as it makes my more "unique" toons have that extra wow factor in teams
Peace out me heroes

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Farming is just a term used when a player kills mobs quickly am i correct?
Therefore any decent player with any decent solo built AoE toon could therefore be classed as a "farmer".
Plus a team of fire/kins imo wouldnt match up to a team of fire/fire blasters or a team of Warshades (yus i know thundorn said solo )
And as has already been mentioned to make one toon awesome at one aspect of the game leaves them a bit low on the other aspects of the game (pvp for example or some 1 on 1 AV fights) I have faced most toon combos in pvp fights and i would much rather fight a fire/kin than say an ill/rad, mind/TA because i know i have a much higher chance of winning. (btw i know this doesnt reflect on player skill, im just basing it on my own experiences )
Ummm so to finish this pointless reply off i wanna say i dont mind the farmers as it makes my more "unique" toons have that extra wow factor in teams
Peace out me heroes

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Can you use more smileys in your next posts pls?
We love smiling

as always Damz you are the light that brightens my day

You are of course completely right. I wouldnt take a fire kin into pvp, Mainly becasue i am pants at PvP.

I think my main problem is i build bright glowie toons and always attack the toughest oponent first. Mind you it dont help when i turn off Player names so i cant see whos what. If i had a penny for every time id run after a Mastermind in Warburg only to be nailed by what later turned out to be two brutes cunningly concealed in amongst the pets, (i say cunningly concealed, what i actually mean is just kind of standing there and me not paying attention), i would have... well about 5p actaully.

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Farming is just a term used when a player kills mobs quickly am i correct?

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No.

Farming = Repeatedly doing the same thing for a certain gain.

Most of this thread has been dedicated to mob farming ie fastest way of killing mobs solo. You could also farm RV turrets for badges, DE eminators for badge, Carnies for magic salvage etc. All classed as farming.

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Can you use more smileys in your next posts pls?
We love smiling

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Smileys are not an option, they are a way of life (besides i only used 6!! thats pretty good considering i usually use 2 per line )
And Thundorn . . . . i'll always stick up for ya since i still member ya from the old supergroup Until you spell my name wrong . . . . then im gonna go virus rikiti monkey on ya [censored]!!!
Peace out heroes!

*sigh* i suffer from major alt-itits and play slow....
made my fire/kin more than 2 issues ago now; and suddenyl now they are a FoTM, and I am labelled a sheep.

nvm - still fidn em loads of fun! in fact love trollers and doms all kinds of ways!

Same here, I keep deleting and making new alts trying to find what I like best. Problem is, every other day I feel like doing something else. Today the flavor is cheese, tomorrow it could be ham.

As for my controller ... I'm having fun with my ill/kin, but I don't farm (obviously).