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I think you may have to high of hopes for Going Rogue. I really doubt it will allow you to make a full transition to the other side but will instead place you in an alternate version with limiations ... but what do I know? I haven't seen anything to say one way or the other, I'm just keep my expectations low.
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I agree... I don't think anyone should get their hopes up too much at this point until more details are released.
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If it isn't really switching sides, I am three copies they won't sell.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
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Actually the separate markets make a lot of sense.
On the Black Market I could buy some stuff that would be out of my price range on the CH, just because there are more people and so they can better control the prices.
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it's hard to know where to begin dissecting the dead whale of wrong that is this post.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
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Actually the separate markets make a lot of sense.
On the Black Market I could buy some stuff that would be out of my price range on the CH, just because there are more people and so they can better control the prices.
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it's hard to know where to begin dissecting the dead whale of wrong that is this post.
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start with the first word
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I think you may have to high of hopes for Going Rogue. I really doubt it will allow you to make a full transition to the other side but will instead place you in an alternate version with limiations ... but what do I know? I haven't seen anything to say one way or the other, I'm just keep my expectations low.
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I agree... I don't think anyone should get their hopes up too much at this point until more details are released.
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If it isn't really switching sides, I am three copies they won't sell.
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Repeat Offenders
they are absolutely going to let us switch sides 'for real'.
anything else would be a PR & sales disaster and they have to know that.
This is another step down the road of acknowledging that it's all one game and factional alliance is just window dressing.
The mechanism is up in the air- I'm going to guess that 'switchers' have to roam Praetoria filling up their good/evil karma bars before they can make the move. It'll probably be level restricted. The higher level you are, the more arduous the process.
All guesses of course, but I'm certain we'll get 'real' side switching.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
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they are absolutely going to let us switch sides 'for real'.
anything else would be a PR & sales disaster and they have to know that.
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Agreed. I don't see why people don't get this fact.
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
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This I know people that won't play villains because of the perceived difficulty in ioing out redside, toss in the smaller population and lack of large merit earning opportunities there will be more villains getting religion than if it were the rapture
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It's not "perceived". I play both red and blue side. On average, IO's are definitely cheaper blue side.
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It's not just price, it's also availability. It's not uncommon for an item to be unavailable at any price redside.
Freedom: Blazing Larb, Fiery Fulcrum, Sardan Reborn, Arctic-Frenzy, Wasabi Sam, Mr Smashtastic.
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If they allow you to keep your stuff when switching sides but they dont merge markets I definately will be moving tons of villains blueside especially my stalkers. I will end up farming the hell out of positron TF just so I can have recipes and enhancements to take back to the other side when I switch again.
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I'm not ever going to team with or invite to team any stalkers, ever.
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Actually the separate markets make a lot of sense.
On the Black Market I could buy some stuff that would be out of my price range on the CH, just because there are more people and so they can better control the prices.
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it's hard to know where to begin dissecting the dead whale of wrong that is this post.
[/ QUOTE ]Glad to hear the Goat is of the same opinion as me. I thought this comment was sooo wrong that I missed something.
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I'm not ever going to team with or invite to team any stalkers, ever.
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This is akin to withholding a plastic knife from Rambo. Somehow, someway, he (and stalkers) might possibly survive. 
President of the Arbiter Sands fan club. We will never forget.
An Etruscan Snood will nevermore be free
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they are absolutely going to let us switch sides 'for real'.
anything else would be a PR & sales disaster and they have to know that.
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Agreed. I don't see why people don't get this fact.
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Track record ?
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they are absolutely going to let us switch sides 'for real'.
anything else would be a PR & sales disaster and they have to know that.
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Agreed. I don't see why people don't get this fact.
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Yeah, I think this is pretty much spot-on. If it's just a stupid instanced sandbox where my defender can play villain for a few missions and not a full-on side switch, I will be pretty pissed off. Same if it's a whole new zone or zones where I get to play villain, but still can't go to the rogue isles proper.
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Track record ?
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Sad but true
Re: market merging
Should have been done from the start. Want an RP reason? Stuff on the BM is stolen from WW! There you go. Want a gameplay reason? It's a vicious cycle: perception of worse markets make people play redside less, and less people playing redside means worse redside markets. I remember when I learned that the markets were cross-server but not cross-faction. It blew my mind. Of course, now if markets ever stopped being cross server, I would expect some anemic markets on low-pop servers.
They've never announced anything about whether you'll "really" be able to switch or not. Everyone is assuming so and talking about it like it's so, but silence on the devs' part is NOT consent. I know you think it'll be a bad "PR" move on their part but the fact is they're not gonna draw in LESS players if it's not the way existing players want it. They're also not gonna LOSE existing players if it's not the way they want it. You guys [censored] and moan all the time but you're still here 5 years later and you're not going anywhere and they know this.
Don't confuse silence for consent. Don't get your hopes up and you won't be disappointed.
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I know you think it'll be a bad "PR" move on their part but the fact is they're not gonna draw in LESS players if it's not the way existing players want it.
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Yes they absolutely would.
the community of hardcore MMO gamers is pretty incestuous and the 'conventional wisdom' they generate has a LOT of power to drive sales.
If they give us some half-baked 'not really' version of side switching they're going get burned at the stake, both online and at Best Buy or wherever.
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They're also not gonna LOSE existing players if it's not the way they want it. You guys [censored] and moan all the time but you're still here 5 years later and you're not going anywhere and they know this.
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I bailed after ED. If they piss me off enough I'll walk- lots of games out there to try, many of them are probably fun enough to keep me occupied for a year or so. Even a crummy MMO can be kinda fun for a few months if you're checking it out with your friends.
I'm not passionate about side switching, so they wouldn't lose me over this. But a LOT of people are really, really excited about it and they definitely would lose some population if they blow this feature.
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Don't confuse silence for consent. Don't get your hopes up and you won't be disappointed.
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Why shouldn't I?
It's fun to be excited, it's fun to anticipate cool stuff.
Especially when it's supported by broad, obvious hints like they've been giving us regarding side switching and power customization.
If they deliver both, as I think they will, it makes the expansion 'must have' for nearly all current players and generates a tidal wave of good word of mouth to bring in newbies.
Certainly more fun than moping around like Eeyore, whining about how everythings gonna stink and we should all crush our expectations into a little ball to guarantee we won't be let down.
This is a video game, not a career change.
If you can't get excited about something this frivolous and trifling, what's the point of living?
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
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They've never announced anything about whether you'll "really" be able to switch or not. Everyone is assuming so and talking about it like it's so, but silence on the devs' part is NOT consent. I know you think it'll be a bad "PR" move on their part but the fact is they're not gonna draw in LESS players if it's not the way existing players want it. They're also not gonna LOSE existing players if it's not the way they want it. You guys [censored] and moan all the time but you're still here 5 years later and you're not going anywhere and they know this.
Don't confuse silence for consent. Don't get your hopes up and you won't be disappointed.
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People complain but don't leave? Say that to the PvP crowd.
Oh wait most of them left...
@Mojo-
Proud Member of Fusion Force.
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Certainly more fun than moping around like Eeyore, whining about how everythings gonna stink and we should all crush our expectations into a little ball to guarantee we won't be let down.
This is a video game, not a career change.
If you can't get excited about something this frivolous and trifling, what's the point of living?
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My point was that people would leave because they were disappointed about some side-switching feature that was never confirmed or even announced. People are getting worked up over rumors at this point and threatening to leave over not getting your rumored feature is silly.
But I think you're wrong about some of your early points. I won't argue it because it's mostly opinion at this point. I just have a newbie's perspective on things here and I see a lot of old-timers sticking with a just-okay MMO (sorry, but this game really is showing its age!!) for whatever reason. I don't think those people are going to leave because they're getting new stuff but NOT the new stuff they thought they were getting. It's still new stuff and they'll still be excited.
CoX is below the radar for a lot of gamers at this point. The devs want fresh blood. A big expansion with lots of hype will get them that, whether is has "real" side switching or not. I know from my point of view it doesn't really make a difference. And I know from my limited experience that if you COULD switch sides, red side would die and the devs don't really want that.
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they are absolutely going to let us switch sides 'for real'.
anything else would be a PR & sales disaster and they have to know that.
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Agreed. I don't see why people don't get this fact.
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Track record ?
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Hard to argue to some degree. Man it would really be sad to see them miss this one. I mean you have some seriously monsterous established franchises entering the picture with HUGE numbers of people that will flock to them. They need to make every single move correctly from here on out to live IMHO.
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
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My point was that people would leave because they were disappointed about some side-switching feature that was never confirmed or even announced. People are getting worked up over rumors at this point and threatening to leave over not getting your rumored feature is silly.
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Nobody's threatening to leave.
What I'm hearing is that if they don't get a full-featured, real side switching they won't be popping for the expansion.
And they'll lose some players that feel passionately about side switching and generate a lot of bad word of mouth.
There's enough info out there to draw conclusions from, and most of them are pretty obvious given the infamous survey.
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But I think you're wrong about some of your early points. I won't argue it because it's mostly opinion at this point. I just have a newbie's perspective on things here and I see a lot of old-timers sticking with a just-okay MMO (sorry, but this game really is showing its age!!) for whatever reason.
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If you're here long enough you see that even long time veterans come and go, and sometimes return. Churn is a reality across all demographics. The population of thick-and-thin die-hards that bleed Paragon Studios red isn't enough to keep the doors open.
An underwhelming release will cost them across all demographics.
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CoX is below the radar for a lot of gamers at this point. The devs want fresh blood. A big expansion with lots of hype will get them that, whether is has "real" side switching or not.
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Not including it will generate a firestorm of criticism and dampen enthusiasm for the new box.
As opposed to delivering exciting, highly anticipated features, which would generate a tidal wave of excitement that would buoy sales.
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I know from my point of view it doesn't really make a difference. And I know from my limited experience that if you COULD switch sides, red side would die and the devs don't really want that.
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nonsense.
players play villains because they enjoy it, not because they're being forced to.
Some villains will migrate to Paragon, some heroes will migrate to the Rogue Isles, and the population imbalance will stay roughly the same.
If GR futures were available on the market, I'd bet big on side switching and power customization.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
You make a lot of valid points, many of which I think we agree on. The rest are matters of opinion and I'll let them lie. I did want to make one comment about this tho:
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I know from my point of view it doesn't really make a difference. And I know from my limited experience that if you COULD switch sides, red side would die and the devs don't really want that.
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nonsense.
players play villains because they enjoy it, not because they're being forced to.
Some villains will migrate to Paragon, some heroes will migrate to the Rogue Isles, and the population imbalance will stay roughly the same.
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I play mostly red side because I like the classes much better. I'd rather play on the more populated side with more to do and a better market, given the chance, but none of the classes on blue-side really appeal to me. (Tho, I have been enjoying playing a sonic/sonic defender lately, I must admit!) Sure I'm not FORCED to, but I kind of am if I want to play a stalker or MM since there's nothing even close on the blue side.
*shrug* I may not be a big enough sample size from which to draw any conclusions however.
I left redside completely after realizing the big market disparity.
I only play when my friends make me or when the server needs me to.
Other than that, I play blueside for the much larger community.
@Mojo-
Proud Member of Fusion Force.
I play almost exclusively redside. I can easily buy everything I want and everything I want is available.
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I play almost exclusively redside. I can easily buy everything I want and everything I want is available.
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I heard that in Thurston Howell III's voice and had visions of yachts and limosines.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
I said Market Disparity (i.e. Difference in Red Vs. Blue) not lack of redside goods :-)
@Mojo-
Proud Member of Fusion Force.
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I play mostly red side because I like the classes much better. I'd rather play on the more populated side with more to do and a better market, given the chance, but none of the classes on blue-side really appeal to me. (Tho, I have been enjoying playing a sonic/sonic defender lately, I must admit!) Sure I'm not FORCED to, but I kind of am if I want to play a stalker or MM since there's nothing even close on the blue side.
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There will certainly be cases like yours.
There will also be people who've always played heroes, who've never tried red side for whatever reason, that will decide to check it out.
And of course there are people like me, with a stable of heroes AND villains.
For a sizable slice of the population it isn't an either/or proposition.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
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This I know people that won't play villains because of the perceived difficulty in ioing out redside, toss in the smaller population and lack of large merit earning opportunities there will be more villains getting religion than if it were the rapture
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It's not "perceived". I play both red and blue side. On average, IO's are definitely cheaper blue side.
[CENTER][U][COLOR=#22229c][URL="http://cit.cohtitan.com/character/53024"][IMG]http://avatars.cohtitan.com/signatures/cit/u53024.png[/IMG][/URL][/COLOR][/U][/CENTER]
[CENTER][SIZE=1][COLOR=white]The #1 True Villain badge collector on Infinity.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/CENTER]