Choosing the Controller that's Right for You

cohRock · 08-19-2006 02:00 AM

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COMBINATION SYNERGY
Obviously this section is incomplete. It's intended that sooner or later people will supply me with increasingly useful synergy comments for each of the 42 combinations. It should be obvious by looking at the credits at the end that different people have written different sections-- some as if they'd been asked simply: "What's best about this combination," others more like "What's worst about this combination?" and everywhere in-between. I leave it to you to get what you can out of the following.

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<ul type="square">[*]Ice/Storm
Ice/Storm is a set of overlapping powers, usually to your benefit. Both the primary and secondary provide multiple slow powers, which is nice, because recharge can never be enhanced, only stacked. Ice Slick and Freezing Rain are patches that are put on the ground, and take up about the same amount of space. Hurricane can be used to push MOBs back onto the patches, or arctic air can be used to slow them from running off. Ice/Storm does very little damage until lvl 32, but has access to Jack Frost, tornado, and lightning storm in the thirties. In general, you will team better with ranged attackers than with melee attackers, but with smart play, youll be a benefit to both. Ice/Storm is also at its strongest when there is at least one other support toon on the team (any other controller or defender, or tanker who can and does grab up agro), but thats not to say its a liability if there isnt.
[*]Ice/Empathy
The Ice/Empathy controller is not one of the stronger soloist controller builds out there, but in a team support role is very effective. It makes use of the strong control powers provided by Ice control to protect the team and Empathy's healing and buffing powers to deal with anything that gets through. While most solo oriented players should probably look elsewhere, the empathy secondary provides several decent buffs for Jack Frost, in Fortitude and Adrenaline Boost, as well as allowing you to heal your pet wherever he is (since he's probably not going to be in melee) Ice Control can be somewhat endurance hungry at times, making Recovery Aura a welcome addition to your power choices.
[*]Ice/Kinetics
Ice/Kinetics is all about making your enemies weaker and your teammates stronger. Ice provides the -recharge and -runspeed debuffs along with it's various other controlling powers, such as knockdown and a couple actual holds. Kinetics contributes with it's damage and recharge debuffing/buffing and, notably, transference for when you get low on endurance. This particular combination can work well in either group or solo settings. On the solo side of things, Jack Frost benefits greatly from Speed Boost and when he gets into range, Fulcrum Shift. In groups, those same powers will greatly benefit your teammates.

Notable power synergies include using frostbite to trigger containment on an entire group, Fulcrum shift to give yourself a damage boost and then using an AoE damage power from the epic pools (such as Fireball or Psychic Tornado) to deal a lot of damage quickly. Since Kinetics is such a melee oriented set, a power like Arctic Air to protect you when you are required to move into close range is also a benefit.
[*]Ice/Trick Arrow
Ice/Trick arrow has a lot of debuff and a lot of control. In the debuff side, Ice has a lot of slows and trick arrow covers pretty much everything else. There is no heal, but you can more than make up for that by saving your team from taking damage at all with the two slick powers(one of which can light on fire), two AoE holds, and two single target holds. Add in the Arctic Air for confusion and you have one of the most control-oriented builds in the game.[/list]
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Ice/FF
An Ice/FF controller has very little overlap between his primary and secondariy powers. Yet, due to having a fully functional secondary with just four powers from it, he has great flexibility in choosing his primary and pool powers. A */FF controller needs from his secondary just Personal Force Field (PFF), Deflection Shield, Insulation Shield, and Dispersion Bubble (DB). He can choose more secondary powers to expand his knockback/repulasion capabilities, but these tend to conflict with what his primary powers accomplish.

Little overlap does not mean little synergy. The largest synergy is in the combination of Arctic Air and Dispersion Bubble, granting an ice/ff controller a scrapper's front-line robustness. Together they reduce damage to he and his teammates, provide mez resistance to hold, immob, and stun, and nerf foes with slow and -recharge as well as ongoing pulses of confuse and fear. If you have a hankering for front-line control, there isn't any better combo.

Jack Frost begins rugged, but keeping him bubbled along with your teammates means he will very, very seldom be defeated.

Any bubbler always offers his team great alpha-strike tanking via Personal Force Field alone (well, ok, augment it with Dispersion Bubble while taking the alpha strike). An ice/ff controller, though, is the king of alpha-strike tanking. Talk about synerygy:

<ul type="square">[*] Bubble Burst
Before jumping into the mob, put up PFF, DB, and Arctic Air (AA). Have team wait back, then jump in and make yourself a nuisance. You can't do anything to the foes, but you can, for example, annoy the Psychic Clockwork King enough for him to let loose on you. Once that happens, call in team. They'll quickly draw the aggro away from you. Big mistake for the bad guys. Release PFF, allowing AA to instantly begin nerfing bad guys, and DB to immediately begin protecting the good guys.[*] Bubble Burst Bounce
Same as above, but as final step let loose an Ice Slick to further nerf the foes.[*] Bubble Burst Chunk
Same as the first, but as final step let loose Glacier and turn most of the front line foes into statues.[/list]

-- Rich
* Thresholds CoH: What to do When
* My Comics Collection

Epiphoid · 08-29-2006 02:15 PM

I think Earth and FF go together decently. Force Fields make your Animated Stone even stronger and I would say that with Force Bubble, Detention Field and Force Bolt and Earth's controls, it is the one of the best combos for the complete lockdown of mobs.

Muad_Dib · 08-29-2006 04:14 PM

nice guide. very well done. i notice though the lack of your thoughts on the illusion/sonic res combination. sure the sonic res is better for teams but the fact that you can make your phantasm or decoys the anchor for the AoE debuff is nice, not to mention that the combination of pets wailing on and the -res debuffs make the enemy go down that much faster.
but what do you think?

Lantzer · 08-30-2006 06:43 AM

[*]Ice/Rad
Ice/Rad is the set for what I like to call "Close-support controllers." Damage is low to non-existant if the set is slotted up for control/debuff, but can make a team _safe_ from within the fight. The set works by combining the two AoE control toggles (Arctic Air and Choking Cloud) with the Rad debuff toggles and the marvelous AoE control granted by Ice slick and rapid-fire Ice Blocks. The set is end-heavy, but this can be covered by Hasten+Accelerated Metabolism+Stamina. The point is to enter the fight behind the tank (or jack frost) and within seconds have the entire spawn held, greatly slowed, confused, crawling around aimlessly in terror, flopping around like a fish, and debuffed to their Acc, Dam, Res, Def, Rech, and Regen.

The two biggest weaknesses for this set is a lack of major damage ability, and AoE Mez from enemies. I'd suggest working toward the psionic ancillary pool for the mez protection. Luckily, with AM, the mezzes don't last long. The damage can be taken care of by toting some blasters around and encouraging them to cut loose and have fun in safety. As this set works best up in melee, if things go south, you'll likely be faceplanting quickly.

ottercubdc · 10-21-2006 08:35 AM

This guide is ASTOUNDING in its detail, analysis, and good advice. By compiling this guide, you've done a great service to the CoH community and Controllers in particular. THANK YOU, Enan!

(And you helped me pick my next one - Mind/TA it is!)

Enantiodromos · 10-24-2006 10:29 AM

Thanks Otter, and everybody. ^_^

The irony is, after brazenly stealing sections from other people's guides without asking (credited them, but didn't ask), the only person I managed to annoy at all, I think, was Frost.

It was really very much a community effort. I need to go back and solicit write-ups on the remaining combos... maybe add some thoughts to some of them.

cohRock · 10-25-2006 11:16 PM

Enantiodromos wrote:
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The irony is, after brazenly stealing sections from other people's guides without asking (credited them, but didn't ask), the only person I managed to annoy at all, I think, was Frost.

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Wow, she carries her annoyance with grace...

Frost wrote:
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Thanks to Enan for compiling this and to all the members of the Controller community who contributed. Turned out very nicely

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-- Rich
* Thresholds CoH: What to do When
* My Comics Collection

The_Gamemaster · 10-26-2006 06:21 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Enantiodromos wrote:
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The irony is, after brazenly stealing sections from other people's guides without asking (credited them, but didn't ask), the only person I managed to annoy at all, I think, was Frost.

[/ QUOTE ]
Wow, she carries her annoyance with grace...

Frost wrote:
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Thanks to Enan for compiling this and to all the members of the Controller community who contributed. Turned out very nicely

[/ QUOTE ]

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Sounds pretty riled up to me...

Interesting guide though. It's not particularly shocking that it would come from the most prolific guide-writer on the forums. It's nice to get this much information concentrated in one place, espcecially for those of us who are experienced players that are only now getting around to exploring the mysterious world of Controlling (at least from the Controller AT anyway )...

Cheers!

Enantiodromos · 10-26-2006 10:58 AM

1. Frost is a guy, despite being part of the Jug band.
2. I didn't say frost was *obviously* annoyed. The ways of Frost are subtle.

Frost · 10-26-2006 12:08 PM

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2. I didn't say frost was *obviously* annoyed. The ways of Frost are subtle.

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Oh they are?

I'm not annoyed.

There...can't get any less subtle than that I am, however..annoyed that you think I was annoyed. Or would that just be annoying? Hmm...

Papaschtroumpf · 12-22-2006 12:01 PM

I wouldn't say Gravity is rare anymore, at least at low levels. I did an Atta mission where 3 out of 4 controllers were Gravity. 2 out of 4 where storm too, althoguh mine was the only grav/storm.

Papaschtroumpf · 12-22-2006 12:20 PM

I noticed that in Mind/TA you say you can't light the slick until APPs: this isn't true if you create a character of Magic or Tech origin, both of which get an inherent power that deals energy damage and is sufficient to light Oil Slick.

Grav/empathy: Sing can't be healed, but regen aura works on it

FYI, I've almost given up on my Ill/Rad, just like my Necro/Dark MM it's so easy to play it's not interesting to me anymore.
My Ill/TA feels a little more novel, but does feel overpowered at times.

My current favorite is my Fire/Storm, one of the "inversely correlated" sets. It has tons of AoE damage and can level super-fast, it's also pretty tricky to play in that if you in over your head, you're going to hit the floor fast. I wouldn;t recommend it for someone new to controlling, but veteran controllers looking for something fun and powerful should give it a try.

shezwick99 · 01-01-2007 10:28 AM

its great!!! thx 4 ur help

Reinman · 01-01-2007 10:23 PM

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Gravity/Storm Summoning
Possibly the second most powerful Controller Secondary, several of the powers in the Storm Summoning set actually work better with a Controller than they do with a Defender!
You get a PBAoE stealth for better movement around the battlefield, a Slow to stack with Crushing Field to reduce incoming damage, a Knockdown to reduce it further that also debuffs with -Def and -Res for more damage more often, a PBAoE Repel with -Acc and Repel which not only provides amazing melee defense, but also increases the amount of Locational Control available, a PBAoE Disorient that stacks well with Wormhole, a "pet" that deals good damage provided you use Gravity Distortion to keep it from throwing everything around, and another "pet" that deals good damage and acts as yet another melee defense.
No real defense against ranged attacks, though, and nothing that really helps Singularity too much.

This powerset has a lot of toggles that drain a lot of endurance. If you're not planning on taking Stamina, be ready to slot many Endurance Reduction enhancements in the toggles.
___________
Crushing field has one downfall-- it immobilizes but does not root. Tornado is hard for gravity users to control, since the -kb is on the holds not the immobilizes, which makes the AoE impossible to spam. This makes gravity, a set that is usually played quite orderly, into a chaotic control set when paired with Storm. That makes tornado into a situational chaotic control for grav instead of a damage/mez dealer, which it is for many other sets.

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I can't really say that I agree with much of this.

I don't even take tornado. Nor do I normally run any toggles aside from hurricane.

Crushing Field not having a -kb is a benefit, not a downfall, it allows you to produce insane amounts of knockDOWN.

The strategies are far different from Fire/Storm.

Actually, I didn't even use Wormhole in the below link, I pet pulled them around the corner.

Does this look like chaos?

Read my guide.

Anyway, your effort is appreciated. I just hate to see misinformation, and you certainly missed the mark on this one.

iloveU99x · 01-11-2007 12:49 AM

Good Job in this guide.This will be very helpful for the new comers.
It is almost to good that it may have an adverse affect of making them not want to play any other AT's

Malakim · 01-11-2007 03:42 PM

I've now seen this guide through several iterations. I keep comming back to it time and time agan - and get something out of it everytime.

I'm really impressed as to how many ways controllers can be played.

Now if only there were similar guides out there for other ATs. If there's this many ways to play a controller, I wonder how many ways there are to play other ATs.

Malakim

Malakim

-Playing since COH beta and still love the game!

ytdrummer · 03-13-2007 04:47 PM

[ QUOTE ][*]Defensitroller: Illusion/FF
2 Deflection Shield
6 Maneuvers
10 Insulation Shield
12 Group Invisibility
20 Dispersion Bubble

Notes: Defensitrollers concentrate on pushing a team's defense to the limit.

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I have this one! I friggin love it.

AMAZING guide btw. Amazing.

Kitty_Eater · 09-10-2007 02:03 AM

Wheres your Ice/Rad Opinion? I see every Ice combo except this one.

DarkDiva · 09-10-2007 06:54 AM

Been ghosting the forums for a while, but I wanted to compliment you on this guide... or book... Anyways there's tons of great info in here!

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The next two lists show particularly popular or unpopular particular combinations *GIVEN* the frequency of the primary and secondary. For example, Illusion/Kinetics is negatively correlated-- meaning people tend to avoid putting them together for some reason.

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I have one of these currently at lvl 17. The problem is that In my personal (and very limited) experience this build does best as a scraptoller, especially at the low levels as I cannot speak for any higher than my toon.

Most Controllers have the mindest of stay as far away from the mob as possible. With Ill/Kin you want to take a melee from the travel pools (Air Sup rocks!) and get up close and personal... after you decieve the boss into being your buddy. I have no problem soloing on her and I have the feeling that once I get Phantom Army... Mwhahaha!

Anyway, thanks for all of the great info.

Ultra_Flux · 09-25-2007 10:02 PM

wow...wow...awesome....

Eldandil · 09-26-2007 05:27 PM

This is a must-read for anyone considering a new controller, Enan. Very nice!

5 stars!

Nod · 09-27-2007 06:10 PM

Nice guide.

Geronimo_69 · 10-20-2007 08:09 AM

Great guide for those of us with 'trollers. Wish I had known about this when I started playing, but oh well. I guess this puts me in the rare column having a Fire/TA 'troller, but the hot, flaming monkeys paired with the ability to snap off an entangling arrow to hold someone down makes for quick work when soloing. Now that I have more knowledge, I'll be looking to get that oil slick arrow either at the next level, or just respec and take it now. This is great! Knowing is half the battle.

A veteran is someone who, at one point in their life, wrote a blank check made payable to 'The United States of America' for an amount of 'up to, and including, my life'.
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gWrath · 11-02-2007 07:58 PM

Awesome guide. Exactly what I needed.

Neuronia · 11-27-2007 08:30 AM

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Wheres your Ice/Rad Opinion? I see every Ice combo except this one.

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Just my own opinion but Ice/Rad is slows, slows and more slows with a throwing in of some heft debuffs to defense and resistance.

I'm just levelling one now but there are sooo many ways you can go with your build that it's crazy!

Ice/Rad is definitely more of a 'mitigation' combination than say...the mob-stomping Fire/Kin or Ill/Rad for example.

Questions about the game, either side? /t @Neuronia or @Neuronium, with your queries!
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