Grats! I think that is a new market forum record!
What's that red accolade?
A game is not supposed to be some kind of... place where people enjoy themselves!
Geas of the Kind Ones, looks like. A Badge-Hunter patch changed it from the Green 'clock' a while back, iirc.
Questions about the game, either side? /t @Neuronia or @Neuronium, with your queries!
168760: A Death in the Gish. 3 missions, 1-14. Easy to solo.
Infinity Villains
Champion, Pinnacle, Virtue Heroes
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Seems to me that if you make your set of IO's purple-level power, you should make them purple-level unavailability. If they're better than purples, they should be less available. And the devs are working on doing that.
The PVP IO's are purple-level power, yes? I haven't looked that closely because they're out of my comfort zone on price, and I don't farm diddly. . . but I have the impression that purples are more of a "once a day" thing than an "Every 5 minutes" thing.
(People do get 400 rep for badges, so there's a system in place that could be used to farm PVP io's, if it's tied to that. )
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Did you ever consider that the the implementation of purples and the random drop system used for rewards in this game is horrible? That it is an over used and miss applied time sink that actually punishes casual gamers instead of assisting them.
That they continue and encourage farming as a time sink while at the same time calling those same players cheaters.
That very little in this game actually rewards indivudual or team accomplishment with any meaningful reward. That you must repeat the content ad nauseum on the same toon to reach its full potential, at which point you have nothing to do but roll a new time sink alt.
Their own development philosophy has become currupted by lack of vision. Well except NCSofts vision of milking $$ through microtransactions.
They need to find someone how to make it fun again.
It time for new leadership on the dev team
"If a system can be exploited, it will be exploited. And if a developer thinks their system cannot be exploited, it'll be exploited like a new actress in her first porn movie." Sanya Weather MMORPG Examiner
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Did you ever consider that the the implementation of purples and the random drop system used for rewards in this game is horrible? That it is an over used and miss applied time sink that actually punishes casual gamers instead of assisting them.
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The system isn't intended to engage "casual gamers" period.
And even so, it's more available to 'casual' players than the top tier gear of most other popular MMOs.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
I disagree. Every body I know who I would classify as casual players covets a set of purples but doesn't think they have any hope of ever getting them. They believe they have no chance of ever putting together a full set without selling their first born.
They also don't think thats very fun. They see me on one of my toons nearly solo the TF they keep dying in and it just turns them off. Why not enable everyone to have access to that same kind of gear through a friendly reward system. Just make everything purchasable by merits and increase the merit rewards for all the Not MA content in the game.
"If a system can be exploited, it will be exploited. And if a developer thinks their system cannot be exploited, it'll be exploited like a new actress in her first porn movie." Sanya Weather MMORPG Examiner
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Their own development philosophy has become currupted by lack of vision. Well except NCSofts vision of milking $$ through microtransactions.
They need to find someone how to make it fun again.
It time for new leadership on the dev team
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So because you don't enjoy it, it's corrupt and needs new leadership.
Mkay.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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I disagree.
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Oh well!
I'm still right.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
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I disagree. Every body I know who I would classify as casual players covets a set of purples but doesn't think they have any hope of ever getting them. They believe they have no chance of ever putting together a full set without selling their first born.
They also don't think thats very fun. They see me on one of my toons nearly solo the TF they keep dying in and it just turns them off.
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Then they are not casual. I'm sorry, the moment you start craving the top end power in the game, you stop being casual and start being a power gamer. Any claim to the contrary is disingenuous at best.
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Why not enable everyone to have access to that same kind of gear through a friendly reward system. Just make everything purchasable by merits and increase the merit rewards for all the Not MA content in the game.
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Because then it would not be rare and hard to obtain. And it's powerful based on the notion that it's rare and hard to obtain. What you're asking for is flat out, direct inflation of the power of everyone, regardless of effort involved. That's not a great idea for the game's longevity and it's not a great idea from the notion of powerful rare gear as a time sink.
You may not like the idea of time sinks, but they're rather well proven. It's why they are so common. Should they all be horrible, impossible grinds? No. But I think you'll find that not that many people here will agree that purples are such.
Edit: As an aside, what are you that purples allow you to practically solo TFs? They don't give much in the way of survival benefits unless your mitigation benefits strongly from a lot of global recharge.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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Then they are not casual. I'm sorry, the moment you start craving the top end power in the game, you stop being casual and start being a power gamer. Any claim to the contrary is disingenuous at best.
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That really doesn't follow. Anyone who drives and covets a Ferari, is not a racer. Anyone who covets, a larger boat is not likely to run an America's cup challenge.
Seeing as automotive analogies are so loved on the boards, in my neck of the woods the interstate was divided into regular lanes and limited access toll lanes. If the roads were like this game those lanes would be speed unlimited and let you run formula 1 racers in them.
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That very little in this game actually rewards indivudual or team accomplishment with any meaningful reward.
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Brett Favre hasn't formally committed anywhere. Perhaps the devs could hire him to visit TF finishers' houses? Beyond that, it's a video game. What kind of meaning did you have in mind?
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That you must repeat the content ad nauseum on the same toon to reach its full potential,
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Huh? I'll give you an example, my scrapper who turned 50 yesterday. He was part of a non-level pact duo with a buddy. Couldn't play the scrapper when buddy wasn't on, so I took to playing the market with him. Got him Field Crafter at level 19. Was pretty much drowning in cash compared to my other characters. Laid in lots of patient bids for all the good lvl 33 sets (excluding the big 3; seemed overkill on a /regen scrapper). Did mostly mission contacts when the duo was online. Somewhere mid 30s he was pretty much at his full potential.
At level 45 buddy decided to race me to 50. I went after Portal Jockey (even though I hate the contacts involved), did some PvP missions, and cruised several tank-centric AE missions (always had to rotate those since they got pulled a lot).
Not a lot of content repetition (other than selecting favorite contacts in Fault, Striga, Croatoa, etc. since I like them). Full potential reached way prior via the market. Still has almost 400 mil on him. Could outfit with purples via more patience, but seriously--it seems like overkill on a /regen scrapper.
President of the Arbiter Sands fan club. We will never forget.
An Etruscan Snood will nevermore be free
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Then they are not casual. I'm sorry, the moment you start craving the top end power in the game, you stop being casual and start being a power gamer. Any claim to the contrary is disingenuous at best.
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That really doesn't follow. Anyone who drives and covets a Ferari, is not a racer.
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That's a severe failure to invert the analogy in a way that fits the example.
What we've got is someone in a Ford Escort who now is so covetous of the Ferrari that they are disgusted with the Escort and no longer want to drive anywhere. They are no longer "casual" in their relationship with the car. It is no longer a means to an end, but an end unto itself.
Someone who's "casual" about their car doesn't really care if it can't go 0-60 in 4.6 seconds, or has a leather interior. They use it to get places and see things. The person coveting a Ferrari wants either the Ferrari itself or the prestige it represents. That's not a casual view of owning a car.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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but seriously--it seems like overkill on a /regen scrapper.
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One of the Cardinal Rules of Scrapping: There's no kill like overkill.
@Demobot
Also on Steam
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Then they are not casual. I'm sorry, the moment you start craving the top end power in the game, you stop being casual and start being a power gamer. Any claim to the contrary is disingenuous at best.
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That really doesn't follow. Anyone who drives and covets a Ferari, is not a racer.
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That's a severe failure to invert the analogy. What we've got is someone in a Ford Escort who now is so covetous of the Ferari that they are disgusted with the Escort and no longer want to drive anywhere. They are no longer "casual" in their relationship with the car. It is no longer a means to an end, but an end unto itself.
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I don't know about that. When I was growing up I really loved to drive, it used to be a relaxing and pleasant experience. I could hop into a car and clear my head with a nice drive. Later on I was working in metropolitan areas where it just didn't make economic sense to own a car, and was even less sensible to try and drive one for pleasure. When I moved down to florida, I had thought to buy a cheap car just to get back into the swing of driving regularly. I rapidly found I hated driving a crappy car. I wound up buying (Low-high end)(High-mid end) vehicle. Does this make me a luxury car enthusiast ? Its not like I am oggling the DuPont Registry. I'd say no it just means I am a casual driver that really hates to inflict a painful ride on myself.
The same pretty much holds true for this game. Its not hard to figure out your character isn't up to snuff. Wanting your character to be respectable doesn't make you a power gamer anymore than wanting a neat lawn and well trimmed yard makes you a gardening nut.
I'll accept that analogy. Here's the problem - it's not what's being described. Just as you've pointed out that there are gradients in available cars somewhere between worn out crap and gold-plated luxury, so too are there in builds in this game. As I alluded to with respect to slotting Purple sets and ability to "solo" a TF while your team dies around you; there are an awful lot of very non-Purple things you can do with an arbitrary character to make them much better at surviving. Even just making a character more endurance efficient can have dramatic impact on play, and you sure don't need purples for that.
So while I agree with your latest refinement of the analogy, it's nothing like what was being claimed and which I responded to. The suggestion was essentially that Purples are the holy grail of enabling characters, and the difficulty of obtaining them makes people just give up on the whole thing. So either there's misplaced interest in purples (perhaps through ignorance of mechanics, which I could certainly forgive) or they really do want Purple-class builds, at which point I still contend they aren't casual at all.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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So while I agree with your latest refinement of the analogy, it's nothing like what was being claimed and which I responded to. The suggestion was essentially that Purples are the holy grail of enabling characters, and the difficulty of obtaining them makes people just give up on the whole thing. So either there's misplaced interest in purples (perhaps through ignorance of mechanics, which I could certainly forgive) or they really do want Purple-class builds, at which point I still contend they aren't casual at all.
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I can certainly find no fault with that. Purples while very nice for particular purposes tend to be overkill or even counterproductive in many builds. So stating that you need purples wouldn't be the mark of the casual or even the power gamer but the mark of a status seeking gamer who views purples as the big bling.
I was using the TF an analogy for toon envy. People do ask all the time whats your build or comment on the performance of a particular player. How often have we all heard somehting like, " I was on an ITF last night with thie crazy XYZ, I wanna make one now but there is no way I could ever afford that build."
This is a super hero game. Why shouldn't it be expected that you should be able to maximize your potential in a reasonable amount of time. What I believe is that for a game who's end content is based on the concept of making a new hero that the time it takes to reach that level of performance should be easier for normal players. Not casual, I don't think they really exist, Just plain old normal guy who wants to have as much fun as he can in the time he has.
"If a system can be exploited, it will be exploited. And if a developer thinks their system cannot be exploited, it'll be exploited like a new actress in her first porn movie." Sanya Weather MMORPG Examiner
and bling is only bling if you don't know what your doing with it.
"If a system can be exploited, it will be exploited. And if a developer thinks their system cannot be exploited, it'll be exploited like a new actress in her first porn movie." Sanya Weather MMORPG Examiner
What exactly does it mean to maximize your potential? Run invince missions solo without dying, run on invince teams w/o dying, soloing AVs and GMs?
Also what is a 'rasonable amount of time'? How long should it take casual Joe to 'maximize his potential?"
The problem I have with these 'casual gamer' situations is that it is so incredibly subjective and lacks any real definition. Everybody has an opinion as to what it means to be a casual gamer, and I think it's just a misnomer anyway.
I've made this assertion before, but this game isn't there just for your entertainment, but to make money. If rewards are too easy to come by and content not challenging enough, who is going to continue to play the game? The game has to appeal to as broad a base as possible. Believe it or not, some people find appeal in the challenge of playing PvP for POs. Others find the challenge of accruing the inf to buy the enhancements for their Uber build to be their draw to the game.
Just because casual Joe can't afford the high-end builds doesn't mean the system is broken. There aer any number of ways to get access to a high-end build anyway. Whichever road you take requires time and effort whether you grind farms, TFs, or spend some time on the markets utilizing a good strategy there.
Don't let the mentality that you can't afford it rule your mind. Such negativity never got anybody an AV soloing or primo farming build. You can do whatever you want in this MMO, but you first have to believe you can.
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How often have we all heard somehting like, " I was on an ITF last night with thie crazy XYZ, I wanna make one now but there is no way I could ever afford that build."
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So because someone said that, it's true?
Let me answer for you. It's not.
Yes, Purples are extremely high priced right now. More than anything, what that means is that they are not that great an investment for people with more immediate desire for improvement. For what you'd pay for one purple you could buy 5-20 other IOs that could do good things for your build. So buy the other things and not 20 purples. Hell, for the price of 20 purples for one character, you could probably outfit 3-6 characters in non-purple kit.
But even if you want purples, it's not impossible. You just have to want to do the things that can earn you that money in the time you want it in. If you can't abide those things that are "fast enough" or don't have the patience to do other things, then you can't get them. Given what else you can get for the price, I'm not sure that should be so disheartening.
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This is a super hero game.
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This is a subscription game, where the makers need us to stick around and pay them money. If we all get the best goodies, get bored, and leave, the money stops, the game ends, and none of us get to play.
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Why shouldn't it be expected that you should be able to maximize your potential in a reasonable amount of time.
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Who's the arbiter of "maximized" and "reasonable amount of time"?
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What I believe is that for a game who's end content is based on the concept of making a new hero that the time it takes to reach that level of performance should be easier for normal players. Not casual, I don't think they really exist, Just plain old normal guy who wants to have as much fun as he can in the time he has.
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That's based on a bad assumption - that the ultra uber super rare goods are meant for the people who are going to level up a new character every time that hit level 50. I can tell you, they're not. They were explicitly described as a means to continue to progress your character who might already be level 50. By definition, that's incompatible with the "normal guy" who's going to make a new character at 50. Its aimed, at least in part, at people who want to keep playing at 50 on the same characters for extended times, chasing the stacked bonus progression.
I mean, for heaven's sake, you can't even slot purples till you're 50. Shouldn't that tell you something?
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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This is a super hero game. Why shouldn't it be expected that you should be able to maximize your potential in a reasonable amount of time.
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Certainly the devs could've used that approach as their design philosophy. But they didn't. I happen to believe that purples are a little too scarce currently, but given the changes they're making in i16 we're going to see a new equilibrium emerge. Not the "anyone will be able to get them" scenario you want, but more available than they are now.
Freedom: Blazing Larb, Fiery Fulcrum, Sardan Reborn, Arctic-Frenzy, Wasabi Sam, Mr Smashtastic.
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This is a super hero game. Why shouldn't it be expected that you should be able to maximize your potential in a reasonable amount of time.
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Because that isn't how MMOs work.
They work by presenting a series of carrots on progressively longer sticks. Purples are the furthest carrot out- they aren't intended to be gained in what you seem to consider a 'reasonable' amount of time.
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What I believe is that for a game who's end content is based on the concept of making a new hero that the time it takes to reach that level of performance should be easier for normal players.
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Your beliefs and opinions are sadly at odds with the reality of the genre.
Who knows though, perhaps you're an unsung game design visionary and the world will kneel before the majesty of your next generation MMO!
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
On the plus side, we have a perfect example when someone asks what "entitlement" means.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
I am not talking about the genre, or other MMOs. I am talking about this game and its the pitiful amount of attention the end game has. You have a choice of ITF, LGTF, STF, LRTF and the KTF plus 2 zone raids. All your other options are going back to do contect you could have done before you capped and maxed out your toon.
So your options are to go back and repeat what you've done, farm for an alts build, or play something else to 50 through all the same content again.
There is a reason this game never really grows. It takes what is a great idea, and some great systems and then expects its players to go play dress up dolls.
I for one am sick of it.
I used to like the people in this community but everyone, in game and on the forums, has really turned into a bunch of jerks. Myself included. Its a shame how far and how fast this game is falling.
"If a system can be exploited, it will be exploited. And if a developer thinks their system cannot be exploited, it'll be exploited like a new actress in her first porn movie." Sanya Weather MMORPG Examiner
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A Day at the Market
That is all!
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Hmm. I think I have about 4 or 5 of these. This may be the right time to unload them...
- Convenient - //\ - Exile - //\ - AatC -