What Build/Challenge Level do you test your Arcs?
By
AncientSpirit_NA,
Posted on: 2009-04-30 15:41 in Mission Architect
Just a thought, but wouldn't 25 be a better testing level? That's the middle between the minimum level and the maximum level. You don't have all your powers, but you have most, you aren't stuck with training enhancements, but most won't have the best IOs.
Most people like to use MA to level, something that a 50 can beat but they can't is useless to them.
You may have a point. I don't have some 25's laying around at the moment, and I am rather hoping that we will see a function added to the Mission Architect that will set a level range-zone that will auto exemplar/sidekick characters to an intended level. That would allow me to take a 50 and run it at 25. Optionally, I could add a single minion spawn from a standard enemy group that caps out at Level 25. That might work.
I'm not really sure thought at what level would be the "Ideal" range for testing since we can not hard set the Level Range-Zone to say:"This Arc is intended for Characters 30 to 40, All others need not apply." yet.
You can't hard-set it, but I use the levels of the missions as a guide. The standard enemies the mission uses will be balanced around a certain level range, and IMO the custom enemies you use should be on par, unless you're specifically creating a "challenging" arc. You should be testing with a character naturally in that level range, since an exemped 50 is more powerful, especially if they have IOs.
Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
Darkfire Avenger DM/SD/Body Scrapper
Arc ID#161629 Freaks, Geeks, and Men in Black
Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World
I test my arcs with my level 50 Willpower/SS Tanker on Level 5 difficulty. If I can't solo it, I try to make Adjustments unless it was an arc I intended to be unsoloable.
I always test at Difficulty 2 and adjust the difficulty of mobs up and down from there. That lets me see bosses around my level and gives me more chances to see Minions and LTs in action.
L50 Mercs/Traps MM, Difficulty 2. She's farily tricked out, so if I can't effortlessly solo the mission then I tone it down. If I'm getting pounded reasonably hard, or pets are actually dying beyond the occasional Tier 1, then even if I can get through the mission odds are good that most soloers will hit too much of a brick wall.
Global @Twoflower / MA Creator & Pro Indie Game Developer.
Mission Architect Works: DIY Laser Moonbase (Dev Choice!), An Internship in the Fine Art of Revenge (2009 MA Award Winner!) and many more! Plus Brand New Arcs for Issue 21!
Initially, it's CL 1, with my shield tanker (or fire scrapper), just to see if the darn thing works. Once I've ascertained that, I'll bump it up to CL2, to check on how my customs work in larger numbers. I'm not really a powergamer, so I don't bother checking for CLs 3-5. I take the assumption that if you're at those levels, you're either teamed, or you know what you're doing. <_<
My Shield Tanker, 47, and Fire Scrapper, 50, are both heavily IO'd out, with a lot of bonuses. It's mostly so I can blow through the missions, testing if spawn placements work, and if all the triggers go off. I'll check Clue spellings after the fact (since clues don't go away until the arc ends... wish would could set some clues to disappear at end of each mission...).
Now, after everything works right, I'll retest it with my Emp/Eng Defender (36),. and my Psi/Men Blaster (22). I don't have any Controllers, but I'll test it with my Mind/Elec Dom (26) as well. If I can't survive with all three, I'll take another look at custom critter ranks/powers/difficulty/missionlevel, to see if I can make it more fair. <_<
Dungeoncleaners! (ID#125715): Slay the Adventurers! Rescue the Monsters! Return the Treasure!
Peppermint Cat-- Lv50 Mewtant Ice/Eng Bls
I look around with my lvl 50 ill/rad using superior invisibility
I test with my lvl 26 dm/wp scrapper primarily
My arc is story, not challenge. I expect them to be solo'd. So I want to see what that looks like.
I begin testing with an invul/eng tanker who can survive a lot of punishment but takes a while to whittle down mobs. I have couple of these so I test them on challenge levels 4 and 5. Once I've worked out the bugs and the story and villains work for (keep in mind, I only have one arc published), I then start bringing in other character types like scrappers and blasters, still at level 50, but usually at challenge levels 3 and 4. If that goes well, I start to dip into low to mid level characters of different AT types (controllers, masterminds and others) that I solo with in the regular game. Basically, if I don't use a toon solo in the real fake world, I won't use him in the MA world. And since I love to create, design and use custom-critters, they scale up and down with me, regardless of what level I choose.
Sometime the choices surprise me. My mid-level Archery MM made mincemeat out of my arc, where higher level damage dealers barely made it through.
Only after I've played my own arc too many times to count, do I publish it ... as I don't think its "right" to ask others to "test" your arc for you. (This is just my personal opinion, and others are entitled to feel exactly the opposite.)
Interestingly, initial comments will always clue you into things you didn't think of. But if you get enough comments, you will learn that just as many people absolutely love a feature that others absolutely abhore. So you're not going to please everybody, that's for sure.
Red_Zero, the method you use is awesome....if you only intend your arcs to be run by 50s. As has been said before, a level 25 auto-SK'd to 50 is still a level 25 (they have no tier 9 or most powers that a 50 would use regularly). A 50 auto-exemp'd to 25 is still a level 50 (just without access to those tier 9s and a few powers a 50 would use regularly).
The two arcs I've been working on are intended for 1-20 and 20-40. I haven't published them yet because they're not where I want them to be. I test them with both heroes and villains naturally in their intended range because, in my view, that's the only way to get an accurate accounting of how a mission performs with people of those levels.
I first test with a controller and defender. Then a tanker. Then a dom and corrupter. The last ATs I test them with are brutes, scrappers, and MMs (for obvious reasons). My arcs are story based and made for solo and small (less than 4 people) teams so that's what I test it with/for. If 8 man teams want to tackle it, they're welcome to but it's going to be easy for most (because it's not intended for them). It's like a 50 saying Dr. Vahzilok is too easy (he's level 20, he wasn't made for you).
Anyway, the #1 piece of sage advice I've ever seen on these boards relates to this. Several people have said, "I make my arcs for me. If other people like it, cool. If they don't, that's cool too" or something to that effect. That's what I've used as my mantra. If I like it and it works for me, that's all that really matters.
@Remianen / @Remianen Too
Sig by RPVisions
I do not test with low-damage ATs. Sorry if you can't solo my arc with your Grav/FF controller, I don't have one and if I did I would die of boredom trying to test with it. I do make sure I run through with both a melee and a squishy of the appropriate level range, preferrably at the low end, on difficulty setting 3 or 4, depending on the powersets.
My 50 blaster on difficulty level 4 is my initial tester though, cause I want the badges and because she can plow through to make sure everything works. I find that if the mobs are easy for her, they're usually ok for my other toons.
Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
Darkfire Avenger DM/SD/Body Scrapper
Arc ID#161629 Freaks, Geeks, and Men in Black
Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World
[ QUOTE ]
... the #1 piece of sage advice I've ever seen on these boards relates to this. Several people have said, "I make my arcs for me. If other people like it, cool. If they don't, that's cool too" or something to that effect. That's what I've used as my mantra. If I like it and it works for me, that's all that really matters.
[/ QUOTE ]
I believe this too ... up to a point. If you don't like your own work, you shouldn't be publishing it. But many ideas that would be tremendous fun just for you aren't really meant for anyone else but you. Your origin story, for example. It MAY be compelling to others but since we all have heros or villians, your origin may not be interesting to us. On the other hand, incorporate the kind of story mechanics that make for a great story and your origin tale could be as big as Clark Kent's or Peter Parkers!
The other thing I think is important when testing your own arc is that you can't "blow through it." My arc still gets the best of me sometimes and sends me to the hospital, or forces me to load up on a special inspiration (or six) before I have to confront the ultimate challenge in the game. To me this makes a players arc play like the Dev team's. Anyway, that my 2 MA tickets on the subject. 
I test initially on my 50 tank at Heroic (that's who I'm building the arcs with). Then I push it up a notch or two. Then full on Invincible. Then I'll use some squishies on heroic (most of mine are from 15-30, except my 50 blaster). If need be, I'll up the limit on some of them, but really, if you're soloing on a squishy in the MA, you'd probably better have it on Heroic.
Team stuff can be...problematic. I try to get some SG mates to help, but mostly I'm on in the wee small hours EDT and it's sometimes hard to get help. I do what I can, even if it's getting a group together to actually play it post-publishing.
Dec out.
I feel comfortable building arcs with my lev 50 wp/fire tank on level 2. That's what I usually play him at.
Once I have a mission or custom group where I want then I experiment with my alts: Blasters. Controllers, Scrappers, etc at various levels. I test them at the level I normally play them.
I found that custom mobs are hard to plan for. They seem to scale drastically from standard to hard and when used at higher difficulty levels.
I test with my TriForm PB/WS pair. However, I am finding some odd critter combinations that my Kheldians do just fine against where Blasters/Scrappers/Tankers not to mention Defenders or Controllers can't solo... 
I test things with varying degrees of difficulty to see how the mission scales. Once I can solo it on Difficulty Lv2 with most encounters are set to 'Hard', I start testing things with teams.
I believe that a Kheldian Gold Standard should be based on SO's, and for anything above that... there's Platinum!
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
I run all my arcs when testing on 5.
First i run with a ss/wp brute
then a mind/elec dom
then a fire/storm corr
then a rad/sonc corr
I expect the first two to be fine, the 3rd to be relatively good if i keep on my toes, and the last to hopefully make it through. If it survives that, I log the ss/wp back in, invite a full group up of random peeps from my sg, and go through. Until the last can be done with almost any character combination, it doesn't stay.
I think the critical levels to test are level 4, 3 and 1.
Why? Even difficulty levels: tenacious and unyielding add on an extra enemy to every spawn. That can really make for some unexpected synergies if you're using customs.
I do a few runs on unyielding, assuming that tenacious will look the same, just easier-con.
Rugged gives the middle-of-the-range, bosses will be bosses, the extra mob will not be there, you can assume Invincible will look the same plus AVs being AVs instead of EBs (Besides anyone playing on Invincible alone and dies, asks for it.)
Heroic should show the easiest level your arc can drop to. Bosses turn into lts, probably EBs into bosses too, iirc. This can have some unexpected survivability issues with NPC allies sometimes.
Since I want my arc playable by most people, I tune for heroic to become a general cakewalk - blaster and defenders should get by easily.
On rugged, it should be slightly challenging, smart playthrough with liberal inspiration use should probably see anyone get through with no deaths.
On unyielding, stuff should be exciting, and epic and a challenge. If I die 4 times on a blaster getting through the map, fair enough, but I gotta get through eventually.
I play a ton of doms, and have controller friends, so all my customs have powersets chosen for gaping mez holes without me even needing to test for it. My blaster relies on limited mez for survival anyway, so if the blaster gets by, any stronger control class will get by.
I set my arc to 40+, so I tested with characters in the 40-50 range. Made it easier to limit testing, else I would feel obliged to do a test every ten levels or so just to see what spawned and what powers they have.
Invictus Est Level 50 Invul/Fire Tank
Malentis Level 50 Ice/Energy/Leviathan Dom (Freedom)
Black Jeremiah Level 50 Fire/Fire/Mu Dom
Sejanna Level 50 Dark/Dark/Elec Def (Virtue)
Arc #119664 - The MiniMech Cometh - Hess TF Mini-Sequel
After playing some random amount of mission arcs, I wonder what people test their own mission arcs at. Challenge Level, Archtype, Build Level, and Enhancement loadout all play a critical role in how hard or easy a mission with custom enemy groups is going to feel.
I my self play:
Challenge Level: 4
Archtype(s): Blaster or Mastermind
Build Level: 50
Enhancement Loadout: All Set IOs w/ some Rares and a few Hammi-O's, No Standard Enhancement Origins (i.e. Singles, Doubles, Training)
I am thinking of changing this out using a second character build meant for Mission Architect testing only:
Challenge Level: 2
Archtype(s): Blaster or Mastermind (No Temp or Accolade Powers)
Build Level: 50
Enhancement Loadout: All Single Origins
This should mimic what the game's base level is intended for, and then I could adjust difficulty of the mission and custom groups up from there. Any thoughts on this?