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Granted, it would be difficult for a Controller (particularly one who likes to rely on powers like Arctic Air) to skip Stamina without sizeable +recharge bonuses to power Heat Loss.
I tend to assume, though, that when we're talking about Numina and Miracle, that we're also including a budget for +recharge bonuses. Controllers have a pretty good situation when it comes to slotting for global recharge, too; a lot of controllery sets are (much) cheaper than their melee/ranged/AoE attack analogues.
In any case, giving some though to rerolling my Ice/Storm as Ice/Cold. Storm's not doing it for me lately. Then again, I have a Cold/Sonic Defender I really like already, so maybe we'll give it a miss. I'm glad Controllers have the option to take Cold now, regardless. 
Edit: Still wish Jack wasn't such a pansy, though. I haven't played extensively on my Ice Controller lately; Jack's attack cycle is still a little borked, isn't it?
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yeah, I can't get up the motivation to roll a controller over a dominator or corruptor these days since I enjoy the raw attacks over control + containment. Domination and Scourge feel more like a natural bonus and not something that is absolutely essential like containment is where it loses appeal with me.
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Unless you are specifically seeking AV's or pvp then benumb is probably the most skippable power - especially for a troller.
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Benumb is IMO one of the main reasons to play /cold.
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especially so since it reduces mez resistance and mag protection abilities.
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What specifically would it lower the protection on that any controller would have issues controlling?
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plenty of custom foes in AE and Fortunata Mistress/Night Widow npcs.
hmm,
Always been sort of "meh" about cold, but I imagine the extra HP and Defense would be pretty useful with those freakishly squishy Imps.
Besides, since Jack has squat for defense, Ice/Cold would be really nice for making him a much better pet.
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Unless you are specifically seeking AV's or pvp then benumb is probably the most skippable power - especially for a troller.
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Benumb is IMO one of the main reasons to play /cold.
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especially so since it reduces mez resistance and mag protection abilities.
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What specifically would it lower the protection on that any controller would have issues controlling?
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plenty of custom foes in AE and Fortunata Mistress/Night Widow npcs.
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hmm I can count on one hand the number of NW's and Forts I faced on the journey to 50 with my last troller.
I'll give you AE, but the way most people seem to build their customs it isn't just the "occassional" one it is all/most/hordes of w/e enemy type they have built. I sincerly hope benumb isn't being relied upon in any meaningful way, that will be some slow progress.
I guess if you go looking for the situation you can find it.
Just so we're all clear, benumb has no affect on the innate protection bosses have, so no 1 shot holding them unless you roll an overpower.
So that leaves the incredibly rare npc's that use a mez protection in addition to normal boss protection. Or specifically looking for them in AE.
I'll stick with my original statement.
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Unless you are specifically seeking AV's or pvp then benumb is probably the most skippable power - especially for a troller.
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Benumb is IMO one of the main reasons to play /cold.
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especially so since it reduces mez resistance and mag protection abilities.
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What specifically would it lower the protection on that any controller would have issues controlling?
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plenty of custom foes in AE and Fortunata Mistress/Night Widow npcs.
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hmm I can count on one hand the number of NW's and Forts I faced on the journey to 50 with my last troller.
I'll give you AE, but the way most people seem to build their customs it isn't just the "occassional" one it is all/most/hordes of w/e enemy type they have built. I sincerly hope benumb isn't being relied upon in any meaningful way, that will be some slow progress.
I guess if you go looking for the situation you can find it.
Just so we're all clear, benumb has no affect on the innate protection bosses have, so no 1 shot holding them unless you roll an overpower.
So that leaves the incredibly rare npc's that use a mez protection in addition to normal boss protection. Or specifically looking for them in AE.
I'll stick with my original statement.
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I think you don't understand the value of -dmg and -special when used on bosses that can't be controlled easily. This is especially true has you go higher towards +4 con and the duration of your controls start to lack and even a purple patch water downed benumb is going to be incredibly important.
I'm interested in trying it with gravity. I know the singularity can't be healed, but would it get the additional HPs from frostwork? And how cool would it look with the shields... like a floating snowball?
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Unless you are specifically seeking AV's or pvp then benumb is probably the most skippable power - especially for a troller.
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Benumb is IMO one of the main reasons to play /cold.
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especially so since it reduces mez resistance and mag protection abilities.
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What specifically would it lower the protection on that any controller would have issues controlling?
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plenty of custom foes in AE and Fortunata Mistress/Night Widow npcs.
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hmm I can count on one hand the number of NW's and Forts I faced on the journey to 50 with my last troller.
I'll give you AE, but the way most people seem to build their customs it isn't just the "occassional" one it is all/most/hordes of w/e enemy type they have built. I sincerly hope benumb isn't being relied upon in any meaningful way, that will be some slow progress.
I guess if you go looking for the situation you can find it.
Just so we're all clear, benumb has no affect on the innate protection bosses have, so no 1 shot holding them unless you roll an overpower.
So that leaves the incredibly rare npc's that use a mez protection in addition to normal boss protection. Or specifically looking for them in AE.
I'll stick with my original statement.
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I think you don't understand the value of -dmg and -special when used on bosses that can't be controlled easily. This is especially true has you go higher towards +4 con and the duration of your controls start to lack and even a purple patch water downed benumb is going to be incredibly important.
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I understand it. What are the values vs a +4 boss? Is this an entire mission filled with +4 bosses like is common in MA? or is this just a few throughout the map?
When you say -special vs bosses I'm assuming you are talking about his outgoing mez (because so few of them use any other things that fall under that debuff). I'd sincerely hope someone doesn't rely on the reduced mez duration to keep them alive vs a +4 boss.
Like I said though:
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I guess if you go looking for it you can find any situation
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I'm a bit surprised you so strongly favor benumb despite it generally being extremely situational (especially on a troller) and you'll go out of your way to find those situations, but at the same time say FW is trash.
To each their own.
Anyway, definitely looking forward to trying fire/cold. Shielded, FW imps are pretty much like scrappers at that point. It will be nice not having my imps vaporize right after pulling them out vs 8 man spawns like they tend to do on my fire/storm.
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I'm interested in trying it with gravity. I know the singularity can't be healed, but would it get the additional HPs from frostwork? And how cool would it look with the shields... like a floating snowball?
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I know the FF gen from traps looks hilarious with the ice shields on it. I wonder if singularity might look similarly comical.
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When you say -special vs bosses I'm assuming you are talking about his outgoing mez (because so few of them use any other things that fall under that debuff). I'd sincerely hope someone doesn't rely on the reduced mez duration to keep them alive vs a +4 boss.
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Benumb debuffs
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Stun/Sleep/Hold/Immobilize/Confuse/Fear Duration
Mez Protection Magnitude
Mez Resist (Acro/AM/Vengeance)
Defense Buffs/Debuffs
ToHit Buffs/Debuffs
Heals (Direct heals only, not +regen or -regen)
Endurance Drain and "Heals" (Direct +end from powers like Transference, not +recovery)
Run/Fly Speed
Run/Fly Speed Resist
Movement Slow Powers (Not -recharge)
Knockback Mag
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So you're claiming you can't find many bosses with ToHit and Def buff/debuffs and knockback abilities? Also it takes 6.17 seconds with 3 recharge SOs to get 2 ST holds off, that's plenty of time for a boss to hit a controller hard for -50% damage debuff from benumb to be worth it.
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When you say -special vs bosses I'm assuming you are talking about his outgoing mez (because so few of them use any other things that fall under that debuff). I'd sincerely hope someone doesn't rely on the reduced mez duration to keep them alive vs a +4 boss.
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Benumb debuffs
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Stun/Sleep/Hold/Immobilize/Confuse/Fear Duration
Mez Protection Magnitude
Mez Resist (Acro/AM/Vengeance)
Defense Buffs/Debuffs
ToHit Buffs/Debuffs
Heals (Direct heals only, not +regen or -regen)
Endurance Drain and "Heals" (Direct +end from powers like Transference, not +recovery)
Run/Fly Speed
Run/Fly Speed Resist
Movement Slow Powers (Not -recharge)
Knockback Mag
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So you're claiming you can't find many bosses with ToHit and Def buff/debuffs and knockback abilities? Also it takes 6.17 seconds with 3 recharge SOs to get 2 ST holds off, that's plenty of time for a boss to hit a controller hard for -50% damage debuff from benumb to be worth it.
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I'm aware of what benumb debuffs and I'm saying I either find mobs requiring benumb en masse in the MA or barely at all in MA/Vanilla.
I've yet to see it reduce a mobs outgoing kb powers to 0, so like I said if I specifically go looking for the situation (maybe buidl a mission with FF mobs) I'd find a scenario where it reduced kb mag enough for 1kb IO to cover me. Otherwise a single IO seems to cover well over 95% of kb you encounter, adding benumb takes that to....? 96?
The problem with benumb for many trollers isn't that the numbers of what it does aren't awesome, because lets face it benumb is amazing. The problem is that it cycles so dang slowly that the overall impact it has is tiny in most scenarios (many AV's and EB's).
Benumb becomes amazing with high recharge - to the point where you can whip it out like every 40 seconds. You know what else becomes amazing with high recharge? All controllers.
IMO it is easily skippable on pve trollers unless they are frequently encountering AV's. When they'd need it to be effective it isn't due to horrible uptime. When their build is mature enough (IO'd) to be throwing it around they no longer need it.
I find it very useful on corrs/defs, I just don't see it having nearly the value on most trollers.
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I'm interested in trying it with gravity. I know the singularity can't be healed, but would it get the additional HPs from frostwork?
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It should; it accepts most buffs just fine. It's just direct healing and + recharge that it's immune to.
Arc #40529 : The Furies of the Earth
Good point on the Fortunatas/Arachnos, Turbo. Many of those guys have unreal mez resistances and defense and don't have to be bosses to be a pain.
Now... to plan a build on what I have to skip... too much good stuff!
Thank you, City of Heroes, for giving me a superhero social network combined with amazingly smooth game play. Petitions signed with realistic expectations.
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ice/cold..
is it possible to slow someone's recharge so much, that they go back in time?
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Yes.
Which means you should do it.
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Ill/Cold, Ice/Cold, Fire Cold in that order.....Maybe even Plant/cold or grav/cold...i dunno.
ice/ice baby dum de de dum dum...sorry this thread is making me have flashbacks and crave ice cream
"...well I have wrestled with reality for thirty-five years, Doctor and I am happy to state I finally won out over it." Elwood P Dowd (from the movie Harvey)
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hmm,
Always been sort of "meh" about cold, but I imagine the extra HP and Defense would be pretty useful with those freakishly squishy Imps.
Besides, since Jack has squat for defense, Ice/Cold would be really nice for making him a much better pet.
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YES !!!!!!!!
The hard things I can do--- The impossible just take a little bit longer.
If numbers are so much more important than a teammate who is fun to play with, forget about the game altogether and go play with a calculator instead. -Claws and Effect-
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Unless you are specifically seeking AV's or pvp then benumb is probably the most skippable power - especially for a troller.
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Benumb is IMO one of the main reasons to play /cold.
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especially so since it reduces mez resistance and mag protection abilities.
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What specifically would it lower the protection on that any controller would have issues controlling?