New Idea of Origins

Im sure we can all agree that when it comes to picking the origin of your character, not many people care which one it is, unless you're heavy RP and you put it in your description. The only thing origins ever have done are decide what enhancements you have to buy, give you a little ranged power at level one, and maybe mess with what missions you get from what contacts. My friend and I were discussing this, and we propose a new step to the origin of your character.

Nearly everyone in game has wanted power customization, to change the color of your attacks and such. This is kind of like that. When you choose your origin, it should affect on how exactly you use your powers and how they look.

For example: If you're a Blaster and you choose Technology, perhaps you can throw your fireblast with little flamethrowers attached to your wrist, much like Pyro in Xmen The Last Stand.(Stealin the idea aside) Or say you're a Controller and you choose Magic, maybe every other attack or so, the animation of the attack gives off a magical aura, similar to that of the new Magic Pack buffs.(Fortunes)

Hopefully you see my point. Having your specific origin change the way your powers are used and work would give players much more to think about when choosing they're origin.

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Virtue, Protector

@FaintPsycho

First, read this.

Second, this would be a terrible way to implement customization if we ever get it. Nobody will agree on which origins should be matched with which animations. Even your own example of a tech origin is actually describing a character who is of mutant origin.

Origin is one of those things that is very broad and I hope it stays that way.

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"Mastermind Pets operate...differently, and aren't as easily fixed. Especially the Bruiser. I want to take him out behind the woodshed and pull an "old yeller" on him at times." - Castle

Power customization is a huge deal for the devs. The animations are, for lack of a better term, hard-baked into each power.

Second, not every tech character would or should use wrist-mounted flamethrowers, nor should every magic character read from a tome of ancient lore, etc.

Origin should not play any part in how your character looks or acts, beyond the RP/backstory component it is used for now...

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What I think would be even better...dual origins.

My name sake would be Magic/Science origin. I choose Magic as the origin, just because I prefere that Origin power over the sleep dart.

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BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection

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When you choose your origin, it should affect on how exactly you use your powers and how they look.


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No. Absolutely not.

What's to say YOUR interpretation of my origin is the same as mine? Some people think "Magic" means dangling charms and waving their wands at everything, that Tech has to have gizmos everywhere, that Natural shouldn't be able to do anything like, oh, Fly.

For instance, my first 50 was an Elec/Elec blaster. Origin - Magic. She didn't use wands, chant spells or anything else. Her family is descended from priestesses of a forgotten goddess. She just channels the energy in the form that came to mind. Why should she have a "magic sigil" or wave a wand or something? That's not part of her.

If you pushed for origin-*inspired* pieces of costumes, customizations, etc... hey, fine. But telling me my character has to do something that, frankly, is out of character because of someone else's preconceived notion of "how an origin does things?" No freaking thanks.

(And I think I need to write up another cut-paste on this.)

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Just for fun, let's agree to origin-based constraints on power sets, emotes, and animations...but only if the entire "origin should do more" camp can agree on who should do what, and how.

What's that? No consensus? Guess we should leave things alone, then.

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Arc 55669 - Tales of the PPD: One Hell of a Deal (video trailer)
Arc 64511 - The Wrecking Ball
Arc 1745 - The Trouble With Trimbles
Arc 302901 - HappyCorpse

Okay..well then it could be made that you don't HAVE to use that certain part of the origin...all Im saying is for the Devs to somehow add something else to the origin, so theres more behind choosing that certain one.

No need to get all upset and what not over a simple idea.

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Virtue, Protector

@FaintPsycho

I disagree. The origins are different enough as it is. Your changes have one good side to them: no effect on gameplay.

Of course, inhibiting the customization or the gameplay would probably be bad. the idea above: [ QUOTE ]
If you pushed for origin-*inspired* pieces of costumes, customizations, etc...

[/ QUOTE ] has it right, I think. A few new pieces (there are supposed to be new pieces in I15), being selectable based on origin might be nice, but I wouldn't take it further than that.

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[ QUOTE ]

If you pushed for origin-*inspired* pieces of costumes, customizations, etc... hey, fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is, in fact, a great idea. Having OPTIONS to customize powers in a variety of ways that could reflect origins (but all options available to all origins) would satisfy everyone I think.

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I had the same idea about origins, but I agree that trying to add power customization would be difficult. Though, I do have a suggestion on how it could be done (read #3. below). Anyway, I have 3 ideas on how to make origins actually matter.


1. How about adding certain inherent advantages/disadvantages or buffs/debuffs (whatever you want to call it) to each origin, independent of the archetype and your enhancements.
Example: All toons with mutant origin will have additional toxic damage resistance. All toons with magic origin are more resistant to dark powers.


2. How about dual origins? There would be consequences though. Add my first idea to this one, you would have only half of the advantage/disadvantage (buff/debuff) as a single origin toon. And single origin enhancements wouldn't be as effective for your dual origin toon.


3. How about sub-origins? My most complex, and probably unrealistic idea, but I think it would be cool anyway.

Example: So you do have a magic defender, but you don't want to use a wand with your powers, fine, why not have 3 different sub-origins within the magic origin. Maybe one would be your witch/wizard sub that uses a wand or staff with all powers. A second would be a sorcerer type that doesn't use any wands or objects with their powers, and a third would be magic creatures or something.

The number of sub origins is almost irrelevant, but my point is that what’s wrong with having a robot toon that sounds and looks like a robot. It wouldn't satisfy everybody, but wouldn't it start to open up the door of possibility of power customization and add to character customization.

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I would like to see some combat auras added that were inspired by different origins; let anyone take them, but they'd be clearly intended for one origin or another:

glowing runes when you use powers

some sort of transporter-like effect

speed lines

etc, but as combat auras instead of regular ones.

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[ QUOTE ]
I had the same idea about origins, but I agree that trying to add power customization would be difficult. Though, I do have a suggestion on how it could be done (read #3. below). Anyway, I have 3 ideas on how to make origins actually matter.


1. How about adding certain inherent advantages/disadvantages or buffs/debuffs (whatever you want to call it) to each origin, independent of the archetype and your enhancements.
Example: All toons with mutant origin will have additional toxic damage resistance. All toons with magic origin are more resistant to dark powers.



[/ QUOTE ]
They tried stuff like that in early versions of this game- Natural got extra Attack, Tech got extra Resistance, for example. They took it out when they realised every Blaster would be Natural, every Tanker would be Tech and so on.

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[ QUOTE ]

3. How about sub-origins? My most complex, and probably unrealistic idea, but I think it would be cool anyway.

Example: So you do have a magic defender, but you don't want to use a wand with your powers, fine, why not have 3 different sub-origins within the magic origin. Maybe one would be your witch/wizard sub that uses a wand or staff with all powers. A second would be a sorcerer type that doesn't use any wands or objects with their powers, and a third would be magic creatures or something.

The number of sub origins is almost irrelevant, but my point is that what’s wrong with having a robot toon that sounds and looks like a robot. It wouldn't satisfy everybody, but wouldn't it start to open up the door of possibility of power customization and add to character customization.

[/ QUOTE ]

OK, once again - please check BaB's FAQ about Power Customization.

Now instead of asking for one set of new animations times 5 origins - you are now asking for 15 times that number?

There are LOTS of thing I would rather BaBs be spending his time on besides that task.

Of course, as far as asking for new costume bits, etc. - they are doing that already. Purchase the Booster Packs for your Tech & Magic-inspired bits, look for Science, Natural & Mutant to come soon.

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Altoholic - but a Blaster at Heart!

Originally Posted by SpyralPegacyon

"You gave us a world where we could fly. I can't thank you enough for that."

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Im sure we can all agree that when it comes to picking the origin of your character, not many people care which one it is, unless you're heavy RP and you put it in your description. The only thing origins ever have done are decide what enhancements you have to buy, give you a little ranged power at level one, and maybe mess with what missions you get from what contacts. My friend and I were discussing this, and we propose a new step to the origin of your character.

Nearly everyone in game has wanted power customization, to change the color of your attacks and such. This is kind of like that. When you choose your origin, it should affect on how exactly you use your powers and how they look.

For example: If you're a Blaster and you choose Technology, perhaps you can throw your fireblast with little flamethrowers attached to your wrist, much like Pyro in Xmen The Last Stand.(Stealin the idea aside) Or say you're a Controller and you choose Magic, maybe every other attack or so, the animation of the attack gives off a magical aura, similar to that of the new Magic Pack buffs.(Fortunes)

Hopefully you see my point. Having your specific origin change the way your powers are used and work would give players much more to think about when choosing they're origin.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes and no.

It would be a very, very cool thing if it were introduced as an OPTION with your origin, giving the player more choices about how their character's powers work.

But a very, very BAD thing if it were hardwired into origin, giving the player no choice in the matter.

I have a magic origin Broadsword/Dark Armor scrapper. His powers come from the sword he wields, take the sword away and he is a normal human. That character would never perform an incantation to activate his armors because it is the sword that is granting them to him, not any magical knowledge or ability. If I were forced to have auras and incantations/gestures in order to use his powers it would kill the concept of the character.

I have another magic origin character that is a mage/alchemist (Fire/TA controller) His fire powers stem from years of training and natural affinity for magic, his Trick Arrow powers come from alchemical knowledge (he's a lousy archer, but a bow is the most efficient delivery system for his concoctions) Incantations, gestures and auras would be perfect for him.

I gave you those two examples just to show that not all characters fit into all origins the same way. What is appropriate for one character would be inappropriate for another. So, while the option for custom power effects based on origin is cool, the idea of there only being one way to represent those powers in a given origin is not.

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Agreed. That if it was made to be on option, then great, everyone's happy. But no one likes being forced into doing something. My original idea was just to make Origins actually do something in the game, something that would give people reason to choose it, other than the RP aspect.

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Virtue, Protector

@FaintPsycho

Thats a great idea!

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Power is unless without the will to use it,
But will in nothing unless you believe in yourself.
And that is ture power!
Written by-Mr Amazing

Personally, I like the idea of origin-inspired content, meaning that if you choose a Magic or Mutant origin, for instance, you would automatically unlock magic or mutant content.

Judging from the fossilized remains of the various origin contacts in Atlas and Galaxy, this was the original idea. However, the devs soon decided to contract their efforts into one chain of mixed origin content.

What I'd like is for the devs to rewrite and modernize the original CoH content, starting at level 1, splitting the various storylines into single and dual origin threads. This could be a continuing project, done a chunk at a time, with new content showing up every month.

I know many people would balk at the idea, saying it is a wasted effort, because all people play anymore is TFs, scanners, and AE farms, and all the devs seem to be able to crank out over the course of a year is 3 small TFs and maybe a half dozen small arcs.

But there are reasons why things are this way. The way I see it, the devs believe they should crank out a small amount of low-story farmable content because that's what datamining shows the players like. As a case in point, AE was created as a bone to throw to the small contingent of the player base that wanted story and RP, and what happened to it? Farm city.

However, I think that most players turn to farms and scanners primarily because the content is so uninteresting (including AE content). There is no realistic opportunity to mine statistics that relate to playing for story or RP, so the belief that players should get increasing amounts of low-story high farm content is self-fulfilling.

I know players and devs may not agree with me, but that's the opinion I formed within about a month of play in 2005 and everything I've seen since then appears to confirm it. <shrug>

To return to the OP for a moment ... lol ... I guess I'd say it's good to voice your opinions and ideas about where the game should go, but realistically, don't expect much to change.

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<QR>

I'd love to see EATs for all the origins.

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Issue 23: All your base are belong to us?

Old idea, actually.

For my part, more choices for power visuals? Excellent. The faster they can do it the better.

Restricting certain graphics to origin? Terrible - leave decisions in players' hands.

There is simply no reason to decree that all tech-based heroes throw fire one way, and all magic-based heroes do it another way.

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My scrapper doesn't need an AoE. She IS an AoE.

[ QUOTE ]
all Im saying is for the Devs to somehow add something else to the origin, so theres more behind choosing that certain one.


[/ QUOTE ]

As origins have been a purely RP (if that) based feature since go-live, changing that now seems counterproductive. I really must disagree and suggest that they stay the way they are.

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My scrapper doesn't need an AoE. She IS an AoE.

I'll echo the inherent idea. I always thought that there could be inherent powers, similar to those of archetype, tied instead to Origin. I never worked out what they would be like, but they would offer more variability between builds and certainly more longevity of use than the basic attack we get now.

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I have a number of Magic origin characters.

Several are incarnate deities or archangelic level beings from various mythologies, exercising powers like super strength or broadsword or energy melee or dark melee, etc.

One learned the power of bears from an Ainu shaman in the interior of Hokkaido, and was also raised in the wild by actual bears - he's my Tarzan hommage, loincloth, fractured grammar, and all. The claws fighting (claws courtesy of a notable Japanese swordsmith who had retired to the northern island to meditate and work in solitude) and bear-like strength, etc. would make him "natural" on a par with Tarzan, Ka-zar, et al. But magic seemed the right flavor for the shamanic regen powers (bear being a potent healing totem in most cultures that recognize Him).

One uses a magic bow that was first carried at the battle of Agincourt.

One or two are even spellcasters of one variety or another.

Where is the unfying image or concept that would make one, single, inherent "magical" look right for all of them?

I will not go into the same detail on armored vs gadgeteer vs nanotech background in my tech characters, but the same objection applies.

So more visuals all round, but for pity's sake why try to ram everyone's vision of a given origin or more to the point, a given character) into some cookie cutter notion that "Magic looks like THIS" or "All tech looks like THAT"? Or conversely, why make an option that might suit someone's look-and-feel down to the ground limited to a given origin?

It seems to me like saying one cannot use the red crayons if drawing one way, or the green ones if drawing another.

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My scrapper doesn't need an AoE. She IS an AoE.

BBhumeBB, read my post earlier in the thread, and the OP's response to it. Your concerns were already addressed. I felt much the same way about it and even gave examples of some of my own characters.

I stated that if it were an option we were given then yes I would be all for it. But, if we were forced into such a thing I heartily disagree with anything like that being implemented.

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[ QUOTE ]
Im sure we can all agree that when it comes to picking the origin of your character, not many people care which one it is, unless you're heavy RP and you put it in your description. The only thing origins ever have done are decide what enhancements you have to buy, give you a little ranged power at level one, and maybe mess with what missions you get from what contacts. My friend and I were discussing this, and we propose a new step to the origin of your character.

Nearly everyone in game has wanted power customization, to change the color of your attacks and such. This is kind of like that. When you choose your origin, it should affect on how exactly you use your powers and how they look.

For example: If you're a Blaster and you choose Technology, perhaps you can throw your fireblast with little flamethrowers attached to your wrist, much like Pyro in Xmen The Last Stand.(Stealin the idea aside) Or say you're a Controller and you choose Magic, maybe every other attack or so, the animation of the attack gives off a magical aura, similar to that of the new Magic Pack buffs.(Fortunes)

Hopefully you see my point. Having your specific origin change the way your powers are used and work would give players much more to think about when choosing they're origin.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the fact origins are only really used for RP purposes is fine and actually helps people to think more about their character and encourages RP.

The same could be argued about a characters gender, height and costume parts.

If we ever get chance to customize our powers, then it should be done independently of origin. By linking it with origin, you are only hindering customization.

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