*pulls out her notebook and pen* I like this thread idea. Definitely going to be taking notes!!
--Virtue--
My 50s:
Tigra Swipe (BS/SR/Dark Scrapper)
Galena Storm (Emp/Ele/Ele Defender)
Master Tolarin (Psi/Fire/Force Blaster)
I've been working on a objective 'work of art' myself.
You enter a warehouse to save a new cooworker. There are these security 'automations' every here and there.
You attempt to use a nearby computer terminal (glowie) and the voice of a security system (single ally ninjitsu non-combat runs to door w/ dialog) explains how someone has tampered with its programming.
1st Boss just explains how they are forced to attack you again'st your will and give hints to who is controlling things.
You save a local security tech, who suspects your friend is beind all this.
You save your coworker (escort - combat ally) and then continue to get ambushed.
You click last glowie to find info regarding who has taken over this security system. More hints to someone inside your organization. This spawns Optional Boss 2 is a failsafe that refuses to let your coworker leave.
Defeat Optional Boss 2 when defeated, decloaks destructable mainframe for the security system. If destroyed, a combat repair automation is spawns near the front (hopefully between you and door). It tells you that once you all make it outside, it needs to arrest your coworker.
Coworker turns rogue once you get to the exit (and sadly, I can't avoid a mission complete here), and if you have the ally, its an easy fight, otherwise its a hard one.
Another neat trick with bertraying escorts is if its a mastermind, thier pets will not betray you but fight for you. This can be worked into the story too.
Freeedom
H: Victra Defile (Rad/Dark) & Hot Hits (Fire/SD)
V: Spike Cream (NW) & Crescent Wind (Nin/Storm)
Sub Hero Inc ARC: 1541
--If you don't like what I have to say, it was probably a typo you are refering to.
I've been having fun with ally ambushes. It's quite a new feeling to see that ambush dialogue and then get a small group of ally clockwork at your side. The only problem is they don't zero in on the you or the marker that spawns them so they occasionally stop short and just stand around.
Another fun trick is to make battles with one side outweighing the other on a small map then adding ally release or other non-required objectives in the same front, back or middle position. On tiny maps the battle will overwhelm one side and complete the objective for you. This is a fun way to make an unguarded follow ally appear among ally NPC's.
A Guide to Champion Drama
My Videos
Ashcraft been published.
[ QUOTE ]
You attempt to use a nearby computer terminal (glowie) and the voice of a security system (single ally ninjitsu non-combat runs to door w/ dialog) explains how someone has tampered with its programming..
[/ QUOTE ]
so putting a non-combat that triggers after an event JUST to insert dialog... clever.
[ QUOTE ]
nother neat trick with bertraying escorts is if its a mastermind, thier pets will not betray you but fight for you. This can be worked into the story too.
[/ QUOTE ]
Do you know if the system correctly subtracts xp for the damage they do? One man's trick is another man's exploit. . .
[ QUOTE ]
Set a "free a captive" to single only, and tie an ambush to him... and you get a "Hot Door" (ambush that hits the second the players zone in)
[/ QUOTE ]
This should really be in the second section, i.e. don't do this. People with long load times could very well zone into the mission dead.
As for things I've done, I used the thing where you tie ambushes to a boss on a Thugs/WP Elite Boss, where the Thugs was set to extreme, meaning gang war. I gave a couple allies who could help so it wouldn't be murder, but essentially the EB was constantly calling in reinforcements. It made for an incredibly fun battle.
Another interesting thing that I've done, and this is in Return of the Revenge of the Son of Drakule Part 2: First Blood, (I really like typing out that title) I used one of the Cimeroran cave maps, specifically Medium size #8, and on that map all the glowies set to Back spawn in the back room, which is one of the ones with the pool and the bridges over it in the shape of a cross. I have 3 altars you have to activate to spawn the boss, and the boss spawns right there in the room, and usually begins attacking right there. It's even cooler when the glowies spawn in a perfect triangle.
I'm working on a mission right now that makes you use stealth. The critters are custom, they all look the same as they are suppose to be the newest generation of PPD cyber units. There are four different types, but they are all lvl 54 Lieutenants. Their power sets combine to make it very hard to beat a sqaud of them.
The mission goal is to destroy an object. It's the main AI data center to shut down the PPD units. All you have to do is destroy this one thing. Problem is there is 30 patrols with speed boost and flight.There are also 3 ambushes tied to the object your destroying, so you have to be able to destroy it quickly and exit. I'm still tweaking but the idea is to make it hard but not ridiculous, and to make people try to stealth the mish and destroy the object quickly. XP and Infamy won't be great, but I'm more interested in trying to get people with 50s to play differently now and then.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Set a "free a captive" to single only, and tie an ambush to him... and you get a "Hot Door" (ambush that hits the second the players zone in)
[/ QUOTE ]
This should really be in the second section, i.e. don't do this. People with long load times could very well zone into the mission dead.
[/ QUOTE ]
It sounds like the OP wants their arc to be 1-stared by ragequitting Mastermind players.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Set a "free a captive" to single only, and tie an ambush to him... and you get a "Hot Door" (ambush that hits the second the players zone in)
[/ QUOTE ]
This should really be in the second section, i.e. don't do this. People with long load times could very well zone into the mission dead.
[/ QUOTE ]
It sounds like the OP wants their arc to be 1-stared by ragequitting Mastermind players.
[/ QUOTE ]
Heh, it's in "scary things 201596"... and in the very first mission. Minion level mechanical spiders from the Arachnos set attack... Even a soloing mastermind should be be able to get some defenses up long before they take you down. A full team will face a wall of these things.... but even still... more scary than lethal. Which was my intent. This ambush stays.... still trying to tweak the second mission though, so the zombie little girls aren't quite as tough
I still think it's a dick move, personally.
Might as well say a couple things about my AE arc, Inverse Ninja Law (202912).
None of the three missions has Defeat All as an objective ... but in order to successfully complete the missions it is wise to Defeat All, simply because of how they are structured.
In the first mission, your first (of two) objectives is to receive additional instructions from your contact (a Tsoo boss named Midnight Sun) once you're on site. This is in a glowie that you have to search. When you complete the glowie, it spawns an escort which is a required objective. When you complete the rescue, the (former) hostage is Pacifist (and thus, can be defeated for mission fail) ... and rather than spawning ambushes, I simply have multiple patrols spawn throughout the map. Sometimes ... but not every time ... one of the patrols spawns right on top of you when you perform the rescue, extending that fight. You then have to escort the hostage back to the mission front door, and if you encounter any of the newly spawned patrols along the way, you're almost certainly going to have to fight them because they'll engage your Escort (who won't fight back). So it makes for a nice Battle In/Battle Out mission on a fairly small map.
The second mission reprises the "get more info from contact once you're on site" requirement in order to spawn a Defend Object with multiple waves of defenders. Additional patrols spawn as well, so that unlike an ambush, it's not the same every single time. Sometimes the patrols will wander in on you where you're defending the object, sometimes they won't. Makes for a nice little variable.
The last mission is a Battle Royale in which the only things spawning on the map are Tsoo Patrols (Enemy), Custom Critter Patrols (Rogue) and a Battle (Tsoo and Custom, both Enemy). Your objective is to Click The Glowie and you have 10 minutes in order to find and do it. The mobs are all engaging each other and so there's combat going on everywhere in a swirling melee ... and you're welcome to partake, or avoid, as you please. It is perfectly possible to "ninja" this mission by stealth in order to click the glowie, and then hang around to mop up all the mobs at your leisure, as you please. It's also fun to just hang around, stealthed, and watch the mobs simply trash each other ... since it's not an assured outcome as to which side will "win" in any particular spot on the map.
It's the end. But the moment has been prepared for ...
I'm a big fan of chained objectives. For example in one of my missions you have to get the "code" to open a computerized vault. The code is retrieved by kidnapping a hostage (i.e a rescue) that then spawns the glowie (a safe).
Of course opening the safe spawns the end boss. It's a nice way to control the story events somewhat. Thus keeping people from skipping through the mission and heading straight for the end boss.
My level 50 Dominators:
Madame Mindbender 50 Mind/Energy
Fly Agaric 50 Plant/Thorn
Nate Nitro 50 Fire/Psi
[ QUOTE ]
I'm a big fan of chained objectives. For example in one of my missions you have to get the "code" to open a computerized vault. The code is retrieved by kidnapping a hostage (i.e a rescue) that then spawns the glowie (a safe).
Of course opening the safe spawns the end boss. It's a nice way to control the story events somewhat. Thus keeping people from skipping through the mission and heading straight for the end boss.
[/ QUOTE ]
I hate this type of chained objective if it's not done the right way. Not because it's a terrible thing overall but because it kills my immersion. I've been through a room or hallway before and there was nothing there. Then I kidnap somebody and suddenly I notice a huge obelisk or tech doodad sitting in the middle of the floor. Now I have actually used this kind of chain in a mission I'm working on but I made it a whiteboard in an office map. That way it's something that somebody might legitimately overlooked on their first time through. Other examples would be file cabinets or trashcans or else crates in warehouse maps. I suppose a safe would be reasonable too if it were some kind of wall safe.
Don't count your weasels before they pop dink!
Something I've used is a technique for making an entire map free of enemies. Loading the maximum number of destructible objects with no guards can take up all the available enemy space.
Don't count your weasels before they pop dink!
[ QUOTE ]
I still think it's a dick move, personally.
[/ QUOTE ]
I have a mission called 'The Surprise Immediate Ambush Attack of the Ghost Widow Clone Army' on local, which i only made for laughs. As soon as I entered it, three ambushes of GW appeared. And killed me lol. I half considered publishing it - with that title, surely no-one could complain? 
Eco.
MArcs:
The Echo, Arc ID 1688 (5mish, easy, drama)
The Audition, Arc ID 221240 (6 mish, complex mech, comedy)
Storming Citadel, Arc ID 379488 (lowbie, 1mish, 10-min timed)
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
[The Incarnate System is] Jack Emmert all over again, only this time it's not "1 hero = 3 white minions" it's "1 hero = 3 white rocks."
|
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'm a big fan of chained objectives. For example in one of my missions you have to get the "code" to open a computerized vault. The code is retrieved by kidnapping a hostage (i.e a rescue) that then spawns the glowie (a safe).
Of course opening the safe spawns the end boss. It's a nice way to control the story events somewhat. Thus keeping people from skipping through the mission and heading straight for the end boss.
[/ QUOTE ]
I hate this type of chained objective if it's not done the right way. Not because it's a terrible thing overall but because it kills my immersion. I've been through a room or hallway before and there was nothing there. Then I kidnap somebody and suddenly I notice a huge obelisk or tech doodad sitting in the middle of the floor. Now I have actually used this kind of chain in a mission I'm working on but I made it a whiteboard in an office map. That way it's something that somebody might legitimately overlooked on their first time through. Other examples would be file cabinets or trashcans or else crates in warehouse maps. I suppose a safe would be reasonable too if it were some kind of wall safe.
[/ QUOTE ]
I avoid these sort of things as much as possible. If we had locked doors it could be easier to make it work right as then you could prevent the "I just searched this room, where did those destructables all come from?" syndrome. The only time it works is when the spawns are enemies and you can write that they came in after you did.
But if the objective chaining causes me to run back and forth across the map over and over, then it's just plain annoying and not "clever" at all.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'm a big fan of chained objectives. For example in one of my missions you have to get the "code" to open a computerized vault. The code is retrieved by kidnapping a hostage (i.e a rescue) that then spawns the glowie (a safe).
Of course opening the safe spawns the end boss. It's a nice way to control the story events somewhat. Thus keeping people from skipping through the mission and heading straight for the end boss.
[/ QUOTE ]
I hate this type of chained objective if it's not done the right way. Not because it's a terrible thing overall but because it kills my immersion. I've been through a room or hallway before and there was nothing there. Then I kidnap somebody and suddenly I notice a huge obelisk or tech doodad sitting in the middle of the floor. Now I have actually used this kind of chain in a mission I'm working on but I made it a whiteboard in an office map. That way it's something that somebody might legitimately overlooked on their first time through. Other examples would be file cabinets or trashcans or else crates in warehouse maps. I suppose a safe would be reasonable too if it were some kind of wall safe.
[/ QUOTE ]
I avoid these sort of things as much as possible. If we had locked doors it could be easier to make it work right as then you could prevent the "I just searched this room, where did those destructables all come from?" syndrome. The only time it works is when the spawns are enemies and you can write that they came in after you did.
But if the objective chaining causes me to run back and forth across the map over and over, then it's just plain annoying and not "clever" at all.
[/ QUOTE ]
hmmm, learning a lot here. First.. I was all proud of my hot door trick, till I found out some people hate it.... now when I start taking notes on another thing I like, turns out there are people who loathe that too.... I'll look at changing the hot door. after all, if people dislike it enough to call it a dick thing to do... I'd better rethink.
In Dorothy... I have a floating eyeball that is labeled "Poorly designed giant head". Defeating it spawns the wizard somewhere else. What I really want is for the wizard to spawn right there in same location. it's an outdoor map... any advice?
The hot door is a good idea in theory. I mean if some poony hero was invading MY base, I'd send a bunch of goons to deal with him as soon as he walked in the door, right? It would actually work fine if you could set ambushes to trigger once the player passed a certain point on the map (in this case, a point fairly close to the door...that would show those over-eager people who just HAVE to run around the corner and wait there for everyone to zone, then complain when they don't get buffs....)
*Politely asks Devs to let us trigger stuff off points on the map, at least the ones that already have trigger points, like pawn shops. And the Mayhem/Safeguard maps, which aren't available for MA but should be.*
Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
Darkfire Avenger DM/SD/Body Scrapper
Arc ID#161629 Freaks, Geeks, and Men in Black
Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World
[ QUOTE ]
hmmm, learning a lot here. First.. I was all proud of my hot door trick, till I found out some people hate it....
[/ QUOTE ]
Some people will love it, others will hate it.
Just try to put enough warning in the intro text or description so that people who hate that sort of theing have a chance to avoid the mission.
If you cut out everythig someone dislikes, you'll end up with no missions at all. Every mission/story has an audience: try to find and advertise to that audience, and warn everyone else away.
Story Arcs I created:
Every Rose: (#17702) Villainous vs Legacy Chain. Forget Arachnos, join the CoT!
Cosplay Madness!: (#3643) Neutral vs Custom Foes. Heroes at a pop culture convention!
Kiss Hello Goodbye: (#156389) Heroic vs Custom Foes. Film Noir/Hardboiled detective adventure!
Having a 'hot door' might be doable as long as you don't go overboard with mega-powered enemies that drop you before you can even portal in. At least, start out small and test it with all kinds of builds to make sure you're not just going to kill people who have no prayer of staying alive. If it needs a bit more, then ramp them up, slowly. I wouldn't mind having an ambush at the door as long as it's not something like an EB or a bunch of ramped up minions or lieuts with mega power combos set on extreme. The chances of my ever going back in would likely be slim to none.
Most people that would get hammered like that would be kind if they didn't rate the arc at all. But, I'd be more inclined to think they would rate it 0* if they were really ticked about it. I doubt you'd find many people that would ever go back in, in either case.
No AV/EBs Deal with The Devil's Pawn-207266 Slash DeMento and the Stolen Weapons-100045 Meet the Demon Spawn-151099 Feedback
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
hmmm, learning a lot here. First.. I was all proud of my hot door trick, till I found out some people hate it....
[/ QUOTE ]
Some people will love it, others will hate it.
Just try to put enough warning in the intro text or description so that people who hate that sort of theing have a chance to avoid the mission.
[/ QUOTE ]
Something as simple as..."Oh and by the way, they're expecting you" would be a suitable hint, I'd think. Hot doors aren't a bad thing for folks who zone in seconds. But for those whose zone times are measured in minutes, hot doors might as well be a plate of debt.
@Remianen / @Remianen Too
Sig by RPVisions
[ QUOTE ]
Something as simple as..."Oh and by the way, they're expecting you" would be a suitable hint, I'd think.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'd go as far to put that in colored text, or italics or bold:
"Oh and by the way, they're expecting you"
"Oh and by the way, they're expecting you"
"Oh and by the way, they're expecting you"
You might even follow it with a "[note: hotdoor]" just to be 100% sure they can't blame you if it makes them cranky (well, like that would stop someone anyway).
I can see that some players would hate hot doors, such as solo MMs and slow loaders (especially solo MMs who load slowly!), but personally I feel it's a valid element to pull from your deck if it fits the story somehow.
<QR>
Ok, some people don't like the door thing, others do. We could spent the next 10 pages griping about hot doors until the flames get the thread locked! Wouldn't that be great?
Or we could just end the threadjack and move on already.
Here's my tip, for what it's worth. Some people like allies, some don't. Make the ally a Lieutenant with a scrapper defense powerset. Tough enough to survive with some help from the player, but not so tough that the player ends up wondering who's really the star of this show.
Then, I'll usually have the contact say something like; "Don't forget to call in, if you need some help." Make those letters in orange or bright yellow. In the mission have a nonrequired item right up front, name it: "You could use this to call Wonderlad!" Have the ally spawn once the glowie is completed. That way the player has the choice to have an ally or not.
Tip #ilostcount: to get a boss with a mastermind type powerset to summon its henchmen early, place a rogue patrol of weak minions near it to make it aggro. That way, once the player arrives, the boss will already have henchmen out and ready, which can be used for a number of things, from making the boss fight more thematic to more challenging, as well as circumventing the 'does not summon henchmen while player is attacking' situation that sometimes pops up.
"If I had Force powers, vacuum or not my cape/clothes/hair would always be blowing in the Dramatic Wind." - Tenzhi
Characters
First, I like story and I like plot, I enjoy well written dialog and good character descriptions.
This has nothing to do with that.
I want a place to discuss clever things you can do with MA, how to make fun missions and how to throw surprises and fun into the mix.
examples:
Ambushes.
I love ambushes... and they add a strong dynamic element
Pop an ambush when the boss first takes damage, and you have a fight to remember:
pop a second ambush at 3/4 damage and a third at 1/2 damage, and now Dorothy fills the sky with flying monkeys.
If you tie an ambush to a boss defeat... and give that boss the power to rez... you get a "Round two" on the same boss... Appropriate dialog, and the players get the impression he's a completely different, and tougher, boss.
Set a "free a captive" to single only, and tie an ambush to him... and you get a "Hot Door" (ambush that hits the second the players zone in)
If you make a Hot Door anything but a minion level ambush, players won't forgive you.
If you make those same minions into masterminds ... you can get a MASSIVE wave of bad guys come at you like a wall of ninjas, thugs, undead or robots.. fun...
Things that DO NOT work. (unless this was part of your evil plan)
Never give an ambusher any status effect or hold powers... for instance a door ambush with ninjas who have caltops means most of your players will never be able to move from the door. While it may be mildly amusing at first to be frozen in place one step into the mission... its not really all that fun. So much for my "how many ninjas can fit in a casino" mission.
If you DO put something tough into an ambush.... remember to put minions in to mitigate it... I wanted ONE cyclops... I got TEN.
I wanted to make a mission called "Run like Hell" where a nasty hot door ambush full of impossible to kill critters comes at you, and your only escape is to find and click the glowie. no other critters in the mission. This did not work.. I tied three door ambushes together and ended up with all three spawning at the door, but just sat there doing nothing, untill you found the captive they were attached to. Any indoor mission... and the ambush gets you before you can run... any outdoor mission, and I couln't correctly pull off the hot door. ps. You can put the hamidon thingies into an ambush.... For the love of all things holy...do not do this unless your goal was instant party wipe.
I'm wanting war stories, clever tricks, and "well, THAT didn't work" What cool things have you done in YOUR missions?